11 ms·

Telegram Cooperates with FSB (Rus)

72 points by EugeneOZ 5y ago

EugeneOZ 5y ago
Text is in Russian, but nowadays it shouldn't be a problem. Just in case, Google Translate: Oleg Matveychev, deputy chairman of the committee on information policy, information technology and communications, told Podyom that as long as the messenger is politically neutral, they will not touch it, and there is no need to become biased by Telegram. “Durov found a compromise with the FSB. Not an agreement, not that he unequivocally said “come in, do whatever you want in my household”, but managed to convince him that people's lives are important and that terrorists are negotiating through Telegram. Requests within the framework of operational activities are transferred there if terrorists or someone is under control. Telegram installed equipment to be able to watch all the dangerous subjects.” And one more thing: FSB is former KGB.
- pmontra 5y ago
  Are the controlling only traffic from inside Russia or worldwide?
  - noxer 5y ago
    According to Durov Telegram does not have servers in Russia.
cheburnet 5y ago
Prev - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30661316 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30661316
- timbit42 5y ago
  Why does this link go to a blank page?
cheburnet 5y ago
These kinds of messages make me doubt Pavel's honesty even more
- tpoacher 5y ago
  Which may well be the intended purpose of these kinds of messages.
achikin 5y ago
All modern social networks and messengers cooperate with law enforcement.
- EugeneOZ 5y ago
  and have equipment installed to listen to the traffic?
  - RF_Savage 5y ago
    Isn't that the law in Russia? Every ISP is required to have the SORM (Russian ECHELON) lawful interception boxes in their network. So anything with servers in Russia will get their traffic intercepted to begin with and then FSB will pressure them for more indepth database access. This has always meant that Telegram was not suitable for anything requiring secrecy or privacy.
    - EugeneOZ 5y ago
      Telegram is not ISP and being used widely by non-russian residents.
      - wolf550e 5y ago
        Telegram is used widely by Russian speakers everywhere.
- wut42 5y ago
  But not Signal, for example. Well, they do: but they have nothing to share. Telegram on the contrary have a ton to share.
  - daneel_w 5y ago
    They have a clear picture of users' social networks because of their dubious requirement that people provide them with working mobile numbers. Who speaks to whom, how frequently, during what times and what days of the week etc. Incredibly valuable and revealing data.
kosasbest 5y ago
Russian --> English translation: https://pdmnews-ru.translate.goog/25704/?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=nui https://pdmnews-ru.translate.goog/25704/?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_t...
- wut42 5y ago
  Damn, that `translate.goog` trick is nice.
deadalus 5y ago
Telegram is the only platform where I have been able to get uncensored footage of the Ukraine conflict from a civilian perspective. Of course there is a lot of propaganda, but I get to see the destruction and war crimes from both sides with my own eyes. Recommended channels(NSFL) : https://t.me/kyivoperativ https://t.me/kyivoperativ https://t.me/intelslava https://t.me/intelslava https://t.me/WORLD18WAR https://t.me/WORLD18WAR https://t.me/Yediotnews https://t.me/Yediotnews https://t.me/asbmil https://t.me/asbmil https://t.me/AtlasNewsTelegram https://t.me/AtlasNewsTelegram https://t.me/s/OSINTUkraine https://t.me/s/OSINTUkraine
- axiosgunnar 5y ago
  Note that over half of those channels are blatantly pro-Putin
  - anilshanbhag 5y ago
    I used to follow ASBMil on Twitter before Twitter banned it :/ I can't vouch for others but ASBMil was doing accurate reporting. Just searching for ASBMil on twitter will show many saying that Twitter is censoring accounts that do not repeat the accepted Western narrative.
    - axiosgunnar 5y ago
      Lol isn't Asbmil the one with the legendary fall of 2021 tweet saying „US intel is trying to fool you all, Russia will never invade, idiots“? Also, if the „western narrative“ is one of condemning the most blatant international military aggression since WWII for the gain of a handful of oligarch… I guess I am pro-Western then. I really can't see any reason to subscribe to any other narrative here. The two sides are completely unequal.
      - startoffs 5y ago
        Almost every sane person said there will be no invasion. That does not make them complicit.
cheburnet 5y ago
