14 ms·

Also worth considering that a 3-4yr old iPhone is quite usable without much noticeable lag (maybe just need to replace battery for $50). 3-4yr old androids hav

Also worth considering that a 3-4yr old iPhone is quite usable without much noticeable lag (maybe just need to replace battery for $50). 3-4yr old androids have been, in my very anecdotal experience, completely unusable (software bugs that’ll never be fixed, battery drain from OS updates released after manufacture year). If I were to give a 13yr old a phone, I’d probably give them my used one, and then survival bias would mean they probably get an iPhone since more of them survive in a very usable state. My dad actually likes Touch ID so much he uses a 5yr old iPhone 7 daily. Just replaced the battery for the 3rd time out of pocket.

Kye 5y ago
I bought my 2015 6S Plus in 2018 and it still works fine and gets updates in 2022. This was after a string of Androids, none much cheaper than the iPhone, that were out of support almost as soon as they launched. I got tired of the ever-growing list of patched vulnerabilities and missing features in newer Androids.
tonyedgecombe 5y ago
I'm still on the original battery on my 7 after nearly five years.
enigma20 5y ago
I'm the Android user myself since 10 years already, was using Google Nexus phones, some mid-range OnePlus. Recently got the OnePlus 8, which got quite a few updates since beginning of this year, and I'm already tired of it. Applications won't start that fast anymore. Camera application is starting with a huge delay when triggered from the lock screen. If I buy and Android phone again, I think I will never install any system updates. Or will switch to iPhone. This is sad.
SkyPuncher 5y ago
I've been an Android fanboy, but I'm starting to hit a point that I'll probably switch to iPhone. Like clockwork, my Android phone becomes unstable after about 2 years. Everything slows down, lock ups happen more frequently. On top of that you have constant tweaks and changes - often on useless things. This year, an update "improved" the clock app. It's now harder to set alarms - and about once per week I get an alarm going off without any UI to disable it. I just have to reset my phone. Why in the world does a stable, reliable feature like the clock app suddenly introduce a major change.
- convery 5y ago
  Ye, I always disable non-security related updates on pretty much all my hardware, then do a update once a year for new features on some stuff. Recently got access to Windows 10 LTSC from a company I worked with and installed it on my workstation, super fast compared to the modern version I was using (LTSC build is 3 years old IIRC) and didn't find any downside compared to 10 Pro, so can recommend that for any dev that feels like their machine is too slow.
  - behnamoh 5y ago
    Is there a way to disable all unnecessary services in Windows 10 to make it be as close to LTSC as possible?
    - gruez 5y ago
      The main draw of LTSC IMO is the 10 year support period. You can continue installing the monthly updates, and not have to worry about a feature update. Those are the ones that come twice a year, and ruins your day by taking 1 hour to install, resets random settings in the process (eg. default apps or telemetry settings), randomly changes the layout/color scheme, and randomly replaces your built in apps with worse ones (https://blogs.windows.com/windows-insider/2021/12/07/redesigned-notepad-for-windows-11-begins-rolling-out-to-windows-insiders/ https://blogs.windows.com/windows-insider/2021/12/07/redesig...). A debloating script doesn't protect you against those. as for disabling bloat in non-LTSC versions, there's various scripts floating around, eg. https://github.com/DrEmpiricism/Optimize-Offline/ https://github.com/DrEmpiricism/Optimize-Offline/ or https://ameliorated.info/ https://ameliorated.info/
      - solarkraft 5y ago
        These are Android-type reasons for switching away. Again Apple offers an option that just sucks less.
- MBCook 5y ago
  > my Android phone becomes unstable after about 2 What do you attribute that to? Is it software updates that slow it down or some kind of pile up of junk that somehow slows it down like Windows 95 used to get? > On top of that you have constant tweaks and changes… Yeah, that exists on the iPhone too. Can’t think of anything off the top of my head but I promise you they make things worse sometimes with redesigns and take a few point releases (or even entire releases) to fix them.
root_axis 5y ago
This isn't true of flagship android phones which are more comparable to the iPhone. For example, my Galaxy S9 continues to work excellently besides the aging battery.
- mohanmcgeek 5y ago
  Samsung phones are exactly like what the GP describes. Maybe things have changed now but Samsung phones used to get only 2 Android version updates
  - nirav72 5y ago
    they largely still only get two major version updates. I've stopped buying Samsung phones and started using a $300 Pixel. A third of the cost compared to a $1000 samsung phone. I can junk it after 2 years and just get another one.
- behnamoh 5y ago
  Allow me to introduce Pixel 6 and the Android 12 fiasco...
- cipheredStones 5y ago
  Funny you say that, because I just had to replace my Galaxy S9 at slightly under two years of age. It became unusable due to a defect called the "Samsung green screen of death", which I learned is widespread, age-related, and unfixable.
MBCook 5y ago
My Mom has a 7 with the latest version of iOS. Never had to replace the battery for some reason (she’s very easy on it). I often use it when I’m around her for some reason or another. Works fantastically. My only complaint is that between the smaller screen (compared to a FaceID phone) and her having it in zoom mode (easier for her to read) the screen feels cramped. But performance wise it’s not an issue at all. Nice and smooth. She’s not playing high end 3D games or editing video so it works for her. Only reason she’s thinking of upgrading? The cameras have come a LONG way in 5 years.
