16 ms·

A toaster from 1949 is still smarter than any sold today

336 points by ourmandave 5y ago

GekkePrutser 5y ago
Yeah toasters these days are crap. I always have to compensate for ambient temperature and the thing still being hot from a previous slice, thickness etc. I'd pay more for a toaster that was smart like this one. I wonder why that's not a thing, we have smart everything else...
oblio 5y ago
It's remarkably difficult to find something as automated at it. This should be super cheap and ubiquitous tech but apparently it isn't. Most of the other stuff uses electronics and does more but is actually dumber as an overall device. For example many can set a target duration or target temperature but because they don't take into account the bread temperature they don't defrost as well.
pickledish 5y ago
His whole channel (called Technology Connections) is probably my favorite one on YouTube, can’t recommend it enough! My favorites are his series on refrigeration and heat pumps, for example this one: https://youtube.com/watch?v=7J52mDjZzto https://youtube.com/watch?v=7J52mDjZzto Edit: to clarify, this article is based on an old Technology Connections video, and the creator of that video has lots more!
- DiabloD3 5y ago
  Technology Connections is hands down one of my favorite Youtube channels. Another guy worth mentioning that tickles the brain cells in a similar way is Isaac Arthur: a guy that breaks down science fiction into science fact, and explores what we could actually do someday in the future, and pokes fun at the stuff that will probably never happen but has become familiar tropes anyways. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZFipeZtQM5CKUjx6grh54g https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZFipeZtQM5CKUjx6grh54g If you want another down to earth (ahem) channel that also explores tech, there's Tech Ingredients who has done crazy things like build the ultimate (and certainly weirdest) speakers, his own epoxy, his own thermal paste, his own whiskey with his own still, his own compressorless fridge and AC, his own rocket motors.... https://www.youtube.com/user/TechIngredients https://www.youtube.com/user/TechIngredients
  - zem 5y ago
    Isaac Arthur is almost certainly a pseudonym paying homage to Isaac Asimov and Arthur C Clarke
    - freemint 5y ago
      Would be but is surprisingly not.
      - AussieWog93 5y ago
        Nominative determinism strikes again!
      - zem 5y ago
        wow, okay, that's surprising for sure!
  - anamexis 5y ago
    Thanks, I wasn't aware of those two! Riffing on those, I can also recommend DIY Perks. He makes pretty stunning electronics projects. https://www.youtube.com/c/DIYPerks https://www.youtube.com/c/DIYPerks
    - Laforet 5y ago
      I might just come forward and recommend NighthawkInLight. He does not upload as frequently as some of the other channels mentioned here but his videos tend to have a much higher production value for some just as interesting topics of science and technology. https://youtube.com/c/Nighthawkinlight https://youtube.com/c/Nighthawkinlight
- netizen-936824 5y ago
  Seconded, I learned a ton about A/V systems from him. He has excellent technical content. Learning about how the old electromechanical juke boxes worked was fascinating. I can also recommend Applied Science. He explains the concepts behind numerous concepts and applies them to a home project in his garage. Such project include: Home made electron microscope Chemical glass strengthening Robotic cookie maker Creating X-Rays Messing around with supercritical CO2 https://m.youtube.com/c/AppliedScience/videos https://m.youtube.com/c/AppliedScience/videos He does all sorts of random shit and it is absolutely wonderful
  - Groxx 5y ago
    Applied Science is amazing, +1 highly recommended. Well, to both.
  - myself248 5y ago
    For A/V stuff, I went looking for an understanding of how color works in video systems, and ran across this gem from Captain Disillusion: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTKP0Y9MVus https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTKP0Y9MVus His whole channel is great, though there's not a ton there, it makes sense given the staggering amount of work that goes into the visualizations of each one.
  - progre 5y ago
    His videos is an amazing demonstration of a general scientific engineering process: "At the 84:th attempt I started to see some promising results..."
- a012 5y ago
  I watched a few videos from his channel and always amazed/wondered how can he has so many vintage items and deep knowledge of/around them. I really enjoy his presentation skill and sense of humour.
  - beervirus 5y ago
    The jokes are painfully corny. But everything else about his channel is gold.
    - kelnos 5y ago
      I'm a pretty corny person, so I enjoy them. Not laugh-out-loud funny, but at least smile-worthy. I do really enjoy his presentation style, and the technical content is well-written and fascinating.
- barbazoo 5y ago
  Love his channel! My favourite videos are the ones about dishwashers.
  - garaetjjte 5y ago
    CED saga for me.
    - ASalazarMX 5y ago
      He won me with the video about why hurricane lamps look like they do: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tURHTuKHBZs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tURHTuKHBZs
philwelch 5y ago
Blogspam for a 2019 YouTube video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1OfxlSG6q5Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1OfxlSG6q5Y
maskaler 5y ago
Does it do crumpets?!
maltalex 5y ago
Re-making these toasters is probably a great idea for a kickstarter.
- jws 5y ago
  But maybe redesign it so the coils can’t be live even when it is off. Because you can’t stop humans from using forks. I grew up with one of these and was going to get an old one and refurbish it, but I live with too many hairless apes that would stick a fork or knife in to retrieve their undersized bread. Maybe if I put on a polarized plug, and check all the outlets in the kitchen to make sure they are wired correctly…
  - maltalex 5y ago
    Of course. The original sunbeam probably could not have been even made or sold today due to safety standards.
    - throwanem 5y ago
      Sure it could. It'd just need a polarized, grounded plug with the ground strap tied to the body.
      - smhenderson 5y ago
        The author even mentions that in the article when he talks about purchasing used ones as gifts. (Before giving them, I opened them up and replaced their aging power cords with modern grounded three-prong ones, as many of these predate even polarized plugs and are not remotely safe by modern electrocution prevention standards.)
      - loonster 5y ago
        Just a polarized plug would do it. That would make it so the switch is before the elements and not after.
        5y ago
jollybean 5y ago
There is definitely a market for the resurgence of some of high quality old-timey products, especially those with some novelty. Sunbeam should literally do a Kickstarter to get the marketing going.
- pengaru 5y ago
  > Sunbeam should literally do a Kickstarter to get the marketing going. Sunbeam products are now Chinesium trash, the brand was sold off long ago. At my last startup we learned this the hard way after buying a Sunbeam set of knives in a butcher block for the office kitchen. Every single knife was dull and serrated identically, despite presenting in the Amazon ad as a comprehensive set of knives.
  - dredmorbius 5y ago
    You can thank Chainsaw Al for that. https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Chainsaw_Al https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Chainsaw_Al https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/05/obituaries/al-dunlap-dead.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/05/obituaries/al-dunlap-dead...
    - consp 5y ago
      That wrap-sheet reads like he should have been in jail for ruining so many peoples lives. White-collar crime pays, but we all knew that already.
    - pengaru 5y ago
