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Great AA Alkaline Battery Test (2016)

263 points by ValentineC 5y ago

zh3 5y ago
Let me leap in here to ding Duracell. They used to be my goto battery, but over the past few years (there was a hedge fund takeover, which IME rarely results in improvements to long-standing quality products) they've turned into liabilities - specifically, they are extremely prone to leaking once even a little bit discharged. To this day I open old kit and there can be duracells in there with "use by 2010" or even earlier dates which are fine, yet far newer batteries (e.g. bought in 2016 with expiries in 2022) leak like there's no tomorrow for the buyout team. Interested to hear of others experiences, or I've just been amazingly unlucky.
- ASalazarMX 5y ago
  Happened for me too. They were very reliable batteries, now even new batteries leak if unused for a few years. They have ruined several remotes that I use sparingly, they should change their name to Ephemeralcell.
- TrainedMonkey 5y ago
  Anecdata, I recently had to replace batteries in several smoke alarms. 3 were Duracells and 2 were Rayovacs. All Duracells were from 2016/2017, i.e. assuming they were installed right away they lasted around 5 years. Rayovacs were from 2010 and 2011, despite both brands being rated for 5 years. It is possible that old Rayovacs were installed around same time as new Duracells and both lasted around same time, still makes for an interesting datapoint.
  - bluGill 5y ago
    Rayovac was bought out by Energizer not too long ago. They used to have a 10 year no leak guarantee, now they leak in a few months as I've learned the hard way.
  - adenner 5y ago
    Just as a bit of feedback, for safety equipment like smoke and CO detectors, standard guidance is to replace the battery at least once a year. (Unless you have an integrated 10 year battery that will last the life of the detector) If you live in an area that follows Daylight Savings time, doing it then is best so that you remember. Otherwise doing it during the Operation Edith drill for Fire Prevention Week is the next best.
    - TrainedMonkey 5y ago
      Does this guidance apply to both battery backup and battery only situations?
      - adenner 5y ago
        It is the safe option. At the least you should be up there validating that it works and as long as you are up there...
  - stjohnswarts 5y ago
    Eh most smoke detectors are only rated for 10 years, you may want to check those and chuck them based on what the manufacturer says.
- bwbmr 5y ago
  Same here, lots of leaks-- some family even has had a drawer full of unexpired Duracells leak. Myself, I've switched over completely to NiMh except when unsupported by the device to remove the change of leaks (Nest x Yale door lock in particular, which detected NiMh as low battery even when 90% of the cell capacity is remaining). AmazonBasics has been bad with leaks too. Edit: I have a Powerex MH-C980 and that has significantly made using NiMh easier. Before with a bundled Panasonic charger I had to charge everything in pairs, 4 max. The Powerex I can charge 8 cells individually, turbo charge if I'm in a rush, and see how much energy actually was used if something seems to be eating through a lot of batteries.
  - Moru 5y ago
    Just to clarify your point there: Charging batteries as pairs is what kills the rechargeable batteries. There is no way for the charger to keep track of both batteries at the same time so it just charges until both should be done. If one of them is bad, the charger will kill the other one too. If they are differently charged, it will kill one of the batteries and next time it will kill the other battery. (Kill as in make worse and worse until it finaly doesn't charge at all.) I have mostly stopped using rechargeable AA and AAA batteries because of the bad quality of the last ones I bought. They took 3-5 charges before dying with a good charger that does all batteries separately.
    - zackees 5y ago
      Also, NiMH batteries can reverse charge and ruin themselves. This happens a lot when batteries are in series and the load will continue to run the batteries until 0 voltage. The weakest battery will deplete first but then the other batteries will continue to pump current through until that weak battery reverses polarity and wrecks itself.
      - hilbert42 5y ago
        Correct, ages ago, I was testing a batch of them and came across several reversed charged ones. At first I thought I must have got my multimeter leads reversed but I found that was not the case. For a long while I kept them to prove the point to anyone who thought I'd must have lost my ability to distinguish plus from minus.
- dv_dt 5y ago
  After using Duracell for years for applications where I had to use alkaline, I recently had a set die with major leaks early, basically ruining a nice LED flashlight.
- cjbgkagh 5y ago
  Happened to me. Duracell was my goto and now they leak. I don’t know who to trust anymore. Thankfully I’m not a big battery consumer.
  - klodolph 5y ago
    As the article states, NiMH has gotten a lot better, and I now use that nearly everywhere instead of alkaline. It's nice not having to shop for batteries as often. I plugged in a charger behind the TV and batteries in a drawer under the TV. With the price point for Eneloop and Duracell batteries, you break even once you use a rechargeable for the fourth time. Part of the reason I have it in the first place is that the Roku 4's abysmal remote control goes through a set of batteries once every three months or so.
    - tkojames 5y ago
      Rumor is the Ikea batteries are rebranded Eneloop I have good luck with them.
      - jq-r 5y ago
        I have a lot of those white ones, and they work great for years now. They're a steal.
      - bxparks 5y ago
        This website says that the IKEA brands are equivalent to the Eneloop Pro and Lite, but not the regular white ones: https://eneloop101.com/batteries/rewrapped-batteries/ https://eneloop101.com/batteries/rewrapped-batteries/ (Scroll/search to "IKEA")
      - tecleandor 5y ago
        Seems like at least the AA size, model LADDA 2450mAh. You can check they're made in Japan. Not sure about the 1900 mAh, or the AAA size model, it might be a different brand.
        5y ago
- JTbane 5y ago
  Yep, have the same experience here. Even worse, I have devices which require batteries to be installed for memory retention, so I can't really remove all the alkalines to prevent leakage.
- Isthatablackgsd 5y ago
  Mmm, I recalled I had Duracell (bought in 2018, expire date 2025) leaked in the battery compartment and I don't use the device. I just assumed the device was on standby mode and been draining the battery for a while which caused the leaking. That mean I have to be wary of Kirkland AA and AAA Batteries because they are made by Duracell. This is new for me and I'm surprised about Duracell, and I am not surprised about hedge fund/private equity. This is their MO.
  - siegecraft 5y ago
    Kirkland batteries were very leaky to the point where I didn't even finish using the pack I bought. I was quite dismayed since Kirkland usually has quality products.
- pomian 5y ago
  That possibly explains the mysterious leaking battery problems. I remember that was an issue over twenty five years ago, which taught us not to leave batteries in devices. But then we accepted that they don't leak anymore. Then in the last five years or so, I keep finding gadgets that are destroyed, or almost so, from massive battery leaks. And alkalines don't seem to last very long, even though they are more expensive than they were.
- tablespoon 5y ago
  > there was a hedge fund takeover, which IME rarely results in improvements to long-standing quality products But think of the shareholder value that was created! https://web.archive.org/web/20121120072539/https://www.newyorker.com/humor/issuecartoons/2012/11/26/cartoons_20121119#slide=6 https://web.archive.org/web/20121120072539/https://www.newyo...
- bxparks 5y ago
  Yup, I hate Duracell batteries with a passion, they leak like a wet sponge and destroy electronics. I have converted most of my batteries to NiMH, but for the few that cannot be rechargeables, I will go out of the way to buy anything but Duracells.
- jolux 5y ago
  It wasn't a hedge fund, it was Berkshire Hathaway.
- CWuestefeld 5y ago
  More anecdata - I don't have anything to add regarding Duracell, but I've experienced the same thing you describe with Energizer. Recently I've leaned toward ACDelco batteries, which aren't on the test list.
  - wlesieutre 5y ago
    I had no idea ACDelco made anything other than car parts, huh.
- gunapologist99 5y ago
  Curious if you're having these leaks in Duracells you bought from a big box retail store, or shipped from Amazon.
  - gerdesj 5y ago
    You mean ... gasp ... they might be fakes. The EU has a quality mark "CE" - Conformitè Europëenne. Sometime the font is a bit wonky and it is alleged that CE in that case stands for China Export instead. I imagine that https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_marking#%22China_Export%22 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_marking#%22China_Export%22 is policed quite carefully.
    - kalium-xyz 5y ago
      those are just self-certified, CE is only on the authority of the people who put the label on not on some EU agency. They can be held accountable for not following CE correctly but not having the correct logo is not a problem.
  - brnt 5y ago
    I get Duracell Industrials through my works office supplier, they also leak frequently.
  - greenyoda 5y ago
    Back when I still bought them, I'd get them from the local big-chain supermarket. So I'm pretty sure they weren't fakes.
  - numpad0 5y ago
    ya saying..."Totally 100% Genuine" Duracell could leak less...
- grumpyprole 5y ago
  Completely agree. Duracell batteries have been leaking consistently for me, I've stopped buying them and actively warn others. They have destroyed various remotes, torches and an expensive camera flash after only a few years.
- justjash 5y ago
  Same. I pulled down my dad's old camera from the closet a few years ago and it probably hadn't been used since the 90s so the batteries were dead. Threw in some new Duracell batteries and played with it a bit before putting it away. Opened it a year or two later and the batteries had swelled and leaked everywhere. Had to use a pair of pliers to extract the swollen batteries from the battery compartment. Such a huge pain.
- jhallenworld 5y ago
