7 ms·

Some conclusions about the high desert after five months of desert life

pnathan 5y ago
I grew up in the high desert. My comment therefore is as follows: This, too, is vanity.
- vehemenz 5y ago
  He admits as much. > But I’m really not different at all. It’s salutary to remember that you are just a type of guy, as my friend Adam reminded me. I sing the praises of the non-consumer wilderness, but will still go to great pains to obtain a fancy croissant. To the longtime residents, I am instantly identifiable as a recent Angeleno, even if I’m wearing a dirty t-shirt and cut-off shorts. My hands are too soft, my body language is too awkward. Maybe if I live out here for like a decade it won’t be accurate to accuse me of LARPing anymore.
  - fullshark 5y ago
    Seems to me like a nonfiction / memoir version of lampshade hanging: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LampshadeHanging https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LampshadeHanging
  - pnathan 5y ago
    Not what I mean. The entire experience that it's a different place, that it inherently is different from the city. The interiority of the individual does not change, although the external world may reflect into the interior differently and the individuals' mind may easily filter one way or another. You can be and have the same interior experience if you're in the middle of a city, or if you're on the top of a mountain. it's just a place to live. one with better air and fewer people.
    - fullshark 5y ago
      I thought you were quoting the bible and was trying to decipher it: https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Ecclesiastes%204%3A4 https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Ecclesiastes%204%3A4
      - pnathan 5y ago
        I was. The whole logical schema here is vanity - or, more literally from the Hebrew - a pursuit after wind, a momentary breath, a flicker of wind on the cheek... The author's experience is that "same structure, new shapes" is the quality of the urban life. But that is also the quality of rural life, although the specific details differ; this is simply another shape in the same structure of life. Whether you're in the city, or the suburbs, or the emptiness of the mountain, you are who you are, people are who they are, there's no innate difference in the matter. The environment is strictly the environment. This, too, is vanity. To further quote the unnamed author - > Only this, I have found, is a real good: that one should eat and drink and get pleasure with all the gains he makes under the sun, during the numbered days of life that God has given him; for that is his portion. To be able to dwell in contentment where one is, is a real blessing.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
danans 5y ago
> Nobody is trying to monetize this uniqueness with a YouTube channel or anything. They just exist that way. To the contrary, people monetizing their unique lifestyles or skills in remote non urban places is a major thing on YouTube. Some are in the environs of Joshua Tree, no less. Just dip your toes in the off-grid or permaculture lifestyle worlds and you'll find them.
- betwixthewires 5y ago
  I think the point of the statement is less "nobody out here is monetizing it on YouTube" and more "you'll meet all sorts of interesting people out here and most of them just live the way they live, no incentive required." Sure you can go on YouTube and live vicariously through a young white dude with a cute girlfriend in a flat bill cap and Oakley sunglasses and a 100k RV shilling products at you and starting every video with "what is up guys hit the notification bell down below", and maybe you can imagine your life being more like that. Maybe you'll even learn a thing or two about gardening or cooling an aluminum box in the summer. But actually getting out there, you'll find a ton of people actually living interesting lives without a gopro on a selfie stick.
  - thfuran 5y ago
    >you'll meet all sorts of interesting people out here and most of them just live the way they live, no incentive required." But isn't that true pretty much everywhere?
    - betwixthewires 5y ago
      Not really. There are interesting people all over sure, but will you meet them? In cities, not very often unfortunately.
      - thebigman433 5y ago
        Really couldnt disagree more. You will meet just as many interesting people in cities. The only difference between urban and rural areas is what generally makes people interesting I think.
citizenpaul 5y ago
> a couple of dogs we didn’t know were running around in our yard. A guy came and picked them up in his truck a few hours later. He explained that they broke out of the yard of a woman down the road...She didn’t want to collect them herself, she was tired. I cannot fathom how someone can live a life this way or how they get there and continue to exist without dying of laziness. How can you care so little and still have animals to take care of much less yourself. It is incomprehensible to me.
- andrei_says_ 5y ago