      It's not like "Chainsaw Al" inherited a pristine Sunbeam and ran it into the ground: "Allegheny's four principal divisions, including Sunbeam, went into decline through the late-1980s. Since Sunbeam-Oster was one of the most important divisions, responsible for nearly half of all sales, the stockholders were very concerned about the leadership. In 1986, the stockholders accused the Chairman and CEO, Robert Buckley of mis-appropriating funds.[10][11] Buckley's successor, Oliver Travers, downsized considerably and by 1988, the company was essentially just Sunbeam and Oster. The decline continued aided by the stock market crash of October 1987 and Allegheny filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy.[12] In the fall of 1989 an investment group called Japonica Partners[13] purchased the remains of Allegheny for $250 million ($521.9 million today) in a hostile takeover.[14] The company was renamed Sunbeam-Oster Company, Inc. At this point the business was then divided into four divisions: Outdoor Products, Household Products, Specialty Products, and International Sales. The company headquarters were moved again from Pittsburgh to Providence, Rhode Island and then finally to Fort Lauderdale, Florida.[15] By late 1991, Sunbeam-Oster's sales had increased 7% enabling it to make the Fortune 500 list." [0] It sounds to me like he was brought in to be the axe man, and he obliged, while adding some fraudulent flair to the mix. One could argue the fraud was just a best-effort attempt to turn the sinking ship around, with flagrant disregard for the law. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunbeam_Products#Growth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunbeam_Products#Growth
jonah 5y ago
I have several of these and can confirm they're awesome and very satisfying to use (when they're working correctly).
- lotophage 5y ago
  > when they're working correctly Is their toasting a bit hit or miss?
  - jonah 5y ago
    As the video discusses, they wear and the bimetallic strip wears/stretches/distorts with age and so it doesn't always actuate. There is an adjustment which can help.
- nevster 5y ago
  I grew up with one of these. Have always been disappointed by other toasters ever since.
- pvillano 5y ago
  >several ?
  - jonah 5y ago
    I inherited my grandmother's and I've picked up a couple at thrift stores over the years. Can only use one at once, but can't pass one up if it's inexpensive for whenever the one I'm using fails...
notacoward 5y ago
My wife has one of these and she's crazy about it. I'm less enthusiastic, especially since it has no protection against the outside getting hot enough to melt or burn anything carelessly put next to it. Maybe an update addressing that and some of the other issues mentioned in OP would yield a toaster that would make both of us happy.
- Gigachad 5y ago
  It's also live while turned off so if you ever put a fork in it, it's deadly.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
Tagbert 5y ago
I wish I could still get a toaster that let me toast one slice at a time. If making toast, I usually just want one slice. It is wasteful to have to heat up both sides for one slice of toast. I remember one model from a few decades ago where you could just put one slice in and push down one button to toast that. If you put in 2 slices, the other button would push both sides down to toast. I haven’t seen that feature in a long time.
- denton-scratch 5y ago
  Mine's a Dualit. It's repairable (it's held together with simple screws, and you can order all the parts), it has a mechanical timer, and a simple lever to raise/lower the toast. There's also a knob to switch between left slot/both slots. No electronics, no indicator lights. I think these things are targeted at commercial outlets (hotels, cafes and so on). I bought it because I imagined it would be ultra-reliable, and five years in I've had no problems. They cost about 3x as much as cheap toasters.
  - Lio 5y ago
    My Dualit is from 2004. It still looks and works like new. It's a design classic. 4 slots. A wonderfully boring device that just works with no fuss.
  - Tagbert 5y ago
    Thanks. I’ll look for that
pxeger1 5y ago
Shitty blogspam article that just copies the original video by Technology Connections
- foundart 5y ago
  Sure but I imagine it has resulted in a lot of exposure for Technology Connections.
  - andrewxdiamond 5y ago
    The person doing the work gets “exposure” while the copy/pasters get free ad revenue? Doesn’t sound like a fair shake to me
    - notriddle 5y ago
      Technology Connections has a Patreon, mentioned at the end of every video.
      - andrewxdiamond 5y ago
        I know, I’ve been a patreon of his for years. That doesn’t change the fact that this website is milking his work for clicks
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
- systemvoltage 5y ago
  IMO The Verge, MKBHD, LTT, Snazzy Labs, etc are entertainment platforms, not tech reviewers. Often lacking conviction, criticism, strong opinions, technical know-how and ability to do the hardwork for objective comparisons. They spend more time polishing the video, studio neatness and thumbnails than informing the public. They're optimized for viewership and revenue.
  - 5y ago
JoeDaDude 5y ago
But...does it run on Linux? https://www.embeddedarm.com/blog/netbsd-toaster-powered-by-the-ts-7200-arm9-sbc/ https://www.embeddedarm.com/blog/netbsd-toaster-powered-by-t...
malleefowl 5y ago
If anyone is looking to buy one, I recently bought a restored Sunbeam T-20 from timstoasters.com and love it. He even replaced the plug with a polarized one.
- deskamess 5y ago
  Where exactly is the buy page? I see everything but that!
  - malleefowl 5y ago
    I just used the form at timstoasters.com/order and said I was looking to buy instead of restore. I agree it could be easier to find!
    - deskamess 5y ago
      Thanks for the info. How was pricing? I assume it has be on the high side given the restoration.
      - malleefowl 5y ago
        Mine was $360 with shipping. Obviously very high compared to a new toaster, but I wouldn’t have wanted to do the wiring myself, so worth it for me.
        dangle1 5y ago
        Holy cow. We have one of these handed down to us. After learning how to calibrate the springs, it runs great. Didn't realize how much wealth it created for us as well.
        maccard 5y ago
        It's high, but not unreasonably so, compared to a decent modern toaster. For example, a dualit 4 slice toaster is £200/$260. Pretty much everyone I know who has one is happy with it, and it meets modern safety standards out of the box.
balaji1 5y ago
This toaster was expensive when it launched, but could be considered worth the money since it would last for a long time and it seems to have a good resale price even today. On the other hand, today it is hard to buy simple things of good quality on Amazon - example 100% cotton or 100% woolen clothes. And it would be harder in a physical superstore like Target or Walmart.
- crooked-v 5y ago
  You might appreciate the BuyItForLife subreddit. The ad hoc nature can make it hard to find stuff, but the posts are generally all direct testimonial by people who have had a given item for an extended period of time.
  - JetAlone 5y ago
    Imagine if we had testers who take a bunch of products with them into a space apartments moving at relativistic speeds, and when ready to retire they can tell us how their products fared during their lifetime... Corporate monasticism, sacrificing one working life a month or so to create an index that helps punish corporations for poor durability...
    - josephcsible 5y ago
      Doesn't relativity work the other way around? Wouldn't less time pass for them if you did that?
      - JetAlone 5y ago
        You're right yeah. So I guess we just periodically put the rest of humanity into a relativistic-pace space-station.
    - MaurizioPz 5y ago
      there's a movie for that, but I think it would be a spoiler to name it
systemvoltage 5y ago