  But I think their NIMH batteries are good. Project Farm reviewed them, they were near the top. Of course I'm looking for good ones that are cheaper..
- jacobolus 5y ago
  Duracell (the Mallory company) was bought by Dart in 1978, then by KKR in 1988, Gillette in 1996, Procter & Gamble bought Gillette in 2005, and Duracell was spun off and bought by Berkshire Hathaway in 2016. (source: Wikipedia) The company has been under large-scale finance / conglomerate management for more than 4 decades by now. I don’t think there would have been any immediate change in battery quality circa 2016. Seems just as likely that corner cutting (assuming there is corner cutting; I have no insight) started before changes of ownership.
  - kuhewa 5y ago
    You could be right as this suit alleging commonplace leaking was before ownership changed. https://topclassactions.com/lawsuit-settlements/lawsuit-news/duracell-batteries-leak-normal-use-class-action-claims/ https://topclassactions.com/lawsuit-settlements/lawsuit-news...
- jasode 5y ago
  I came across this recent youtube comment[1] on why older batteries didn't leak. I don't know if it's correct but sharing it anyway: >ceptimus 2 weeks ago (edited) >> Old alkaline batteries contained mercury, which made them resistant to leaking. The mercury was there to absorb the hydrogen gas, which builds internal pressure when the battery is used, causing them to leak. Newer alkaline batteries don't have mercury, because it's harmful to the environment when disposed. Unfortunately, the mercury free batteries leak much sooner - many of them long before their 'use by' date, even if you've never used them. Now you've replaced the batteries, you should check the camera more frequently. The modern rechargeable Ni-mh batteries, with a low self-discharge rate, are a good alternative: less likely to leak; but they're only nominally 1.2 Volts per cell instead of 1.5 volts, so some equipment won't work with them. EDIT... maybe there's more to it than just mercury because some low-effort googling[2] found that law prohibiting it in batteries was 1996 (~25 years ago). That doesn't match the timeline in the video because Alec says his old batteries (that didn't leak) were "use-by-date-2016". So maybe something else was different about the formulation in his Kirkland Signature batteries circa ~2008. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5s6xerRqVY&lc=UgztQzUKV5BJQqlFwVB4AaABAg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5s6xerRqVY&lc=UgztQzUKV5BJQ... [2] https://www.google.com/search?q=mercury+removed+from+alkaline+batteries+1996 https://www.google.com/search?q=mercury+removed+from+alkalin...
- surge 5y ago
  Someone did a test and found the Costco Kirkland batteries were not only as good as Duracell, but cheaper and lasted longer.
- Spooky23 5y ago
  They are expensive, but if you need a primary battery, the non-rechargeable lithium batteries are great. My clock radio backup battery has probably been in there for >15 years.
- sandworm101 5y ago
  In a past life I worked in the entertainment biz. Duracell ProCells were the go-to battery for important things. Britney Spears' headset would have had a Procell in it. They would all get tested before use and maybe 5 in a thousand were bad and not used. They weren't the absolute best in the world but they were acceptable and cheap enough to use and toss. After a show we would all take the 'used' batteries home and use them until they were actually flat. The only time I ever saw one leak in a device was if it got submerged or very hot. Now, the procell in my pencil-sized flashlight seems to leak after a month. I switched to energizer and, at least in my sample size of one, I haven't seen a leak.
  - rainbowzootsuit 5y ago
    Having worked in video production for a time, my understanding of the intent/marketing of the procell line is that you always use a fresh one for each production. Therefore, they are lower spec than one that might sit in a device for a long time as they're going to be done with their intended life in a few hours, and they're cheaper than the retail cells with better longevity. I certainly never ran them through the qualifications that the article did.
    - sandworm101 5y ago
      The places I worked certainly went thought them like water. Every time something like a lav pack or mic came off a performer it got a new procell. There were buckets of them at the end of the day. They never spent much time inside the devices but did come home with us for use in remotes and kids toys. I understood the procell line to mean that the batteries each got tested for voltage before shipping. 20/30 years ago, for whatever reason, a percentage of consumer batteries would be already dead when they left the factory.
      - sidpatil 5y ago
        > 20/30 years ago, for whatever reason, a percentage of consumer batteries would be already dead when they left the factory. My uneducated guess is that manufacturing defects led to internal shorts or opens, both of which eventually lead to the same result — no output.
- im_down_w_otp 5y ago
  I have a pack of AAA Duracells I just went to open the other day which were "use by 2025" that I purchased just a few weeks ago, and one of the batteries in the middle of the fresh unopened pack was already leaking with one end fully encrusted with corrosion.
- petee 5y ago
  90% of my Duracells from the past decade have leaked and ruined equipment, and all well before expiration date. Ive been now telling my family and friends to avoid at all cost
- GekkePrutser 5y ago
  Same here. Have had many of them leak before the due by date :(
- greenyoda 5y ago
  I've had exactly the same experience with Duracell - batteries leaking years before their expiration date (sometimes shortly after purchase). I never buy Duracell anymore.
- mherdeg 5y ago
  Yeah the second blog post in this series has some examples of leaking, unexpired batteries: https://goughlui.com/2016/12/19/great-aa-alkaline-battery-test-pt-2-the-contenders https://goughlui.com/2016/12/19/great-aa-alkaline-battery-te...
wrjensen 5y ago
I have had the same issues with Duracell leakage. I won't buy them any more, for exactly that reason.
warpech 5y ago
Also see this impressive test: https://anrieff.net/batterytest/index_en.html https://anrieff.net/batterytest/index_en.html (European market)
Normille 5y ago
Check out 'Project Farm' on YouTube for a couple more in-depth tests of AA batteries TLDR: Made in Japan = GOOD Made in China = BAD
- Isthatablackgsd 5y ago
  I love how he made it clear where it was assembled in. Every time he said "Made in USA with Global Components!", I was like yea more like made in China and rebranded in USA.
  - csdvrx 5y ago
    We need a new slogan: "rebranded in USA with a total lack of pride"
wmorein 5y ago
Apologies for the slightly off topic question but can anyone point me to the best test/comparison of Alkaline batteries vs. the new Lithium rechargeable ones? Older rechargeable AA and AAA batteries were terribly short lived and so mostly useless but I assume Lithium ones are much better?
- bradfa 5y ago
  I've not seen AA or AAA sized lithium rechargeable batteries but modern low-self-discharge NiMH AA and AAA cell batteries are quite good today. The Panasonic Eneloop brand are generally widely available and good value for money. The AA size Eneloops are generally around 2100mAh and the AAA size around 900mAh. The only downside to modern NiMH batteries today seems to be finding a good and easy to use charger which will properly discharge and/or cycle the batteries without requiring a human to fiddle with it or understand charge rates and when to discharge the cell prior to charging.
  - dragontamer 5y ago
    > The only downside to modern NiMH batteries today seems to be finding a good and easy to use charger which will properly discharge and/or cycle the batteries without requiring a human to fiddle with it or understand charge rates and when to discharge the cell prior to charging. Only if you're really babying your NiMH cells is it worthwhile to do this. ----- Frankly, my recommendation is to just throw away NiMH cells once they "go bad" (maybe a discharge/recharge cycle will save them, but they're really not that expensive). For most consumers out there, the $10 trickle charge that takes 8+ hours is superior, because they'll never cycle the NiMH cells to death. How many dozens of charge/recharge cycles do you need before there's an issue, even with the most primitive of charging strategies? When it takes months for a typical AA powered appliance to run out of NiMH charge, you realize that these "dozens" of charge/discharge cycles gives a life-span measured in _YEARS_ for these NiMH cells. After 5 years, your NiMH cells might be on its last legs, needing a full discharge/recharge to get back to full power. Then and only then should you consider a $30 charger to perform this resurrection, except its probably more cost-efficient to just spend $2 and throw away the "old" cell. You'll need to throw away $20 worth of cells (ie: 10 cells) before your $30 fancy charger with discharge/recharge cycles + coulomb counting is superior to the $10 crap trickle charger. Maybe an RC-car enthusiast will get there (or an electronic-hobbyist), but that's a _LOT_ of charge/recharge cycles before you reach this point. Even with the inferior $10 trickle charge design. ------- EDIT: That being said, spending $30, $40, or $50 on a higher-end charger because you find it "cool" is probably worthwhile. Coolness is a factor and we're not really talking about a lot of money here. But the $10 charger + buy new cells as needed approach is probably the most cost-effective strategy.
rdl 5y ago
Duracell used to be really good about replacing devices if their batteries leaked. They screwed me a couple years ago and refused to replace something (a $50 apple keyboard, I think they gave me $10 for it?). I went from buying exclusively Duracell for alkaline to now just buying Energizer Lithium for everything where it isn't specifically contraindicated (very rare).
- zh3 5y ago
  Yes, I too have switched to Energizer - zero problems to date (switched from Duracell some years ago).
dragontamer 5y ago
I think the main issue with AA Alkaline is the proliferation of cheap low-self-discharge NiMH cells (aka: Eneloop, but also Energizer and other brands have good LSD NiMH available). A huge number of appliances seem to be designed for the 1.35V NiMH chemistry now. Perhaps a random TV-remote still prefers Alkaline but most seem to work fine with NiMH. ----- Buying a pack of 20 NiMH cells and rotating your collection between charging / discharging states is cheap enough and effective. Its like you have "infinite" AAs since you can just keep recharging them. EDIT: A few years ago, Alkaline was still needed for TV remotes. But most Low-self-discharge NiMH now lasts for over a year without self-discharging away. Sure, not as good as Alkaline's 10-year life span but surely 1+ year lifespans is good enough for your TV remote? Its not that big of a hassle to reach recharge your NiMH once a year is it?
