8 ms·

It's more than that: it's the fact that all of the payment info is there. Every step, field entry, hurdle you put infront of a consumer is usually associated a

by zndr 5y ago

It's more than that: it's the fact that all of the payment info is there. Every step, field entry, hurdle you put infront of a consumer is usually associated a significant increase in "cart abandonment". By apple allowing you to just apple pay straight in and avoid CC, and billing address etc, they are decreasing the hurdles and increasing the conversion. Is it worth 30%? In 2013? Maybe In 2021? Definitely not. It should be closer to 5%. That being said I do like using Apple subscriptions because they make it REALLY easy to cancel them, all in one place, something that can't be said for a lot of other services.

Drew_ 5y ago
Apple Pay isn't the only payment processor that's convenient like this. But of course, Apple has created a market where their processor is the only one allowed.
- Spivak 5y ago
  I mean I pay for shit on my iPhone with PayPal, "Shop Pay", "Amazon Pay", or direct CC entry -- not digital goods obviously but still it's a frame of reference. None are half as good as Apple Pay's "hit button, double click, FaceID, done" flow. Like I will actually switch to using my phone to make purchases because I don't want to enter my CC info on some random site.
  - lwansbrough 5y ago
    If Apple wasn’t user-hostile this would all be an API that any payment provider could use.
  - Drew_ 5y ago
    Your experience with other payment processors on an iPhone are indeed not as good simply because they aren't allowed to be as good. Every single one of your experiences with these alternative payment processors was forced through a Safari browser.
    - judge2020 5y ago
      Nothing is stopping the 'Shop' app or Amazon app from being used for any and all third-party (or fourth party, in this case) payments, as long as they're not selling purely digital goods.
  - vatueil 5y ago
    I still prefer "hit button, tap TouchID, done". I also wish Apple would make it easier to switch to a different credit card for a one-off purchase. And stop forcing everyone in a Family Sharing group to use the same credit card for all purchases
    - thom 5y ago
      Argh, every day I consider going back to my iPhone 8 Plus purely because FaceID is so terrible. The point about switching cards easily is also absolutely right, plenty of places don’t accept American Express which is my default card.
pcthrowaway 5y ago
If it's anything like Google Subscriptions, there's the danger of disputing charges leading to your Apple account being banned, so it's probably in the users' interests to avoid it. But of course, when you've just come off of a plane at 2 AM and want to get a ride to your hotel so you can get a few hours of sleep before checkout time, this is probably not something users will think about.
- syspec 5y ago
  It's not like google subscriptions
onphonenow 5y ago
Yeah, one MAJOR issue I have with the folks complaining about apple. Many of them have HORRIBLE cancellation policies. I had to fight NY Times like crazy (it was sign up online, call to cancel kind of thing). Match is also in the "alliance" fighting apple with Facebook. They also have scummy practices (either tracking you or again duping you). The other thing I like with Apple, the trial periods are REALLY clear. When you sign up with comcast it's like $29/month (and then in tiny tiny print 10 pages later you find out that after 6 months it's $69/month or whatever). So until these folks clean things up where they ALREADY have full control (on the web) I'm willing to cut apple a ton of slack. Apple will remind you to cancel a subscription when you delete a related app. It reminds you if a subscription will renew and you can cancel then. I willing spend money through the app store I'd not spend ANYWHERE else. For folks willing to spend money but who don't want to f'ed around with constantly apple is the place to be. And it is super easy these days. Double tap or touch and done.
- jmknoll 5y ago
  Do virtualized credit card numbers address this problem? I have a free browser extension from my credit card company that generates virtual account numbers and when I pay for a service I create a new number for it. If it’s difficult to cancel the service I just delete the number instead.
  - cachvico 5y ago
    It doesn't. That's for fraud protection, not just-on-the-right-side-of-the-law subscription sketchiness.
    - paulgb 5y ago
      Legally it doesn't, but for practical purposes most recurring subscriptions probably won't pursue you over a declined payment and will just suspend your account. I don't advocate this, but I've heard that it works.
    - MiddleEndian 5y ago
      This shouldn't be on-the-right-side-of-the-law. You should be able to have your credit card send a "cancel" signal and that should be it. Further charges are theft.
Gigachad 5y ago
Apple should be forced to allow other payment processors store a platform wide login like you can with a Google account. So none of the payments run through Apples infrastructure, but there is no extra friction over their provider.
- sfifs 5y ago
  Eventually they will be in every sizeable market outside the US starting with Korea. With all that 30% cut money leaving the domestic economy and multi trillion valuation, Apple has made itself too juicy a target
viscanti 5y ago
> It's more than that: it's the fact that all of the payment info is there. Haven't Lyft and Uber already collected that payment information to charge per ride today? Is there even any friction savings here? What justifies the 30% cut when these companies seem to have done just fine not using the Apple Payment infrastructure?
- dragonwriter 5y ago
  > What justifies the 30% cut Power. Prices in capitalism don't reflect moral justifications, they reflect power.
funstuff007 5y ago
> Every step, field entry, hurdle you put infront of a consumer is usually associated a significant increase in "cart abandonment". Yeah, that's annoying, but for new vendors I just use Paypal.
threatofrain 5y ago
Apple Pay is different from App Store fees. Apple Pay is a payment process where the store doesn’t get your credit card number. Apple Store fees are a matter of business agreements between software companies and Apple. Using PayPal won’t help an app company escape its agreements with Apple.

by zndr 5y ago

Drew_ 5y ago

Apple Pay isn't the only payment processor that's convenient like this. But of course, Apple has created a market where their processor is the only one allowed.