This actually applies to a lot of old tech and old software. The idea that old == bad is permanently seared into the brains of people. Thanks to marketing. There should be a good balance between trying out new things (new JS frameworks!) and then if it doesn't work, STOP. Modern society is moving towards criticism == bad, which leads to things like Youtube removing dislike visibility and inability to challenge ideas in a corporate setting (someone might just get offended by criticism). My hope and expectation for society is to balance experimentation and criticism. We need both in equal amounts. A good analogy that I keep is gradient descend algorithm - if we get stuck in a local optima, unless we undo things, there is no way to improve (This is criticism). At the same time, if we don't allow picking new directions, improvement is hopeless (This is experimentation).
cuddlybacon 5y ago
Since everyone is mentioning Technology Connections (he deserves it, great channel), I want to bring up this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiS27feX8o0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiS27feX8o0 To me, this really shows the sad direction smart appliances have gone in. I would love to see that smart appliances would have continued to evolve in this direction. I don't like the current state of smart appliances, but going back to the absolute basic seems like an over-reaction to me.
- ASalazarMX 5y ago
  I wanted to automate my house, but the results convinced me that starting from the absolute basics and growing from it is the best approach. It's more environmentally friendly too. The only smart devices left are some smart bulbs, and I'm waiting for them to fail before replacing them with regular LEDs. Nothing beats the reliability and energy/resource savings of plain locks and buttons.
  - Nextgrid 5y ago
    A smart home can be reliable, useful and environmentally friendly (if we consider potential energy savings). You just won't get there with consumer-grade solutions. Pretty much every consumer-grade tech nowadays is designed to generate "engagement" and collect data; the actual "useful" work it does is only the bare-minimum needed to convince you to buy the product and "engage" with it. If you look beyond the consumer-grade trash, you can get somewhere nice with $500 if you go the DIY route with modules/relays supporting open protocols and Home Assistant, or if you have several thousands to spare check out higher-end solutions such as Crestron. Any good system will be completely self-contained, not rely on the internet, and provided the hardware is maintained should last essentially forever.
    - droopyEyelids 5y ago
      Crestron may be as good as humanity can do for home automation, but it's the way to madness with proprietary development tools, security vulnerabilities, and hardware that still isn't up to infrastructure reliability levels.
ls15 5y ago
But can it collect data about its user and show ads?
rob74 5y ago
I can contribute another simple example of a kitchen appliance that didn't necessarily get smarter: the cooking plate! Remember the good old cookers with rotary switches? Those actually had up to seven different stages of heating (see schematic here http://www.herd.josefscholz.de/7Takt/img16.gif http://www.herd.josefscholz.de/7Takt/img16.gif)! While the new digital ones are... digital - i.e. they switch the plate on and off repeatedly to produce different amounts of heat, but that depends on the pot/pan/whatever you put on it to store the heat while the plate is off. So a definite step backward if you ask me...
- bmicraft 5y ago
  At least from my experience my induction stove does not seem to have this problem, which kinda makes sense if you think about it: It already has to switch on/off many times per second to induce current, so it can just skip some cycles. I suppose as induction slowly wins over resistive heating this will become a non issue once again.
  - ericbarrett 5y ago
    I really loved my induction range and miss it, having moved back to gas. It could bring an 8 quart pot of water to a rolling boil in two minutes flat.
- bryanrasmussen 5y ago
  Not to mention the digital ones are more prone to failure.
  - Gigachad 5y ago
    Are they? Is this studied? I have never heard of one failing and know many people with them.
    - bryanrasmussen 5y ago
      by cooking plate I mean the cooking plates in the normally sold induction stovetop, in those of course the failure is generally not on the cooking plate but the stovetop itself but that doesn't matter, once the stovetop goes you can't use a plate because it's all one big integrated appliance. So anyway I bought a slightly above medium priced one a few years ago, and it has failed about 5 times. When we had the guy out to fix it he said that it was a common problem that the part where you have to push to start a particular plate cooking can fail to register a push anymore and as a general rule if one of the 'buttons' couldn't be pushed none of them could be pushed because after all they aren't really buttons. I asked why is it continually failing he said oh sometimes there is some underlying electrical issue, but I think we have everything fixed now. Anyway after the fifth breakdown in a couple years it has been going pretty good for a year now. Now of course since an induction stovetop is one big piece, there are fewer parts that can fail. So maybe there actually is a higher failure on analog stoves, but I remember every time I had a failure on my analog stoves it was only one piece that failed, and sometimes it was easy to make it work again, like a broken knob, or it was only a partial failure like that cooking plate doesn't get as hot as it used to. When my current stovetop fails, it is all failed. A case in point I bought a small portable two cooking plate analog stove at the same time I bought the more modern induction one. One of the cooking plates got broken some years back but the other still works. We also need it to make espresso as the pot is too light to register on the induction stovetop. on edit: must be tired, changed in case of point to a case in point.
askvictor 5y ago
I've used quite a few toasters in my years (including this one), but don't understand why, as the toaster gets older, it tends to burn toast. I've noticed this from both cheap, and not-so-cheap toasters. Any ideas what changes in a toaster over a few years of use to cause this? I've picked up these from hard rubbish a couple of times, but they did tend to burn the toast a bit; kind of wishing I had tried to re-furbish them, now knowing how the mechanism works.
- IncRnd 5y ago
  A toaster will often start to burn toast when the toaster isn't clean. When there are a lot of food particles at the bottom that detritus can increase the heat from the heating elements. So, the best way to avoid this is to clean the appliance.
  - askvictor 5y ago
    That's what I have been starting to figure, but while I can clean the bottom tray easily enough, there tends to be a build up of 'stuck-on' detritus in amongst the elements and other places that aren't really possible to clean without taking the whole thing apart.
cassepipe 5y ago
Ok I guess now is the time and place to complain to whomever cares about toaster design. Why is it that the metal grid that holds the bread has its bars so wide apart ? I don't toast only industrial square bread, I happen to regularly toast good state of the art european bakery bread that have very different slice sizes. It is maddenig to have your slice slip trhough the metal bars and prevent the toaster from going up or having to go fishing for your slice with whatever tool you think fit for the job, in 2021. Is my use case that specific ? I have been looking for a toaster with a tight grid bread holder but could not find one so far. Please help.
- myself248 5y ago
  Same problem! I bake a lot of my own bread and often end up with odd-shaped lumps of loaf-ends which fall between the wires. Also I wish I could get a narrow-slot toaster. I never toast bagels, and I feel like a the ubiquitous wide-slot designs waste energy and take longer because there's so much unnecessary room for air to convection-cool the bread.
  - bombcar 5y ago