- fouric 5y ago
  How do you find good cheap low-self-discarge NiMH cells? I couldn't find any research on them (like the post article but for NiMH) because of SEO spam, and Amazon reviews are (of course) worthless. Heck, I'm afraid to even buy NiMH batteries because of counterfeits. I bought a few batches of Amazon Basics batteries a year ago and 3/8 are dead already, but even if I purchased something labeled "Eneloop" on there, how do I know it's Eneloop?
- klodolph 5y ago
  > A huge number of appliances seem to be designed for the 1.35V NiMH chemistry now. Yes, this is my experience too. One of the problems with NiMH is that appliances have helpful low-battery indicators which might light up as soon as you put NiMH cells in them, even though the appliance might continue working for a long time yet. A prime example is the Nintendo Game Boy Advance, which was released in 2001. The thing is powered by switching regulators which work fine with the lower voltages of NiMH cells! Newer appliances have solved these problems. For example, the Yamaha PSS-A50 (a fantastic, inexpensive portable keyboard) has an option to configure the low-battery indicator for alkaline or NiMH chemistry.
  - ace2358 5y ago
    Totally agree! My Game Boy Advanced power light is green for about an hour then red for hours and hours on my eneloops. Also my Tascam field recorder has the option for alkaline or NiMH batteries. I still have some kitchen scales that won’t work with NiMH though :( I’ve had my energiser batteries for almost 10 years and I’ve been rotating them through devices and the charger. Only recently have I begun to lose some cells. Time to upgrade them all to eneloops!!
jvanderbot 5y ago
Does anyone know of a good rechargeable battery comparison test? I've noticed that some 18650's are just crap after a couple charges, and some dinky AA batteries last forever after many charges.
- 0cVlTeIATBs 5y ago
  https://lygte-info.dk https://lygte-info.dk is a good site.
- aidenn0 5y ago
  Amazon Basics low-self-discharge batteries are fine. Eneloop if you want to avoid giving Amazon money and don't mind paying more for the brand.
- SomewhatLikely 5y ago
  Project Farm has a video with tests: https://youtu.be/-jXQNY6rve8 https://youtu.be/-jXQNY6rve8
- arendtio 5y ago
  I am very happy with my Eneloops. I used Ansmanns before (and still use the Ansmann recharge device), but they died after like 20 cycles (note: those Ansmanns were models from before the low-self-discharge era). The Eneloops are 3 years old and still work fine while being used every day (recharge about once per week).
LeoPanthera 5y ago
There's very little reason to continue using Alkalines in the majority of cases. Rechargeable batteries both last longer, and, perhaps even more importantly, do not leak.
- johndough 5y ago
  Rechargeable batteries (assuming NiMH and Ni-Cd) can still leak, but usually the leakage is less severe.
- ARandomerDude 5y ago
  Batteries are so cheap these days that I consider them essentially single use, like a paper plate. I buy the 60 pack of Rayovac AAs at Home Depot and always have fresh batteries -- and I don't have to worry about a leaking issue.
  - crtasm 5y ago
    Single use batteries aren't good for our planet, please try rechargables?
CamperBob2 5y ago
Spoiler: they're all obsolete cost-reduced leaky pieces of shit. Use Eneloops or other NiMH rechargeables when possible, lithium primary cells otherwise. For a while you could avoid leakage by steering clear of Duracell in favor of Energizer, but that's no longer true. Do not use alkaline AAs or AAAs in any equipment you want to keep.
SavantIdiot 5y ago
+1 for introducing me to the B&K 8600. It never occurred to me to search for a DC load device. I've been building FET-based loads and using a power supply to calibrate them. /smacks forehead/ This is what you miss when you don't get to work with professionals on your hobbies (i.e., building low power IoT sensors for funsies).
silisili 5y ago
On the subject of AA alkaline batteries - one thing I learned a long time ago somehow I'll share that people seem amazed by is that you can approximate their charge by bouncing them on a hard surface. Drop an AA battery negative/flat side down an inch or two onto a hard surface like a counter or table. A new battery will just land and thud. A dead battery will bounce repeatedly(you'll hear it more than see it).
- iancmceachern 5y ago
  I wonder what phenomenon is driving this. A spent battery weighs more?
  - dragontamer 5y ago
    The physical chemistry changes as a battery is spent. The internal chemicals are being converted from one molecule into another. Its not surprising to me that the two different chemicals have different physical properties. (Elasticity, density, who knows? They're a fully different chemical once the electrons move around)
    - ChrisLomont 5y ago
      Almost all the mass of a molecule is in atom nuclei, and these masses do not change under any battery chemistry I've ever seen. The only way to change mass appreciably is to add or remove atoms from the interior of the battery.
  - thescriptkiddie 5y ago
    IIRC alkaline batteries produce some kind of gas while being discharged. When the battery is dead it is probably inflated like an unopened soda can, assuming it hasn't leaked.
    - jandrese 5y ago
      Isn't that what the vents holes are for?
moreati 5y ago
Note, this is from 2016.
- CamperBob2 5y ago
  Indeed, and one major change that's taken place in the last few years is that Energizers are now as leak-prone as Duracells. Likely true of other brands as well. The only way to win the alkaline battery game is not to play.
colanderman 5y ago
Re: constant current appliances, most any "digital" appliance that uses a linear regulator (as opposed to a DC-DC converter) will exhibit such a load profile.
RicoElectrico 5y ago
There's also http://lygte-info.dk/ http://lygte-info.dk/ which has a ton of battery and charger tests. Definitely worth reading.
Maarten88 5y ago
As a test I recently bought a pair of Li-ion AA batteries, that are recharged through a micro USB connector in the battery. They are rated 2880 mWh and are advertised to provide a flat 1.5v during the whole discharge cycle (they have internal circuitry to convert from the native 3.7v). I wonder how those compare to my current rotating stock of Ni-MH ones that regularly stop working. Jury is still out, they were considerably more expensive though (something like €4.50 a piece).
- discreditable 5y ago
  I have some similar Li-ion AA batteries for my Blink cameras. They work very well since the Blinks hate ni-mh batteries. Interestingly, these behave oddly in my camera speedlite. They can't seem to charge the flash, and the LCD flickers while on. My best guess is the charging the flash capacitor pulls more juice than the lithium batteries can handle. Thankfully, ni-mh work great. For your Ni-mh that stop working, if they won't charge you can sort of jump start them using a good battery and they'll charge again. Use some aluminum foil strips and touch the contacts between the batteries together for a few seconds. Positive to positive, negative to negative if I remember correctly.
- mnw21cam 5y ago
  The AAA versions of these are a godsend for my Bose noise cancelling headphones. I tried using NiMH batteries, but the headphones would cut out every time I shook my head or chewed something, because they didn't have a high enough voltage.
reiichiroh 5y ago
Anyone remember the rechargeable alkaline brand “Pure Energy” available in Canada?
zwieback 5y ago
I know what I'll pick up next time I'm at IKEA.
- diebeforei485 5y ago
  Ikea no longer sells alkaline batteries :) https://www.ikea.com/us/en/newsroom/corporate-news/ikea-to-remove-non-rechargeable-alkaline-batteries-by-2021-pubb6aee8b0 https://www.ikea.com/us/en/newsroom/corporate-news/ikea-to-r...
  - robert_foss 5y ago
    But they do sell Low Self-Discharge NiMH 2450mA batteries. https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/ladda-rechargeable-battery-hr06-aa-1-2v-50504692/ https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/ladda-rechargeable-battery-hr06...
zoomablemind 5y ago
Chiming in, I just recently was wondering how two seemingly equal by chemistry and size batteries just from different mfgrs could be so much incomparable by practical life-times. On so many occasions Panasonic or Sony (Japan made) batteries which come included with devices (like remote controls etc) would last years (!) (in some odd case I had Sony AA battery functional after more than a decade), yet any recent replacements from Duracel or Energizer the ones bought from a pharmacy would get exhausted within a year of similar use. There must be some difference there, just how to tell what is that?
- raihansaputra 5y ago
  "By Chemistry" seems to be the keyword here. AFAIK Alkaline also have several chemistry differences, and batteries especially OEM would be matched to the use (low energy-long storage for remote). General purpose/OTS battery seem to optimize for power for ease-of-use. Avoid the scenario of "Oh this toy doesn't work with this battery brand so I'll avoid it". Have you tried specific long-use batteries? Non-alkaline or Alkaline branded as such?
  - zoomablemind 5y ago
    > ...Have you tried specific long-use batteries? Non-alkaline or Alkaline branded as such? What is "long-use" in this case? Most of the batteries are advertized on the packaging as "long-lasting guaranteed!". Sure, there're lithium batteries, and LSD rechargeables, but alkaline kind are normally just touted as "Alkaline!" or highlighted to that effect. Just fetched some of those old OEM batteries, Panasonic one is labeled Ultra Hyper (Costa Rica made) UM-3UHS/R6, Sony is Super Red (Japan made), R6P(SR) - this one is labeled 03/98, I kid you not, still measures 1.4V. I sure haven't seen these on shelves here, well, not currently, at least.
    - raihansaputra 5y ago
      The Sony one is advertised as `low-current` use battery, so I'm not surprised that it lasted long. Well 1.4 is no joke though. Interestingly I can't find any listing for any low-current battery on Amazon. I swear I've seen them in my local stores a few years ago, advertised specifically for remotes. Maybe they're not profitable so people stop selling them. Bummer.