  Tiredness may be related to health issues. Like, long Covid.
  - akulbe 5y ago
    It has been almost 9 months since I came home from my hospitalization with COVID. Prior to that, I'd have thought the same as citizenpaul. Now that I'm dealing with "long COVID" in a big, big way… I thought the same as you, and wondered if it wasn't something like that going on. Priorities have shifted, for sure. Having come >< close to death, the things you used to think were super important just don't seem to matter as much in the grand scheme of things.
- micromacrofoot 5y ago
  in a lot of rural areas dogs just roam around, neighborhood dogs would wander into our house sometimes they’ll come home when they’re hungry, as long as they don’t bother livestock people don’t tend to care much
  - dendrite9 5y ago
    I don't think people realize this because they aren't exposed to it. My sibling almost got bitten by our relative's dog because they got down in the dog's face and went to pet him. The dog lived roaming in an orchard and now lives in a fenced in yard, but isn't used to new people, especially people invading its space. It seems especially common among a group of friends who have pets they dote upon like children to assume all dogs are friendly unless told otherwise. But that isn't true everywhere and they aren't all so socialized. The previous set of dogs would leave in the morning, run through the ditches, find other dogs, then come back later. Occasionally it was a concern, but often they were free to roam.
wyclif 5y ago
What kind of homes and properties are the Angelinos migrating to Joshua Tree buying or building?
- radicaldreamer 5y ago
  Expensive ones
  - soared 5y ago
    The types of homes purchased by people who casually have wine and escargot, and don’t think twice when blogging about it.
paulcole 5y ago
This reads like an AI trained on Joan Didion and tech bros.
- thebooktocome 5y ago
  Joan Didion didn’t deserve that.
  - paulcole 5y ago
    It honestly wasn’t meant as a shot at her. Tech bros on the other hand… Comical (but bang-on accurate) to start this by quoting Paul Graham.
- gnramires 5y ago
  I thought it was beautiful, specially the meditative state of the desert silence. I find 'tech bro' characterization uncalled for here (and uncharitable in general) -- dismissing someone's personal writing based on stereotype. Stereotyping any large number of people (could be psychologists, writers, scientists or tech workers) never leads to a good reflection. It's more in vogue to do so with well off people, but no less uncharitable.
matthewdgreen 5y ago
> You don’t get to only hang out with Democrats. Former Trump voters are the people who drag your car out of the sand when it gets stuck, or help you fix your bathroom, and they are extremely nice, and don’t turn their noses down at your fussy jute rugs or purple sofa. I guess I’ve always assumed that (like myself) many US city dwellers grew up in rural areas and migrated to the city because of the lack of economic opportunity. Many others grew up in generally conservative working class urban areas. So I’m constantly surprised that Substackers feel the need to constantly remind their audience that rural people are ordinary folks and don’t have forked tongues or whatever. At the same time I feel articles like this one miss a lot of the real tragedy that goes on in US rural areas. For city migrants with fancy remote jobs there’s plenty to enjoy. But your children will have to leave the area when they grow up, at least to maintain a similar quality of life. Having moved to a medium-size city (and left my rural home at 18) I am contemplating the idea that my own children might live close to me after they grow up - or at least they could choose to. That’s exciting and I think trumps any amount of natural beauty I miss living in Baltimore. And over the course of my lifetime politics has become polarized in a very nasty way, largely due (I think) to the economic circumstances. You can ignore this but it’s still there. Finally: if your friends in the city are pretentious, make some new friends.
- pnathan 5y ago
  > For city migrants with fancy remote jobs there’s plenty to enjoy. But your children will have to leave the area when they grow up, at least to maintain a similar quality of life. Having moved to a medium-size city (and left my rural home at 18) I am contemplating the idea that my own children might live close to me after they grow up - or at least they could choose to. That’s exciting and I think trumps any amount of natural beauty I miss living in Baltimore. Absolutely true. Part of why we want to be in the city is so that our children don't _have_ to leave, like we had to.
  - s1artibartfast 5y ago
