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Yeah, the answer is to simply not use Windows. I can only see there being an advantage for some game developers to be using it these days. Linux is actually a

Yeah, the answer is to simply not use Windows. I can only see there being an advantage for some game developers to be using it these days. Linux is actually a much better OS for techies: you can make it look nicer, have a better workflow, and you can really play games now that Steam Deck brought so much focus on Linux compatibility. Otherwise, Mac OS is doing just fine as well.

unicornfinder 5y ago
Indeed. I'm a web developer and my tools genuinely work better just under native Linux than they ever could with WSL etc.
- makapuf 5y ago
  Would love to, but my employer has complex network settings (using 802.11X..), specific vpn client, im software, hw auth tokens with specific drivers and Windows shares and ntlm proxies all of which that makes integrating to the internal network with Linux a part time job. I gave up and set up a vm with Linux keeping windows do its thing.
  - flatiron 5y ago
    Any reason to not use wsl? I’m forced to either use windows/Mac at work and chose windows with wsl. Works reasonably well. I just live in WSL and use office (which is better than MAC office by a large margin)
    - makapuf 5y ago
      wsl needs to be administrator if I'm not mistaken, plus needs internal network which may/may not be allowed by the antivirus/firewall package, I prefer no to spend too much neurons on windows debugging / internals and keep them for linux
adamddev1 5y ago
Unfortunately laptop driver support is often rough. I used an XPS 9343 (one marketed as supporting Ubuntu) but I faced issues with popping speaker sounds and mobile data tethering sucking GBs of data for some crazy reason.
- major505 5y ago
  Thats why I changed to thinkpads. They seen to use less weird hardware with no support. But I had to do some concessions. I don`t use notebooks with discrete gpus, since NVIDIA optimus have shit support.
  - cies 5y ago
    I'm on a Lenovo Yoga 5 Slim now. Cheap for the specs, needed some tweaking to get suspend working, otherwise works like a charm out-of-the-box.
    - major505 5y ago
      My everyday beater is a Thinkpad x250. Small, ligth, not exactly top of the line, but works for most aplications. Only thing I suffer is running Android studio in it.
  - prohobo 5y ago
    I think the new Framework laptops might be better than Thinkpads now.
    - eptcyka 5y ago
      I'd use one in a heartbeat if they had a trackpoint.
      - swaranga 5y ago
        I have been using the HP Elitebooks provided by my company and works well with Ubuntu. No complaints. I even upgraded my RAM to 64 GB.
Ygg2 5y ago
> Yeah, the answer is to simply not use Windows. Yeah, no. You either switch to Mac and lose 99% of your applications and some of your hardware. Or you switch to Linux and lose 90% of your applications and latest hardware; And enjoy random problems and figuring out which of hundred answers online is right. Answer could be none, because for example Wayland support for multiple monitors sucks.
- cute_boi 5y ago
  It depends what you work on. I have installed popos like 2 years ago. I have 0 issues so far. For web development, nodejs etc. Linux is better than windows by a miles. Not everybody is graphics designer, video editor who needs Photoshop, Microsoft Excel etc. And, I haven't found any random problems at least on PC. It might be problematic in laptop, which I honestly don't know.
  - zekica 5y ago
    My last and current laptops work completely fine with linux, but I chose hardware that works fine. The old one is a Latitude E5470, and the new one is a Lenovo Thinkbook 14 G2 ARE (with Ryzen 4700u). Both require no extra drivers, while the new one requires at least kernel 5.10 to work, and works better with 5.13. Both have similar battery life on windows 10 and linux.
  - kamray23 5y ago
    Yeah, I run Arch and despite it being a kind of "hobbyist" type system, after the initial configuration, there are no problems or constant maintenance. I have had a few things break sometimes because I accidentally install a partial update, but that's obviously my own fault. Also, part of the problem people have with Linux is that it does not run Windows programs and they complain because they can't get QEMU or VMware or WINE functioning correctly. You shouldn't need those. When you switch to Linux, you lose your software. It's a reality you accept, because that software you used was not designed for Linux. Instead of trying desperately to get your old software to run, you instead use alternatives, be they open or closed, to run what you want. There are more than a few alternatives, many of them having similar or exceeding the power of paid windows-only products.
jskrablin 5y ago
High DPI displays support can be quite rough in Linux, along with slowish GUI. Some apps are fine, others less so. Last time I was using Mac - it was constantly overheating, then the battery inflated itself, Docker performance was awful. I went with Windows 10 + WSL2 ~ year ago (some for compatibility reasons, some because curiosity) and it's working OK so far. Most of my time is spent in WSL2 + VSC with rest being mostly for browser and running some VMs. It works surprisingly well. Well enough I don't feel any urgent need to go and install Linux (except the one running in WSL). I did look at Mac options ~ year ago but it just wasn't worth the money. Its price tag + effectively locked HW platform is just not worth it compared to what I currently use. It's not like I can't afford it, there's just no added value in it, at least for my type of work (DevOps,SysOps). I won't be upgrading to Win11 anytime soon though, I'll probably switch back to Linux sometime in the future.
capableweb 5y ago
> I can only see there being an advantage for some game developers to be using it these days Maybe for developers writing games in C++ or their own engines (or small time engines), but for many, how is it better? As far as I know, out of the most popular engines, only Godot actually offers out-of-the-box Linux support. Unreal, Unity, CryEngine and the others don't offer Linux support for their editors, although some give you access to the source code so you can build it yourself on Linux, but that's often not so trivial.
- SirTiddlesworth 5y ago
  Unity has supported Linux for a few years now.
- Deukhoofd 5y ago
  Unity has fairly good support for Linux editors. I've been working in Unity on Linux for years now, without any major issues.
- mijoharas 5y ago
  while this data is 5 years out of date (and I was writing C++), the sdk and toolchain for PS3 and PS4 was only installable via windows (even though they're BSD platforms, go figure). The same was true for wii/wiiU (linux under the hood) if I recall correctly. I'd be shocked if that weren't also the case for xbox* though I don't remember that specifically.

