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Venmo, PayPal and Zelle must report $600 in transactions to IRS
- walterbell 5y agoTraining data wheels for CBDC (2025) fintech/payment surveillance and real-time allowlists, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27805709 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27805709
- PopAlongKid 5y agoPaypal FAQ: https://newsroom.paypal-corp.com/2021-11-04-New-US-Tax-Reporting-Requirements-Your-Questions-Answered https://newsroom.paypal-corp.com/2021-11-04-New-US-Tax-Repor...
- PopAlongKid 5y agoThis closes, beginning 2022, a huge loophole (reporting omission) that has existed for the last several years. IRS Form 1099-NEC & 1099-MISC reporting did not include credit card or other 3rd party payment processor payments, while Form 1099-K also didn't include them unless relatively high thresholds were reached. Now, many more such payments will be reported, encouraging more taxpayers under the U.S. system of "voluntary compliance" (self-reporting attested to under penalty of perjury) to be honest.
- abfan1127 5y agoor the alternative to push payments back to cash only or quit because its not worth the hassle.
- throwaway0a5e 5y agoThe junk flippers, handymen and professionals taking side jobs will be just fine taking cash. This only screws the "I work through an app" crowd.
- tylerhou 5y agoNot worth the hassle of paying legally-required income tax?
- albatross13 5y agoCorrect.
- bthrn 5y agoIf I sell my old couch at a loss for $600, and get paid with Venmo, the default behavior now is to have a form sent to the IRS. The burden is on me to prove it is a loss and have the documentation to back it up, or risk having $600 of taxable income in the eyes of the IRS. At this small threshold, it sounds like a burden to me.
- gowld 5y agoSeparately, even though selling used goods at a loss is deductible on income tax, you can still get chased own for sales tax, thanks to USA's absurd non-VAT sales tax system.
- PopAlongKid 5y ago>even though selling used goods at a loss is deductible on income tax Not if the goods were for personal rather than business or investment use. Losses on sale of personal-use assets are non-deductible for income tax purposes.
- gamblor956 5y agoEvery part of your statement is wrong. 1) Selling used goods at a loss is not deductible on your tax return unless you are in the business of selling used goods. 2) Unless you are selling a lot of tangible goods (i.e., you have a business selling things), you aren't even eligible to register for sales tax in most U.S. states. 3) If tax applies to the sale of a used good in this situation, it would be a use tax that is the responsibility of the buyer to report and pay.
- deleted 5y ago
- andrew_ 5y agoI'm curious to see if this impacts eBay and the high dollar transactions.
- from 5y agoHow much revenue will this actually raise? The previous threshold was $20k which makes me think this new policy will mostly just result in the IRS catching the neighborhood bike repairman who made $3k last year on Venmo and didn't report it rather than some shadowy ecommerce millionaire tax cheat.
- andrew_ 5y agoThis is more legislative theater. "We're catching the cheats" where the cheats are as you describe, middle or lower class households or individuals trying to get ahead with a side hustle. I hope to see this reversed in the near future.
- UncleMeat 5y agoWhy should a side hustle on etsy be taxed less than a side hustle working at the local coffee shop?
- LorenPechtel 5y agoThe side hustle on etsy will likely have plenty of expenses that come off the income--but now you made the person do things like maintain inventory and the like. The compliance burden is a lot higher. I'd like to see some modified rules for sufficiently small businesses--no inventory, no depreciation, you simply take expenses when they are incurred. This would especially apply to service type businesses where your expenses are consumables and tool replacement.
- PopAlongKid 5y agoThere already are rules that avoid most depreciation in this case. The Tangible Property Regulations allow a De Minimis Safe Harbor expense deduction for assets purchased, such as a computer or office furniture. The max amount is $2,500.
- andrew_ 5y agoThere's another reply in this post about a scenario of selling a couch on Craigslist, as an example. The burden that comes with a simple transaction is undue.