    Yes and no. There is always the option of being a "townie". I moved into a city 15 years ago and often ponder what life would be like if I had stayed, and what I want for my children. While city life certainly comes with more monetary opportunity, I am still not sure it is worth the costs. I earn 200k/yr and struggle with the prospect of being a home owner here, knowing full well I make well above the median. Visiting my home town, I talk with peers who stuck around and bought homes with a bar tender's salary shortly after graduating highschool. They have their own challenges, but they are very different than mine. The grass is always greener, but I feel that the American dream of family, home ownership, and independence and is much more attainable in small towns.
1024core 5y ago
I recently visited JT after a gap of 20 years. I was shocked at how much it had changed. Where there were just the odd, local mom-and-pop shops peddling essentials, there were now shops selling high-end fashion crap. JT has become LA suburbia.
maxk42 5y ago
Five months, eh? Convenient that you just missed July and August. Let us know how you feel in another seven months.
- lazide 5y ago
  It’s like the Pacific Northwest and folks who move based on experiences during a visit anytime from May to August. It works itself out long term, but being one? Oof. That was a harsh awakening. I never knew moss could grow on a sidewalk before. Before I left, I knew it was amazing you could even see the sidewalk.
gumby 5y ago
> LA is great… As you approach the city you feel the ambient stress levels start ramping up. I find the Bay Area, and the valley in particular energizing, and even high stress. There’s something going on on every corner. My wife, an artist, found it dull, a cultural wasteland. When we went to LA she was excited by the high energy buzz, all the activity wherever you looked, and so much creativity. While to me, it was a sleepy place: the people even walked slowly and had long lunches! All a matter of perspective.
- andreilys 5y ago
  I mean… the SFBA when benchmarked against NYC and LA is a cultural wasteland, I don’t think that’s a matter of opinion. Very few artists/creatives live there because they are priced out by tech workers.
  - opportune 5y ago
    Depends on what you mean by culture. In terms of haute or prestige culture including the arts that would be correct. But if you are looking for fringe subcultures like psychonauts, ENM, amateur philosophy, people into weird shit like growing gourmet mushrooms or home (not necessarily illegal) chemistry - basically the stuff you wouldn't see on Instagram or whatever because it's too niche and weird - the SFBA has a really high density.
- vmception 5y ago
  But in what way is your perspective about SF Bay Area objective? From what I noticed, the people that like that place and aspire for it, aside from natives: Live in northern california or central valley and have no other city around. They aspire to escape their circumstance to SF. Other groups of people that have no other frame of reference of the other major cities, specifically LA/NYC. A work visa holder with no choice in the matter. Or people with other frames of reference that love the outdoors and doing things an 1-4 hours away from the area but pretending it is something they do in that area. “What do you like about San Francisco?” <fond memories of hikes in Marin and Lake Tahoe> Just for the benefit of the doubt I’m going to put you in that last category. I’m really just hoping that you don’t mean running around to tech meetups for pizza and AWS credits and saying its a matter of perspective.
antisthenes 5y ago
Maybe the author has a point in there somewhere, but I honestly can't get through writing like this. Reads as vapid, shallow nonsense.
antisthenes 5y ago
Maybe the author has a point in there somewhere, but I honestly couldn't get through the writing. Who's the target audience for this? Reads as vapid, shallow nonsense, and there's certainly no conclusions, let alone arguments anywhere to be seen.
- kerneloftruth 5y ago
  Actually, I think you understand it all really well. That's a good characterization. TFA is unintended self-parody.
danboarder 5y ago
"The environment forcibly meditates you." I love this quote, and I've experienced it while backpacking through the desert and through mountains as well, almost complete loss of time and forgetting all the things I used to care about (like checking what is on the front page of HN, for example). Coming back to the city is a weird feeling of "time" returning, almost like a regaining of consciousness after being asleep, it's a strange sensation. But also returning to the city pushes that meditative awareness side of me back into the shadow.
renewiltord 5y ago
I like this guy, honestly. But this sounds like someone who took their gap year in their middle age.
djrogers 5y ago
“ The world, you find out, is held together by sturdy guys with beards named Jim who don’t give two sh##s about what you think or how you behave. Some of them say “God bless” and “have a blessed day” without a hint of irony.” This right here is what so many people who never leave big cities miss out on.
- thebigman433 5y ago
