5 ms·

Your comment reminds me of the video where they ask white people in Berkeley, CA if voter id laws are racist. They say yes of course they’re racist because Afri

by 300bps 5y ago

Your comment reminds me of the video where they ask white people in Berkeley, CA if voter id laws are racist. They say yes of course they’re racist because African Americans don’t have id as often, don’t have as much access to the internet, don’t know where the DMV is, etc. Then they go to Harlem to ask people what they think of those comments. https://youtu.be/yW2LpFkVfYk https://youtu.be/yW2LpFkVfYk As for your claims themselves, In 3 months I studied 350 hours to pass the hardest test in finance while I was married, had three young children and worked full time. Nobody has time to do the things required to advance your career. You have to make the time. For years, I also recruited and mentored students from an inner city bootcamp near me where the students spend 80-90 hours per week for 12 weeks learning software engineering. The vast majority of students are minority and there is fierce competition to hire graduates by local companies.

inter_netuser 5y ago
What’s the hardest test called?
- 300bps 5y ago
  Google "hardest test in finance" and the CFA exams are the first several pages of results.
  - inter_netuser 5y ago
    The hardest test in finance is a physics/math PhD defence, from MIT or Caltech. CFA is just a decoy.
learc83 5y ago
You can select people to display in your man on the street interview segment to make it look like the average American doesn’t know who the President is. Regardless of what some people in Harlem think, data shows that minorities are in fact much less likely to have government ID. https://www.brennancenter.org/sites/default/files/legacy/d/download_file_39242.pdf https://www.brennancenter.org/sites/default/files/legacy/d/d...
- 300bps 5y ago
  data shows that minorities are in fact much less likely to have government ID. The study you provided was a phone survey of less than 1,000 people that occurred 15 years ago. It along with other studies showing similar results were debunked by researchers at Stanford, Yale, and the University of Pennsylvania. http://stanford.edu/~jgrimmer/comment_final.pdf http://stanford.edu/~jgrimmer/comment_final.pdf
  - tzs 5y ago
    There are other studies. See some of the references here [1]. [1] https://www.aclu.org/other/oppose-voter-id-legislation-fact-sheet https://www.aclu.org/other/oppose-voter-id-legislation-fact-...
    - 300bps 5y ago
      There are other studies. The first reference on your link is the exact link to the exact study the other commenter provided. The second reference on your link itself uses as a reference the exact link to the exact study the other commenter provided.
  - learc83 5y ago
    That comment paper isn't actually debunking that specific survey. It's just essentially saying that proving that voter ID laws suppress minority votes is hard. The phone survey of less than a 1,000 people is still a perfectly valid piece of evidence. The methodology wasn't obviously flawed and the delta was so large that the sample size was more than enough. Here's another survey from 2012 that shows a similar number. http://www.projectvote.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/AMERICANS-WITH-PHOTO-ID-Research-Memo-February-2015.pdf http://www.projectvote.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/AMERIC... Sure as your comment paper points out, you can't use nation wide data to prove state level causation, but there's still good evidence that minorities are much less likely to have government ID. It's not a shocking result either. We know that not having ID correlates with low income, and minority status also correlates with low income (on average, sure there are some minorities that actually have higher income).
nopenopenopeno 5y ago
The claim was always about undocumented immigrants voting and the Democratic Party gave up on that because even immigrants started hating them lol.
tzs 5y ago
> Then they go to Harlem to ask people what they think of those comments. Maybe they should have asked in one of the states that is actually passing restrictive voter ID laws, and that is at the same time closing DMV offices in minority areas, limiting the hours that DMVs issue IDs, and has nearly non-existent affordable public transit. The might have gotten different answers than asking in a state that is pro voter rights, in a neighborhood that has a DMV office, and that has excellent access to public transportation if for some reason the neighborhood DMV is not available.
- luxuryballs 5y ago
  Can you actually name a specific town/county that has this problem or is this imaginary?
  - tstrimple 5y ago
    It's happening in multiple states. Finding examples is trivial. https://www.aclu.org/blog/voting-rights/voting-rights-act/alabamas-dmv-shutdown-has-everything-do-race https://www.aclu.org/blog/voting-rights/voting-rights-act/al...
- jimbokun 5y ago
  In public opinion polls black voters strongly favor voter ids.
  - tzs 5y ago
    Those polls also show that they strongly favor free IDs that are easy to obtain. Almost no one opposed the idea of voter ID if it is free and easy for everyone who is eligible to vote to obtain such ID. It's when shenanigans like those in North Carolina described in footnote 360 in this report [1] take place that it is a problem. The government knew that 25% of black voters lacked DMV-issued photo ID but the law provided that all government issued IDs would work (even expired ones), so that was fine. Then with race data in hand, the legislature amended the law to exclude most of those non-DMV IDs that black voters had, and retain the non-DMV IDs that white people were likely to have. [1] https://www.usccr.gov/files/pubs/2018/Minority_Voting_Access_2018.pdf https://www.usccr.gov/files/pubs/2018/Minority_Voting_Access...
pbhjpbhj 5y ago
Hmm. I dare say you could make the same video in the UK but not about race, instead about about how "poor people can't afford ID". But, statistically it's still true, and the people who can't afford ID are working one of their two jobs (or unemployed) not walking around town during the day. Free, state issued ID is part of the answer but the opportunity cost getting to a photo booth (!) is still a surprisingly large inhibitor given the stringent requirements on photos. (I do my own photos at home, you have to have a reasonable colour printer, I edit on the computer but you could probably do it on a smartphone nowadays). If people of a particular background are over-represented amongst the [very] poor (such as "White Irish" in the UK) then they'll be disproportionately disenfranchised.
cma 5y ago
You could possibly make the same video about literacy tests used in Jim Crow. The key thing is having a racist outcome and then finding metrics to achieve it with plausible deniability (I don't find it plausible that leetcode was put into place like this, but for voting it has a long history).

by 300bps 5y ago

inter_netuser 5y ago

What’s the hardest test called?