unicornfinder 5y ago

Indeed. I'm a web developer and my tools genuinely work better just under native Linux than they ever could with WSL etc.

makapuf 5y ago
Would love to, but my employer has complex network settings (using 802.11X..), specific vpn client, im software, hw auth tokens with specific drivers and Windows shares and ntlm proxies all of which that makes integrating to the internal network with Linux a part time job. I gave up and set up a vm with Linux keeping windows do its thing.
- flatiron 5y ago
  Any reason to not use wsl? I’m forced to either use windows/Mac at work and chose windows with wsl. Works reasonably well. I just live in WSL and use office (which is better than MAC office by a large margin)
  - makapuf 5y ago
    wsl needs to be administrator if I'm not mistaken, plus needs internal network which may/may not be allowed by the antivirus/firewall package, I prefer no to spend too much neurons on windows debugging / internals and keep them for linux

adamddev1 5y ago

Unfortunately laptop driver support is often rough. I used an XPS 9343 (one marketed as supporting Ubuntu) but I faced issues with popping speaker sounds and mobile data tethering sucking GBs of data for some crazy reason.

major505 5y ago
Thats why I changed to thinkpads. They seen to use less weird hardware with no support. But I had to do some concessions. I don`t use notebooks with discrete gpus, since NVIDIA optimus have shit support.
- cies 5y ago
  I'm on a Lenovo Yoga 5 Slim now. Cheap for the specs, needed some tweaking to get suspend working, otherwise works like a charm out-of-the-box.
  - major505 5y ago
    My everyday beater is a Thinkpad x250. Small, ligth, not exactly top of the line, but works for most aplications. Only thing I suffer is running Android studio in it.
- prohobo 5y ago
  I think the new Framework laptops might be better than Thinkpads now.
  - eptcyka 5y ago
    I'd use one in a heartbeat if they had a trackpoint.
    - swaranga 5y ago
      I have been using the HP Elitebooks provided by my company and works well with Ubuntu. No complaints. I even upgraded my RAM to 64 GB.