    Get a commercial one https://www.webstaurantstore.com/search/toaster.html https://www.webstaurantstore.com/search/toaster.html But probably not worth the space.
    - myself248 5y ago
      Literally all of the pop-up style toasters there are wide-slot types. And the conveyor style are clearly out of the question since my stated goal is to use less energy. I'm not sure I understand your suggestion.
- 52-6F-62 5y ago
  My partner and I were given one of these: https://www.dualit.com/products/classic-toasters https://www.dualit.com/products/classic-toasters They're dead simple, and work excellently. The bars you're mentioning are single, wide and flat, so they'd support thin slices well.
JoshGlazebrook 5y ago
Honestly, I searched for a great toaster after going through a few cheap ones and I always came back to this Japanese "steam" toaster. - https://us.balmuda.com/products/balmuda-the-toaster https://us.balmuda.com/products/balmuda-the-toaster $300 for a toaster seems insane, but it honestly is worth it. You fill the little 5cc "cup" with water and pour it in, and it uses steam to lock in moisture and then toast. Toast (and honestly everything else) comes out perfectly crisp all over and the inside stays moist.
- late2part 5y ago
  I have this and the Mitsubishi T0-ST-1T. Both are good. Neither are great. I miss my Breville, it seemed more consistently better than good.
ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
That reminds me of this old bit of Internet humor, called "The Parable of the Toaster"[0]: Once upon a time, in a kingdom not far from here, a king summoned two of his advisors for a test. He showed them both a shiny metal box with two slots in the top, a control knob, and a lever. "What do you think this is?" One advisor, an Electrical Engineer, answered first. "It is a toaster," he said. The king asked, "How would you design an embedded computer for it?" The advisor: "Using a four-bit microcontroller, I would write a simple program that reads the darkness knob and quantifies its position to one of 16 shades of darkness, from snow white to coal black. The program would use that darkness level as the index to a 16-element table of initial timer values. Then it would turn on the heating elements and start the timer with the initial value selected from the table. At the end of the time delay, it would turn off the heat and pop up the toast. Come back next week, and I'll show you a working prototype." The second advisor, an IT consultant, immediately recognized the danger of such short-sighted thinking. He said, "Toasters don't just turn bread into toast, they are also used to warm frozen waffles. What you see before you is really a breakfast food cooker. As the subjects of your kingdom become more sophisticated, they will demand more capabilities. They will need a breakfast food cooker that can also cook sausage, fry bacon, and make scrambled eggs. A toaster that only makes toast will soon be obsolete. If we don't look to the future, we will have to completely redesign the toaster in just a few years." "With this in mind, we can formulate a more intelligent solution to the problem. First, create a class of breakfast foods. Specialize this class into subclasses: grains, pork, and poultry. The specialization process should be repeated with grains divided into toast, muffins, pancakes, and waffles; pork divided into sausage, links, and bacon; and poultry divided into scrambled eggs, hard-boiled eggs, poached eggs, fried eggs, and various omelette classes." "The ham and cheese omelette class is worth special attention because it must inherit characteristics from the pork, dairy, and poultry classes. Thus, we see that the problem cannot be properly solved without multiple inheritance. At run time, the program must create the proper object and send a message to the object that says, 'Cook yourself.' The semantics of this message depend, of course, on the kind of object, so they have a different meaning to a piece of toast than to scrambled eggs." "Reviewing the process so far, we see that the analysis phase has revealed that the primary requirement is to cook any kind of breakfast food. In the design phase, we have discovered some derived requirements. Specifically, we need an object-oriented language with multiple inheritance. Of course, users don't want the eggs to get cold while the bacon is frying, so concurrent processing is required, too." "We must not forget the user interface. The lever that lowers the food lacks versatility, and the darkness knob is confusing. Users won't buy the product unless it has a user-friendly, graphical interface. When the breakfast cooker is plugged in, users should see a cowboy boot on the screen. Users click on it, and the message 'Booting UNIX v.8.3' appears on the screen. (UNIX 8.3 should be out by the time the product gets to the market.) Users can pull down a menu and click on the foods they want to cook." "Having made the wise decision of specifying the software first in the design phase, all that remains is to pick an adequate hardware platform for the implementation phase. An Intel Pentium with 48MB of memory, a 1.2GB hard disk, and a SVGA monitor should be sufficient. If you select a multitasking, object oriented language that supports multiple inheritance and has a built-in GUI, writing the program will be a snap." The king wisely had the IT consultant beheaded, and they all lived happily ever after. [0] http://www.solipsys.co.uk/new/TheParableOfTheToaster.html http://www.solipsys.co.uk/new/TheParableOfTheToaster.html (Although I believe that it is even older than this)
lost-found 5y ago
Ehh main problem with this is different people like their toast toasted to different levels.
- throwaway0a5e 5y ago
  Add a knob that moves the strip closer/further from the heat source. There. Done.
  - fabbari 5y ago
    I have one of this toasters, it has a little knob to adjust how dark the toast needs to be. I have also replaced the power cord.
  - lost-found 5y ago
    You just described every other toaster out there.
dang 5y ago
Past related threads: The Classic Sunbeam Radiant Control Toaster (2006) - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23723112 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23723112 - July 2020 (47 comments) How to design a good toaster with lessons from the 1940s [video] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23363646 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23363646 - May 2020 (17 comments) An Antique Toaster That's Better Than Today’s [video] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21164014 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21164014 - Oct 2019 (232 comments) Also slightly related: Toaster Central: Antique and Vintage Toasters and Waffle Irons - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21432144 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21432144 - Nov 2019 (7 comments)
silisili 5y ago
Serious question - do most folks still own toasters today? They just seem so... specifically single function and take up counterspace. In my house, we have a sandwich press which we use for 4 or less pieces of toast at a time. And of course it doubles as a press for paninis or cubanos, too. And you never have to worry about unevenness, as it's just two hot plates basically. If cooking a lot of toast for a get together or really large meal, just throw them in the oven. I haven't owned a toaster as an adult, so I'm really curious how popular they are these days.
- exhilaration 5y ago
  Toaster oven FTW, it's probably our most used appliance. Get one with the convection setting and it'll beat any air fryer too [1]. [1] Wirecutter review: https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/best-air-fryer/ https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/best-air-fryer/
  - silisili 5y ago
    See that I understand, very versatile choice. Would you day it works better than a fullsize convection oven, or about the same?
    - exhilaration 5y ago