300bps 5y ago
Google "hardest test in finance" and the CFA exams are the first several pages of results.
- inter_netuser 5y ago
  The hardest test in finance is a physics/math PhD defence, from MIT or Caltech. CFA is just a decoy.

learc83 5y ago

You can select people to display in your man on the street interview segment to make it look like the average American doesn’t know who the President is. Regardless of what some people in Harlem think, data shows that minorities are in fact much less likely to have government ID. https://www.brennancenter.org/sites/default/files/legacy/d/download_file_39242.pdf https://www.brennancenter.org/sites/default/files/legacy/d/d...

300bps 5y ago
data shows that minorities are in fact much less likely to have government ID. The study you provided was a phone survey of less than 1,000 people that occurred 15 years ago. It along with other studies showing similar results were debunked by researchers at Stanford, Yale, and the University of Pennsylvania. http://stanford.edu/~jgrimmer/comment_final.pdf http://stanford.edu/~jgrimmer/comment_final.pdf
- tzs 5y ago
  There are other studies. See some of the references here [1]. [1] https://www.aclu.org/other/oppose-voter-id-legislation-fact-sheet https://www.aclu.org/other/oppose-voter-id-legislation-fact-...
  - 300bps 5y ago
    There are other studies. The first reference on your link is the exact link to the exact study the other commenter provided. The second reference on your link itself uses as a reference the exact link to the exact study the other commenter provided.
- learc83 5y ago
  That comment paper isn't actually debunking that specific survey. It's just essentially saying that proving that voter ID laws suppress minority votes is hard. The phone survey of less than a 1,000 people is still a perfectly valid piece of evidence. The methodology wasn't obviously flawed and the delta was so large that the sample size was more than enough. Here's another survey from 2012 that shows a similar number. http://www.projectvote.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/AMERICANS-WITH-PHOTO-ID-Research-Memo-February-2015.pdf http://www.projectvote.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/AMERIC... Sure as your comment paper points out, you can't use nation wide data to prove state level causation, but there's still good evidence that minorities are much less likely to have government ID. It's not a shocking result either. We know that not having ID correlates with low income, and minority status also correlates with low income (on average, sure there are some minorities that actually have higher income).

nopenopenopeno 5y ago

The claim was always about undocumented immigrants voting and the Democratic Party gave up on that because even immigrants started hating them lol.

tzs 5y ago

> Then they go to Harlem to ask people what they think of those comments. Maybe they should have asked in one of the states that is actually passing restrictive voter ID laws, and that is at the same time closing DMV offices in minority areas, limiting the hours that DMVs issue IDs, and has nearly non-existent affordable public transit. The might have gotten different answers than asking in a state that is pro voter rights, in a neighborhood that has a DMV office, and that has excellent access to public transportation if for some reason the neighborhood DMV is not available.

luxuryballs 5y ago
Can you actually name a specific town/county that has this problem or is this imaginary?
- tstrimple 5y ago
  It's happening in multiple states. Finding examples is trivial. https://www.aclu.org/blog/voting-rights/voting-rights-act/alabamas-dmv-shutdown-has-everything-do-race https://www.aclu.org/blog/voting-rights/voting-rights-act/al...
jimbokun 5y ago
In public opinion polls black voters strongly favor voter ids.
- tzs 5y ago
  Those polls also show that they strongly favor free IDs that are easy to obtain. Almost no one opposed the idea of voter ID if it is free and easy for everyone who is eligible to vote to obtain such ID. It's when shenanigans like those in North Carolina described in footnote 360 in this report [1] take place that it is a problem. The government knew that 25% of black voters lacked DMV-issued photo ID but the law provided that all government issued IDs would work (even expired ones), so that was fine. Then with race data in hand, the legislature amended the law to exclude most of those non-DMV IDs that black voters had, and retain the non-DMV IDs that white people were likely to have. [1] https://www.usccr.gov/files/pubs/2018/Minority_Voting_Access_2018.pdf https://www.usccr.gov/files/pubs/2018/Minority_Voting_Access...

pbhjpbhj 5y ago

Hmm. I dare say you could make the same video in the UK but not about race, instead about about how "poor people can't afford ID". But, statistically it's still true, and the people who can't afford ID are working one of their two jobs (or unemployed) not walking around town during the day. Free, state issued ID is part of the answer but the opportunity cost getting to a photo booth (!) is still a surprisingly large inhibitor given the stringent requirements on photos. (I do my own photos at home, you have to have a reasonable colour printer, I edit on the computer but you could probably do it on a smartphone nowadays). If people of a particular background are over-represented amongst the [very] poor (such as "White Irish" in the UK) then they'll be disproportionately disenfranchised.

cma 5y ago

You could possibly make the same video about literacy tests used in Jim Crow. The key thing is having a racist outcome and then finding metrics to achieve it with plausible deniability (I don't find it plausible that leetcode was put into place like this, but for voting it has a long history).