- sethc2 5y ago
  I have a 1st generation SE bought in 2017 and still haven't replaced my battery. It's life isn't great, but I can generally get through the day without charging. I've thought of upgrading for the same reason as your mom though.
null_object 5y ago
Exactly this - my youngest is still using an iPhone 6s which is running the latest (iOS 15) version just fine, after only one battery update. We bought it in 2015.
refsab 5y ago
How is everybody having Apple replace batteries on their old devices? Walked in and tried to get the battery on my first gen iPad Air replaced. The guy said the model is flagged as 'vintage' in the system and he can't replace it. Vintage...
- solarkraft 5y ago
  > having Apple ... Oh no. Apple won't do shit (or at an unreasonable price, if you're lucky). That's one reason everyone's so mad about them making it so hard for everyone else.
- kwiens 5y ago
  Apple won't do the repairs past 5 years in most of the country, up to 7 years in California. But you can do it yourself. Repair kits for iPads: https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPad-Fix-Kits https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPad-Fix-Kits iPhones: https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPhone-Fix-Kits/iPhone-Battery-Kits https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPhone-Fix-Kits/iPhone-Battery-K... Disclaimer: I sell these.
  - aspenmayer 5y ago
    Thanks for making iFixit. Really helps the right to repair movement.
  - chemmail 5y ago
    Disclaimer: replacing batteries on iPads are insanely difficult.
  - tinus_hn 5y ago
    Are there no third party repair services in the US? In Europe these are basically on every corner.
- dwaite 5y ago
  The vintage designation is for products 5-7 years old. Apple does not guarantee part availability in this range but will do repairs if possible. 7+ is considered obsolete and they won't touch it. That is old enough that a battery update through a third party or through a DIY vendor like iFixit should be reasonable.
bxparks 5y ago
Every Android phone that I've owned (about 7-8 of them?) died with hardware problems within 2-3 years. Except for my current one. It's a 5 year-old Moto G5 Plus that I bought for ~$200. It got one OS upgrade to Android 8.1.0. I run Firefox, Signal, Google Authenticator, and the usual set of Google apps (GMail, Maps, Keep, Drive, Contacts, Calendar). It's a great phone. The only problem is that it stopped receiving security updates 3 freaking years ago. But I'm not going to throw away a perfectly usable phone.
- gruez 5y ago
  > Every Android phone that I've owned (about 7-8 of them?) died with hardware problems within 2-3 years. Except for my current one. That seems suspiciously high. I "manage" approximately that many phones and only one has stopped working without obvious cause of failure (eg. smashed screen).
  - bxparks 5y ago
    I agree, but here is my rough memory: - the Nexus One died when the power button broke - the Nexus S died when half the touch screen stopped working - the Galaxy Nexus died for some hardware reason that I cannot remember - one of my Nexus 4 died when the battery ballooned and shattered the glass - another Nexus 4 died in an infinite boot loop - the spare BLU brand phone died in an infinite boot loop - the Moto X died when the radio antenna (both WiFi and cell) stopped working - the Nexus 5X died in an infinite boot loop
    - crtasm 5y ago
      I don't think the bootloops count as hardware failure?
    - lostmsu 5y ago
      Can confirm Nexus 4 and Moto X issues. Had exactly the same ones. Nexus 6 though (it is very similar to Moto X hardware wise) only died after 4 years after taking a swim, and was perfectly functional until then.
    - 5y ago
chemmail 5y ago
I tried to get a new S21 from Bestbuy, it is $499. I have a old iphone 11 and it is worth more than the new S21, so Bestbuy would not take it.
sofixa 5y ago
> 3-4yr old androids have been, in my very anecdotal experience, completely unusable (software bugs that’ll never be fixed, battery drain from OS updates released after manufacture year). What sort of Android device? Flagships usually have a much longer life than cheap ones. I had a Mi Mix 2S for 3 years (2.5 of it with literally a hole in the bottom left corner with a circuit bord visible after i dropped a heavy and sharp object on it) and it was as snappy and fast when it died due to water damage, and was still getting updates. I know people with OnePlus 6 or Samsung Galaxy S7 which work just fine ( there are no updates though). The updates part sucks but is getting better across providers, so hopefully will be better in the future.
rich_sasha 5y ago
I got an iPhone 7 2 years ago (then-new), precisely because I was fed up with Android. But mostly I'm quite disappointed. Better privacy settings are great, it is so much easier to lock down permissions (though I hear Android has gone a long way). Everything else is worse. Performance was OK, but now is so-so, phone definitely feels very slow from time to time, or Safari randomly crashing. Some websites will reload a bunch of times then crash completely. Typing is so much worse, autocorrect is more like auto-typo, compared to what I'm used to (which surely mined text data from my and everyone's phone but so be it). App availability for general stuff seems worse. I wanted to like my iPhone, but don't, and I'm likely to go back to Android when this one finally dies.
- ivank 5y ago
  The Safari crashes can sometimes be fixed by rebooting the phone. Otherwise they happen much less frequently on an iPhone with at least 3GB RAM (7 has 2GB). The autocorrect can be fixed by using Gboard instead. I don't know why Apple can't make their iPhone keyboard work right.
hffft 5y ago