- vmception 5y ago> encouraging more taxpayers under the U.S. system of "voluntary compliance" (self-reporting attested to under penalty of perjury) to be honest. Ha, yes that is a funny fallacy they use. On the IRS side, they use a social graph and node based system to determine who to look into. If one filer takes a tax deduction for a payment, the IRS then looks to the recipient to see if they paid taxes. When a mismatch occurs, typically of the recipient, they send out the "we determined that you owe us this much" letters. From my experience just talking to people, a very large number of people really believe that only their employer or a their bank is "snitching" on them, and whenever they get a payment outside of those systems they think "they don't have to pay taxes" because "the IRS doesn't know". I really am at a loss of words of how deep tax ignorance goes. The 1099 system and compliance behind the 1099s is also a helpful notice for the IRS' graph system, although not necessary as they can just look at the same filer's deductions, but they can coax more payments as they do have statutory penalties for not filing a 1099.
- BitwiseFool 5y ago>"encouraging more taxpayers under the U.S. system of "voluntary compliance" (self-reporting attested to under penalty of perjury) to be honest." I really dislike the implication of dishonesty. For the average person the IRS is involved in your paycheck, not in your Venmo transactions and Facebook Marketplace postings. I sense this kind of reporting is only going to create resentment, and I hope it does. Edit: I Venmo my sister money for groceries and pizza from time to time because she is in college. I'm well under the threshold for the gift-tax (as long as you are under ~$14,000 a year), but now the IRS has a record of all these transactions I have even more to worry about when it comes time to file. What happens if my "payments" are ~$700 and I don't put that amount in the gift column on my 1040? What about her? Does she need to report this as well? The IRS will know about it. Sure, you could say I was supposed to be reporting this the whole time, but is this a reasonable expectation for transactions so minor and mundane? Were you reporting such things this whole time?
- stjohnswarts 5y agoYes they weren't draining enough of our incomes already. This should make everyone very happy that we have yet one more avenue for the government to spy on us everyday in every way. This is double plus good.
- pavlov 5y agoNote that it's commercial transactions, not your friends & family payments: "Starting Jan. 1, the IRS said, if a person accrues more than $600 annually in commercial payments on an app like Venmo, then Venmo “must file and furnish a Form 1099-K” for them — reporting on all the commercial income they collected through the app. "The tax-reporting change only applies to charges for commercial goods or services, not personal charges to friends and family, like splitting a dinner bill."
- bitxbitxbitcoin 5y agoThat means we will have to see how hard they crack down on f&f payments which are default in certain trading circles with a separate reputation system to manage fraud.
- sethhochberg 5y agoI try not to be cynical about news coverage, but its so difficult when I see headlines like this that could be so much more clear by simply adding the word "commercial"... several friends have been outraged about changes to how they split monthly expenses with roommates, partners, etc before discovering the reality of the situation - seemingly all because the reporting on it has just been _bad_.
- colpabar 5y ago> several friends have been outraged I don't know if you can even call it cynicism anymore. You just understand the news media business model. Outrageous headline -> more clicks -> more ad revenue. There would simply be less revenue if your friends only had to read one article to get the full picture.
- reaperducer 5y agoPart of the problem is bad headlines. A larger part of the problem is the fact that when people get their news from social media, they read only the headlines and don't bother with the story. Somehow people have become convinced that reading a stream of half-sentence headlines is the same thing as being informed about current events.
- frankbreetz 5y agoThis seems like a direct a attack on small businesses, it looks like neighborhood kid cutting grass has to pay taxes while Amazon doesn't. The opposing political party is going to get a lot of press out of this one.
- sjg007 5y agoHuh? The neighbor kid has always had to pay taxes.
- rsstack 5y agoPeople don't like to acknowledge the difference between tax evasion and tax avoidance. Amazon always avoided taxes, which was legal and is still legal. The neighbor kid often evaded taxes, which was illegal and is still illegal - just slightly easier to enforce after this change.
- lotsofpulp 5y agoEveryone avoids taxes.
- rsstack 5y agoThat's between you and your accountant (and if caught: lawyer). I don't see an issue with the IRS attempting to enforce the law.
- lotsofpulp 5y agoI do not either. I was pointing out that, functionally, no one intentionally chooses to pay more tax than they have to. Hence the uselessness of bringing up tax avoidance. Amazon spending all of their revenue to expand the business and hence not owing any tax is tax avoidance, and people contributing to tax advantaged retirement/health/education accounts and deductible charitable expenses is tax avoidance all the same.
- macinjosh 5y agoIsn't government awesome! Let's squeeze the little guy for every cent we can! /s
- nunez 5y agoI honestly thought this was fake news when my wife told me that this was happening some months ago. This is going to confuse so many people.