bentcorner 5y ago
> This can be implemented basically with a fixed value of resistance, but because of the way resistance interacts with voltage, it’s actually very gentle on the battery. As the battery voltage falls, the current falls accordingly, so the delivered power falls even further. For modern appliances, this type of loading is not common. Dumb question - is it at all possible to design a modern device which operates this way? (As battery voltage falls, device performance also falls? It's been a really really long time since my EE classes - are transistors just unable to operate this way?)
- sbierwagen 5y ago
  Some LED flashlights with multiple brightness modes will drop to low brightness mode when cell voltage falls below a certain point.
- gruez 5y ago
  > It's been a really really long time since my EE classes - are transistors just unable to operate this way?) Yeah, most CPUs nowadays have dynamic frequency adjustment to maximize battery life. Lower frequencies also mean transistors can operate at lower voltages, so by reducing the operating frequency, you can reduce the voltage and therefore power draw on your battery.
- orev 5y ago
  Apple did this with iPhones, where the CPU throttles itself when the battery can’t keep up with the peak demand anymore. They got sued for it (mostly because they didn’t tell anyone and people bought new phones when the old ones started mysteriously slowing down).
- dragontamer 5y ago
  Have you ever used an old flashlight in the 80s or 90s? As AA charge fell, the light got dimmer and dimmer. Today, we have devices that do the exact _OPPOSITE_, pulling the last bits of electricity out of the cells through boost-converters or whatnot (boost converters existed back then, but weren't as efficient or cheap as today). Consumers demanded consistent and reliable performance no matter if at full-battery charge or nearly empty. People preferred their devices to suddenly "shut off".
symby 5y ago
Not included in this analysis is leakage rate... by which I mean ooze leakage. I have found that some batteries have a much greater likelihood of leaking ooze than others (yeah Rayovak, I'm looking at you!) Except in the case of crappy toys, the damage that this causes radically outstrips the cost of the battery. As a result, I buy batteries not based on electrical performance, but track record in not ruining the things I put them into. I am very happy to accept 50% less energy if I can avoid destroying my $200 gadget.
- mitchbob 5y ago
  > As a result, I buy batteries not based on electrical performance, but track record in not ruining the things I put them into. So do I. I'm now using low self-discharge NiMH batteries (mostly Eneloops) in pretty much every device that uses batteries, and I've never had one leak. I also use smart chargers to check battery health when I recharge them. A bit more initial outlay, but much cheaper in the long run, as the batteries can be recharged 1000s of times, and they hold their charge for many months.
- msie 5y ago
  I have had success in removing the battery leakage from my toys. Baking soda + water on a q-tip works really well.
walrus01 5y ago
something that didn't exist in 2016 and does now, are AA batteries that are composed of an internal lithium ion cell, a DC-DC converter for 1.5VDC output to the end terminals, and internal 5V-USB to li-ion charge controller circuitry. With a USB port literally built into the body of the battery. They're more expensive, but can pay for themselves... https://www.amazon.com/AA-Batteries-ANVOW-Rechargeable-Capacity/dp/B08JTSBSNR?th=1 https://www.amazon.com/AA-Batteries-ANVOW-Rechargeable-Capac... there are lots of other models if you search for "AA battery lithium ion USB" I would recommend these over anything that is NiMH based (memory effect) or needs a proprietary charger.
- intrasight 5y ago
  I'd seen those in the past. Prices have come down. Am curious what are the benefits over NiMN.
  - walrus01 5y ago
    should be little to no memory effect unlike NiMH
    - Zak 5y ago
      Modern, high-quality NiMH has little to no memory effect. Eneloops are the gold standard, though rumor has it many other brands have caught up.
  - exhilaration 5y ago
    At first glance, capacity seems to be the main benefit, from the above link: Battery Capacity: 3400mWh Compare that to Eneloop pros: 2500mAh Using this converter https://convert-formula.com/mwh-mahz https://convert-formula.com/mwh-mahz 3400mWh at 1.5v is 2256mAh so the Eneloop pros actually have more capacity.
    - walrus01 5y ago
      Downside being that the eneloop pro needs its own charger, these should be able to charge from any phone charger, or come with their own 4-to-1 usb cable.
zw123456 5y ago
This is really amazing work, I found part 3 to be the most interesting https://goughlui.com/2016/12/19/great-aa-alkaline-battery-test-pt-3-the-results https://goughlui.com/2016/12/19/great-aa-alkaline-battery-te... particularly the mwh/$ and other charts like capacity vs. weight etc.
adwi 5y ago
Tl;dr from author in comments: > The best choice is to avoid disposable batteries where possible and use low-self-discharge Ni-MH cells such as the Sanyo/Panasonic Eneloop. Even though the upfront cost is higher, it only takes a few recharges (in some cases, less than ten) to be financially (and possibly even environmentally) ahead.
wrycoder 5y ago
Note that this is the first post of a four part series. The final post, an addendum, is [0]. The post with the energy ratings is [1] [0] https://goughlui.com/2017/01/31/great-aa-alkaline-battery-test-addendum-25ma-constant-current-tests/ https://goughlui.com/2017/01/31/great-aa-alkaline-battery-te... [1] https://goughlui.com/2016/12/19/great-aa-alkaline-battery-test-pt-3-the-results https://goughlui.com/2016/12/19/great-aa-alkaline-battery-te...
anonymousiam 5y ago
It's an old article, but still mostly correct. Several developments have changed the landscape over the past decade. The Chinese have pretty much taken over the battery manufacturing industry. As a result, the quality of many low-production battery series has gone down dramatically. Some cells that once had a 10-year shelf life will now be completely useless within two years. A more positive development has been the improvement in power electronics. Quality consumer electronics will now often include power conditioning circuits so the "cut off" voltage from a battery is no longer relevant. The batteries can now continue to power the device until they are completely discharged. (See: https://www.ti.com/tool/TPS61280EVM-585 https://www.ti.com/tool/TPS61280EVM-585)
fomine3 5y ago
Panasonic (who sell expensive alkaline cell) or FDK (who made eneloop) 's alkaline is my choice for expensive/important appliances.
ggm 5y ago
I think the way we went to 1.2v for rechargables when we design to higher nominal voltage is really confusing. Why we didn't either shift the design basis to use 1.2-1.1 as a signal so we had better outcome when 1.2 drops off, or design the 1.2 cells to deliver 1.4 dropping to 1.2 and 1.1 is beyond me. Because in practice, we're not designing for the consequences of 1.2 It shelves on 1.2 forever, tails, and then BOOM its gone. we should have designed for that curve, not for 1.5 -1.4 -1.3 -1.2 ....... BOOM
pengaru 5y ago
The number of comments here saying batteries used to not leak, as if this is some kind of new phenomenon, confuses the hell out of me. Alkaline batteries have always been prone to leaking and ruining electronics when left in them too long for as long as I can remember (I'm in my 40s). It's worse in my experience if subjected to extreme temperature swings. Rechargeables tend to be more robustly made in this department.
stavros 5y ago
I built a similar test rig from a $15 plane controller to test some VTC6 batteries I bought: https://notes.stavros.io/maker-things/battery-discharge-curves/ https://notes.stavros.io/maker-things/battery-discharge-curv... It was a lot of fun!
- watersb 5y ago
  I actually learned a lot from your reports when I geeked out on flashlights and battery formats that were new to me, the 27xxx size. Thanks very much! (It was sometime in the past 18 months, in which all time sequences have been shredded in a lockdown blur.)
  - stavros 5y ago
    No problem, but are you sure it was me? My battery measurements are pretty recent.
diebeforei485 5y ago
We should get rid of consumer single-use batteries in my opinion. There is an increasing number of smart home devices that tell people to avoid rechargeable batteries. This was understandable when smart home products were a small category, often run by small companies that couldn't possibly put in the effort to understand the discharge curve of every rechargeable battery out there. But given the size of the industry today, they should come together and create a standard for a rechargeable battery. Perhaps they can even partner with battery manufacturers and create a new form factor, so people can't just use alkaline batteries instead. Professional uses like military, R&D, filming etc are often cited but in reality they are a very small percentage of batteries used, and don't need to change before consumer applications do.
rpaddock 5y ago
Around ~2005 one of our products was featured in a Duracell commercial. In 2011 manufacturing for all but the 9V was moved to Tunisia and the design of the battery was changed. In pre-2011 batteries the cylinder was the negative terminal. In the newer design the cylinder is the positive. Look at the bottom of the newer ones and you will see a very small O-Ring separating the positive from the negative. It is very easy to breach this O-Ring when inserting a battery, resulting in it getting hot. Well over 100'F has been measured. The new design WILL leak. Because of our commercial connection we discussed this with Duracell. The end result was "We don't care". Today they are riding on the reputation of the past. We then evaluated all the batteries on the market at that time. Technically the Energizers and the RayOVacs came out the same, with the RayOVacs being cheaper we switched to those. Shortly there after Energizer bought RayOVac. Look at the Fine Print on the package today and it says they are made by Energizer. Has anyone noticed the scam that Home Depot and Walmart, and probably others, are running? C and D cells are the same price. The marketing campaign tells us this is a Good Thing, without explaining how. If the energy density is not the same, then the price should not be the same.