  > This right here is what so many people who never leave big cities miss out on. I think this is also a highly idealized version of these people. I grew up in the Bay Area but have spent the majority of the last 5 years in Montana. There are plenty of kind and gracious people, but there are also a huge amount of people that do actually care about how you behave and where youre from. Ive been told countless times to leave the state, go back to where Im from, etc. The culture is definitely different from cities, but anyone who tells you its all rainbows, sunshine, and people saying "god bless" no matter what is lying to you.
  - wrycoder 5y ago
    Maybe they infer that you are making suggestions how they should live their lives? “Countless times” would indicate that it’s about you, not them.
    - watwut 5y ago
      Or he is just visibly noticeably different. Some rural places have in fact hostile culture. Others don't, sure, but some really do.
    - thebooktocome 5y ago
      That may be the anxiety that causes their behavior, but it’s an anxiety borne out of their own preconceptions. You don’t have to do anything in particular to set them off: mere passive existence is enough. At least, in my experience.
    - thebigman433 5y ago
draw_down 5y ago
the_gipsy 5y ago
> You go to cities for commerce, optionality, stimulation, sex, culture, bright lights, and the feeling of being relevant. Cities tell you that, whatever human life is about, you are right on top of it. No, Sasha, most people go to the city to escape poverty.
- dragonwriter 5y ago
  “to escape poverty” is a subset of “for commerce”.
- technothrasher 5y ago
  Some of us don’t go to cities at all if they can help it. My visit to a city is usually because I was dragged there by somebody else, or because I’m traveling through to get somewhere else. I’ve visited enough cities (in every continent but South America, and Antarctica obviously) to know you all can keep them.
  - the_gipsy 5y ago
    I recently moved out of the city too, and everything in the article resonates with me. It's just that people that move into the city usually do it to get a better job. If you have been born there, yea, it probably feels like what the author said, you don't even realize.
soared 5y ago
Oh boy do I not like this blog post! It’s well written and entertaining, but painfully unaware of itself despite thinking it is self aware. Rich guy from LA buys a house closer to nature and experiences the life most people live but thinks it’s some transformative magical experience. Goes back to LA to eat escargot with friends but finds the city not as relaxing. It’s like he’s cosplaying as a normal person. Although if the article is written like this on purpose, it’s a work of art.
- yellow_postit 5y ago
  To their credit they seem self aware with the comment on LARPing being a person that really lives there.
- wrycoder 5y ago
  Definitely keeps his teddy bear in LA. But I like the writing.
- morsch 5y ago
  I don't think it's well written, in fact I found it almost physically uncomfortable to read, but I'll agree that it's impressive if done on purpose.
- porknubbins 5y ago
  I found his description of LA as pretty dead on for why I moved out of NYC. There is endless novelty on some level but little or no actual meta-novelty, i.e. you can consume different things and experiences but you can’t not consume. I do think he misses a lot about the benefits of living in a less popular area which are mostly around long term things like building, creating, community etc and freedom to decide your own pattern of living.
astura 5y ago
Whoop-de-do, you spent five months somewhere. >Former Trump voters are the people who drag your car out of the sand when it gets stuck, or help you fix your bathroom, and they are extremely nice, and don’t turn their noses down at your fussy jute rugs or purple sofa. Yeah... This is going to be highly dependant on your race and ethnicity. I'm really sick of this holier than thou attitude, and it's not even true. The implication is that people who vote Democrat won't help you when you break down and give a thought about your interior design choices. It's just not true, grow up. I spent 20 minutes listening to someone from Mississippi talking about how much better she is than "people around here" because she once helped "a Dominican or Puerto Rican" who broke down in front of her house. ... Except every single person I personally know around here would have done the same, except nobody I know around here would think to brag about it or pat themselves on the back.
betwixthewires 5y ago
I've read this thread and agree with most of the criticism, but still, this portrayal does resonate with me. It's about the desert, but could be equally applied to getting away from cities to a slower paced place with a lot of outside going on. I did that (for more than 5 months) and never intend to go back to the cities. Just being able to see the stars in the sky and the lack of traffic make it worth whatever inconveniences come along with slower paced life. The noise of life is always in the background in the city, there's a base level stress that's just always there. Some people thrive on it. Some people, like me, need the calm.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

