6 ms·

You know what? I don't care anymore. When this type of thing happens it's almost always China. Whether it's intentional malware or a lack of QA, how could one t

You know what? I don't care anymore. When this type of thing happens it's almost always China. Whether it's intentional malware or a lack of QA, how could one tell? They have such a reputation for both I don't know why we still let their electronics into our countries.

Aperocky 5y ago
> When this type of thing happens it's almost always China. It could only happen in China - because the author bought dubious stuff from unknown third party on AliExpress. Craiglist scams happen mostly in US because people don't use it elsewhere. Sort of like how you shoot the arrow first and then draw a target around it, 100% bullseye.
WesolyKubeczek 5y ago
- DrBazza 5y ago
  > "efficient" MBA eloi outsourced everything to morlocks a long time ago. This is the biggest weakness of the West - and it all stems back to "share holder value". Companies, US ones, in particular, seem to have some absurd drive to pay endless dividends to shareholders, and drive 'value' via share price, by appearing to be profitable. In other words, get stuff from the cheapest provider. It didn't help that at the same time people like Carl Icahn came along and stripped a company that was cheap to buy, but also sat on a pile of cash. And again, if he could 'drive value' for the share holders, said company was a target. Eventually state-level politics appear - artificially low-prices Chinese goods because the CCP fix the exchange rate, or subsidise an entire market to corner it globally. Rinse repeat, and that's where we're at now.
  - Workaccount2 5y ago
    People don't realize that the US defense budget is practically the only thing keeping American manufacturing alive.
    - 3pt14159 5y ago
      Eh. Manufacturing has never gone down in GDP terms. It just seems to have gone down due to layoffs as a result of further mechanization of production.
    - Scoundreller 5y ago
      Massive consumer demand helps too.
  - toss1 5y ago
    Yup, and it's even more directed than that. Western MBAs and politicians think they know that manufacturing is just a fungible commodity and think that we're exploiting cheap Chinese labor to 'drive shareholder value'. While they have this myopic focus on quarterly results, the CCP has a 100- and 500-year plan, and is happily exploiting that myopia for strategic economic and military value, including subsidizing massive undercutting of entire industries in order to kill all but their own. The result is that they are gaining the deep know-how of manufacturing, the ability to compromise their adversaries' military gear at the component level, and the ability to choke off supply chains. Although there is still barely time to repair this, it will go down as a strategic blunder of historic proportions.
    - mach1ne 5y ago
      This was the case some 10 years ago, but Chinese labor is no longer cheap. The wealth brought in by making China the factory of the world drove the income level of its middle class up and now there are few advantages in manufacturing your products in China. Western manufacturers are constantly pulling their factories back from China, many having gained an ultimate net loss from moving in in the 90s and now relocating again.
      - toss1 5y ago
        Yes, they have made a net loss, and meanwhile transferred an insane amount of technology to China. But those managers got their bonuses and are long-gone... And sure Chinese labor isn't as cheap, they've moved up the value chain some, but it is still cheap enough compared to US wages to make items and ship them here - particularly with China's lax environmental and labor laws. The relocations to even cheaper labor-rate counties are still an improvement, as at least they aren't creating all levels of strategic disadvantage...