263 points by ValentineC 5y ago

zh3 5y ago

Let me leap in here to ding Duracell. They used to be my goto battery, but over the past few years (there was a hedge fund takeover, which IME rarely results in improvements to long-standing quality products) they've turned into liabilities - specifically, they are extremely prone to leaking once even a little bit discharged. To this day I open old kit and there can be duracells in there with "use by 2010" or even earlier dates which are fine, yet far newer batteries (e.g. bought in 2016 with expiries in 2022) leak like there's no tomorrow for the buyout team. Interested to hear of others experiences, or I've just been amazingly unlucky.

ASalazarMX 5y ago
Happened for me too. They were very reliable batteries, now even new batteries leak if unused for a few years. They have ruined several remotes that I use sparingly, they should change their name to Ephemeralcell.
TrainedMonkey 5y ago
Anecdata, I recently had to replace batteries in several smoke alarms. 3 were Duracells and 2 were Rayovacs. All Duracells were from 2016/2017, i.e. assuming they were installed right away they lasted around 5 years. Rayovacs were from 2010 and 2011, despite both brands being rated for 5 years. It is possible that old Rayovacs were installed around same time as new Duracells and both lasted around same time, still makes for an interesting datapoint.
- bluGill 5y ago
  Rayovac was bought out by Energizer not too long ago. They used to have a 10 year no leak guarantee, now they leak in a few months as I've learned the hard way.
- adenner 5y ago
  Just as a bit of feedback, for safety equipment like smoke and CO detectors, standard guidance is to replace the battery at least once a year. (Unless you have an integrated 10 year battery that will last the life of the detector) If you live in an area that follows Daylight Savings time, doing it then is best so that you remember. Otherwise doing it during the Operation Edith drill for Fire Prevention Week is the next best.
  - TrainedMonkey 5y ago
    Does this guidance apply to both battery backup and battery only situations?
    - adenner 5y ago
      It is the safe option. At the least you should be up there validating that it works and as long as you are up there...
- stjohnswarts 5y ago
  Eh most smoke detectors are only rated for 10 years, you may want to check those and chuck them based on what the manufacturer says.
bwbmr 5y ago
Same here, lots of leaks-- some family even has had a drawer full of unexpired Duracells leak. Myself, I've switched over completely to NiMh except when unsupported by the device to remove the change of leaks (Nest x Yale door lock in particular, which detected NiMh as low battery even when 90% of the cell capacity is remaining). AmazonBasics has been bad with leaks too. Edit: I have a Powerex MH-C980 and that has significantly made using NiMh easier. Before with a bundled Panasonic charger I had to charge everything in pairs, 4 max. The Powerex I can charge 8 cells individually, turbo charge if I'm in a rush, and see how much energy actually was used if something seems to be eating through a lot of batteries.
- Moru 5y ago
  Just to clarify your point there: Charging batteries as pairs is what kills the rechargeable batteries. There is no way for the charger to keep track of both batteries at the same time so it just charges until both should be done. If one of them is bad, the charger will kill the other one too. If they are differently charged, it will kill one of the batteries and next time it will kill the other battery. (Kill as in make worse and worse until it finaly doesn't charge at all.) I have mostly stopped using rechargeable AA and AAA batteries because of the bad quality of the last ones I bought. They took 3-5 charges before dying with a good charger that does all batteries separately.
  - zackees 5y ago
    Also, NiMH batteries can reverse charge and ruin themselves. This happens a lot when batteries are in series and the load will continue to run the batteries until 0 voltage. The weakest battery will deplete first but then the other batteries will continue to pump current through until that weak battery reverses polarity and wrecks itself.
    - hilbert42 5y ago
      Correct, ages ago, I was testing a batch of them and came across several reversed charged ones. At first I thought I must have got my multimeter leads reversed but I found that was not the case. For a long while I kept them to prove the point to anyone who thought I'd must have lost my ability to distinguish plus from minus.
dv_dt 5y ago
After using Duracell for years for applications where I had to use alkaline, I recently had a set die with major leaks early, basically ruining a nice LED flashlight.
cjbgkagh 5y ago
Happened to me. Duracell was my goto and now they leak. I don’t know who to trust anymore. Thankfully I’m not a big battery consumer.
- klodolph 5y ago
  As the article states, NiMH has gotten a lot better, and I now use that nearly everywhere instead of alkaline. It's nice not having to shop for batteries as often. I plugged in a charger behind the TV and batteries in a drawer under the TV. With the price point for Eneloop and Duracell batteries, you break even once you use a rechargeable for the fourth time. Part of the reason I have it in the first place is that the Roku 4's abysmal remote control goes through a set of batteries once every three months or so.
  - tkojames 5y ago
    Rumor is the Ikea batteries are rebranded Eneloop I have good luck with them.
    - jq-r 5y ago
      I have a lot of those white ones, and they work great for years now. They're a steal.
    - bxparks 5y ago
      This website says that the IKEA brands are equivalent to the Eneloop Pro and Lite, but not the regular white ones: https://eneloop101.com/batteries/rewrapped-batteries/ https://eneloop101.com/batteries/rewrapped-batteries/ (Scroll/search to "IKEA")
    - tecleandor 5y ago
      Seems like at least the AA size, model LADDA 2450mAh. You can check they're made in Japan. Not sure about the 1900 mAh, or the AAA size model, it might be a different brand.
      - 5y ago
JTbane 5y ago
Yep, have the same experience here. Even worse, I have devices which require batteries to be installed for memory retention, so I can't really remove all the alkalines to prevent leakage.
Isthatablackgsd 5y ago
Mmm, I recalled I had Duracell (bought in 2018, expire date 2025) leaked in the battery compartment and I don't use the device. I just assumed the device was on standby mode and been draining the battery for a while which caused the leaking. That mean I have to be wary of Kirkland AA and AAA Batteries because they are made by Duracell. This is new for me and I'm surprised about Duracell, and I am not surprised about hedge fund/private equity. This is their MO.
- siegecraft 5y ago
  Kirkland batteries were very leaky to the point where I didn't even finish using the pack I bought. I was quite dismayed since Kirkland usually has quality products.
pomian 5y ago
That possibly explains the mysterious leaking battery problems. I remember that was an issue over twenty five years ago, which taught us not to leave batteries in devices. But then we accepted that they don't leak anymore. Then in the last five years or so, I keep finding gadgets that are destroyed, or almost so, from massive battery leaks. And alkalines don't seem to last very long, even though they are more expensive than they were.
tablespoon 5y ago
> there was a hedge fund takeover, which IME rarely results in improvements to long-standing quality products But think of the shareholder value that was created! https://web.archive.org/web/20121120072539/https://www.newyorker.com/humor/issuecartoons/2012/11/26/cartoons_20121119#slide=6 https://web.archive.org/web/20121120072539/https://www.newyo...
bxparks 5y ago
Yup, I hate Duracell batteries with a passion, they leak like a wet sponge and destroy electronics. I have converted most of my batteries to NiMH, but for the few that cannot be rechargeables, I will go out of the way to buy anything but Duracells.
jolux 5y ago
It wasn't a hedge fund, it was Berkshire Hathaway.
CWuestefeld 5y ago
More anecdata - I don't have anything to add regarding Duracell, but I've experienced the same thing you describe with Energizer. Recently I've leaned toward ACDelco batteries, which aren't on the test list.
- wlesieutre 5y ago
  I had no idea ACDelco made anything other than car parts, huh.
gunapologist99 5y ago
Curious if you're having these leaks in Duracells you bought from a big box retail store, or shipped from Amazon.
- gerdesj 5y ago
  You mean ... gasp ... they might be fakes. The EU has a quality mark "CE" - Conformitè Europëenne. Sometime the font is a bit wonky and it is alleged that CE in that case stands for China Export instead. I imagine that https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_marking#%22China_Export%22 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_marking#%22China_Export%22 is policed quite carefully.
  - kalium-xyz 5y ago
    those are just self-certified, CE is only on the authority of the people who put the label on not on some EU agency. They can be held accountable for not following CE correctly but not having the correct logo is not a problem.
- brnt 5y ago
  I get Duracell Industrials through my works office supplier, they also leak frequently.
- greenyoda 5y ago
  Back when I still bought them, I'd get them from the local big-chain supermarket. So I'm pretty sure they weren't fakes.
- numpad0 5y ago
  ya saying..."Totally 100% Genuine" Duracell could leak less...
grumpyprole 5y ago
Completely agree. Duracell batteries have been leaking consistently for me, I've stopped buying them and actively warn others. They have destroyed various remotes, torches and an expensive camera flash after only a few years.
justjash 5y ago
Same. I pulled down my dad's old camera from the closet a few years ago and it probably hadn't been used since the 90s so the batteries were dead. Threw in some new Duracell batteries and played with it a bit before putting it away. Opened it a year or two later and the batteries had swelled and leaked everywhere. Had to use a pair of pliers to extract the swollen batteries from the battery compartment. Such a huge pain.
jhallenworld 5y ago
But I think their NIMH batteries are good. Project Farm reviewed them, they were near the top. Of course I'm looking for good ones that are cheaper..
jacobolus 5y ago
Duracell (the Mallory company) was bought by Dart in 1978, then by KKR in 1988, Gillette in 1996, Procter & Gamble bought Gillette in 2005, and Duracell was spun off and bought by Berkshire Hathaway in 2016. (source: Wikipedia) The company has been under large-scale finance / conglomerate management for more than 4 decades by now. I don’t think there would have been any immediate change in battery quality circa 2016. Seems just as likely that corner cutting (assuming there is corner cutting; I have no insight) started before changes of ownership.
- kuhewa 5y ago
  You could be right as this suit alleging commonplace leaking was before ownership changed. https://topclassactions.com/lawsuit-settlements/lawsuit-news/duracell-batteries-leak-normal-use-class-action-claims/ https://topclassactions.com/lawsuit-settlements/lawsuit-news...
jasode 5y ago
I came across this recent youtube comment[1] on why older batteries didn't leak. I don't know if it's correct but sharing it anyway: >ceptimus 2 weeks ago (edited) >> Old alkaline batteries contained mercury, which made them resistant to leaking. The mercury was there to absorb the hydrogen gas, which builds internal pressure when the battery is used, causing them to leak. Newer alkaline batteries don't have mercury, because it's harmful to the environment when disposed. Unfortunately, the mercury free batteries leak much sooner - many of them long before their 'use by' date, even if you've never used them. Now you've replaced the batteries, you should check the camera more frequently. The modern rechargeable Ni-mh batteries, with a low self-discharge rate, are a good alternative: less likely to leak; but they're only nominally 1.2 Volts per cell instead of 1.5 volts, so some equipment won't work with them. EDIT... maybe there's more to it than just mercury because some low-effort googling[2] found that law prohibiting it in batteries was 1996 (~25 years ago). That doesn't match the timeline in the video because Alec says his old batteries (that didn't leak) were "use-by-date-2016". So maybe something else was different about the formulation in his Kirkland Signature batteries circa ~2008. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5s6xerRqVY&lc=UgztQzUKV5BJQqlFwVB4AaABAg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5s6xerRqVY&lc=UgztQzUKV5BJQ... [2] https://www.google.com/search?q=mercury+removed+from+alkaline+batteries+1996 https://www.google.com/search?q=mercury+removed+from+alkalin...
surge 5y ago
Someone did a test and found the Costco Kirkland batteries were not only as good as Duracell, but cheaper and lasted longer.
Spooky23 5y ago
They are expensive, but if you need a primary battery, the non-rechargeable lithium batteries are great. My clock radio backup battery has probably been in there for >15 years.
sandworm101 5y ago
In a past life I worked in the entertainment biz. Duracell ProCells were the go-to battery for important things. Britney Spears' headset would have had a Procell in it. They would all get tested before use and maybe 5 in a thousand were bad and not used. They weren't the absolute best in the world but they were acceptable and cheap enough to use and toss. After a show we would all take the 'used' batteries home and use them until they were actually flat. The only time I ever saw one leak in a device was if it got submerged or very hot. Now, the procell in my pencil-sized flashlight seems to leak after a month. I switched to energizer and, at least in my sample size of one, I haven't seen a leak.
- rainbowzootsuit 5y ago
  Having worked in video production for a time, my understanding of the intent/marketing of the procell line is that you always use a fresh one for each production. Therefore, they are lower spec than one that might sit in a device for a long time as they're going to be done with their intended life in a few hours, and they're cheaper than the retail cells with better longevity. I certainly never ran them through the qualifications that the article did.
  - sandworm101 5y ago
    The places I worked certainly went thought them like water. Every time something like a lav pack or mic came off a performer it got a new procell. There were buckets of them at the end of the day. They never spent much time inside the devices but did come home with us for use in remotes and kids toys. I understood the procell line to mean that the batteries each got tested for voltage before shipping. 20/30 years ago, for whatever reason, a percentage of consumer batteries would be already dead when they left the factory.
    - sidpatil 5y ago
      > 20/30 years ago, for whatever reason, a percentage of consumer batteries would be already dead when they left the factory. My uneducated guess is that manufacturing defects led to internal shorts or opens, both of which eventually lead to the same result — no output.
im_down_w_otp 5y ago
I have a pack of AAA Duracells I just went to open the other day which were "use by 2025" that I purchased just a few weeks ago, and one of the batteries in the middle of the fresh unopened pack was already leaking with one end fully encrusted with corrosion.
petee 5y ago
90% of my Duracells from the past decade have leaked and ruined equipment, and all well before expiration date. Ive been now telling my family and friends to avoid at all cost
GekkePrutser 5y ago
Same here. Have had many of them leak before the due by date :(
greenyoda 5y ago
I've had exactly the same experience with Duracell - batteries leaking years before their expiration date (sometimes shortly after purchase). I never buy Duracell anymore.
mherdeg 5y ago
Yeah the second blog post in this series has some examples of leaking, unexpired batteries: https://goughlui.com/2016/12/19/great-aa-alkaline-battery-test-pt-2-the-contenders https://goughlui.com/2016/12/19/great-aa-alkaline-battery-te...

wrjensen 5y ago

I have had the same issues with Duracell leakage. I won't buy them any more, for exactly that reason.

warpech 5y ago

Also see this impressive test: https://anrieff.net/batterytest/index_en.html https://anrieff.net/batterytest/index_en.html (European market)

Normille 5y ago

Check out 'Project Farm' on YouTube for a couple more in-depth tests of AA batteries TLDR: Made in Japan = GOOD Made in China = BAD

Isthatablackgsd 5y ago
I love how he made it clear where it was assembled in. Every time he said "Made in USA with Global Components!", I was like yea more like made in China and rebranded in USA.
- csdvrx 5y ago
  We need a new slogan: "rebranded in USA with a total lack of pride"

wmorein 5y ago

Apologies for the slightly off topic question but can anyone point me to the best test/comparison of Alkaline batteries vs. the new Lithium rechargeable ones? Older rechargeable AA and AAA batteries were terribly short lived and so mostly useless but I assume Lithium ones are much better?

bradfa 5y ago
I've not seen AA or AAA sized lithium rechargeable batteries but modern low-self-discharge NiMH AA and AAA cell batteries are quite good today. The Panasonic Eneloop brand are generally widely available and good value for money. The AA size Eneloops are generally around 2100mAh and the AAA size around 900mAh. The only downside to modern NiMH batteries today seems to be finding a good and easy to use charger which will properly discharge and/or cycle the batteries without requiring a human to fiddle with it or understand charge rates and when to discharge the cell prior to charging.
- dragontamer 5y ago
  > The only downside to modern NiMH batteries today seems to be finding a good and easy to use charger which will properly discharge and/or cycle the batteries without requiring a human to fiddle with it or understand charge rates and when to discharge the cell prior to charging. Only if you're really babying your NiMH cells is it worthwhile to do this. ----- Frankly, my recommendation is to just throw away NiMH cells once they "go bad" (maybe a discharge/recharge cycle will save them, but they're really not that expensive). For most consumers out there, the $10 trickle charge that takes 8+ hours is superior, because they'll never cycle the NiMH cells to death. How many dozens of charge/recharge cycles do you need before there's an issue, even with the most primitive of charging strategies? When it takes months for a typical AA powered appliance to run out of NiMH charge, you realize that these "dozens" of charge/discharge cycles gives a life-span measured in _YEARS_ for these NiMH cells. After 5 years, your NiMH cells might be on its last legs, needing a full discharge/recharge to get back to full power. Then and only then should you consider a $30 charger to perform this resurrection, except its probably more cost-efficient to just spend $2 and throw away the "old" cell. You'll need to throw away $20 worth of cells (ie: 10 cells) before your $30 fancy charger with discharge/recharge cycles + coulomb counting is superior to the $10 crap trickle charger. Maybe an RC-car enthusiast will get there (or an electronic-hobbyist), but that's a _LOT_ of charge/recharge cycles before you reach this point. Even with the inferior $10 trickle charge design. ------- EDIT: That being said, spending $30, $40, or $50 on a higher-end charger because you find it "cool" is probably worthwhile. Coolness is a factor and we're not really talking about a lot of money here. But the $10 charger + buy new cells as needed approach is probably the most cost-effective strategy.

rdl 5y ago

Duracell used to be really good about replacing devices if their batteries leaked. They screwed me a couple years ago and refused to replace something (a $50 apple keyboard, I think they gave me $10 for it?). I went from buying exclusively Duracell for alkaline to now just buying Energizer Lithium for everything where it isn't specifically contraindicated (very rare).

zh3 5y ago
Yes, I too have switched to Energizer - zero problems to date (switched from Duracell some years ago).

dragontamer 5y ago

I think the main issue with AA Alkaline is the proliferation of cheap low-self-discharge NiMH cells (aka: Eneloop, but also Energizer and other brands have good LSD NiMH available). A huge number of appliances seem to be designed for the 1.35V NiMH chemistry now. Perhaps a random TV-remote still prefers Alkaline but most seem to work fine with NiMH. ----- Buying a pack of 20 NiMH cells and rotating your collection between charging / discharging states is cheap enough and effective. Its like you have "infinite" AAs since you can just keep recharging them. EDIT: A few years ago, Alkaline was still needed for TV remotes. But most Low-self-discharge NiMH now lasts for over a year without self-discharging away. Sure, not as good as Alkaline's 10-year life span but surely 1+ year lifespans is good enough for your TV remote? Its not that big of a hassle to reach recharge your NiMH once a year is it?