Ygg2 5y ago

> Yeah, the answer is to simply not use Windows. Yeah, no. You either switch to Mac and lose 99% of your applications and some of your hardware. Or you switch to Linux and lose 90% of your applications and latest hardware; And enjoy random problems and figuring out which of hundred answers online is right. Answer could be none, because for example Wayland support for multiple monitors sucks.

cute_boi 5y ago
It depends what you work on. I have installed popos like 2 years ago. I have 0 issues so far. For web development, nodejs etc. Linux is better than windows by a miles. Not everybody is graphics designer, video editor who needs Photoshop, Microsoft Excel etc. And, I haven't found any random problems at least on PC. It might be problematic in laptop, which I honestly don't know.
- zekica 5y ago
  My last and current laptops work completely fine with linux, but I chose hardware that works fine. The old one is a Latitude E5470, and the new one is a Lenovo Thinkbook 14 G2 ARE (with Ryzen 4700u). Both require no extra drivers, while the new one requires at least kernel 5.10 to work, and works better with 5.13. Both have similar battery life on windows 10 and linux.
- kamray23 5y ago
  Yeah, I run Arch and despite it being a kind of "hobbyist" type system, after the initial configuration, there are no problems or constant maintenance. I have had a few things break sometimes because I accidentally install a partial update, but that's obviously my own fault. Also, part of the problem people have with Linux is that it does not run Windows programs and they complain because they can't get QEMU or VMware or WINE functioning correctly. You shouldn't need those. When you switch to Linux, you lose your software. It's a reality you accept, because that software you used was not designed for Linux. Instead of trying desperately to get your old software to run, you instead use alternatives, be they open or closed, to run what you want. There are more than a few alternatives, many of them having similar or exceeding the power of paid windows-only products.

jskrablin 5y ago

High DPI displays support can be quite rough in Linux, along with slowish GUI. Some apps are fine, others less so. Last time I was using Mac - it was constantly overheating, then the battery inflated itself, Docker performance was awful. I went with Windows 10 + WSL2 ~ year ago (some for compatibility reasons, some because curiosity) and it's working OK so far. Most of my time is spent in WSL2 + VSC with rest being mostly for browser and running some VMs. It works surprisingly well. Well enough I don't feel any urgent need to go and install Linux (except the one running in WSL). I did look at Mac options ~ year ago but it just wasn't worth the money. Its price tag + effectively locked HW platform is just not worth it compared to what I currently use. It's not like I can't afford it, there's just no added value in it, at least for my type of work (DevOps,SysOps). I won't be upgrading to Win11 anytime soon though, I'll probably switch back to Linux sometime in the future.

capableweb 5y ago

> I can only see there being an advantage for some game developers to be using it these days Maybe for developers writing games in C++ or their own engines (or small time engines), but for many, how is it better? As far as I know, out of the most popular engines, only Godot actually offers out-of-the-box Linux support. Unreal, Unity, CryEngine and the others don't offer Linux support for their editors, although some give you access to the source code so you can build it yourself on Linux, but that's often not so trivial.

SirTiddlesworth 5y ago
Unity has supported Linux for a few years now.
Deukhoofd 5y ago
Unity has fairly good support for Linux editors. I've been working in Unity on Linux for years now, without any major issues.
mijoharas 5y ago
while this data is 5 years out of date (and I was writing C++), the sdk and toolchain for PS3 and PS4 was only installable via windows (even though they're BSD platforms, go figure). The same was true for wii/wiiU (linux under the hood) if I recall correctly. I'd be shocked if that weren't also the case for xbox* though I don't remember that specifically.