I grew up in the high desert. My comment therefore is as follows: This, too, is vanity.

vehemenz 5y ago
He admits as much. > But I’m really not different at all. It’s salutary to remember that you are just a type of guy, as my friend Adam reminded me. I sing the praises of the non-consumer wilderness, but will still go to great pains to obtain a fancy croissant. To the longtime residents, I am instantly identifiable as a recent Angeleno, even if I’m wearing a dirty t-shirt and cut-off shorts. My hands are too soft, my body language is too awkward. Maybe if I live out here for like a decade it won’t be accurate to accuse me of LARPing anymore.
- fullshark 5y ago
  Seems to me like a nonfiction / memoir version of lampshade hanging: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LampshadeHanging https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LampshadeHanging
- pnathan 5y ago
  Not what I mean. The entire experience that it's a different place, that it inherently is different from the city. The interiority of the individual does not change, although the external world may reflect into the interior differently and the individuals' mind may easily filter one way or another. You can be and have the same interior experience if you're in the middle of a city, or if you're on the top of a mountain. it's just a place to live. one with better air and fewer people.
  - fullshark 5y ago
    I thought you were quoting the bible and was trying to decipher it: https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Ecclesiastes%204%3A4 https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Ecclesiastes%204%3A4
    - pnathan 5y ago
      I was. The whole logical schema here is vanity - or, more literally from the Hebrew - a pursuit after wind, a momentary breath, a flicker of wind on the cheek... The author's experience is that "same structure, new shapes" is the quality of the urban life. But that is also the quality of rural life, although the specific details differ; this is simply another shape in the same structure of life. Whether you're in the city, or the suburbs, or the emptiness of the mountain, you are who you are, people are who they are, there's no innate difference in the matter. The environment is strictly the environment. This, too, is vanity. To further quote the unnamed author - > Only this, I have found, is a real good: that one should eat and drink and get pleasure with all the gains he makes under the sun, during the numbered days of life that God has given him; for that is his portion. To be able to dwell in contentment where one is, is a real blessing.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

> Nobody is trying to monetize this uniqueness with a YouTube channel or anything. They just exist that way. To the contrary, people monetizing their unique lifestyles or skills in remote non urban places is a major thing on YouTube. Some are in the environs of Joshua Tree, no less. Just dip your toes in the off-grid or permaculture lifestyle worlds and you'll find them.

betwixthewires 5y ago
I think the point of the statement is less "nobody out here is monetizing it on YouTube" and more "you'll meet all sorts of interesting people out here and most of them just live the way they live, no incentive required." Sure you can go on YouTube and live vicariously through a young white dude with a cute girlfriend in a flat bill cap and Oakley sunglasses and a 100k RV shilling products at you and starting every video with "what is up guys hit the notification bell down below", and maybe you can imagine your life being more like that. Maybe you'll even learn a thing or two about gardening or cooling an aluminum box in the summer. But actually getting out there, you'll find a ton of people actually living interesting lives without a gopro on a selfie stick.
- thfuran 5y ago
  >you'll meet all sorts of interesting people out here and most of them just live the way they live, no incentive required." But isn't that true pretty much everywhere?
  - betwixthewires 5y ago
    Not really. There are interesting people all over sure, but will you meet them? In cities, not very often unfortunately.
    - thebigman433 5y ago
      Really couldnt disagree more. You will meet just as many interesting people in cities. The only difference between urban and rural areas is what generally makes people interesting I think.

citizenpaul 5y ago

> a couple of dogs we didn’t know were running around in our yard. A guy came and picked them up in his truck a few hours later. He explained that they broke out of the yard of a woman down the road...She didn’t want to collect them herself, she was tired. I cannot fathom how someone can live a life this way or how they get there and continue to exist without dying of laziness. How can you care so little and still have animals to take care of much less yourself. It is incomprehensible to me.