Telegram channel "Код Дурова" asked a source close to Telegram what they thought of Matveichev's words - "Clowns" (https://t.me/d_code/13701 https://t.me/d_code/13701) Keep in mind that they are paid for correct answers. Reminding how Elvira Nabiulina (head of the Central Bank of Russia) talks about the good economic situation and stability in Russia.
eterevsky 5y ago
This is just a random speculation. There is no hard or even indirect evidence that Durov cooperates with FSB in any way. Even Whatsapp which belongs to Facebook is still available in Russia despite their explicit pro-Ukrainian stance.
- EugeneOZ 5y ago
  There is a name of the source in the article. And it literally says that Durov cooperates with FSB.
- dainiusse 5y ago
  How did he go away without sharing encryption keys? Other networks platforms were forced to do this or close. Telegram left untouched...
  - alophawen 5y ago
    Because he's been in exile since 2014. https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/03/technology/once-celebrated-in-russia-programmer-pavel-durov-chooses-exile.html https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/03/technology/once-celebrate...
    - dainiusse 5y ago
      This doesn't explain why Telegram isn't simply blocked in there
  - mananaysiempre 5y ago
    Several years of blocking attempts hardly count as “untouched” in my book, but neither WhatsApp nor Signal shared anything either; in fact I don’t think any Western social network is in compliance in any practical sense.
- huhtenberg 5y ago
  Killing WhatsApp will be disastrous for the Russian economy. The effect will probably be on par if not greater than all other sanctions combined. Every single daily thing is done via WhatsApp. The state realizes that which is why they carved an explicit (if a completely made-up) exception for it when they went after Instagram, Facebook and Meta. You don't want to inconvenience your brainwashed masses that much or they could be shaken out of their nirvana and start looking closely at what's going on.
isodev 5y ago
This doesn’t really look like a trustworthy publication and the post doesn’t actually point to anything specific changing on the platform. I guess anyone could say stuff on the internet these days, it doesn’t mean it’s true.
sega_sai 5y ago
This is a claim from a Russian member of parliament. Given that they all have been selected by Kremlin, and are there to just rubber stamp whatever has been sent to them from the Kremlin, they are all just nobodies without any knowledge or authority. There is no reason to trust this claim at the moment. It is true that in my opinion Durov himself is a bit shady and some actions of Telegram were a bit weird (i.e. in the beginning of the war against Ukraine), but right now it's Telegram is certainly the easiest way in Russia to access independent voices.
plemian 5y ago
the title is misleading. read Durov story about it https://t.me/durov/179 https://t.me/durov/179
BoumTAC 5y ago
This week, Telegram start censoring RT and Sputnik channel in France. I'm a lot disappointed, as it was the "free speech" platform. Not anymore...
- noxer 5y ago
  Both still up if you live in a place that respects free speech. Not telegrams fault that they are forced to respect certain local law. Also a bird told me that you need to write blocked channel names backwards if want to see what your gov does not want you to see.
  - tentacleuno 5y ago
    Could you elaborate on what you mean? Do you mean Telegram allows access to the same channel when you write its name backwards?
    - noxer 5y ago
      These channels are only blocked if you have "the wrong" phone number (blame the local gov) So other people mirror these blocked channels and to easy find them, they "mirror" the name too. Its basically the Streisand effect in action.
19h 5y ago
This article has zero sources and the link at the bottom links to their telegram channel that links back to this article. I‘d take this with a metric ton of salt.
startoffs 5y ago
Durov has been on exile for years because he refused to cooperate in the past and he made a statement about this. You can read his statement on his telegram account. https://t.me/durov https://t.me/durov
dang 5y ago
We have deep respect for languages, but HN is an English-language site, so posts here need to be in English. That may require waiting until a good English-language article appears, but the more significant the topic is, the more (and sooner) this is likely to happen. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20english%20language%20site&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...

