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Here's a dialogue my father attributes to CF Gauss Young student: Should I finish my college studies or jump straight to a thesis in advanced mathematics? Gau

Here's a dialogue my father attributes to CF Gauss Young student: Should I finish my college studies or jump straight to a thesis in advanced mathematics? Gauss: You should finish your studies. Young student: But you jumped straight to a thesis! Gauss: I also didn't ask anyone's advice. IE, people who march to a different drummer, who have a unique vocation, aren't the ones who need to be told about it.

Dylan16807 5y ago
Oh. Without much context, I would interpret the quote as "I made the worse choice for lack of guidance". Your suggested interpretation, that asking for advice means you're not an outlier on what you're asking about or you'd already know, strikes me as a very toxic ideal. That's a recipe for both unwarranted self-doubt and headstrong dumb choice-making.
- joe_the_user 5y ago
  Your suggested interpretation, that asking for advice means you're not an outlier on what you're asking about or you'd already know, strikes me as a very toxic ideal. It's a story of my father. As far as I know, GF Gauss was the greatest mathematician since Archimedes and also a rather toxic person. And there are a lot of ways you can interpret the quote. I think it's not so much an ideal but statement that actually society, even other prodigies, aren't necessarily going to support you going your own way. That isn't good imo but it's realistic. "Tough love" isn't necessarily the best teacher but it's certainly here.
- viraptor 5y ago
  > that asking for advice means you're not an outlier I'd take it as a bit milder view - that currently you're not eager enough to risk things and not in a position where you know you're ready. This reminds me of a theme on HN questions around a decade ago: "Should I drop out of uni to work on a startup?" (often from people who don't have one yet or a good idea how to join one) If the person is neither convinced enough to do it themselves, nor are they in a position where their work is so successful that uni interferes... - it's likely a safer bet not to do it. And that doesn't mean I have any knowledge or guesses about whether that person can be an outlier in the future.
- ordu 5y ago
  > Your suggested interpretation, that asking for advice means... No, it is an interpretation suggested by your mind. It is one possible interpretation out of many. I can show you by pointing to some of other interpretations. 1. You need to ask because you are unsure, so your idea to jump to a thesis is not a guaranteed success, so you may fail spectacularly. Be patient and do it right. 2. There is an opinion, that people ask for advice to have something to blame for their failure. If you are not feel like taking responsibility for your life yourself, then Gauss wouldn't take it either. 3. If you fear to make a radical decision, then it means that it is a radical decision for you. Maybe Gauss just did what he liked best. Probably he was so passionate about his thesis, so he forgot about studies, missed exams and then he had no choice except to finish his thesis. 4. To go counter-culture you need a strict conviction that you are doing it right. If you are not, then you are probably fail due to peer-pressure or some other issues induced by a social reaction to your actions. If you are asking for advice, then you are not in a right frame of mind to do it. 5. Academia is a harsh competition, you need to steel yourself and to learn how to do it. You have bachelor and magisterial studies to grow teeth, and no one, even Gauss, cannot teach you. You need to figure it out on your own. Or, maybe he was teaching his student exactly this, when he refused to give advice? This story is like a koan, you can think about it every few years again and again, and every time find new interpretations stemmed from new life experiences you've got since the last time.
  - Dylan16807 5y ago
    > No, it is an interpretation suggested by your mind. It is one possible interpretation out of many. I can show you by pointing to some of other interpretations. It's not suggested by my mind. I was paraphrasing the last line of the post I replied to. > This story is like a koan, you can think about it every few years again and again, and every time find new interpretations stemmed from new life experiences you've got since the last time. If you're into that, have fun, but I wasn't replying to all the ways someone could interpret that line. Also half your interpretations include the toxic mindset I was talking about. Especially 1, "because", "so", "so". 1 is directly saying that if you ask for advice on that topic then you're unfit for the risk. That attitude can go fuck itself. 3 suggests that asking means fear, which is the same kind of terrible. And 4 directly states the toxic idea again at the end, that asking for advice means lack of conviction. Talking through life-changing plans with people is a good idea, and doesn't mean you're choosing in a bad way, and doesn't mean you haven't already decided.