Kye 5y ago

I bought my 2015 6S Plus in 2018 and it still works fine and gets updates in 2022. This was after a string of Androids, none much cheaper than the iPhone, that were out of support almost as soon as they launched. I got tired of the ever-growing list of patched vulnerabilities and missing features in newer Androids.

tonyedgecombe 5y ago

I'm still on the original battery on my 7 after nearly five years.

enigma20 5y ago

I'm the Android user myself since 10 years already, was using Google Nexus phones, some mid-range OnePlus. Recently got the OnePlus 8, which got quite a few updates since beginning of this year, and I'm already tired of it. Applications won't start that fast anymore. Camera application is starting with a huge delay when triggered from the lock screen. If I buy and Android phone again, I think I will never install any system updates. Or will switch to iPhone. This is sad.

SkyPuncher 5y ago

I've been an Android fanboy, but I'm starting to hit a point that I'll probably switch to iPhone. Like clockwork, my Android phone becomes unstable after about 2 years. Everything slows down, lock ups happen more frequently. On top of that you have constant tweaks and changes - often on useless things. This year, an update "improved" the clock app. It's now harder to set alarms - and about once per week I get an alarm going off without any UI to disable it. I just have to reset my phone. Why in the world does a stable, reliable feature like the clock app suddenly introduce a major change.