72 points by EugeneOZ 5y ago

Text is in Russian, but nowadays it shouldn't be a problem. Just in case, Google Translate: Oleg Matveychev, deputy chairman of the committee on information policy, information technology and communications, told Podyom that as long as the messenger is politically neutral, they will not touch it, and there is no need to become biased by Telegram. “Durov found a compromise with the FSB. Not an agreement, not that he unequivocally said “come in, do whatever you want in my household”, but managed to convince him that people's lives are important and that terrorists are negotiating through Telegram. Requests within the framework of operational activities are transferred there if terrorists or someone is under control. Telegram installed equipment to be able to watch all the dangerous subjects.” And one more thing: FSB is former KGB.

pmontra 5y ago
Are the controlling only traffic from inside Russia or worldwide?
- noxer 5y ago
  According to Durov Telegram does not have servers in Russia.

cheburnet 5y ago

Prev - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30661316 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30661316

timbit42 5y ago
Why does this link go to a blank page?

cheburnet 5y ago

These kinds of messages make me doubt Pavel's honesty even more

tpoacher 5y ago
Which may well be the intended purpose of these kinds of messages.

achikin 5y ago

All modern social networks and messengers cooperate with law enforcement.

EugeneOZ 5y ago
and have equipment installed to listen to the traffic?
- RF_Savage 5y ago
  Isn't that the law in Russia? Every ISP is required to have the SORM (Russian ECHELON) lawful interception boxes in their network. So anything with servers in Russia will get their traffic intercepted to begin with and then FSB will pressure them for more indepth database access. This has always meant that Telegram was not suitable for anything requiring secrecy or privacy.
  - EugeneOZ 5y ago
    Telegram is not ISP and being used widely by non-russian residents.
    - wolf550e 5y ago
      Telegram is used widely by Russian speakers everywhere.
wut42 5y ago
But not Signal, for example. Well, they do: but they have nothing to share. Telegram on the contrary have a ton to share.
- daneel_w 5y ago
  They have a clear picture of users' social networks because of their dubious requirement that people provide them with working mobile numbers. Who speaks to whom, how frequently, during what times and what days of the week etc. Incredibly valuable and revealing data.

kosasbest 5y ago

Russian --> English translation: https://pdmnews-ru.translate.goog/25704/?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=nui https://pdmnews-ru.translate.goog/25704/?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_t...

wut42 5y ago
Damn, that `translate.goog` trick is nice.

deadalus 5y ago

Telegram is the only platform where I have been able to get uncensored footage of the Ukraine conflict from a civilian perspective. Of course there is a lot of propaganda, but I get to see the destruction and war crimes from both sides with my own eyes. Recommended channels(NSFL) : https://t.me/kyivoperativ https://t.me/kyivoperativ https://t.me/intelslava https://t.me/intelslava https://t.me/WORLD18WAR https://t.me/WORLD18WAR https://t.me/Yediotnews https://t.me/Yediotnews https://t.me/asbmil https://t.me/asbmil https://t.me/AtlasNewsTelegram https://t.me/AtlasNewsTelegram https://t.me/s/OSINTUkraine https://t.me/s/OSINTUkraine

axiosgunnar 5y ago
Note that over half of those channels are blatantly pro-Putin
- anilshanbhag 5y ago
  I used to follow ASBMil on Twitter before Twitter banned it :/ I can't vouch for others but ASBMil was doing accurate reporting. Just searching for ASBMil on twitter will show many saying that Twitter is censoring accounts that do not repeat the accepted Western narrative.
  - axiosgunnar 5y ago
    Lol isn't Asbmil the one with the legendary fall of 2021 tweet saying „US intel is trying to fool you all, Russia will never invade, idiots“? Also, if the „western narrative“ is one of condemning the most blatant international military aggression since WWII for the gain of a handful of oligarch… I guess I am pro-Western then. I really can't see any reason to subscribe to any other narrative here. The two sides are completely unequal.
    - startoffs 5y ago
      Almost every sane person said there will be no invasion. That does not make them complicit.

