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“Follow the science!” Science says kids are barely affected by Covid and it’s safe for them to go to school. “The science is wrong!”

les_diabolique 5y ago
Are kids not capable of carrying covid and spreading it to adults?
- seibelj 5y ago
  Somehow all the private schools around me have been open for in-person learning safely since the lockdowns began.
- cannaceo 5y ago
  Are adults forced to take similar precautions to children? I got an email this week that story time at the public library is canceled because of covid. No adult venues canceled.
  - les_diabolique 5y ago
    Are you suggesting children and adults have similar behaviours and understanding of situations and behave accordingly?
    - bpodgursky 5y ago
      - dang 5y ago
        Please don't take HN threads further into flamewar hell. You can make your substantive points thoughtfully, as most users in this thread have been doing. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: you've unfortunately been making a habit of doing this. That's not cool, and we ban accounts that do it. Would you please review the site guidelines and fix this?
    - shatteredvisage 5y ago
- google234123 5y ago
  The science says no
- apatters 5y ago
  Are adults not capable of getting vaccinated and eliminating their risk of severe illness?
  - Arainach 5y ago
    They are not. Vaccines reduce the chance of severe illness. They do not eliminate it, particularly with comorbidities.
    - bcrosby95 5y ago
      It's rare to be able to completely eliminate a risk. Both of the extremes in this kinda drive me batty. On one side, I know a family that was taking distance learning as a chance to travel the world with their kids, before any vaccine was available. They have caught covid 3 times now. I also know people that have resolved to never get covid. Why? Because it's covid. Any attempts to discuss things in more detail brings out comparisons to things such as the bubonic plague, measles, and drinking water you shit in.
  - les_diabolique 5y ago
    You would think so, but here we are and a segment of the population still doesn't have the vaccine.
- refurb 5y ago
  Crazy how in other countries schools haven't been closed at all!
  - les_diabolique 5y ago
    Not quite sure how this answers my question.
    - refurb 5y ago
      You're mistakenly equating covid cases with a need to shutdown schools.
- ALittleLight 5y ago
  Covid is contagious enough that most people are either going to get it or have had it. Why we should sacrifice children's well being to marginally delay the time at which their parents or families will be infected is beyond me. If individual families want to choose to take their kids out of school that should be their choice. It should not be the default.
  - lghh 5y ago
    > Covid is contagious enough that most people are either going to get it or have had it Based on what? Also, you can get it more than once. This is a pretty bleak outlook. > Why we should sacrifice children's well being Why should we sacrifice the teacher's well being? > delay the time at which their parents or families will be infected is beyond me. Because getting sick isn't guaranteed and getting sick can land people in the hospitals and clog our healthcare system.
    - nradov 5y ago
      This article provides a good explanation of why no one will be able to avoid the virus. https://www.medpagetoday.com/opinion/vinay-prasad/94646 https://www.medpagetoday.com/opinion/vinay-prasad/94646 The CDC estimated that 44% of the US population had been infected as of September 2021. Obviously that number will be higher now. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/burden.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/burd...
    - ALittleLight 5y ago
      We are now nearly in the situation where most people have had it and the virus shows no signs of abating. This is not a bleak outlook simply a realistic one. You've either had it or are going to get it. The bleak outlook is the one that says you should cower alone and apart from friends and family until you do get it. Go get vaccinated and live as before. Again, you aren't sacrificing the teacher's well being. The teacher is, anyway, most likely going to get covid. If a teacher doesn't like being exposed to children they should resign or be fired. Schools are not for the benefit of teachers but for the benefit of children. Once vaccinated you are unlikely to require hospitalization. Actually, you're unlikely to require hospitalization regardless of vaccination but especially unlikely once vaccinated. Maybe it's sensible for people to make some minor changes to "flatten the curve" but going to remote school is no minor change and it is far worse than the negligible benefits. While it's true you can catch the disease multiple times subsequent infections are less likely and less severe.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
codefreakxff 5y ago
Science does not say kids are barely affected by Covid... that would be the right wing media and politicians. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/transmission_k_12_schools.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-br... Closely related: Floria wants to stop Covid testing so that their reported infection rates will drop. https://cbs12.com/news/local/florida-surgeon-general-signals-change-to-covid-testing-approach https://cbs12.com/news/local/florida-surgeon-general-signals...
- nradov 5y ago
  A large study of children in Germany found zero deaths of children aged 5-11 without comorbidities. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.11.30.21267048v1 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.11.30.21267048v...
  - codefreakxff 5y ago
    There is a lot of area between "barely affected" and "dying". https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/covid-warning-symptoms-children-kids-hospitalized-record-numbers-rcna10741 https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/covid-warning-sym...
- gandalfgeek 5y ago
  This is an out of context mischaracterization. For age < 18, kids are 3-5x more likely to die of activities such as riding in a car and going to the pool (not to mention the good ol' flu). Virtually nobody even thinks about behavior adjustments when it comes to those activities. You're needlessly trolling when you're labeling parents and kids speaking up against all this as right wing.
  - codefreakxff 5y ago
    I’m not trolling. I’ve linked to facts. If you think the CDC and Surgeon General are not facts then you, sir, are trolling Why does everyone say it’s fine for kids to get Covid because they are not dying? Again, you are trolling. Hospitalization rates are way up with Omicron. And only reason it looked like kids were less affected by Covid was because there was a lack of testing for kids and schools were initially closed. Schools are open and infection rates are same as adults. Sure. They aren’t dying as much because adults are generally way less healthy. But they are not magically immune and we can pretend there is nothing to be concerned about Edit: confirmed. I looked at your comment history and you seem to love trolling and posting snarky things
eli 5y ago
Covid hospitalizations for children are at an all-time high. And who is going to teach the kids when all the teachers are sick or possibly infectious?
- Ancapistani 5y ago
  > Covid hospitalizations for children are at an all-time high. I initially assumed this was true, though I also assumed that COVID-related hospitalization for children was extremely low. When I checked, though, it does not appear to be true. For ages 5-17 (school-aged kids), hospitalization rates peaked at 1.4/100k in September 2021.[1] As of Dec 15, 2021, 655 children 0-17 have died from COVID[2]. That's certainly not good, but it's a very small number relatively speaking. Consider that in 2018, there were 3,820 for ages 0-14 due to "unintentional injury".[3] 1: https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/COVIDNet/COVID19_3.html https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/COVIDNet/COVID19_3.html 2: https://www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-from-covid-by-age-us/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-... 3: https://www.cdc.gov/injury/images/lc-charts/leading_causes_of_death_by_age_group_2018_1100w850h.jpg https://www.cdc.gov/injury/images/lc-charts/leading_causes_o...
  - eli 5y ago
    CovidNET data is a few weeks out of date and not all parts of the country are experiencing the latest wave at the same time. AAP report based on states reporting more current data shows we are setting records for hospitalized children in several states: https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2022-01-04/u-s-hospitals-seeing-record-numbers-of-young-covid-patients https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2022-01-04/... A better criticism would be to investigate how they are defining “covid patient” because if 7% of a city has an active covid infection, you’d expect 7% of hospital patients there for other reasons to have it too. That said the trend is not great and this will only accelerate with school back in session and community transmission very high across the country. We’re setting new national records for hospitalized adult covid patients too, for what it’s worth. I don’t find comparisons to other causes of death of children compelling. Nor is death the only serious long term outcome to be concerned about with covid.