andrei_says_ 5y ago
Tiredness may be related to health issues. Like, long Covid.
- akulbe 5y ago
  It has been almost 9 months since I came home from my hospitalization with COVID. Prior to that, I'd have thought the same as citizenpaul. Now that I'm dealing with "long COVID" in a big, big way… I thought the same as you, and wondered if it wasn't something like that going on. Priorities have shifted, for sure. Having come >< close to death, the things you used to think were super important just don't seem to matter as much in the grand scheme of things.
micromacrofoot 5y ago
in a lot of rural areas dogs just roam around, neighborhood dogs would wander into our house sometimes they’ll come home when they’re hungry, as long as they don’t bother livestock people don’t tend to care much
- dendrite9 5y ago
  I don't think people realize this because they aren't exposed to it. My sibling almost got bitten by our relative's dog because they got down in the dog's face and went to pet him. The dog lived roaming in an orchard and now lives in a fenced in yard, but isn't used to new people, especially people invading its space. It seems especially common among a group of friends who have pets they dote upon like children to assume all dogs are friendly unless told otherwise. But that isn't true everywhere and they aren't all so socialized. The previous set of dogs would leave in the morning, run through the ditches, find other dogs, then come back later. Occasionally it was a concern, but often they were free to roam.

wyclif 5y ago

What kind of homes and properties are the Angelinos migrating to Joshua Tree buying or building?

radicaldreamer 5y ago
Expensive ones
- soared 5y ago
  The types of homes purchased by people who casually have wine and escargot, and don’t think twice when blogging about it.

paulcole 5y ago

This reads like an AI trained on Joan Didion and tech bros.

thebooktocome 5y ago
Joan Didion didn’t deserve that.
- paulcole 5y ago
  It honestly wasn’t meant as a shot at her. Tech bros on the other hand… Comical (but bang-on accurate) to start this by quoting Paul Graham.
gnramires 5y ago
I thought it was beautiful, specially the meditative state of the desert silence. I find 'tech bro' characterization uncalled for here (and uncharitable in general) -- dismissing someone's personal writing based on stereotype. Stereotyping any large number of people (could be psychologists, writers, scientists or tech workers) never leads to a good reflection. It's more in vogue to do so with well off people, but no less uncharitable.

matthewdgreen 5y ago

> You don’t get to only hang out with Democrats. Former Trump voters are the people who drag your car out of the sand when it gets stuck, or help you fix your bathroom, and they are extremely nice, and don’t turn their noses down at your fussy jute rugs or purple sofa. I guess I’ve always assumed that (like myself) many US city dwellers grew up in rural areas and migrated to the city because of the lack of economic opportunity. Many others grew up in generally conservative working class urban areas. So I’m constantly surprised that Substackers feel the need to constantly remind their audience that rural people are ordinary folks and don’t have forked tongues or whatever. At the same time I feel articles like this one miss a lot of the real tragedy that goes on in US rural areas. For city migrants with fancy remote jobs there’s plenty to enjoy. But your children will have to leave the area when they grow up, at least to maintain a similar quality of life. Having moved to a medium-size city (and left my rural home at 18) I am contemplating the idea that my own children might live close to me after they grow up - or at least they could choose to. That’s exciting and I think trumps any amount of natural beauty I miss living in Baltimore. And over the course of my lifetime politics has become polarized in a very nasty way, largely due (I think) to the economic circumstances. You can ignore this but it’s still there. Finally: if your friends in the city are pretentious, make some new friends.

pnathan 5y ago
> For city migrants with fancy remote jobs there’s plenty to enjoy. But your children will have to leave the area when they grow up, at least to maintain a similar quality of life. Having moved to a medium-size city (and left my rural home at 18) I am contemplating the idea that my own children might live close to me after they grow up - or at least they could choose to. That’s exciting and I think trumps any amount of natural beauty I miss living in Baltimore. Absolutely true. Part of why we want to be in the city is so that our children don't _have_ to leave, like we had to.
- s1artibartfast 5y ago
  Yes and no. There is always the option of being a "townie". I moved into a city 15 years ago and often ponder what life would be like if I had stayed, and what I want for my children. While city life certainly comes with more monetary opportunity, I am still not sure it is worth the costs. I earn 200k/yr and struggle with the prospect of being a home owner here, knowing full well I make well above the median. Visiting my home town, I talk with peers who stuck around and bought homes with a bar tender's salary shortly after graduating highschool. They have their own challenges, but they are very different than mine. The grass is always greener, but I feel that the American dream of family, home ownership, and independence and is much more attainable in small towns.