convery 5y ago
Ye, I always disable non-security related updates on pretty much all my hardware, then do a update once a year for new features on some stuff. Recently got access to Windows 10 LTSC from a company I worked with and installed it on my workstation, super fast compared to the modern version I was using (LTSC build is 3 years old IIRC) and didn't find any downside compared to 10 Pro, so can recommend that for any dev that feels like their machine is too slow.
- behnamoh 5y ago
  Is there a way to disable all unnecessary services in Windows 10 to make it be as close to LTSC as possible?
  - gruez 5y ago
    The main draw of LTSC IMO is the 10 year support period. You can continue installing the monthly updates, and not have to worry about a feature update. Those are the ones that come twice a year, and ruins your day by taking 1 hour to install, resets random settings in the process (eg. default apps or telemetry settings), randomly changes the layout/color scheme, and randomly replaces your built in apps with worse ones (https://blogs.windows.com/windows-insider/2021/12/07/redesigned-notepad-for-windows-11-begins-rolling-out-to-windows-insiders/ https://blogs.windows.com/windows-insider/2021/12/07/redesig...). A debloating script doesn't protect you against those. as for disabling bloat in non-LTSC versions, there's various scripts floating around, eg. https://github.com/DrEmpiricism/Optimize-Offline/ https://github.com/DrEmpiricism/Optimize-Offline/ or https://ameliorated.info/ https://ameliorated.info/
    - solarkraft 5y ago
      These are Android-type reasons for switching away. Again Apple offers an option that just sucks less.
MBCook 5y ago
> my Android phone becomes unstable after about 2 What do you attribute that to? Is it software updates that slow it down or some kind of pile up of junk that somehow slows it down like Windows 95 used to get? > On top of that you have constant tweaks and changes… Yeah, that exists on the iPhone too. Can’t think of anything off the top of my head but I promise you they make things worse sometimes with redesigns and take a few point releases (or even entire releases) to fix them.

root_axis 5y ago

This isn't true of flagship android phones which are more comparable to the iPhone. For example, my Galaxy S9 continues to work excellently besides the aging battery.

mohanmcgeek 5y ago
Samsung phones are exactly like what the GP describes. Maybe things have changed now but Samsung phones used to get only 2 Android version updates
- nirav72 5y ago
  they largely still only get two major version updates. I've stopped buying Samsung phones and started using a $300 Pixel. A third of the cost compared to a $1000 samsung phone. I can junk it after 2 years and just get another one.
behnamoh 5y ago
Allow me to introduce Pixel 6 and the Android 12 fiasco...
cipheredStones 5y ago
Funny you say that, because I just had to replace my Galaxy S9 at slightly under two years of age. It became unusable due to a defect called the "Samsung green screen of death", which I learned is widespread, age-related, and unfixable.

MBCook 5y ago

My Mom has a 7 with the latest version of iOS. Never had to replace the battery for some reason (she’s very easy on it). I often use it when I’m around her for some reason or another. Works fantastically. My only complaint is that between the smaller screen (compared to a FaceID phone) and her having it in zoom mode (easier for her to read) the screen feels cramped. But performance wise it’s not an issue at all. Nice and smooth. She’s not playing high end 3D games or editing video so it works for her. Only reason she’s thinking of upgrading? The cameras have come a LONG way in 5 years.

sethc2 5y ago
I have a 1st generation SE bought in 2017 and still haven't replaced my battery. It's life isn't great, but I can generally get through the day without charging. I've thought of upgrading for the same reason as your mom though.

null_object 5y ago

Exactly this - my youngest is still using an iPhone 6s which is running the latest (iOS 15) version just fine, after only one battery update. We bought it in 2015.

refsab 5y ago

How is everybody having Apple replace batteries on their old devices? Walked in and tried to get the battery on my first gen iPad Air replaced. The guy said the model is flagged as 'vintage' in the system and he can't replace it. Vintage...