Dylan16807 5y ago

Oh. Without much context, I would interpret the quote as "I made the worse choice for lack of guidance". Your suggested interpretation, that asking for advice means you're not an outlier on what you're asking about or you'd already know, strikes me as a very toxic ideal. That's a recipe for both unwarranted self-doubt and headstrong dumb choice-making.

joe_the_user 5y ago
Your suggested interpretation, that asking for advice means you're not an outlier on what you're asking about or you'd already know, strikes me as a very toxic ideal. It's a story of my father. As far as I know, GF Gauss was the greatest mathematician since Archimedes and also a rather toxic person. And there are a lot of ways you can interpret the quote. I think it's not so much an ideal but statement that actually society, even other prodigies, aren't necessarily going to support you going your own way. That isn't good imo but it's realistic. "Tough love" isn't necessarily the best teacher but it's certainly here.
viraptor 5y ago
> that asking for advice means you're not an outlier I'd take it as a bit milder view - that currently you're not eager enough to risk things and not in a position where you know you're ready. This reminds me of a theme on HN questions around a decade ago: "Should I drop out of uni to work on a startup?" (often from people who don't have one yet or a good idea how to join one) If the person is neither convinced enough to do it themselves, nor are they in a position where their work is so successful that uni interferes... - it's likely a safer bet not to do it. And that doesn't mean I have any knowledge or guesses about whether that person can be an outlier in the future.
ordu 5y ago
> Your suggested interpretation, that asking for advice means... No, it is an interpretation suggested by your mind. It is one possible interpretation out of many. I can show you by pointing to some of other interpretations. 1. You need to ask because you are unsure, so your idea to jump to a thesis is not a guaranteed success, so you may fail spectacularly. Be patient and do it right. 2. There is an opinion, that people ask for advice to have something to blame for their failure. If you are not feel like taking responsibility for your life yourself, then Gauss wouldn't take it either. 3. If you fear to make a radical decision, then it means that it is a radical decision for you. Maybe Gauss just did what he liked best. Probably he was so passionate about his thesis, so he forgot about studies, missed exams and then he had no choice except to finish his thesis. 4. To go counter-culture you need a strict conviction that you are doing it right. If you are not, then you are probably fail due to peer-pressure or some other issues induced by a social reaction to your actions. If you are asking for advice, then you are not in a right frame of mind to do it. 5. Academia is a harsh competition, you need to steel yourself and to learn how to do it. You have bachelor and magisterial studies to grow teeth, and no one, even Gauss, cannot teach you. You need to figure it out on your own. Or, maybe he was teaching his student exactly this, when he refused to give advice? This story is like a koan, you can think about it every few years again and again, and every time find new interpretations stemmed from new life experiences you've got since the last time.
- Dylan16807 5y ago
  > No, it is an interpretation suggested by your mind. It is one possible interpretation out of many. I can show you by pointing to some of other interpretations. It's not suggested by my mind. I was paraphrasing the last line of the post I replied to. > This story is like a koan, you can think about it every few years again and again, and every time find new interpretations stemmed from new life experiences you've got since the last time. If you're into that, have fun, but I wasn't replying to all the ways someone could interpret that line. Also half your interpretations include the toxic mindset I was talking about. Especially 1, "because", "so", "so". 1 is directly saying that if you ask for advice on that topic then you're unfit for the risk. That attitude can go fuck itself. 3 suggests that asking means fear, which is the same kind of terrible. And 4 directly states the toxic idea again at the end, that asking for advice means lack of conviction. Talking through life-changing plans with people is a good idea, and doesn't mean you're choosing in a bad way, and doesn't mean you haven't already decided.