les_diabolique 5y ago

Are kids not capable of carrying covid and spreading it to adults?

seibelj 5y ago
Somehow all the private schools around me have been open for in-person learning safely since the lockdowns began.
cannaceo 5y ago
Are adults forced to take similar precautions to children? I got an email this week that story time at the public library is canceled because of covid. No adult venues canceled.
- les_diabolique 5y ago
  Are you suggesting children and adults have similar behaviours and understanding of situations and behave accordingly?
  - bpodgursky 5y ago
    - dang 5y ago
      Please don't take HN threads further into flamewar hell. You can make your substantive points thoughtfully, as most users in this thread have been doing. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: you've unfortunately been making a habit of doing this. That's not cool, and we ban accounts that do it. Would you please review the site guidelines and fix this?
  - shatteredvisage 5y ago
google234123 5y ago
The science says no
apatters 5y ago
Are adults not capable of getting vaccinated and eliminating their risk of severe illness?
- Arainach 5y ago
  They are not. Vaccines reduce the chance of severe illness. They do not eliminate it, particularly with comorbidities.
  - bcrosby95 5y ago
    It's rare to be able to completely eliminate a risk. Both of the extremes in this kinda drive me batty. On one side, I know a family that was taking distance learning as a chance to travel the world with their kids, before any vaccine was available. They have caught covid 3 times now. I also know people that have resolved to never get covid. Why? Because it's covid. Any attempts to discuss things in more detail brings out comparisons to things such as the bubonic plague, measles, and drinking water you shit in.
- les_diabolique 5y ago
  You would think so, but here we are and a segment of the population still doesn't have the vaccine.
refurb 5y ago
Crazy how in other countries schools haven't been closed at all!
- les_diabolique 5y ago
  Not quite sure how this answers my question.
  - refurb 5y ago
    You're mistakenly equating covid cases with a need to shutdown schools.
ALittleLight 5y ago
Covid is contagious enough that most people are either going to get it or have had it. Why we should sacrifice children's well being to marginally delay the time at which their parents or families will be infected is beyond me. If individual families want to choose to take their kids out of school that should be their choice. It should not be the default.
- lghh 5y ago
  > Covid is contagious enough that most people are either going to get it or have had it Based on what? Also, you can get it more than once. This is a pretty bleak outlook. > Why we should sacrifice children's well being Why should we sacrifice the teacher's well being? > delay the time at which their parents or families will be infected is beyond me. Because getting sick isn't guaranteed and getting sick can land people in the hospitals and clog our healthcare system.
  - nradov 5y ago
    This article provides a good explanation of why no one will be able to avoid the virus. https://www.medpagetoday.com/opinion/vinay-prasad/94646 https://www.medpagetoday.com/opinion/vinay-prasad/94646 The CDC estimated that 44% of the US population had been infected as of September 2021. Obviously that number will be higher now. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/burden.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/burd...
  - ALittleLight 5y ago
    We are now nearly in the situation where most people have had it and the virus shows no signs of abating. This is not a bleak outlook simply a realistic one. You've either had it or are going to get it. The bleak outlook is the one that says you should cower alone and apart from friends and family until you do get it. Go get vaccinated and live as before. Again, you aren't sacrificing the teacher's well being. The teacher is, anyway, most likely going to get covid. If a teacher doesn't like being exposed to children they should resign or be fired. Schools are not for the benefit of teachers but for the benefit of children. Once vaccinated you are unlikely to require hospitalization. Actually, you're unlikely to require hospitalization regardless of vaccination but especially unlikely once vaccinated. Maybe it's sensible for people to make some minor changes to "flatten the curve" but going to remote school is no minor change and it is far worse than the negligible benefits. While it's true you can catch the disease multiple times subsequent infections are less likely and less severe.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