fouric 5y ago
How do you find good cheap low-self-discarge NiMH cells? I couldn't find any research on them (like the post article but for NiMH) because of SEO spam, and Amazon reviews are (of course) worthless. Heck, I'm afraid to even buy NiMH batteries because of counterfeits. I bought a few batches of Amazon Basics batteries a year ago and 3/8 are dead already, but even if I purchased something labeled "Eneloop" on there, how do I know it's Eneloop?
klodolph 5y ago
> A huge number of appliances seem to be designed for the 1.35V NiMH chemistry now. Yes, this is my experience too. One of the problems with NiMH is that appliances have helpful low-battery indicators which might light up as soon as you put NiMH cells in them, even though the appliance might continue working for a long time yet. A prime example is the Nintendo Game Boy Advance, which was released in 2001. The thing is powered by switching regulators which work fine with the lower voltages of NiMH cells! Newer appliances have solved these problems. For example, the Yamaha PSS-A50 (a fantastic, inexpensive portable keyboard) has an option to configure the low-battery indicator for alkaline or NiMH chemistry.
- ace2358 5y ago
  Totally agree! My Game Boy Advanced power light is green for about an hour then red for hours and hours on my eneloops. Also my Tascam field recorder has the option for alkaline or NiMH batteries. I still have some kitchen scales that won’t work with NiMH though :( I’ve had my energiser batteries for almost 10 years and I’ve been rotating them through devices and the charger. Only recently have I begun to lose some cells. Time to upgrade them all to eneloops!!

jvanderbot 5y ago

Does anyone know of a good rechargeable battery comparison test? I've noticed that some 18650's are just crap after a couple charges, and some dinky AA batteries last forever after many charges.

0cVlTeIATBs 5y ago
https://lygte-info.dk https://lygte-info.dk is a good site.
aidenn0 5y ago
Amazon Basics low-self-discharge batteries are fine. Eneloop if you want to avoid giving Amazon money and don't mind paying more for the brand.
SomewhatLikely 5y ago
Project Farm has a video with tests: https://youtu.be/-jXQNY6rve8 https://youtu.be/-jXQNY6rve8
arendtio 5y ago
I am very happy with my Eneloops. I used Ansmanns before (and still use the Ansmann recharge device), but they died after like 20 cycles (note: those Ansmanns were models from before the low-self-discharge era). The Eneloops are 3 years old and still work fine while being used every day (recharge about once per week).

LeoPanthera 5y ago

There's very little reason to continue using Alkalines in the majority of cases. Rechargeable batteries both last longer, and, perhaps even more importantly, do not leak.

johndough 5y ago
Rechargeable batteries (assuming NiMH and Ni-Cd) can still leak, but usually the leakage is less severe.
ARandomerDude 5y ago
Batteries are so cheap these days that I consider them essentially single use, like a paper plate. I buy the 60 pack of Rayovac AAs at Home Depot and always have fresh batteries -- and I don't have to worry about a leaking issue.
- crtasm 5y ago
  Single use batteries aren't good for our planet, please try rechargables?

CamperBob2 5y ago

Spoiler: they're all obsolete cost-reduced leaky pieces of shit. Use Eneloops or other NiMH rechargeables when possible, lithium primary cells otherwise. For a while you could avoid leakage by steering clear of Duracell in favor of Energizer, but that's no longer true. Do not use alkaline AAs or AAAs in any equipment you want to keep.

SavantIdiot 5y ago

+1 for introducing me to the B&K 8600. It never occurred to me to search for a DC load device. I've been building FET-based loads and using a power supply to calibrate them. /smacks forehead/ This is what you miss when you don't get to work with professionals on your hobbies (i.e., building low power IoT sensors for funsies).

silisili 5y ago

On the subject of AA alkaline batteries - one thing I learned a long time ago somehow I'll share that people seem amazed by is that you can approximate their charge by bouncing them on a hard surface. Drop an AA battery negative/flat side down an inch or two onto a hard surface like a counter or table. A new battery will just land and thud. A dead battery will bounce repeatedly(you'll hear it more than see it).

iancmceachern 5y ago
I wonder what phenomenon is driving this. A spent battery weighs more?
- dragontamer 5y ago
  The physical chemistry changes as a battery is spent. The internal chemicals are being converted from one molecule into another. Its not surprising to me that the two different chemicals have different physical properties. (Elasticity, density, who knows? They're a fully different chemical once the electrons move around)
  - ChrisLomont 5y ago
    Almost all the mass of a molecule is in atom nuclei, and these masses do not change under any battery chemistry I've ever seen. The only way to change mass appreciably is to add or remove atoms from the interior of the battery.
- thescriptkiddie 5y ago
  IIRC alkaline batteries produce some kind of gas while being discharged. When the battery is dead it is probably inflated like an unopened soda can, assuming it hasn't leaked.
  - jandrese 5y ago
    Isn't that what the vents holes are for?

moreati 5y ago

Note, this is from 2016.

CamperBob2 5y ago
Indeed, and one major change that's taken place in the last few years is that Energizers are now as leak-prone as Duracells. Likely true of other brands as well. The only way to win the alkaline battery game is not to play.

colanderman 5y ago

Re: constant current appliances, most any "digital" appliance that uses a linear regulator (as opposed to a DC-DC converter) will exhibit such a load profile.

RicoElectrico 5y ago

There's also http://lygte-info.dk/ http://lygte-info.dk/ which has a ton of battery and charger tests. Definitely worth reading.

Maarten88 5y ago

As a test I recently bought a pair of Li-ion AA batteries, that are recharged through a micro USB connector in the battery. They are rated 2880 mWh and are advertised to provide a flat 1.5v during the whole discharge cycle (they have internal circuitry to convert from the native 3.7v). I wonder how those compare to my current rotating stock of Ni-MH ones that regularly stop working. Jury is still out, they were considerably more expensive though (something like €4.50 a piece).

discreditable 5y ago
I have some similar Li-ion AA batteries for my Blink cameras. They work very well since the Blinks hate ni-mh batteries. Interestingly, these behave oddly in my camera speedlite. They can't seem to charge the flash, and the LCD flickers while on. My best guess is the charging the flash capacitor pulls more juice than the lithium batteries can handle. Thankfully, ni-mh work great. For your Ni-mh that stop working, if they won't charge you can sort of jump start them using a good battery and they'll charge again. Use some aluminum foil strips and touch the contacts between the batteries together for a few seconds. Positive to positive, negative to negative if I remember correctly.
mnw21cam 5y ago
The AAA versions of these are a godsend for my Bose noise cancelling headphones. I tried using NiMH batteries, but the headphones would cut out every time I shook my head or chewed something, because they didn't have a high enough voltage.

reiichiroh 5y ago

Anyone remember the rechargeable alkaline brand “Pure Energy” available in Canada?

zwieback 5y ago

I know what I'll pick up next time I'm at IKEA.

diebeforei485 5y ago
Ikea no longer sells alkaline batteries :) https://www.ikea.com/us/en/newsroom/corporate-news/ikea-to-remove-non-rechargeable-alkaline-batteries-by-2021-pubb6aee8b0 https://www.ikea.com/us/en/newsroom/corporate-news/ikea-to-r...
- robert_foss 5y ago
  But they do sell Low Self-Discharge NiMH 2450mA batteries. https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/ladda-rechargeable-battery-hr06-aa-1-2v-50504692/ https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/ladda-rechargeable-battery-hr06...

zoomablemind 5y ago

Chiming in, I just recently was wondering how two seemingly equal by chemistry and size batteries just from different mfgrs could be so much incomparable by practical life-times. On so many occasions Panasonic or Sony (Japan made) batteries which come included with devices (like remote controls etc) would last years (!) (in some odd case I had Sony AA battery functional after more than a decade), yet any recent replacements from Duracel or Energizer the ones bought from a pharmacy would get exhausted within a year of similar use. There must be some difference there, just how to tell what is that?

raihansaputra 5y ago
"By Chemistry" seems to be the keyword here. AFAIK Alkaline also have several chemistry differences, and batteries especially OEM would be matched to the use (low energy-long storage for remote). General purpose/OTS battery seem to optimize for power for ease-of-use. Avoid the scenario of "Oh this toy doesn't work with this battery brand so I'll avoid it". Have you tried specific long-use batteries? Non-alkaline or Alkaline branded as such?
- zoomablemind 5y ago
  > ...Have you tried specific long-use batteries? Non-alkaline or Alkaline branded as such? What is "long-use" in this case? Most of the batteries are advertized on the packaging as "long-lasting guaranteed!". Sure, there're lithium batteries, and LSD rechargeables, but alkaline kind are normally just touted as "Alkaline!" or highlighted to that effect. Just fetched some of those old OEM batteries, Panasonic one is labeled Ultra Hyper (Costa Rica made) UM-3UHS/R6, Sony is Super Red (Japan made), R6P(SR) - this one is labeled 03/98, I kid you not, still measures 1.4V. I sure haven't seen these on shelves here, well, not currently, at least.
  - raihansaputra 5y ago
    The Sony one is advertised as `low-current` use battery, so I'm not surprised that it lasted long. Well 1.4 is no joke though. Interestingly I can't find any listing for any low-current battery on Amazon. I swear I've seen them in my local stores a few years ago, advertised specifically for remotes. Maybe they're not profitable so people stop selling them. Bummer.