1024core 5y ago

I recently visited JT after a gap of 20 years. I was shocked at how much it had changed. Where there were just the odd, local mom-and-pop shops peddling essentials, there were now shops selling high-end fashion crap. JT has become LA suburbia.

maxk42 5y ago

Five months, eh? Convenient that you just missed July and August. Let us know how you feel in another seven months.

lazide 5y ago
It’s like the Pacific Northwest and folks who move based on experiences during a visit anytime from May to August. It works itself out long term, but being one? Oof. That was a harsh awakening. I never knew moss could grow on a sidewalk before. Before I left, I knew it was amazing you could even see the sidewalk.

gumby 5y ago

> LA is great… As you approach the city you feel the ambient stress levels start ramping up. I find the Bay Area, and the valley in particular energizing, and even high stress. There’s something going on on every corner. My wife, an artist, found it dull, a cultural wasteland. When we went to LA she was excited by the high energy buzz, all the activity wherever you looked, and so much creativity. While to me, it was a sleepy place: the people even walked slowly and had long lunches! All a matter of perspective.

andreilys 5y ago
I mean… the SFBA when benchmarked against NYC and LA is a cultural wasteland, I don’t think that’s a matter of opinion. Very few artists/creatives live there because they are priced out by tech workers.
- opportune 5y ago
  Depends on what you mean by culture. In terms of haute or prestige culture including the arts that would be correct. But if you are looking for fringe subcultures like psychonauts, ENM, amateur philosophy, people into weird shit like growing gourmet mushrooms or home (not necessarily illegal) chemistry - basically the stuff you wouldn't see on Instagram or whatever because it's too niche and weird - the SFBA has a really high density.
vmception 5y ago
But in what way is your perspective about SF Bay Area objective? From what I noticed, the people that like that place and aspire for it, aside from natives: Live in northern california or central valley and have no other city around. They aspire to escape their circumstance to SF. Other groups of people that have no other frame of reference of the other major cities, specifically LA/NYC. A work visa holder with no choice in the matter. Or people with other frames of reference that love the outdoors and doing things an 1-4 hours away from the area but pretending it is something they do in that area. “What do you like about San Francisco?” <fond memories of hikes in Marin and Lake Tahoe> Just for the benefit of the doubt I’m going to put you in that last category. I’m really just hoping that you don’t mean running around to tech meetups for pizza and AWS credits and saying its a matter of perspective.

antisthenes 5y ago

Maybe the author has a point in there somewhere, but I honestly can't get through writing like this. Reads as vapid, shallow nonsense.

antisthenes 5y ago

Maybe the author has a point in there somewhere, but I honestly couldn't get through the writing. Who's the target audience for this? Reads as vapid, shallow nonsense, and there's certainly no conclusions, let alone arguments anywhere to be seen.

kerneloftruth 5y ago
Actually, I think you understand it all really well. That's a good characterization. TFA is unintended self-parody.

danboarder 5y ago

"The environment forcibly meditates you." I love this quote, and I've experienced it while backpacking through the desert and through mountains as well, almost complete loss of time and forgetting all the things I used to care about (like checking what is on the front page of HN, for example). Coming back to the city is a weird feeling of "time" returning, almost like a regaining of consciousness after being asleep, it's a strange sensation. But also returning to the city pushes that meditative awareness side of me back into the shadow.

renewiltord 5y ago

I like this guy, honestly. But this sounds like someone who took their gap year in their middle age.

djrogers 5y ago

“ The world, you find out, is held together by sturdy guys with beards named Jim who don’t give two sh##s about what you think or how you behave. Some of them say “God bless” and “have a blessed day” without a hint of irony.” This right here is what so many people who never leave big cities miss out on.

