6 ms·
Omicron Makes Vaccine Mandates Obsolete
- cft 5y agoBy no less than Luc Montagnier himself. This looks like the nuclear letter by Einstein to Roosevelt. WSJ is one of the very few remaining solid objective outlets in the US. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luc_Montagnier https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luc_Montagnier
- brimnes 5y agoDuring the COVID-19 pandemic, Montagnier was a promoter of the conspiracy theory that SARS-CoV-2, the causative virus, was deliberately created in, and thereafter escaped from a laboratory. Such a claim has been refuted by other virologists.
- itisit 5y agoAnd other virologists share Montagnier’s assertion that the proverbial pangolins had nothing to do with this fiasco.
- mrtesthah 5y ago>Such a claim has been refuted by other virologists. You make it sound like there’s a consensus here, but I don’t think that’s actually the case—at least not anymore, if it was true before.
- jimmygrapes 5y agoYou sure about that?
- ekianjo 5y ago> other virologists. You mean the Lancet Hoax?
- rasz 5y ago>Such a claim has been refuted by other virologists. like Peter Daszak, Shi Zhengli, and Fauci https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/10/nih-admits-funding-risky-virus-research-in-wuhan https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/10/nih-admits-funding-r...
- cft 5y agoThere's a ring of people here that gang up and downvote posts, waging political wars. Then they seek out and downvote others recent comments by the same user. dang has to look into this.
- mixologic 5y agoJust from reading his wikipedia bio, whatever gravitas he may have once had seems to have been traded for conspiracy theories and pseudoscience. This looks like idea laundering.
- WaxedChewbacca 5y ago
- ekianjo 5y ago> wikipedia bio You should know better than blindly trust wikipedia. It's written by humans, too, who are not devoid of bias.
- eesmith 5y agoNor should one blindly trust a Nobel Prize winner. cft (who, like us all, is not devoid of bias) linked to Wikipedia as support for the importance of this letter. I think it's only fair to examine that page to check if that support is appropriate.
- wbl 5y agoApparently the WSJ is against polio vaccination mandates.
- WaxedChewbacca 5y ago
- ekianjo 5y ago> against polio vaccination mandates. Bad analogies are bad analogies.
- wbl 5y agoIPV does not stop you from getting infected in your gut or transmitting polio. It does stop you from paralysis.
- mint2 5y agoI can’t read the article, but guessing it puts very little weight on the severity reduction vaccines grant. Or is there new data showing that’s not a thing?
- vips7L 5y agohttps://archive.fo/2022.01.09-232109/https://www.wsj.com/articles/omicron-makes-bidens-vaccine-mandates-obsolete-covid-healthcare-osha-evidence-supreme-court-11641760009 https://archive.fo/2022.01.09-232109/https://www.wsj.com/art...
- Shared404 5y agoI don't see anything about severity reduction in the article. The argument it has lies in >As the World Health Organization puts it, “if mandatory vaccination is considered necessary to interrupt transmission chains and prevent harm to others, there should be sufficient evidence that the vaccine is efficacious in preventing serious infection and/or transmission.” For Omicron, there is as yet no such evidence. And > The little data we have suggest the opposite. One preprint study found that after 30 days the Moderna and Pfizer vaccines no longer had any statistically significant positive effect against Omicron infection, and after 90 days, their effect went negative—i.e., vaccinated people were more susceptible to Omicron infection. That's the most relevant quote from the article. The study mentioned is here [0]. Fwiw, one of the authors discovered HIV[1], so they presumably know what they're talking about. [0] https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.12.20.21267966v3.full https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.12.20.21267966v... [1] The end of the article mentions "Dr. Montagnier was a winner of the 2008 Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine for discovering the human immunodeficiency virus." Edit: For the record, I'm most definitely not anti-vax, just summarizing the article as best I could. Thanks to everyone who dig deeper than I did.
- eesmith 5y agoI know too much about the bad ideas of Nobel Prize winners to trust your presumption (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobel_disease https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobel_disease ), so I went to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luc_Montagnier https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luc_Montagnier ] During the COVID-19 pandemic, Montagnier was criticised for using his Nobel prize status to "spread dangerous health messages outside his field of knowledge"[6] for promoting the conspiracy theory that SARS-CoV-2 was deliberately created in a laboratory. Such a claim has been refuted by other virologists.[7][8][9][10] Of course there's no reason to trust Wikipedia. My point is to challenge the idea that because someone got a Nobel Prize on one topic, that makes them a credible source on even related topics. RationalWiki has a much lower threshold than Wikipedia and at https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Nobel_disease https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Nobel_disease writes of Montagnier support for "[h]omeopathy, water memory, autism quackery, AIDS cured by nutrition and vaccine hysteria", linking to https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2011/01/14/the-nobel-disease-meets-dna-teleportatio https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2011/01/14/the-nobel-dise... for support. It was easy to find L Montagnier et al 2011 J. Phys.: Conf. Ser.306 012007, "DNA waves and water" https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1742-6596/306/1/012007/pdf https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1742-6596/306/1/0... which, if true, would indeed overthrow science, and deserve another Nobel Prize. Yet it's almost only cited by homeopaths, and more broadly "alt. medicine" sources. The setup doesn't look complicated, so should be easily reproducible. Almost as if it wasn't correct - just like we would expect.
- dexen 5y agohttps://archive.fo/4pSSU https://archive.fo/4pSSU
- a0-prw 5y agoIn Denmark, 94% of infections are Omicron. Double vaccinated get infected at a higher rate than unvaccinated.(Source: ssi.dk) A booster reduces infection rates to a little less than the unvaccinated. Those are what the data show in Denmark.
- Pinegulf 5y agoInteresting. Maybe the effective lockdown of the unvaccinated is a factor in this? ref: https://dk.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-services/security-and-travel-information/covid-19-information/ https://dk.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-services/security-and-t...
- a0-prw 5y agoThere's no lockdown for unvaccinated in Denmark. If you want access to services you need a valid "coronapas" (health passport) which requires either full vaccination, a negative test or recovery from covid.
- raxxorrax 5y agoI agree that mandates cannot be justified and we were never at a point that they could be justified. Pfizer will sell us their Omicron vaccination next...
- nsoonhui 5y agoFun fact: the article was co-written with Jed Rubenfeld, who is a constitutional scholar and husband to the "tiger mum", Amy Chua.
- aldoraine 5y agoif i were czar of the universe, ad hominem attacks would be punishable by life in prison. i find them that infuriatingly annoying. why are people more interested in the authors’ biographies than the their substantive arguments?