- Lurkynerd 5y agoGreat, let's nickle and dime the single mother selling arts and crafts on Etsy while the mega corps get away with billions. This was buried in the same legislation supposedly drafted to help the poor. But of course, the fattest handouts were all to big banks and the rest of too big to fail corporate America.
- TameAntelope 5y agoI know it's popular to decry every single dollar lost as a critical dollar (the difference between eating and starving), but if you're selling $600+ arts and crafts on Etsy, you should a) probably pay the US government for creating the infrastructure enabling you to do that in the first place, and b) the taxes are not going to mean very much to you in any event, especially considering how we structure our tax system to enable folks making less to pay less overall in income taxes at the end of the year. Edit: There's a clear anti-government push in this comment section, which I don't think is representative of HN at large. I'm curious where it's coming from, if not organically, though I admit my lizard brain is more likely just pattern matching despite there not being any actual pattern at all.
- _dark_matter_ 5y agoThis is the amount accumulated. So e.g. 30x $20 transactions, not $600+ arts and crafts.
- TameAntelope 5y agoYeah, it doesn't matter from a tax perspective. You don't pay more on additional transactions.
- javert 5y agoShould we be paying the US government to send our young men to die in trumped-up wars that we have no reasonable hope of winning? a) Vietnam b) Afghanistan c) Iraq That's what your tax money goes to, folks. Is that what Etsy moms should be paying for? I pay my US federal taxes, because it's illegal not to. But, at a fundamental level, it's immoral to do so. I don't think all taxes are immoral. Just US Federal taxes. Remember that the Federal government now exists almost purely to serve lobbyists and interest groups - not the people and not the states.
- amir734jj 5y ago- deleted
- pionar 5y agoNone. This is commercial transactions, not personal ones.
- easymodex 5y agoProve it.
- morpheuskafka 5y agoUh, I wouldn't be posting about that online... that is not allowed under OFAC rules and the taxes would be the least of your concern if the government investigated.
- throaway46546 5y agoIsn't that very illegal?
- bdcravens 5y agoWe've always had to issue 1099s for any contractor we pay more than $600 to. If you earn income, you're required to pay taxes on it. Seems to me the outrage is over closing a loophole.
- bthrn 5y agoMy understanding is that the outrage is over spending time and money codifying new laws to collect taxes for small transactions instead of spending time and money codifying new laws to collect taxes from large tax-avoidant businesses and wealthy individuals who both are in a position to pay much more and who compared to average people pay basically nothing.
- toast0 5y agoReceiving a payment may or may not be earning income. A lot of people use these payment services to sell used personal goods for less than they paid (often, significantly less), which is not income. But now, they'll need to keep documentation of cost basis of their household goods, in case they sell them later. Even if you're selling used goods for profit, only part of the sale is income.
- bdcravens 5y agoYes, it does create a business burden. However, many sales of personal goods have some sort of tax burden (not the same, but for example, when you buy a car from an individual you are expected to pay tax on the purchase) I run a small resales business, and I do track COGS on sales. I often sell my personal items as well, and when I do, I just put the COGS as the sales price.
- TameAntelope 5y agoI don't use Venmo a lot, but I did notice a "purpose" button when I was in there the other day, I wonder if that's how they figure out which of these transactions are commercial payments, or if there's some other way to do it. If I remember correctly, the default option was "Personal gift" or something like that. Is it technically fraud to forget to flip that option now? The app didn't explain any of that to me...
- morpheuskafka 5y agoThat started before this but it is how they will classify it. It was already against the terms of service to do that (albeit quite common on a small scale) as it prevented the processing fee from being charged.
- dont__panic 5y agoWhile it sounds like this headline is missing a "commercial" modifier needed to clarify what this applies to, I currently use Zelle for sharing expenses with my S/O. Does anybody have any suggestions for a replacement service, or is Zelle as good as it gets in the USA? Concerned that I'll eventually be paying taxes on my rent and beer splitting.
- rkk3 5y ago> Concerned that I'll eventually be paying taxes on my rent and beer splitting. You already paying those taxes through whoever bought the beer etc, so you wouldn't owe anything. But what I think could be a headache is now increased record keeping around those transfer payments -- ie; your S/O received net $x in payments from you and may now need to report and justify them.