      I didn't even know there were full size convection ovens! We've got the toaster oven and a gas oven, I would say they work about the same, it's just so much more efficient to use the electric toaster oven (assuming what you're trying to cook fits in there).
  - Nition 5y ago
    Funnily enough, convection toaster ovens are rebranding their same old models as being air friers now. Because of course an air fryer is just a weirdly shaped convection toaster oven in the first place.
- jmisavage 5y ago
  I've had the same toaster for the better part of 15 years now I don't think its any weirder than owning a dedicated sandwich press. It's usually a set it and forget it kinda of item that doesn't take long to do its job.
hapless 5y ago
They bury the lede in the last fucking paragraph. The reason this toaster is immensely better than the toaster you have at home is very, very simple: this toaster's 1949 price would be hundreds of dollars in 2021 terms. You can still buy really, truly excellent toasters made for industrial/commercial use, or for the homes of the very rich, and they're quite a lot better than the trash people keep in their houses. And they cost a lot more, too. Last time I checked, a commercial 2-slice toaster was in the $300-$400 range. This is true for lots of home appliances. My favorite example is the Kitchenaid mixer. The modern mixers are very thoroughly "value engineered" to keep the price down. If you want to buy an original "Kitchenaid," like they made in the 1930s, you can call up Hobart and buy a miniature mixer. And it will cost you ~$2,000 in 2021, just as it did in 1935. You can have the good toaster, the good mixer, etc, but it sure looks like people don't actually want that. The pattern of product offerings in your average store suggests people want something affordable, and it doesn't particularly matter whether it is good at its job.
- jonahx 5y ago
  > and it doesn't particularly matter whether it is good at its job. I would amend that to: "it doesn't matter whether it excels at its job, as long as it's good enough." And those modern, cheap toasters are good enough.
- throwawaylinux 5y ago
  > They bury the lede in the last fucking paragraph. The reason this toaster is immensely better than the toaster you have at home is very, very simple: this toaster's 1949 price would be hundreds of dollars in 2021 terms. From the article it seemed that it's better because it has a radiant temperature sensor rather than a simple timer. Unless you're disputing that and saying it's good for some other reason that would cost a lot of money, a temperature sensor and little control system for it would not cost hundreds of dollars to make today. EDIT: The problem seems to be that regular consumer appliances seem to have raced to the bottom in the past 30 years or so. It's not that a significantly better toaster would cost hundreds of dollars more, it's that it would cost a few dollars more. The high end things that are 10x the price seem to be priced that way mostly because there is not a strong mid range market, or maybe they compete on gimmicks rather than basics. Because you don't need a $300 powder coated steel toaster with an a glass oven door and 5 cooking regimes including steaming that was mentioned in the article (https://us.balmuda.com/collections/toaster https://us.balmuda.com/collections/toaster) to get the functionality and robustness of their simple 1940s sunbeam toaster.
swayvil 5y ago
Poverty could be defined as an unavailability of high-quality resources. So if the quality of the available resources goes down, that's poverty?
stjohnswarts 5y ago
Also more likely to burn your house down :)
ddingus 5y ago
What I like most about devices like this is how robust the world is has a whole lot to do with how robust the device is. My Grandparents had a custom camp trailer made in '74. I have it now. Grannie lived the longest and knew I loved it. BTW, she went white water kayaking the year before she died. Lived well, no regrets. I got so much from her, but I digress... That trailer ran on propane gas. Still does, except for lighting. Originally, it had all gas lights too, but those are just a bit dangerous and I helped them replace those as a teen years ago. The rest runs on gas. Fridge, Stove, Range, Heater. Just this year, the heater decided it needed a new thermocouple. I'll get one, clean it up a little, and it will run just fine the same way it has for all those years. The fridge works on a simple chemical solution that boils up through restricted openings, and as the material trickles down, it works to carry heat out of the fridge. That fridge does have an AC option. We've only used it once, and it was to see whether it worked, and how well. Basically, it works and isn't any better than the little gas flame needed to make the fridge work. It will run a couple weeks on a few gallons of propane, has a freezer, and works well up to a little under 110 degrees F. (Yeah, rough year)' Over the years, I've picked up a few of these kinds of devices and I love them. Mixer, toaster, various old clocks, washer, dryer, weather instruments... And I've had some professional experience. Older industrial machines that rely on springs, relays, R/C circuits, bimetal elements, just work. The engineering on these is kind of a lost art in some ways. In others, we have such great material science these days! The same kind of approach might actually have serious merit. Repair can be a challenge, until one has worked on a few. The basic ideas are broadly applicable. Once those are in mind, and a person has some mastery, these devices are like an open book! Count me a fan. I like simple things that just do that which they are designed for. One downside can be overall efficiency. While that counts, I can see people just choosing to live a little smaller, leaner and that can largely balance out, or at the least not be terrible. That's basically what we do. Re: Smart home There are very compelling possibilities. But, I am just not up for the maintenance and or the work to really hit the upper level of what can be done, not to mention it's either expensive, or takes considerable time, understanding and skill to roll one's own. In my 30's I was wanting a lot of those things. However, as time has passed and I see the classics just work, and work, and work, and I don't see people struggling with them, odd states, modes, extras that get in the way, or one uses so seldom it's always a bigger time investment than the value derived. Less is more in my home and life. Professionally, that's not going to fly most of the time. And the use cases are different, returns different too. But, there is a whole lot to be said for robust gear for living. It's simple, life can be simple, with few surprises, all of which frees time and energy for doing other things. One last thing, and that's the idea of buying once and using for a long time, even handing the thing off to someone else to use. I like this and have employed it in my life. Saved a ton. Sure, these kinds of things are expensive, but one can chip away at things and before we know it, are pretty well equipped and it's gonna last. Worth it. Where one is inclined to fix things up, or buy used, seeking these kinds of devices, there are deals. Many people get caught up in things like "digital toasters", and that's fine. I'm happy to pick up the good stuff while it's an option.
ltbarcly3 5y ago
I absolutely hate low effort articles like this. Just restating the contents of a TikToc or in this case plagerizing a Youtube video (Technology Connections, aka Alec Watson) to generate content is lazy, even if you 'credit' the source you are stealing all your content from in some cursory way. Alec noticed something truley interesting and did many days of research and first hand investigation to build this content from scratch, this article just steals it outright and links to his YouTube video as though that makes it cool?
quokka 5y ago
Years ago I had one of these. It slowly stopped working and my wife got sick of it. Without any way to fix it I got rid of it, which I now regret. The toaster we have now browns unevenly and is wildly inconsistent from run to run.

