5 ms·

I do not understand the "nazi" qualifier. Isn't Zelenskyy a Jew? And also pro bilingual country? I guess Zelenskyy's election was a blow to Russian propaganda,

by orwin 5y ago

I do not understand the "nazi" qualifier. Isn't Zelenskyy a Jew? And also pro bilingual country? I guess Zelenskyy's election was a blow to Russian propaganda, but they didn't even try to change their narrative? Just added drug addict? I wouldv'e said he is a drug addicted puppet with no political experience and money in UK's fiscal heaven. But nazi? That doesn't seems right. Hopefully it doesn't end like Makhnov did. "History doesn't repeat itself, but sometime it rhyme" (Mark Twain i guess?)

vanusa 5y ago
I do not understand the "nazi" qualifier. It's an emotional/rhetorical ploy -- an appeal to WW2-era patriotism, and the relative sense of greatness and prosperity that flourished in the SU after the sacrifices made in that war, specifically. It's not supposed to be rational or correct or make any other kind of sense.
Wiseacre 5y ago
Have you read 1984?
joecot 5y ago
The President is Jewish, yes. But there are Nazi elements to the Ukrainian military. For example, the Azov Battalion[1] are very clearly neonazis. But they were also one of the main forces fighting Russian separatists in the east, so they were adopted into the National Guard. As everyone's noticed, the situation in Ukraine is complicated. Yes, Putin's claim that he's invading Ukraine to denazify it is clearly bs. BUT, Ukraine has a Nazi problem, largely due to the internal alliances the government has to make in order to stand a chance against Russia. If Putin managed to get Ukraine's military to coup their government and then negotiate with him, that coup would probably be from the neonazis. Luckily for Ukraine, it turns out so far that its White Nationalists still care about the "nation" part. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion
- thesmok 5y ago
  Please compare numbers of far right members in Ukrainian and German parliaments, and recalibrate your definition of "nazi problem" of a country.
- raxxorrax 5y ago
  Quite right. The difficulty in criticism in that direction is that Putin uses the same arguments against the domestic opposition. In both cases nationalistic ambitions in both Russia and Ukraine can be easily explained. I think to counter such narratives and honest acknowledgment is necessary. Then you can highlight how an invasion of a country dwarfs these tendencies.
raxxorrax 5y ago
With the prevalence of alcoholism in Russia, it is curious they denounce drug uptake that much.
anelson 5y ago
Invoking the image of nazis is also a dog whistle directed at primarily older Russians. During WWII some Ukrainian forces initially joined the invading Nazi forces against the Soviet Union, which given how the Soviets treated Ukraine maybe made sense at the time. Ever since then the memory of this “betrayal” has been kept alive in Russian culture. There’s no greater enemy than nazis, so the image of a Nazi Ukrainian oppressing Russians is a powerful one. Utter and complete bullshit propaganda of course, but it’s not an accident that Putin uses this particular image. The fact that Zelenskiy is a Russian speaking Jew is, I guess, either not widely known in Russia or not considered sufficient proof of his innocence…
IAmGraydon 5y ago
There is a small, but real Nazi element in the Ukrainian military and it’s leadership. Bad as that is, Putin is taking it and blowing it out of proportion to suit his purpose. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion

by orwin 5y ago

vanusa 5y ago

I do not understand the "nazi" qualifier. It's an emotional/rhetorical ploy -- an appeal to WW2-era patriotism, and the relative sense of greatness and prosperity that flourished in the SU after the sacrifices made in that war, specifically. It's not supposed to be rational or correct or make any other kind of sense.

Wiseacre 5y ago

Have you read 1984?

joecot 5y ago

The President is Jewish, yes. But there are Nazi elements to the Ukrainian military. For example, the Azov Battalion[1] are very clearly neonazis. But they were also one of the main forces fighting Russian separatists in the east, so they were adopted into the National Guard. As everyone's noticed, the situation in Ukraine is complicated. Yes, Putin's claim that he's invading Ukraine to denazify it is clearly bs. BUT, Ukraine has a Nazi problem, largely due to the internal alliances the government has to make in order to stand a chance against Russia. If Putin managed to get Ukraine's military to coup their government and then negotiate with him, that coup would probably be from the neonazis. Luckily for Ukraine, it turns out so far that its White Nationalists still care about the "nation" part. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion

thesmok 5y ago
Please compare numbers of far right members in Ukrainian and German parliaments, and recalibrate your definition of "nazi problem" of a country.
raxxorrax 5y ago
Quite right. The difficulty in criticism in that direction is that Putin uses the same arguments against the domestic opposition. In both cases nationalistic ambitions in both Russia and Ukraine can be easily explained. I think to counter such narratives and honest acknowledgment is necessary. Then you can highlight how an invasion of a country dwarfs these tendencies.

raxxorrax 5y ago

With the prevalence of alcoholism in Russia, it is curious they denounce drug uptake that much.

anelson 5y ago

Invoking the image of nazis is also a dog whistle directed at primarily older Russians. During WWII some Ukrainian forces initially joined the invading Nazi forces against the Soviet Union, which given how the Soviets treated Ukraine maybe made sense at the time. Ever since then the memory of this “betrayal” has been kept alive in Russian culture. There’s no greater enemy than nazis, so the image of a Nazi Ukrainian oppressing Russians is a powerful one. Utter and complete bullshit propaganda of course, but it’s not an accident that Putin uses this particular image. The fact that Zelenskiy is a Russian speaking Jew is, I guess, either not widely known in Russia or not considered sufficient proof of his innocence…

IAmGraydon 5y ago

There is a small, but real Nazi element in the Ukrainian military and it’s leadership. Bad as that is, Putin is taking it and blowing it out of proportion to suit his purpose. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion