8 ms·

Meta axes head of global community development embroiled in underage sex sting

118 points by spenvo 5y ago

spywaregorilla 5y ago
- kwertyoowiyop 5y ago
  Sometimes when HN resembles Reddit, it’s too funny to complain about.
  - keeganpoppen 5y ago
    as you can see, humor is not tolerated on HN (, unfortunately)
    - Nicksil 5y ago
      >as you can see, humor is not tolerated on HN (, unfortunately) It is if it's funny.
  - syspec 5y ago
    What was the comment?
smm11 5y ago
Nice screening process for the company that knows everything about you.
- mdoms 5y ago
  I keep seeing this criticism and I don't get it. Presumably no one knew about his proclivities - not his parents, not his best friend, not his wife (if he had one), no one. It's obviously a very secretive part of his life and it's unreasonable to expect an employer to somehow know this about him. Meta employes 60,000 people according to a quick google search. I promise you there are plenty of Meta employees who have hobbies and interests the employer doesn't know about.
  - KennyBlanken 5y ago
    - z3c0 5y ago
      I think you knew what they meant. Changing the wording doesn't change their point, so you're nitpicking semantics.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
  - Mountain_Skies 5y ago
    There aren't 60,000 employees who are the Head of Global Community Development. I'm not sure how far up the org chart that position is but I'm betting it's up in the top 1% of the company. It's not like this is the janitor or the person stocking the supply closet.
    - iqanq 5y ago
      So what do you want, Facebook to hire dicks to investigate employees?
      - mauvehaus 5y ago
        In case the downvotes are for language, "dick" is also slang for a detective, sometimes specifically a private investigator[0], which I infer the parent intended in their usage. Which isn't to say it's never been used in a double entendre with its more common meaning. See, for instance, the theme to Shaft[1]. [0] https://www.quora.com/How-did-the-term-private-dick-for-a-private-investigator-originate?share=1 https://www.quora.com/How-did-the-term-private-dick-for-a-pr... [1] https://genius.com/Isaac-hayes-theme-from-shaft-lyrics https://genius.com/Isaac-hayes-theme-from-shaft-lyrics
        datavirtue 5y ago
        Slang for a private investigator, in 1940 maybe.
- datavirtue 5y ago
  LMAO
denlekke 5y ago
anyone have more info on the group that makes these videos ? seems like they make decoy accounts and pretend to be underage targets but would like to learn more about their process: are they legit or would it be equivalent to police entrapment ?
- giraffe_lady 5y ago
  What do you mean legit? Usable in court? Nothing else is really equivalent to "police entrapment" though. What makes that bad is that it's the police doing it, otherwise it's just asking a favor. If you can lie your way to getting someone to confess to a crime that's pretty much fine in the legal system, I think. Police do it all the time anyway and not even as some shady thing they have to hide it's just part of the work.
  - jeffbee 5y ago
    In American jurisprudence, the police can be as deceptive as they want to be in interrogations. They can say that a confederate confessed, that they have evidence, that the victim died or identified the suspect, regardless of the truth of those statements. See the recent Nightingale case, which is hilarious because criminals are idiots. """Ferland and Keegan suggested to Nightingale that they potentially had satellite photography of his car at the Millers’ home; had DNA test results showing that Nightingale’s DNA was on a doorknob and a locking mechanism at the Millers’ home, which was significant because it appeared that the last person out had locked the door; had found flakes of Nightingale’s skin on the Millers’ bodies; and had recovered fingerprint or DNA evidence on money that the detectives told Nightingale they had seized from his father. These were “realistic bluffs” and untrue."""
    - lupire 5y ago
      Related: There is always at least one person lying during a polygraph examination.
  - denlekke 5y ago
    great question ! i guess i was just wondering how the investigators make sure they aren't creating a situation that wouldn't exist otherwise. i couldn't find much info on the process. is the victim a real underage person ? was the victim already being contacted in a sexual way by this guy before the investigators got involved ? having seen internet investigators get things wrong before and having an incentive to create the most sensational content possible, i just want to evaluate for myself how careful they are about what they're doing
oceanghost 5y ago
I assume that as your company scales your chances of hiring criminals are about the same as their presence in the population.
version_five 5y ago
The article tries to make the story all about Facebook, when it basically just boils down to the fact that a (alleged, there is still due process required) pervert worked there. They didn't know about him, they weren't harboring him or anything, it's just a low level employee doing something inappropriate.
- spywaregorilla 5y ago
  The head of global community development is a low level employee?
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - mdoms 5y ago
    > The head of global community development The article says "a head", not "the head", and refers to him as "manager of global community development". Of course I can't confirm this, but on one of the big Reddit threads on this topic an anonymous user claimed to be a Meta employee and looked this fella up, he managed 10 people. Just a low level people manager.
    - spywaregorilla 5y ago
      10 direct reports is very different from total downstream people. Feels unclear still
    - ghaff 5y ago
      A manager of community development isn't even necessarily a people manager. That said, other people with a similar title at Facebook on LinkedIn do seem to be fairly experienced (although not really senior) so they may very well manage people.
  - itake 5y ago
    I glanced through a cache of his twitter account. I would expect important industry leaders with twitter accounts would have larger following. I don't think this was a high level roll like the article described.
mdoms 5y ago
I have seen the video (or parts of it) and it's hard to imagine how he could not be considered guilty. On the other hand, determining the innocence or guilt of a person based on videos from vigilante groups who have a huge incentive to produce dramatic videos makes me incredibly, incredibly uncomfortable.
- sillysaurusx 5y ago
  Wanna link to the juicy parts? Embrace the drama. EDIT: 40m32s is so damning. https://youtu.be/XDbMDy2e44w#t=40m32s https://youtu.be/XDbMDy2e44w#t=40m32s I’m amazed how stupid he is for not shutting up and walking out the door.
  - mdoms 5y ago
    Highlights are here https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1494455923049390080 https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1494455923049390080
  - Kranar 5y ago
    The interrogators are pretty slick at this, and this is clearly not their first rodeo. The way you stop someone from walking out the door is you pretend that if they cooperate with you, you will help them out and contain this issue; if they don't cooperate with you then their life is ruined. You can see this from the good cop/bad cop routine they have setup between the man and the woman [1] Once you're caught as a pedophile who is lured into a hotel room with walls of text worth of conversations, you're basically done. At that point in your mind you're praying that the person who caught you doesn't disclose this to everyone, your job, your partner, your family, etc... You are praying that there is some way to contain this issue and get some help, and the good cop interrogator gives you some hope that she will help you contain it and that while she thinks what you did is disgusting, she can help get you out of the worst of it if only you cooperate and do what she tells you. Of course in reality it's not like these interrogators are good guys themselves and this entire thing is being streamed to Twitch in real time. The whole thing is just a crappy mess. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_cop/bad_cop https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_cop/bad_cop
strangattractor 5y ago
- pc86 5y ago
  So you're saying this is part of corporate policy? Or what, exactly?
sillysaurusx 5y ago
One interesting secondary effect: people are now saying Reddit (the company) is participating in a coverup, even to the extent of deleting accounts. https://twitter.com/simpbloodbath/status/1494464667032252432?s=21 https://twitter.com/simpbloodbath/status/1494464667032252432... I want to say “I doubt that’s true,” but that’s the thing about propaganda. It’s often hard to tell. EDIT: it seems true: https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyFuckingVideos/comments/suq88j/removed_by_reddit/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyFuckingVideos/comments/suq88j/... Hmm. That’s not a great look. On the other hand, the submitter’s account still seems to be active. Maybe they reversed.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- itsdrewmiller 5y ago
  https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/top/ https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/top/ it's literally the #1 video of the day in what I assume is the biggest videos sub; they are probably just removing reposts.
  - sillysaurusx 5y ago
    Reddit admins themselves removing reposts? Seems unlikely. And sure, it’s #1 now. The point was that they were doing this as the story was unfolding. If you look at the timestamps, there’s a pretty big gap between the one at #1 and the one I linked. It’s pretty strange seeing admins remove a post like this. And a bunch of people are saying they saw the account get suspended.
    - itsdrewmiller 5y ago
      The video was posted 19 hours ago.
      - sillysaurusx 5y ago
        Yep. And the one that was deleted by admins was posted over a day ago. It now seems at least plausible that someone was trying to wipe this story, and lost. At the time, users felt frustrated no one was covering this: https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyFuckingVideos/comments/suq88j/comment/hxbjc2v/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3 https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyFuckingVideos/comments/suq88j/...
duhballs 5y ago
Smart move by Meta.
newaccount2021 5y ago
syspec 5y ago
Yikes, here is that Jeren Miles at an event for the Boys and Girls club[0]. - [0] https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DyQT5vZUcAAtUDe.jpg https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DyQT5vZUcAAtUDe.jpg
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
fallingknife 5y ago
Article - "a manager of" Headline - "a head of" HN Title - "head of"
floatinglotus 5y ago
Well, it seems like he had the right job at Facebook.

118 points by spenvo 5y ago

spywaregorilla 5y ago

kwertyoowiyop 5y ago
Sometimes when HN resembles Reddit, it’s too funny to complain about.
- keeganpoppen 5y ago
  as you can see, humor is not tolerated on HN (, unfortunately)
  - Nicksil 5y ago
    >as you can see, humor is not tolerated on HN (, unfortunately) It is if it's funny.
- syspec 5y ago
  What was the comment?

smm11 5y ago

Nice screening process for the company that knows everything about you.

mdoms 5y ago
I keep seeing this criticism and I don't get it. Presumably no one knew about his proclivities - not his parents, not his best friend, not his wife (if he had one), no one. It's obviously a very secretive part of his life and it's unreasonable to expect an employer to somehow know this about him. Meta employes 60,000 people according to a quick google search. I promise you there are plenty of Meta employees who have hobbies and interests the employer doesn't know about.
- KennyBlanken 5y ago
  - z3c0 5y ago
    I think you knew what they meant. Changing the wording doesn't change their point, so you're nitpicking semantics.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- Mountain_Skies 5y ago
  There aren't 60,000 employees who are the Head of Global Community Development. I'm not sure how far up the org chart that position is but I'm betting it's up in the top 1% of the company. It's not like this is the janitor or the person stocking the supply closet.
  - iqanq 5y ago
    So what do you want, Facebook to hire dicks to investigate employees?
    - mauvehaus 5y ago
      In case the downvotes are for language, "dick" is also slang for a detective, sometimes specifically a private investigator[0], which I infer the parent intended in their usage. Which isn't to say it's never been used in a double entendre with its more common meaning. See, for instance, the theme to Shaft[1]. [0] https://www.quora.com/How-did-the-term-private-dick-for-a-private-investigator-originate?share=1 https://www.quora.com/How-did-the-term-private-dick-for-a-pr... [1] https://genius.com/Isaac-hayes-theme-from-shaft-lyrics https://genius.com/Isaac-hayes-theme-from-shaft-lyrics
      - datavirtue 5y ago
        Slang for a private investigator, in 1940 maybe.
datavirtue 5y ago
LMAO

denlekke 5y ago

anyone have more info on the group that makes these videos ? seems like they make decoy accounts and pretend to be underage targets but would like to learn more about their process: are they legit or would it be equivalent to police entrapment ?

giraffe_lady 5y ago
What do you mean legit? Usable in court? Nothing else is really equivalent to "police entrapment" though. What makes that bad is that it's the police doing it, otherwise it's just asking a favor. If you can lie your way to getting someone to confess to a crime that's pretty much fine in the legal system, I think. Police do it all the time anyway and not even as some shady thing they have to hide it's just part of the work.
- jeffbee 5y ago
  In American jurisprudence, the police can be as deceptive as they want to be in interrogations. They can say that a confederate confessed, that they have evidence, that the victim died or identified the suspect, regardless of the truth of those statements. See the recent Nightingale case, which is hilarious because criminals are idiots. """Ferland and Keegan suggested to Nightingale that they potentially had satellite photography of his car at the Millers’ home; had DNA test results showing that Nightingale’s DNA was on a doorknob and a locking mechanism at the Millers’ home, which was significant because it appeared that the last person out had locked the door; had found flakes of Nightingale’s skin on the Millers’ bodies; and had recovered fingerprint or DNA evidence on money that the detectives told Nightingale they had seized from his father. These were “realistic bluffs” and untrue."""
  - lupire 5y ago
    Related: There is always at least one person lying during a polygraph examination.
- denlekke 5y ago
  great question ! i guess i was just wondering how the investigators make sure they aren't creating a situation that wouldn't exist otherwise. i couldn't find much info on the process. is the victim a real underage person ? was the victim already being contacted in a sexual way by this guy before the investigators got involved ? having seen internet investigators get things wrong before and having an incentive to create the most sensational content possible, i just want to evaluate for myself how careful they are about what they're doing

oceanghost 5y ago

I assume that as your company scales your chances of hiring criminals are about the same as their presence in the population.

version_five 5y ago

The article tries to make the story all about Facebook, when it basically just boils down to the fact that a (alleged, there is still due process required) pervert worked there. They didn't know about him, they weren't harboring him or anything, it's just a low level employee doing something inappropriate.

spywaregorilla 5y ago
The head of global community development is a low level employee?
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- mdoms 5y ago
  > The head of global community development The article says "a head", not "the head", and refers to him as "manager of global community development". Of course I can't confirm this, but on one of the big Reddit threads on this topic an anonymous user claimed to be a Meta employee and looked this fella up, he managed 10 people. Just a low level people manager.
  - spywaregorilla 5y ago
    10 direct reports is very different from total downstream people. Feels unclear still
  - ghaff 5y ago
    A manager of community development isn't even necessarily a people manager. That said, other people with a similar title at Facebook on LinkedIn do seem to be fairly experienced (although not really senior) so they may very well manage people.
- itake 5y ago
  I glanced through a cache of his twitter account. I would expect important industry leaders with twitter accounts would have larger following. I don't think this was a high level roll like the article described.

mdoms 5y ago

I have seen the video (or parts of it) and it's hard to imagine how he could not be considered guilty. On the other hand, determining the innocence or guilt of a person based on videos from vigilante groups who have a huge incentive to produce dramatic videos makes me incredibly, incredibly uncomfortable.

sillysaurusx 5y ago
Wanna link to the juicy parts? Embrace the drama. EDIT: 40m32s is so damning. https://youtu.be/XDbMDy2e44w#t=40m32s https://youtu.be/XDbMDy2e44w#t=40m32s I’m amazed how stupid he is for not shutting up and walking out the door.
- mdoms 5y ago
  Highlights are here https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1494455923049390080 https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1494455923049390080
- Kranar 5y ago
  The interrogators are pretty slick at this, and this is clearly not their first rodeo. The way you stop someone from walking out the door is you pretend that if they cooperate with you, you will help them out and contain this issue; if they don't cooperate with you then their life is ruined. You can see this from the good cop/bad cop routine they have setup between the man and the woman [1] Once you're caught as a pedophile who is lured into a hotel room with walls of text worth of conversations, you're basically done. At that point in your mind you're praying that the person who caught you doesn't disclose this to everyone, your job, your partner, your family, etc... You are praying that there is some way to contain this issue and get some help, and the good cop interrogator gives you some hope that she will help you contain it and that while she thinks what you did is disgusting, she can help get you out of the worst of it if only you cooperate and do what she tells you. Of course in reality it's not like these interrogators are good guys themselves and this entire thing is being streamed to Twitch in real time. The whole thing is just a crappy mess. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_cop/bad_cop https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_cop/bad_cop

strangattractor 5y ago

pc86 5y ago
So you're saying this is part of corporate policy? Or what, exactly?

sillysaurusx 5y ago

One interesting secondary effect: people are now saying Reddit (the company) is participating in a coverup, even to the extent of deleting accounts. https://twitter.com/simpbloodbath/status/1494464667032252432?s=21 https://twitter.com/simpbloodbath/status/1494464667032252432... I want to say “I doubt that’s true,” but that’s the thing about propaganda. It’s often hard to tell. EDIT: it seems true: https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyFuckingVideos/comments/suq88j/removed_by_reddit/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyFuckingVideos/comments/suq88j/... Hmm. That’s not a great look. On the other hand, the submitter’s account still seems to be active. Maybe they reversed.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
itsdrewmiller 5y ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/top/ https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/top/ it's literally the #1 video of the day in what I assume is the biggest videos sub; they are probably just removing reposts.
- sillysaurusx 5y ago
  Reddit admins themselves removing reposts? Seems unlikely. And sure, it’s #1 now. The point was that they were doing this as the story was unfolding. If you look at the timestamps, there’s a pretty big gap between the one at #1 and the one I linked. It’s pretty strange seeing admins remove a post like this. And a bunch of people are saying they saw the account get suspended.
  - itsdrewmiller 5y ago
    The video was posted 19 hours ago.
    - sillysaurusx 5y ago
      Yep. And the one that was deleted by admins was posted over a day ago. It now seems at least plausible that someone was trying to wipe this story, and lost. At the time, users felt frustrated no one was covering this: https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyFuckingVideos/comments/suq88j/comment/hxbjc2v/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3 https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyFuckingVideos/comments/suq88j/...

duhballs 5y ago

Smart move by Meta.

newaccount2021 5y ago

syspec 5y ago

Yikes, here is that Jeren Miles at an event for the Boys and Girls club[0]. - [0] https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DyQT5vZUcAAtUDe.jpg https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DyQT5vZUcAAtUDe.jpg

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

fallingknife 5y ago

Article - "a manager of" Headline - "a head of" HN Title - "head of"

floatinglotus 5y ago

Well, it seems like he had the right job at Facebook.