336 points by ourmandave 5y ago

Yeah toasters these days are crap. I always have to compensate for ambient temperature and the thing still being hot from a previous slice, thickness etc. I'd pay more for a toaster that was smart like this one. I wonder why that's not a thing, we have smart everything else...

oblio 5y ago

It's remarkably difficult to find something as automated at it. This should be super cheap and ubiquitous tech but apparently it isn't. Most of the other stuff uses electronics and does more but is actually dumber as an overall device. For example many can set a target duration or target temperature but because they don't take into account the bread temperature they don't defrost as well.

pickledish 5y ago

His whole channel (called Technology Connections) is probably my favorite one on YouTube, can’t recommend it enough! My favorites are his series on refrigeration and heat pumps, for example this one: https://youtube.com/watch?v=7J52mDjZzto https://youtube.com/watch?v=7J52mDjZzto Edit: to clarify, this article is based on an old Technology Connections video, and the creator of that video has lots more!

DiabloD3 5y ago
Technology Connections is hands down one of my favorite Youtube channels. Another guy worth mentioning that tickles the brain cells in a similar way is Isaac Arthur: a guy that breaks down science fiction into science fact, and explores what we could actually do someday in the future, and pokes fun at the stuff that will probably never happen but has become familiar tropes anyways. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZFipeZtQM5CKUjx6grh54g https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZFipeZtQM5CKUjx6grh54g If you want another down to earth (ahem) channel that also explores tech, there's Tech Ingredients who has done crazy things like build the ultimate (and certainly weirdest) speakers, his own epoxy, his own thermal paste, his own whiskey with his own still, his own compressorless fridge and AC, his own rocket motors.... https://www.youtube.com/user/TechIngredients https://www.youtube.com/user/TechIngredients
- zem 5y ago
  Isaac Arthur is almost certainly a pseudonym paying homage to Isaac Asimov and Arthur C Clarke
  - freemint 5y ago
    Would be but is surprisingly not.
    - AussieWog93 5y ago
      Nominative determinism strikes again!
    - zem 5y ago
      wow, okay, that's surprising for sure!
- anamexis 5y ago
  Thanks, I wasn't aware of those two! Riffing on those, I can also recommend DIY Perks. He makes pretty stunning electronics projects. https://www.youtube.com/c/DIYPerks https://www.youtube.com/c/DIYPerks
  - Laforet 5y ago
    I might just come forward and recommend NighthawkInLight. He does not upload as frequently as some of the other channels mentioned here but his videos tend to have a much higher production value for some just as interesting topics of science and technology. https://youtube.com/c/Nighthawkinlight https://youtube.com/c/Nighthawkinlight
netizen-936824 5y ago
Seconded, I learned a ton about A/V systems from him. He has excellent technical content. Learning about how the old electromechanical juke boxes worked was fascinating. I can also recommend Applied Science. He explains the concepts behind numerous concepts and applies them to a home project in his garage. Such project include: Home made electron microscope Chemical glass strengthening Robotic cookie maker Creating X-Rays Messing around with supercritical CO2 https://m.youtube.com/c/AppliedScience/videos https://m.youtube.com/c/AppliedScience/videos He does all sorts of random shit and it is absolutely wonderful
- Groxx 5y ago
  Applied Science is amazing, +1 highly recommended. Well, to both.
- myself248 5y ago
  For A/V stuff, I went looking for an understanding of how color works in video systems, and ran across this gem from Captain Disillusion: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTKP0Y9MVus https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTKP0Y9MVus His whole channel is great, though there's not a ton there, it makes sense given the staggering amount of work that goes into the visualizations of each one.
- progre 5y ago
  His videos is an amazing demonstration of a general scientific engineering process: "At the 84:th attempt I started to see some promising results..."
a012 5y ago
I watched a few videos from his channel and always amazed/wondered how can he has so many vintage items and deep knowledge of/around them. I really enjoy his presentation skill and sense of humour.
- beervirus 5y ago
  The jokes are painfully corny. But everything else about his channel is gold.
  - kelnos 5y ago
    I'm a pretty corny person, so I enjoy them. Not laugh-out-loud funny, but at least smile-worthy. I do really enjoy his presentation style, and the technical content is well-written and fascinating.
barbazoo 5y ago
Love his channel! My favourite videos are the ones about dishwashers.
- garaetjjte 5y ago
  CED saga for me.
  - ASalazarMX 5y ago
    He won me with the video about why hurricane lamps look like they do: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tURHTuKHBZs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tURHTuKHBZs

philwelch 5y ago

Blogspam for a 2019 YouTube video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1OfxlSG6q5Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1OfxlSG6q5Y

maskaler 5y ago

Does it do crumpets?!

maltalex 5y ago

Re-making these toasters is probably a great idea for a kickstarter.