- KingMachiavelli 5y agoNo, as long as you don't mark the transaction as payment for a good/service i.e a commercial sale then it doesn't get reported or counted towards the $600 limit. This is exactly the same distinction Paypal has made for over a decade; if you want purchase protection on a transaction then they collect a percentage and (now) they will also count it towards the seller's $600 reporting limit. If you are just paying a friend back you don't want to pay the transaction fee anyway and you don't need purchase protection either.
- morpheuskafka 5y agoZelle has determined that none of their transactions qualify under these rules: https://www.zellepay.com/faq/does-zelle-report-how-much-money-i-receive-irs https://www.zellepay.com/faq/does-zelle-report-how-much-mone... For PayPal/Venmo and similar services, they are only going to report transactions classified as "goods & services."
- theguyovrthere 5y agoIt took me about 3 weeks to realize that all the major banks supported Zelle... how crazy is that? And then I looked into its origins and discovered that it was all the big banks getting together to say 'hey, lets keep the money in our system' So it is not surprising to me that they probably lobbied somehow to be excluded since Zelle is a "cash replacement" sponsored by the banks.
- LorenPechtel 5y agoZelle is supposed to be only a pay-your-friend system as it lacks chargeback capability and the like. Thus it's quite reasonable for it not to be involved in reporting business income--it's not supposed to be handling business income.
- bmarquez 5y agoThe interesting thing is that to use Zelle, you have to have an account at a participating bank (which did stronger KYC on you when you opened your account, as opposed to Paypal/Venmo). So there wouldn't be a need to issue 1099s when authorities can contact the bank directly. Also, I would rather trust my bank than PayPal when it comes to giving out my ID or SSN. Zelle will probably become more popular in the future.
- conductr 5y ago> So there wouldn't be a need to issue 1099s when authorities can contact the bank directly. It's so the taxpayer is aware of what to report on their taxes and is aware of what is already being communicated. Just like a W2 employee get's a W2 so they can do their taxes. It's already been communicated to the government. As a taxpayer in our system, these documents basically serve to say "this is what the IRS knows already. When you file your taxes, you probably want to do so in a way that they can make sense of and sufficiently validates your tax payment as accurate"
- peanut_worm 5y agoSo anyone who pays their rent through these services can expect that to go up
- BHSPitMonkey 5y agoOnly true if the landlord was actually hiding their rental income in the first place.
- thesausageking 5y agoWhy was this included in a Covid-19 stimulus bill?
- walterbell 5y agoTrillions of stimulus can lead to inflation. Payment kill switches or other negative incentives can constrain money velocity in selected geo-regions or industries, as a deflationary tool.
- gsibble 5y agoBecause they knew no one would read it. There's a lot more in there and the infrastructure bill too. Like a remote kill switch for vehicles to be used by law enforcement in the infrastructure bill. Democrats love hiding unpopular stuff in gigantic bills because they no no one reads them or even has time to before they are passed.
- LorenPechtel 5y agoBoth sides are guilty of this.
- stjohnswarts 5y agothis is one reason I did care about them squashing the next big spending bill. It shoudl be split up into smaller bills so they can't hide as much pork and invasions of privacy like this crazy new law (from OP).
- adolph 5y agoA bill is a changeset to law. It has a title that is generally aligned with the major intent. Otherwise the bill as a whole acts like a freight train; the major intent is the engine and whatever else ready to be merged is hitched onto it.
- nunez 5y agoWhat an amazing analogy.
- 5y ago
- walterbell 5y agoKYC all the things! Meanwhile, https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/jasonleopold/fincen-files-financial-scandal-criminal-networks https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/jasonleopold/fincen-fil... > A huge trove of secret government documents reveals for the first time how the giants of Western banking move trillions of dollars in suspicious transactions, enriching themselves and their shareholders while facilitating the work of terrorists, kleptocrats, and drug kingpins. And the US government, despite its vast powers, fails to stop it. Even criminal convictions have had little effect beyond fines, https://wallstreetonparade.com/2020/09/3-count-felon-jpmorgan-chase-caught-laundering-more-dirty-money/ https://wallstreetonparade.com/2020/09/3-count-felon-jpmorga... > Every American should be horrified by this latest report from the ICIJ; every American should be outraged that the U.S. is now second only to the Cayman Islands for hiding dirty money for criminals.