Spivak 5y ago
I mean I pay for shit on my iPhone with PayPal, "Shop Pay", "Amazon Pay", or direct CC entry -- not digital goods obviously but still it's a frame of reference. None are half as good as Apple Pay's "hit button, double click, FaceID, done" flow. Like I will actually switch to using my phone to make purchases because I don't want to enter my CC info on some random site.
- lwansbrough 5y ago
  If Apple wasn’t user-hostile this would all be an API that any payment provider could use.
- Drew_ 5y ago
  Your experience with other payment processors on an iPhone are indeed not as good simply because they aren't allowed to be as good. Every single one of your experiences with these alternative payment processors was forced through a Safari browser.
  - judge2020 5y ago
    Nothing is stopping the 'Shop' app or Amazon app from being used for any and all third-party (or fourth party, in this case) payments, as long as they're not selling purely digital goods.
- vatueil 5y ago
  I still prefer "hit button, tap TouchID, done". I also wish Apple would make it easier to switch to a different credit card for a one-off purchase. And stop forcing everyone in a Family Sharing group to use the same credit card for all purchases
  - thom 5y ago
    Argh, every day I consider going back to my iPhone 8 Plus purely because FaceID is so terrible. The point about switching cards easily is also absolutely right, plenty of places don’t accept American Express which is my default card.

pcthrowaway 5y ago

If it's anything like Google Subscriptions, there's the danger of disputing charges leading to your Apple account being banned, so it's probably in the users' interests to avoid it. But of course, when you've just come off of a plane at 2 AM and want to get a ride to your hotel so you can get a few hours of sleep before checkout time, this is probably not something users will think about.

syspec 5y ago
It's not like google subscriptions

onphonenow 5y ago

Yeah, one MAJOR issue I have with the folks complaining about apple. Many of them have HORRIBLE cancellation policies. I had to fight NY Times like crazy (it was sign up online, call to cancel kind of thing). Match is also in the "alliance" fighting apple with Facebook. They also have scummy practices (either tracking you or again duping you). The other thing I like with Apple, the trial periods are REALLY clear. When you sign up with comcast it's like $29/month (and then in tiny tiny print 10 pages later you find out that after 6 months it's $69/month or whatever). So until these folks clean things up where they ALREADY have full control (on the web) I'm willing to cut apple a ton of slack. Apple will remind you to cancel a subscription when you delete a related app. It reminds you if a subscription will renew and you can cancel then. I willing spend money through the app store I'd not spend ANYWHERE else. For folks willing to spend money but who don't want to f'ed around with constantly apple is the place to be. And it is super easy these days. Double tap or touch and done.

jmknoll 5y ago
Do virtualized credit card numbers address this problem? I have a free browser extension from my credit card company that generates virtual account numbers and when I pay for a service I create a new number for it. If it’s difficult to cancel the service I just delete the number instead.
- cachvico 5y ago
  It doesn't. That's for fraud protection, not just-on-the-right-side-of-the-law subscription sketchiness.
  - paulgb 5y ago
    Legally it doesn't, but for practical purposes most recurring subscriptions probably won't pursue you over a declined payment and will just suspend your account. I don't advocate this, but I've heard that it works.
  - MiddleEndian 5y ago
    This shouldn't be on-the-right-side-of-the-law. You should be able to have your credit card send a "cancel" signal and that should be it. Further charges are theft.

Gigachad 5y ago

Apple should be forced to allow other payment processors store a platform wide login like you can with a Google account. So none of the payments run through Apples infrastructure, but there is no extra friction over their provider.

sfifs 5y ago
Eventually they will be in every sizeable market outside the US starting with Korea. With all that 30% cut money leaving the domestic economy and multi trillion valuation, Apple has made itself too juicy a target

viscanti 5y ago

> It's more than that: it's the fact that all of the payment info is there. Haven't Lyft and Uber already collected that payment information to charge per ride today? Is there even any friction savings here? What justifies the 30% cut when these companies seem to have done just fine not using the Apple Payment infrastructure?

dragonwriter 5y ago
> What justifies the 30% cut Power. Prices in capitalism don't reflect moral justifications, they reflect power.

funstuff007 5y ago

> Every step, field entry, hurdle you put infront of a consumer is usually associated a significant increase in "cart abandonment". Yeah, that's annoying, but for new vendors I just use Paypal.

threatofrain 5y ago

Apple Pay is different from App Store fees. Apple Pay is a payment process where the store doesn’t get your credit card number. Apple Store fees are a matter of business agreements between software companies and Apple. Using PayPal won’t help an app company escape its agreements with Apple.