thebigman433 5y ago
> This right here is what so many people who never leave big cities miss out on. I think this is also a highly idealized version of these people. I grew up in the Bay Area but have spent the majority of the last 5 years in Montana. There are plenty of kind and gracious people, but there are also a huge amount of people that do actually care about how you behave and where youre from. Ive been told countless times to leave the state, go back to where Im from, etc. The culture is definitely different from cities, but anyone who tells you its all rainbows, sunshine, and people saying "god bless" no matter what is lying to you.
- wrycoder 5y ago
  Maybe they infer that you are making suggestions how they should live their lives? “Countless times” would indicate that it’s about you, not them.
  - watwut 5y ago
    Or he is just visibly noticeably different. Some rural places have in fact hostile culture. Others don't, sure, but some really do.
  - thebooktocome 5y ago
    That may be the anxiety that causes their behavior, but it’s an anxiety borne out of their own preconceptions. You don’t have to do anything in particular to set them off: mere passive existence is enough. At least, in my experience.
  - thebigman433 5y ago

draw_down 5y ago

the_gipsy 5y ago

> You go to cities for commerce, optionality, stimulation, sex, culture, bright lights, and the feeling of being relevant. Cities tell you that, whatever human life is about, you are right on top of it. No, Sasha, most people go to the city to escape poverty.

dragonwriter 5y ago
“to escape poverty” is a subset of “for commerce”.
technothrasher 5y ago
Some of us don’t go to cities at all if they can help it. My visit to a city is usually because I was dragged there by somebody else, or because I’m traveling through to get somewhere else. I’ve visited enough cities (in every continent but South America, and Antarctica obviously) to know you all can keep them.
- the_gipsy 5y ago
  I recently moved out of the city too, and everything in the article resonates with me. It's just that people that move into the city usually do it to get a better job. If you have been born there, yea, it probably feels like what the author said, you don't even realize.

soared 5y ago

Oh boy do I not like this blog post! It’s well written and entertaining, but painfully unaware of itself despite thinking it is self aware. Rich guy from LA buys a house closer to nature and experiences the life most people live but thinks it’s some transformative magical experience. Goes back to LA to eat escargot with friends but finds the city not as relaxing. It’s like he’s cosplaying as a normal person. Although if the article is written like this on purpose, it’s a work of art.

yellow_postit 5y ago
To their credit they seem self aware with the comment on LARPing being a person that really lives there.
wrycoder 5y ago
Definitely keeps his teddy bear in LA. But I like the writing.
morsch 5y ago
I don't think it's well written, in fact I found it almost physically uncomfortable to read, but I'll agree that it's impressive if done on purpose.
porknubbins 5y ago
I found his description of LA as pretty dead on for why I moved out of NYC. There is endless novelty on some level but little or no actual meta-novelty, i.e. you can consume different things and experiences but you can’t not consume. I do think he misses a lot about the benefits of living in a less popular area which are mostly around long term things like building, creating, community etc and freedom to decide your own pattern of living.

astura 5y ago

Whoop-de-do, you spent five months somewhere. >Former Trump voters are the people who drag your car out of the sand when it gets stuck, or help you fix your bathroom, and they are extremely nice, and don’t turn their noses down at your fussy jute rugs or purple sofa. Yeah... This is going to be highly dependant on your race and ethnicity. I'm really sick of this holier than thou attitude, and it's not even true. The implication is that people who vote Democrat won't help you when you break down and give a thought about your interior design choices. It's just not true, grow up. I spent 20 minutes listening to someone from Mississippi talking about how much better she is than "people around here" because she once helped "a Dominican or Puerto Rican" who broke down in front of her house. ... Except every single person I personally know around here would have done the same, except nobody I know around here would think to brag about it or pat themselves on the back.

betwixthewires 5y ago

I've read this thread and agree with most of the criticism, but still, this portrayal does resonate with me. It's about the desert, but could be equally applied to getting away from cities to a slower paced place with a lot of outside going on. I did that (for more than 5 months) and never intend to go back to the cities. Just being able to see the stars in the sky and the lack of traffic make it worth whatever inconveniences come along with slower paced life. The noise of life is always in the background in the city, there's a base level stress that's just always there. Some people thrive on it. Some people, like me, need the calm.

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