jws 5y ago
But maybe redesign it so the coils can’t be live even when it is off. Because you can’t stop humans from using forks. I grew up with one of these and was going to get an old one and refurbish it, but I live with too many hairless apes that would stick a fork or knife in to retrieve their undersized bread. Maybe if I put on a polarized plug, and check all the outlets in the kitchen to make sure they are wired correctly…
- maltalex 5y ago
  Of course. The original sunbeam probably could not have been even made or sold today due to safety standards.
  - throwanem 5y ago
    Sure it could. It'd just need a polarized, grounded plug with the ground strap tied to the body.
    - smhenderson 5y ago
      The author even mentions that in the article when he talks about purchasing used ones as gifts. (Before giving them, I opened them up and replaced their aging power cords with modern grounded three-prong ones, as many of these predate even polarized plugs and are not remotely safe by modern electrocution prevention standards.)
    - loonster 5y ago
      Just a polarized plug would do it. That would make it so the switch is before the elements and not after.
      - 5y ago

jollybean 5y ago

There is definitely a market for the resurgence of some of high quality old-timey products, especially those with some novelty. Sunbeam should literally do a Kickstarter to get the marketing going.

pengaru 5y ago
> Sunbeam should literally do a Kickstarter to get the marketing going. Sunbeam products are now Chinesium trash, the brand was sold off long ago. At my last startup we learned this the hard way after buying a Sunbeam set of knives in a butcher block for the office kitchen. Every single knife was dull and serrated identically, despite presenting in the Amazon ad as a comprehensive set of knives.
- dredmorbius 5y ago
  You can thank Chainsaw Al for that. https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Chainsaw_Al https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Chainsaw_Al https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/05/obituaries/al-dunlap-dead.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/05/obituaries/al-dunlap-dead...
  - consp 5y ago
    That wrap-sheet reads like he should have been in jail for ruining so many peoples lives. White-collar crime pays, but we all knew that already.
  - pengaru 5y ago
    It's not like "Chainsaw Al" inherited a pristine Sunbeam and ran it into the ground: "Allegheny's four principal divisions, including Sunbeam, went into decline through the late-1980s. Since Sunbeam-Oster was one of the most important divisions, responsible for nearly half of all sales, the stockholders were very concerned about the leadership. In 1986, the stockholders accused the Chairman and CEO, Robert Buckley of mis-appropriating funds.[10][11] Buckley's successor, Oliver Travers, downsized considerably and by 1988, the company was essentially just Sunbeam and Oster. The decline continued aided by the stock market crash of October 1987 and Allegheny filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy.[12] In the fall of 1989 an investment group called Japonica Partners[13] purchased the remains of Allegheny for $250 million ($521.9 million today) in a hostile takeover.[14] The company was renamed Sunbeam-Oster Company, Inc. At this point the business was then divided into four divisions: Outdoor Products, Household Products, Specialty Products, and International Sales. The company headquarters were moved again from Pittsburgh to Providence, Rhode Island and then finally to Fort Lauderdale, Florida.[15] By late 1991, Sunbeam-Oster's sales had increased 7% enabling it to make the Fortune 500 list." [0] It sounds to me like he was brought in to be the axe man, and he obliged, while adding some fraudulent flair to the mix. One could argue the fraud was just a best-effort attempt to turn the sinking ship around, with flagrant disregard for the law. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunbeam_Products#Growth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunbeam_Products#Growth

jonah 5y ago

I have several of these and can confirm they're awesome and very satisfying to use (when they're working correctly).

lotophage 5y ago
> when they're working correctly Is their toasting a bit hit or miss?
- jonah 5y ago
  As the video discusses, they wear and the bimetallic strip wears/stretches/distorts with age and so it doesn't always actuate. There is an adjustment which can help.
nevster 5y ago
I grew up with one of these. Have always been disappointed by other toasters ever since.
pvillano 5y ago
>several ?
- jonah 5y ago
  I inherited my grandmother's and I've picked up a couple at thrift stores over the years. Can only use one at once, but can't pass one up if it's inexpensive for whenever the one I'm using fails...

notacoward 5y ago

My wife has one of these and she's crazy about it. I'm less enthusiastic, especially since it has no protection against the outside getting hot enough to melt or burn anything carelessly put next to it. Maybe an update addressing that and some of the other issues mentioned in OP would yield a toaster that would make both of us happy.

Gigachad 5y ago
It's also live while turned off so if you ever put a fork in it, it's deadly.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]

Tagbert 5y ago

I wish I could still get a toaster that let me toast one slice at a time. If making toast, I usually just want one slice. It is wasteful to have to heat up both sides for one slice of toast. I remember one model from a few decades ago where you could just put one slice in and push down one button to toast that. If you put in 2 slices, the other button would push both sides down to toast. I haven’t seen that feature in a long time.

denton-scratch 5y ago
Mine's a Dualit. It's repairable (it's held together with simple screws, and you can order all the parts), it has a mechanical timer, and a simple lever to raise/lower the toast. There's also a knob to switch between left slot/both slots. No electronics, no indicator lights. I think these things are targeted at commercial outlets (hotels, cafes and so on). I bought it because I imagined it would be ultra-reliable, and five years in I've had no problems. They cost about 3x as much as cheap toasters.
- Lio 5y ago
  My Dualit is from 2004. It still looks and works like new. It's a design classic. 4 slots. A wonderfully boring device that just works with no fuss.
- Tagbert 5y ago
  Thanks. I’ll look for that

pxeger1 5y ago

Shitty blogspam article that just copies the original video by Technology Connections

foundart 5y ago
Sure but I imagine it has resulted in a lot of exposure for Technology Connections.
- andrewxdiamond 5y ago
  The person doing the work gets “exposure” while the copy/pasters get free ad revenue? Doesn’t sound like a fair shake to me
  - notriddle 5y ago
    Technology Connections has a Patreon, mentioned at the end of every video.
    - andrewxdiamond 5y ago
      I know, I’ve been a patreon of his for years. That doesn’t change the fact that this website is milking his work for clicks
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
systemvoltage 5y ago
IMO The Verge, MKBHD, LTT, Snazzy Labs, etc are entertainment platforms, not tech reviewers. Often lacking conviction, criticism, strong opinions, technical know-how and ability to do the hardwork for objective comparisons. They spend more time polishing the video, studio neatness and thumbnails than informing the public. They're optimized for viewership and revenue.
- 5y ago

JoeDaDude 5y ago

But...does it run on Linux? https://www.embeddedarm.com/blog/netbsd-toaster-powered-by-the-ts-7200-arm9-sbc/ https://www.embeddedarm.com/blog/netbsd-toaster-powered-by-t...