  - reaperducer 5y ago
    and it all stems back to "share holder value". Which is just a business buzzphrase for "Greed." The West is being eaten alive by its own greed, and the Chinese are just watching us do it.
    - WesolyKubeczek 5y ago
      Chinese are just as greedy and corrupt, make no mistake.
  - rafale 5y ago
    It wouldn't be so bad if we outsourced to countries that are ideologically compatible with the West. The problem is China. Not outsourcing itself.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
- pomian 5y ago
  Brilliant!
danieltanfh95 5y ago
it's because chinese goods are consistently good that anything bad is news. ironic isn't it literally everything is made in china, if the quality is as bad as you say the world would have fallen apart. It seems critical thinking is rare among news outrage these days. The same comments were said of Japanese products back in the day, "IP thieves", "shitty quality", and here we are decades later praising Japanese products. Its hilarious at this point.
- io98763 5y ago
  I don't recall the Japanese being accused of poor quality. Just imitating rather than innovating. Many Japanese products like swords, knives, cameras, have been known for surprisingly high quality for a long time. Centuries in some cases. I'd say Chinese manufacturing is a little cheaper and a lot lower quality, and generally the price difference is not remotely sufficient to make up for the loss in performance. You need a company in the middle who cares about their reputation to be safe buying it.
  - yorwba 5y ago
    > I don't recall the Japanese being accused of poor quality. It was a different time: https://www.nytimes.com/1952/01/13/archives/japanese-machinetool-industry-lags-lack-of-export-business-is-laid.html https://www.nytimes.com/1952/01/13/archives/japanese-machine... "The Japanese flair for imitating, but not equaling, the manufactures of occidental nations has caught up with her machine-tool industry, ..." (1952) First it was imitating, but not equaling, then it was imitating with equal quality but a little cheaper, and a few generations later nobody remembers that "Made in Japan" ever meant anything but high quality.
  - danieltanfh95 5y ago
    most people won't remember it because it's really long ago, just after world war 2
- baja_blast 5y ago
  > literally everything is made in china, if the quality is as bad as you say the world would have fallen apart. And that's why nowadays things like washing machines and refrigerators which used to last decades now break within the first year or two. > The same comments were said of Japanese products back in the day, "IP thieves", "shitty quality", and here we are decades later praising Japanese products. Its hilarious at this point. But these stereotypes lasted only for a decade tops! I have not seen the same commitment to quality that Japanese brands produced. I believe it is a cultural difference, Japanese take great pride in workmanship.
Dah00n 5y ago
So most of this happens in products made where most of these products are made? Seems logically. Besides it doesn't seem any better in the US. By far the most backdoored internet equipment producer is Cisco.
pphysch 5y ago
The malware described in the article is script kiddy stuff. Probably part of a ripped Win7. Stuxnet, Pegasus, Vault 7 tech are far more dangerous with that capacity to cause real harm to actual people. Who developed these?