- user3939382 5y agoHow about when HSBC was caught inserting punctuation into entity names on wire transfers to evade blacklists so they could transfer around billions of dollars for drug cartels for years. No one got prosecuted, they got a slap on the wrist fine.
- newaccount74 5y agoKYC is such a joke. Just today I got a form that says literally "I confirm that I am not using the services for money laundering or terrorism". That's gonna stop them criminals!
- browningstreet 5y agoI opened a Venmo account a year ago and never did anything with it. I recently rented a house and the landlord wants me to pay with Venmo. I logged into Venmo and tried to add my bank account — error. Then manually. Then debit card, all errors. I knew it wasn’t really an error, plaid showed my bank balance before erroring out. I had to call their customer service 4x before I found someone who could see that it was a kyc block and put me through the process of verifying myself. Upload documents. Wait for them to review. Then put my account into partial freeze so I could add my bank and then verify transactions. Then talk to CS person and wait for them to manually unfreeze my account. It took a week. Just so I can pay rent.
- sysadm1n 5y agoI never let money accumulate in Paypal. As soon as someone sends money / buys something, I send it straight to my bank. I've heard too many horror stories of Paypal putting money 'on hold' and people having no recourse from that (since Paypal have largely shunted support to algorithms and very extensive FAQ sections that cover every issue so you don't need to reach, you know, an actual human).
- peanuty1 5y agoWhat about Cash App?
- gsibble 5y agoHow like the US government. Go after the teenager cutting lawns to get his taxes and let the elite pay next to nothing with carried interest. We are owned by corporations and the rich. It's pathetic. And I'm a conservative!
- yandrypozo 5y agosame idea for "non-essential" businesses
- loudtieblahblah 5y agoBuilding back better.... On the backs of the peasants.
- parkingrift 5y agoPeople find this to be unfair because it will increase the tax burden on the "mom and pop" business tier while larger businesses continue to (legally) evade taxation. If we stop taxing businesses we could simplify the tax code and outright remove the entire capital gains category. We will never win this game of cat and mouse. The more we try, the more the burden will move down the economic ladder.
- bluedino 5y agoDoes this count for selling a personal item to another person? Let's say I sell my old Mac on eBay, and the buyer sends me $750 using PayPal. Do I have to pay taxes on that?
- BHSPitMonkey 5y agoNo, because this only applies to commercial transactions (and PayPal always asks you to specify whether a transaction is personal or commercial in nature).
- bmarquez 5y agoThat amount would be reported to the IRS if you used eBay (because the "Goods and Services" setting is used on that platform). If you sold it outside of eBay and the buyers used "Goods and Services" it would also be reported. Only if a buyer used "Friends & Family" it would not be reported.
- secabeen 5y agoIt would get reported to the IRS as revenue. Since you're selling that item for less than you paid for it, and assuming that you didn't depreciate it as a business asset, you have a net loss, and shouldn't have to pay tax. The question is going to be, how does the IRS handle reports like this?
- lsllc 5y agoI suspect this will fuel the continued use of cash and also help drive the adoption of crypto-currency in the real world (e.g. un-taxable income).
- vmception 5y agoThat would be short sighted. Anyone that takes a tax deduction on what they feel is a business expense alerts the IRS to look for a tax payment from the recipient. So it doesn't matter what medium the payment occurred in. You have no idea what the individual nodes in your professional graph reported for their benefit. Get a CPA if you want to level up your understanding and advantages in society. A firm, not "your friend that does taxes" or the person with a cardboard e-filing sign on their window above the air conditioner.