bentcorner 5y ago

> This can be implemented basically with a fixed value of resistance, but because of the way resistance interacts with voltage, it’s actually very gentle on the battery. As the battery voltage falls, the current falls accordingly, so the delivered power falls even further. For modern appliances, this type of loading is not common. Dumb question - is it at all possible to design a modern device which operates this way? (As battery voltage falls, device performance also falls? It's been a really really long time since my EE classes - are transistors just unable to operate this way?)

sbierwagen 5y ago
Some LED flashlights with multiple brightness modes will drop to low brightness mode when cell voltage falls below a certain point.
gruez 5y ago
> It's been a really really long time since my EE classes - are transistors just unable to operate this way?) Yeah, most CPUs nowadays have dynamic frequency adjustment to maximize battery life. Lower frequencies also mean transistors can operate at lower voltages, so by reducing the operating frequency, you can reduce the voltage and therefore power draw on your battery.
orev 5y ago
Apple did this with iPhones, where the CPU throttles itself when the battery can’t keep up with the peak demand anymore. They got sued for it (mostly because they didn’t tell anyone and people bought new phones when the old ones started mysteriously slowing down).
dragontamer 5y ago
Have you ever used an old flashlight in the 80s or 90s? As AA charge fell, the light got dimmer and dimmer. Today, we have devices that do the exact _OPPOSITE_, pulling the last bits of electricity out of the cells through boost-converters or whatnot (boost converters existed back then, but weren't as efficient or cheap as today). Consumers demanded consistent and reliable performance no matter if at full-battery charge or nearly empty. People preferred their devices to suddenly "shut off".

symby 5y ago

Not included in this analysis is leakage rate... by which I mean ooze leakage. I have found that some batteries have a much greater likelihood of leaking ooze than others (yeah Rayovak, I'm looking at you!) Except in the case of crappy toys, the damage that this causes radically outstrips the cost of the battery. As a result, I buy batteries not based on electrical performance, but track record in not ruining the things I put them into. I am very happy to accept 50% less energy if I can avoid destroying my $200 gadget.

mitchbob 5y ago
> As a result, I buy batteries not based on electrical performance, but track record in not ruining the things I put them into. So do I. I'm now using low self-discharge NiMH batteries (mostly Eneloops) in pretty much every device that uses batteries, and I've never had one leak. I also use smart chargers to check battery health when I recharge them. A bit more initial outlay, but much cheaper in the long run, as the batteries can be recharged 1000s of times, and they hold their charge for many months.
msie 5y ago
I have had success in removing the battery leakage from my toys. Baking soda + water on a q-tip works really well.

walrus01 5y ago

something that didn't exist in 2016 and does now, are AA batteries that are composed of an internal lithium ion cell, a DC-DC converter for 1.5VDC output to the end terminals, and internal 5V-USB to li-ion charge controller circuitry. With a USB port literally built into the body of the battery. They're more expensive, but can pay for themselves... https://www.amazon.com/AA-Batteries-ANVOW-Rechargeable-Capacity/dp/B08JTSBSNR?th=1 https://www.amazon.com/AA-Batteries-ANVOW-Rechargeable-Capac... there are lots of other models if you search for "AA battery lithium ion USB" I would recommend these over anything that is NiMH based (memory effect) or needs a proprietary charger.

intrasight 5y ago
I'd seen those in the past. Prices have come down. Am curious what are the benefits over NiMN.
- walrus01 5y ago
  should be little to no memory effect unlike NiMH
  - Zak 5y ago
    Modern, high-quality NiMH has little to no memory effect. Eneloops are the gold standard, though rumor has it many other brands have caught up.
- exhilaration 5y ago
  At first glance, capacity seems to be the main benefit, from the above link: Battery Capacity: 3400mWh Compare that to Eneloop pros: 2500mAh Using this converter https://convert-formula.com/mwh-mahz https://convert-formula.com/mwh-mahz 3400mWh at 1.5v is 2256mAh so the Eneloop pros actually have more capacity.
  - walrus01 5y ago
    Downside being that the eneloop pro needs its own charger, these should be able to charge from any phone charger, or come with their own 4-to-1 usb cable.

zw123456 5y ago

This is really amazing work, I found part 3 to be the most interesting https://goughlui.com/2016/12/19/great-aa-alkaline-battery-test-pt-3-the-results https://goughlui.com/2016/12/19/great-aa-alkaline-battery-te... particularly the mwh/$ and other charts like capacity vs. weight etc.

adwi 5y ago

Tl;dr from author in comments: > The best choice is to avoid disposable batteries where possible and use low-self-discharge Ni-MH cells such as the Sanyo/Panasonic Eneloop. Even though the upfront cost is higher, it only takes a few recharges (in some cases, less than ten) to be financially (and possibly even environmentally) ahead.

wrycoder 5y ago

Note that this is the first post of a four part series. The final post, an addendum, is [0]. The post with the energy ratings is [1] [0] https://goughlui.com/2017/01/31/great-aa-alkaline-battery-test-addendum-25ma-constant-current-tests/ https://goughlui.com/2017/01/31/great-aa-alkaline-battery-te... [1] https://goughlui.com/2016/12/19/great-aa-alkaline-battery-test-pt-3-the-results https://goughlui.com/2016/12/19/great-aa-alkaline-battery-te...

anonymousiam 5y ago

It's an old article, but still mostly correct. Several developments have changed the landscape over the past decade. The Chinese have pretty much taken over the battery manufacturing industry. As a result, the quality of many low-production battery series has gone down dramatically. Some cells that once had a 10-year shelf life will now be completely useless within two years. A more positive development has been the improvement in power electronics. Quality consumer electronics will now often include power conditioning circuits so the "cut off" voltage from a battery is no longer relevant. The batteries can now continue to power the device until they are completely discharged. (See: https://www.ti.com/tool/TPS61280EVM-585 https://www.ti.com/tool/TPS61280EVM-585)

fomine3 5y ago

Panasonic (who sell expensive alkaline cell) or FDK (who made eneloop) 's alkaline is my choice for expensive/important appliances.

ggm 5y ago

I think the way we went to 1.2v for rechargables when we design to higher nominal voltage is really confusing. Why we didn't either shift the design basis to use 1.2-1.1 as a signal so we had better outcome when 1.2 drops off, or design the 1.2 cells to deliver 1.4 dropping to 1.2 and 1.1 is beyond me. Because in practice, we're not designing for the consequences of 1.2 It shelves on 1.2 forever, tails, and then BOOM its gone. we should have designed for that curve, not for 1.5 -1.4 -1.3 -1.2 ....... BOOM

pengaru 5y ago

The number of comments here saying batteries used to not leak, as if this is some kind of new phenomenon, confuses the hell out of me. Alkaline batteries have always been prone to leaking and ruining electronics when left in them too long for as long as I can remember (I'm in my 40s). It's worse in my experience if subjected to extreme temperature swings. Rechargeables tend to be more robustly made in this department.

stavros 5y ago

I built a similar test rig from a $15 plane controller to test some VTC6 batteries I bought: https://notes.stavros.io/maker-things/battery-discharge-curves/ https://notes.stavros.io/maker-things/battery-discharge-curv... It was a lot of fun!

watersb 5y ago
I actually learned a lot from your reports when I geeked out on flashlights and battery formats that were new to me, the 27xxx size. Thanks very much! (It was sometime in the past 18 months, in which all time sequences have been shredded in a lockdown blur.)
- stavros 5y ago
  No problem, but are you sure it was me? My battery measurements are pretty recent.

diebeforei485 5y ago

We should get rid of consumer single-use batteries in my opinion. There is an increasing number of smart home devices that tell people to avoid rechargeable batteries. This was understandable when smart home products were a small category, often run by small companies that couldn't possibly put in the effort to understand the discharge curve of every rechargeable battery out there. But given the size of the industry today, they should come together and create a standard for a rechargeable battery. Perhaps they can even partner with battery manufacturers and create a new form factor, so people can't just use alkaline batteries instead. Professional uses like military, R&D, filming etc are often cited but in reality they are a very small percentage of batteries used, and don't need to change before consumer applications do.

rpaddock 5y ago

Around ~2005 one of our products was featured in a Duracell commercial. In 2011 manufacturing for all but the 9V was moved to Tunisia and the design of the battery was changed. In pre-2011 batteries the cylinder was the negative terminal. In the newer design the cylinder is the positive. Look at the bottom of the newer ones and you will see a very small O-Ring separating the positive from the negative. It is very easy to breach this O-Ring when inserting a battery, resulting in it getting hot. Well over 100'F has been measured. The new design WILL leak. Because of our commercial connection we discussed this with Duracell. The end result was "We don't care". Today they are riding on the reputation of the past. We then evaluated all the batteries on the market at that time. Technically the Energizers and the RayOVacs came out the same, with the RayOVacs being cheaper we switched to those. Shortly there after Energizer bought RayOVac. Look at the Fine Print on the package today and it says they are made by Energizer. Has anyone noticed the scam that Home Depot and Walmart, and probably others, are running? C and D cells are the same price. The marketing campaign tells us this is a Good Thing, without explaining how. If the energy density is not the same, then the price should not be the same.