Aperocky 5y ago

> When this type of thing happens it's almost always China. It could only happen in China - because the author bought dubious stuff from unknown third party on AliExpress. Craiglist scams happen mostly in US because people don't use it elsewhere. Sort of like how you shoot the arrow first and then draw a target around it, 100% bullseye.

WesolyKubeczek 5y ago

DrBazza 5y ago
> "efficient" MBA eloi outsourced everything to morlocks a long time ago. This is the biggest weakness of the West - and it all stems back to "share holder value". Companies, US ones, in particular, seem to have some absurd drive to pay endless dividends to shareholders, and drive 'value' via share price, by appearing to be profitable. In other words, get stuff from the cheapest provider. It didn't help that at the same time people like Carl Icahn came along and stripped a company that was cheap to buy, but also sat on a pile of cash. And again, if he could 'drive value' for the share holders, said company was a target. Eventually state-level politics appear - artificially low-prices Chinese goods because the CCP fix the exchange rate, or subsidise an entire market to corner it globally. Rinse repeat, and that's where we're at now.
- Workaccount2 5y ago
  People don't realize that the US defense budget is practically the only thing keeping American manufacturing alive.
  - 3pt14159 5y ago
    Eh. Manufacturing has never gone down in GDP terms. It just seems to have gone down due to layoffs as a result of further mechanization of production.
  - Scoundreller 5y ago
    Massive consumer demand helps too.
- toss1 5y ago
  Yup, and it's even more directed than that. Western MBAs and politicians think they know that manufacturing is just a fungible commodity and think that we're exploiting cheap Chinese labor to 'drive shareholder value'. While they have this myopic focus on quarterly results, the CCP has a 100- and 500-year plan, and is happily exploiting that myopia for strategic economic and military value, including subsidizing massive undercutting of entire industries in order to kill all but their own. The result is that they are gaining the deep know-how of manufacturing, the ability to compromise their adversaries' military gear at the component level, and the ability to choke off supply chains. Although there is still barely time to repair this, it will go down as a strategic blunder of historic proportions.
  - mach1ne 5y ago
    This was the case some 10 years ago, but Chinese labor is no longer cheap. The wealth brought in by making China the factory of the world drove the income level of its middle class up and now there are few advantages in manufacturing your products in China. Western manufacturers are constantly pulling their factories back from China, many having gained an ultimate net loss from moving in in the 90s and now relocating again.
    - toss1 5y ago
      Yes, they have made a net loss, and meanwhile transferred an insane amount of technology to China. But those managers got their bonuses and are long-gone... And sure Chinese labor isn't as cheap, they've moved up the value chain some, but it is still cheap enough compared to US wages to make items and ship them here - particularly with China's lax environmental and labor laws. The relocations to even cheaper labor-rate counties are still an improvement, as at least they aren't creating all levels of strategic disadvantage...
- reaperducer 5y ago
  and it all stems back to "share holder value". Which is just a business buzzphrase for "Greed." The West is being eaten alive by its own greed, and the Chinese are just watching us do it.
  - WesolyKubeczek 5y ago
    Chinese are just as greedy and corrupt, make no mistake.
- rafale 5y ago
  It wouldn't be so bad if we outsourced to countries that are ideologically compatible with the West. The problem is China. Not outsourcing itself.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
pomian 5y ago
Brilliant!

danieltanfh95 5y ago

it's because chinese goods are consistently good that anything bad is news. ironic isn't it literally everything is made in china, if the quality is as bad as you say the world would have fallen apart. It seems critical thinking is rare among news outrage these days. The same comments were said of Japanese products back in the day, "IP thieves", "shitty quality", and here we are decades later praising Japanese products. Its hilarious at this point.

io98763 5y ago
I don't recall the Japanese being accused of poor quality. Just imitating rather than innovating. Many Japanese products like swords, knives, cameras, have been known for surprisingly high quality for a long time. Centuries in some cases. I'd say Chinese manufacturing is a little cheaper and a lot lower quality, and generally the price difference is not remotely sufficient to make up for the loss in performance. You need a company in the middle who cares about their reputation to be safe buying it.
- yorwba 5y ago
  > I don't recall the Japanese being accused of poor quality. It was a different time: https://www.nytimes.com/1952/01/13/archives/japanese-machinetool-industry-lags-lack-of-export-business-is-laid.html https://www.nytimes.com/1952/01/13/archives/japanese-machine... "The Japanese flair for imitating, but not equaling, the manufactures of occidental nations has caught up with her machine-tool industry, ..." (1952) First it was imitating, but not equaling, then it was imitating with equal quality but a little cheaper, and a few generations later nobody remembers that "Made in Japan" ever meant anything but high quality.
- danieltanfh95 5y ago
  most people won't remember it because it's really long ago, just after world war 2
baja_blast 5y ago
> literally everything is made in china, if the quality is as bad as you say the world would have fallen apart. And that's why nowadays things like washing machines and refrigerators which used to last decades now break within the first year or two. > The same comments were said of Japanese products back in the day, "IP thieves", "shitty quality", and here we are decades later praising Japanese products. Its hilarious at this point. But these stereotypes lasted only for a decade tops! I have not seen the same commitment to quality that Japanese brands produced. I believe it is a cultural difference, Japanese take great pride in workmanship.

Dah00n 5y ago

So most of this happens in products made where most of these products are made? Seems logically. Besides it doesn't seem any better in the US. By far the most backdoored internet equipment producer is Cisco.

pphysch 5y ago

The malware described in the article is script kiddy stuff. Probably part of a ripped Win7. Stuxnet, Pegasus, Vault 7 tech are far more dangerous with that capacity to cause real harm to actual people. Who developed these?