cheburnet 5y ago

Telegram channel "Код Дурова" asked a source close to Telegram what they thought of Matveichev's words - "Clowns" (https://t.me/d_code/13701 https://t.me/d_code/13701) Keep in mind that they are paid for correct answers. Reminding how Elvira Nabiulina (head of the Central Bank of Russia) talks about the good economic situation and stability in Russia.

eterevsky 5y ago

This is just a random speculation. There is no hard or even indirect evidence that Durov cooperates with FSB in any way. Even Whatsapp which belongs to Facebook is still available in Russia despite their explicit pro-Ukrainian stance.

EugeneOZ 5y ago
There is a name of the source in the article. And it literally says that Durov cooperates with FSB.
dainiusse 5y ago
How did he go away without sharing encryption keys? Other networks platforms were forced to do this or close. Telegram left untouched...
- alophawen 5y ago
  Because he's been in exile since 2014. https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/03/technology/once-celebrated-in-russia-programmer-pavel-durov-chooses-exile.html https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/03/technology/once-celebrate...
  - dainiusse 5y ago
    This doesn't explain why Telegram isn't simply blocked in there
- mananaysiempre 5y ago
  Several years of blocking attempts hardly count as “untouched” in my book, but neither WhatsApp nor Signal shared anything either; in fact I don’t think any Western social network is in compliance in any practical sense.
huhtenberg 5y ago
Killing WhatsApp will be disastrous for the Russian economy. The effect will probably be on par if not greater than all other sanctions combined. Every single daily thing is done via WhatsApp. The state realizes that which is why they carved an explicit (if a completely made-up) exception for it when they went after Instagram, Facebook and Meta. You don't want to inconvenience your brainwashed masses that much or they could be shaken out of their nirvana and start looking closely at what's going on.

isodev 5y ago

This doesn’t really look like a trustworthy publication and the post doesn’t actually point to anything specific changing on the platform. I guess anyone could say stuff on the internet these days, it doesn’t mean it’s true.

sega_sai 5y ago

This is a claim from a Russian member of parliament. Given that they all have been selected by Kremlin, and are there to just rubber stamp whatever has been sent to them from the Kremlin, they are all just nobodies without any knowledge or authority. There is no reason to trust this claim at the moment. It is true that in my opinion Durov himself is a bit shady and some actions of Telegram were a bit weird (i.e. in the beginning of the war against Ukraine), but right now it's Telegram is certainly the easiest way in Russia to access independent voices.

plemian 5y ago

the title is misleading. read Durov story about it https://t.me/durov/179 https://t.me/durov/179

BoumTAC 5y ago

This week, Telegram start censoring RT and Sputnik channel in France. I'm a lot disappointed, as it was the "free speech" platform. Not anymore...

noxer 5y ago
Both still up if you live in a place that respects free speech. Not telegrams fault that they are forced to respect certain local law. Also a bird told me that you need to write blocked channel names backwards if want to see what your gov does not want you to see.
- tentacleuno 5y ago
  Could you elaborate on what you mean? Do you mean Telegram allows access to the same channel when you write its name backwards?
  - noxer 5y ago
    These channels are only blocked if you have "the wrong" phone number (blame the local gov) So other people mirror these blocked channels and to easy find them, they "mirror" the name too. Its basically the Streisand effect in action.

19h 5y ago

This article has zero sources and the link at the bottom links to their telegram channel that links back to this article. I‘d take this with a metric ton of salt.

startoffs 5y ago

Durov has been on exile for years because he refused to cooperate in the past and he made a statement about this. You can read his statement on his telegram account. https://t.me/durov https://t.me/durov

dang 5y ago

We have deep respect for languages, but HN is an English-language site, so posts here need to be in English. That may require waiting until a good English-language article appears, but the more significant the topic is, the more (and sooner) this is likely to happen. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20english%20language%20site&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...