codefreakxff 5y ago

Science does not say kids are barely affected by Covid... that would be the right wing media and politicians. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/transmission_k_12_schools.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-br... Closely related: Floria wants to stop Covid testing so that their reported infection rates will drop. https://cbs12.com/news/local/florida-surgeon-general-signals-change-to-covid-testing-approach https://cbs12.com/news/local/florida-surgeon-general-signals...

nradov 5y ago
A large study of children in Germany found zero deaths of children aged 5-11 without comorbidities. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.11.30.21267048v1 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.11.30.21267048v...
- codefreakxff 5y ago
  There is a lot of area between "barely affected" and "dying". https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/covid-warning-symptoms-children-kids-hospitalized-record-numbers-rcna10741 https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/covid-warning-sym...
gandalfgeek 5y ago
This is an out of context mischaracterization. For age < 18, kids are 3-5x more likely to die of activities such as riding in a car and going to the pool (not to mention the good ol' flu). Virtually nobody even thinks about behavior adjustments when it comes to those activities. You're needlessly trolling when you're labeling parents and kids speaking up against all this as right wing.
- codefreakxff 5y ago
  I’m not trolling. I’ve linked to facts. If you think the CDC and Surgeon General are not facts then you, sir, are trolling Why does everyone say it’s fine for kids to get Covid because they are not dying? Again, you are trolling. Hospitalization rates are way up with Omicron. And only reason it looked like kids were less affected by Covid was because there was a lack of testing for kids and schools were initially closed. Schools are open and infection rates are same as adults. Sure. They aren’t dying as much because adults are generally way less healthy. But they are not magically immune and we can pretend there is nothing to be concerned about Edit: confirmed. I looked at your comment history and you seem to love trolling and posting snarky things

eli 5y ago

Covid hospitalizations for children are at an all-time high. And who is going to teach the kids when all the teachers are sick or possibly infectious?

Ancapistani 5y ago
> Covid hospitalizations for children are at an all-time high. I initially assumed this was true, though I also assumed that COVID-related hospitalization for children was extremely low. When I checked, though, it does not appear to be true. For ages 5-17 (school-aged kids), hospitalization rates peaked at 1.4/100k in September 2021.[1] As of Dec 15, 2021, 655 children 0-17 have died from COVID[2]. That's certainly not good, but it's a very small number relatively speaking. Consider that in 2018, there were 3,820 for ages 0-14 due to "unintentional injury".[3] 1: https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/COVIDNet/COVID19_3.html https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/COVIDNet/COVID19_3.html 2: https://www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-from-covid-by-age-us/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-... 3: https://www.cdc.gov/injury/images/lc-charts/leading_causes_of_death_by_age_group_2018_1100w850h.jpg https://www.cdc.gov/injury/images/lc-charts/leading_causes_o...
- eli 5y ago
  CovidNET data is a few weeks out of date and not all parts of the country are experiencing the latest wave at the same time. AAP report based on states reporting more current data shows we are setting records for hospitalized children in several states: https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2022-01-04/u-s-hospitals-seeing-record-numbers-of-young-covid-patients https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2022-01-04/... A better criticism would be to investigate how they are defining “covid patient” because if 7% of a city has an active covid infection, you’d expect 7% of hospital patients there for other reasons to have it too. That said the trend is not great and this will only accelerate with school back in session and community transmission very high across the country. We’re setting new national records for hospitalized adult covid patients too, for what it’s worth. I don’t find comparisons to other causes of death of children compelling. Nor is death the only serious long term outcome to be concerned about with covid.