solarkraft 5y ago
> having Apple ... Oh no. Apple won't do shit (or at an unreasonable price, if you're lucky). That's one reason everyone's so mad about them making it so hard for everyone else.
kwiens 5y ago
Apple won't do the repairs past 5 years in most of the country, up to 7 years in California. But you can do it yourself. Repair kits for iPads: https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPad-Fix-Kits https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPad-Fix-Kits iPhones: https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPhone-Fix-Kits/iPhone-Battery-Kits https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPhone-Fix-Kits/iPhone-Battery-K... Disclaimer: I sell these.
- aspenmayer 5y ago
  Thanks for making iFixit. Really helps the right to repair movement.
- chemmail 5y ago
  Disclaimer: replacing batteries on iPads are insanely difficult.
- tinus_hn 5y ago
  Are there no third party repair services in the US? In Europe these are basically on every corner.
dwaite 5y ago
The vintage designation is for products 5-7 years old. Apple does not guarantee part availability in this range but will do repairs if possible. 7+ is considered obsolete and they won't touch it. That is old enough that a battery update through a third party or through a DIY vendor like iFixit should be reasonable.

bxparks 5y ago

Every Android phone that I've owned (about 7-8 of them?) died with hardware problems within 2-3 years. Except for my current one. It's a 5 year-old Moto G5 Plus that I bought for ~$200. It got one OS upgrade to Android 8.1.0. I run Firefox, Signal, Google Authenticator, and the usual set of Google apps (GMail, Maps, Keep, Drive, Contacts, Calendar). It's a great phone. The only problem is that it stopped receiving security updates 3 freaking years ago. But I'm not going to throw away a perfectly usable phone.

gruez 5y ago
> Every Android phone that I've owned (about 7-8 of them?) died with hardware problems within 2-3 years. Except for my current one. That seems suspiciously high. I "manage" approximately that many phones and only one has stopped working without obvious cause of failure (eg. smashed screen).
- bxparks 5y ago
  I agree, but here is my rough memory: - the Nexus One died when the power button broke - the Nexus S died when half the touch screen stopped working - the Galaxy Nexus died for some hardware reason that I cannot remember - one of my Nexus 4 died when the battery ballooned and shattered the glass - another Nexus 4 died in an infinite boot loop - the spare BLU brand phone died in an infinite boot loop - the Moto X died when the radio antenna (both WiFi and cell) stopped working - the Nexus 5X died in an infinite boot loop
  - crtasm 5y ago
    I don't think the bootloops count as hardware failure?
  - lostmsu 5y ago
    Can confirm Nexus 4 and Moto X issues. Had exactly the same ones. Nexus 6 though (it is very similar to Moto X hardware wise) only died after 4 years after taking a swim, and was perfectly functional until then.
  - 5y ago

chemmail 5y ago

I tried to get a new S21 from Bestbuy, it is $499. I have a old iphone 11 and it is worth more than the new S21, so Bestbuy would not take it.

sofixa 5y ago

> 3-4yr old androids have been, in my very anecdotal experience, completely unusable (software bugs that’ll never be fixed, battery drain from OS updates released after manufacture year). What sort of Android device? Flagships usually have a much longer life than cheap ones. I had a Mi Mix 2S for 3 years (2.5 of it with literally a hole in the bottom left corner with a circuit bord visible after i dropped a heavy and sharp object on it) and it was as snappy and fast when it died due to water damage, and was still getting updates. I know people with OnePlus 6 or Samsung Galaxy S7 which work just fine ( there are no updates though). The updates part sucks but is getting better across providers, so hopefully will be better in the future.

rich_sasha 5y ago

I got an iPhone 7 2 years ago (then-new), precisely because I was fed up with Android. But mostly I'm quite disappointed. Better privacy settings are great, it is so much easier to lock down permissions (though I hear Android has gone a long way). Everything else is worse. Performance was OK, but now is so-so, phone definitely feels very slow from time to time, or Safari randomly crashing. Some websites will reload a bunch of times then crash completely. Typing is so much worse, autocorrect is more like auto-typo, compared to what I'm used to (which surely mined text data from my and everyone's phone but so be it). App availability for general stuff seems worse. I wanted to like my iPhone, but don't, and I'm likely to go back to Android when this one finally dies.

ivank 5y ago
The Safari crashes can sometimes be fixed by rebooting the phone. Otherwise they happen much less frequently on an iPhone with at least 3GB RAM (7 has 2GB). The autocorrect can be fixed by using Gboard instead. I don't know why Apple can't make their iPhone keyboard work right.

hffft 5y ago