- lsllc 5y agoPreviously posted/discussed: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29846464 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29846464 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29838943 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29838943 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29818738 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29818738 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29817774 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29817774
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- analog31 5y agoI run a very small business through PayPal. This won't change anything for me. I'll get a 1099 form telling me what I already know. At the same time, I frequent a web forum for musicians, many of whom buy and sell instruments. I don't think most of them are thinking of it as a business, but simply enjoy trying different gear and flipping one piece to finance the next one. Many musicians also earn a certain amount of cash income. "Never ascribe to malice that which can be adequately explained by ignorance." Discussions of tax reporting and the new PayPal rule seem to express as much confusion as annoyance. There is a widespread belief that cash income is not meant to be taxed. I think this might be due to a number of reasons, notably the fact that most people don't do their own taxes any more. Your obligations end with handing a sheaf of papers to an expert, who works on your return and (hopefully) hands a check back to you at the end. Also for this reason they don't see a difference between reportage and taxation -- a rise in reportage is equivalent to a tax increase. And they don't understand marginal taxation, so they assume $600 means they have to send $600 to the IRS. On the other hand, those of us who really did run businesses qua businesses, and filled out our own Schedule C's (even through TurboTax), see exactly what goes into the calculation and what comes out the other end. There's a place for 1099 income but also for non-1099 income. We were already paying those taxes. A minor disruption is that people will have to manage their personal affairs more like businesses, most notably maintaining records of their purchases so they're not on the hook for the entire sale. Buying a guitar for $600 and selling it for $601 gets you a 1099 for $601, but you only owe your marginal tax rate times one dollar. Still, knowing the cost basis so you can work it out correctly requires keeping records.
- conductr 5y agoKeep your guitar for a little while and it becomes long-term capital gain of $1 :)
- analog31 5y agoWhen I bought a new instrument a decade ago, I did some reading on the tax implications. I was ready to splurge on something nice. There was a fascinating case of a musician who bought a super expensive 200 year old instrument. He amortized the expense over some period like 7 years. Then he was invited to come on down to the tax court for a friendly chat. Turns out, the tax court didn't smile on depreciating an appreciating asset that demonstrably lasts 200 years. I actually considered buying an instrument in salvage condition and paying to have it restored, since restoration is an expense. But in the final analysis, I was more interested in playing than screwing around for a few dollars in tax savings.
- conductr 5y agoIt's crazy these threshold dollar amounts seem to never increase. $600 reporting requirement has been $600 forever it seems. It used to be my annual lawncare expense was less than $600/year. Now I pay roughly 2x-3x and it's over $600 so I am shouldered with this burden due to inflation/COL/time and a fixed IRS dollar amount. Just like how cash transactions >$10,000 need to be filed with IRS. That was set in the '80s I believe, when $10,000 in cash was much more substantial. It's not increased with time so the reporting burden just becomes more burdensome. Pretty soon a trip to the ATM will trigger an IRS report.
- zionic 5y agoThis is by design. They want to track everything but that’s too much too quick, so instead they set the limit high and let inflation do the job.
- adenozine 5y agoToo lazy to click the article, but... Could a hypothetical individual just charge 599, and then charge again for more? That even sounds like a stupid question, but I've heard this 600 usd number in the headlines yesterday and this morning, so I wonder the semantics.
- paymentanswer 5y agoNo this wouldn’t work. They track the amount over the course of the tax year. From this perspective 600 $1 payments is the same as 1 $600 payment.
- causality0 5y agoSee this is irritating because of the people I know, the vast majority of electronically transferred dollars are from one family member or romantic partner to another. These people don't have the ability to adequately defend themselves from official letters saying they have to pay taxes on their mom supporting them through school or their boyfriend paying their insurance.
- throwaway532532 5y agoI believe this is most likely going to hurt hair cutters, strippers (and similar sexy workers like ig models), others who get tips like valets, small time weed flippers.. These folks might get reported for higher amounts and not be able to write off expenses (easily or legally) and so will be easy targets/victims of this reporting. Most Etsy sellers can write off some expenses for materials easily, and johnny mowing lawns can likely claim no need to file with total income below threshold, do those won't be worth much time. This is going to devastate some people with very large and unexpected it's bills.
- throwaway532532 5y agoBabysitters, cleaners, pet care.. many small time gigs / side gigs gonna get hammered
- stjohnswarts 5y agoJust goes to show you how greedy the IRS (and federal government is), they'll go after your 14 year old baby sitter and try to jail them because they earned and worked hard enough to buy a cheap clunker car to drive for when they turn 15/16. Require them to file taxes and keep detailed paperwork for exactly how long you babysat little timothy on March 15.
- exabrial 5y agoI'm not so concerned about $600 from Joe Blow, much more concerned about the multi-million transactions Pelosi and her husband are doing.