malleefowl 5y ago

If anyone is looking to buy one, I recently bought a restored Sunbeam T-20 from timstoasters.com and love it. He even replaced the plug with a polarized one.

deskamess 5y ago
Where exactly is the buy page? I see everything but that!
- malleefowl 5y ago
  I just used the form at timstoasters.com/order and said I was looking to buy instead of restore. I agree it could be easier to find!
  - deskamess 5y ago
    Thanks for the info. How was pricing? I assume it has be on the high side given the restoration.
    - malleefowl 5y ago
      Mine was $360 with shipping. Obviously very high compared to a new toaster, but I wouldn’t have wanted to do the wiring myself, so worth it for me.
      - dangle1 5y ago
        Holy cow. We have one of these handed down to us. After learning how to calibrate the springs, it runs great. Didn't realize how much wealth it created for us as well.
      - maccard 5y ago
        It's high, but not unreasonably so, compared to a decent modern toaster. For example, a dualit 4 slice toaster is £200/$260. Pretty much everyone I know who has one is happy with it, and it meets modern safety standards out of the box.

balaji1 5y ago

This toaster was expensive when it launched, but could be considered worth the money since it would last for a long time and it seems to have a good resale price even today. On the other hand, today it is hard to buy simple things of good quality on Amazon - example 100% cotton or 100% woolen clothes. And it would be harder in a physical superstore like Target or Walmart.

crooked-v 5y ago
You might appreciate the BuyItForLife subreddit. The ad hoc nature can make it hard to find stuff, but the posts are generally all direct testimonial by people who have had a given item for an extended period of time.
- JetAlone 5y ago
  Imagine if we had testers who take a bunch of products with them into a space apartments moving at relativistic speeds, and when ready to retire they can tell us how their products fared during their lifetime... Corporate monasticism, sacrificing one working life a month or so to create an index that helps punish corporations for poor durability...
  - josephcsible 5y ago
    Doesn't relativity work the other way around? Wouldn't less time pass for them if you did that?
    - JetAlone 5y ago
      You're right yeah. So I guess we just periodically put the rest of humanity into a relativistic-pace space-station.
  - MaurizioPz 5y ago
    there's a movie for that, but I think it would be a spoiler to name it

systemvoltage 5y ago

This actually applies to a lot of old tech and old software. The idea that old == bad is permanently seared into the brains of people. Thanks to marketing. There should be a good balance between trying out new things (new JS frameworks!) and then if it doesn't work, STOP. Modern society is moving towards criticism == bad, which leads to things like Youtube removing dislike visibility and inability to challenge ideas in a corporate setting (someone might just get offended by criticism). My hope and expectation for society is to balance experimentation and criticism. We need both in equal amounts. A good analogy that I keep is gradient descend algorithm - if we get stuck in a local optima, unless we undo things, there is no way to improve (This is criticism). At the same time, if we don't allow picking new directions, improvement is hopeless (This is experimentation).

cuddlybacon 5y ago

Since everyone is mentioning Technology Connections (he deserves it, great channel), I want to bring up this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiS27feX8o0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiS27feX8o0 To me, this really shows the sad direction smart appliances have gone in. I would love to see that smart appliances would have continued to evolve in this direction. I don't like the current state of smart appliances, but going back to the absolute basic seems like an over-reaction to me.

ASalazarMX 5y ago
I wanted to automate my house, but the results convinced me that starting from the absolute basics and growing from it is the best approach. It's more environmentally friendly too. The only smart devices left are some smart bulbs, and I'm waiting for them to fail before replacing them with regular LEDs. Nothing beats the reliability and energy/resource savings of plain locks and buttons.
- Nextgrid 5y ago
  A smart home can be reliable, useful and environmentally friendly (if we consider potential energy savings). You just won't get there with consumer-grade solutions. Pretty much every consumer-grade tech nowadays is designed to generate "engagement" and collect data; the actual "useful" work it does is only the bare-minimum needed to convince you to buy the product and "engage" with it. If you look beyond the consumer-grade trash, you can get somewhere nice with $500 if you go the DIY route with modules/relays supporting open protocols and Home Assistant, or if you have several thousands to spare check out higher-end solutions such as Crestron. Any good system will be completely self-contained, not rely on the internet, and provided the hardware is maintained should last essentially forever.
  - droopyEyelids 5y ago
    Crestron may be as good as humanity can do for home automation, but it's the way to madness with proprietary development tools, security vulnerabilities, and hardware that still isn't up to infrastructure reliability levels.

ls15 5y ago

But can it collect data about its user and show ads?

rob74 5y ago

I can contribute another simple example of a kitchen appliance that didn't necessarily get smarter: the cooking plate! Remember the good old cookers with rotary switches? Those actually had up to seven different stages of heating (see schematic here http://www.herd.josefscholz.de/7Takt/img16.gif http://www.herd.josefscholz.de/7Takt/img16.gif)! While the new digital ones are... digital - i.e. they switch the plate on and off repeatedly to produce different amounts of heat, but that depends on the pot/pan/whatever you put on it to store the heat while the plate is off. So a definite step backward if you ask me...

bmicraft 5y ago
At least from my experience my induction stove does not seem to have this problem, which kinda makes sense if you think about it: It already has to switch on/off many times per second to induce current, so it can just skip some cycles. I suppose as induction slowly wins over resistive heating this will become a non issue once again.
- ericbarrett 5y ago
  I really loved my induction range and miss it, having moved back to gas. It could bring an 8 quart pot of water to a rolling boil in two minutes flat.
bryanrasmussen 5y ago
Not to mention the digital ones are more prone to failure.
- Gigachad 5y ago
  Are they? Is this studied? I have never heard of one failing and know many people with them.
  - bryanrasmussen 5y ago
    by cooking plate I mean the cooking plates in the normally sold induction stovetop, in those of course the failure is generally not on the cooking plate but the stovetop itself but that doesn't matter, once the stovetop goes you can't use a plate because it's all one big integrated appliance. So anyway I bought a slightly above medium priced one a few years ago, and it has failed about 5 times. When we had the guy out to fix it he said that it was a common problem that the part where you have to push to start a particular plate cooking can fail to register a push anymore and as a general rule if one of the 'buttons' couldn't be pushed none of them could be pushed because after all they aren't really buttons. I asked why is it continually failing he said oh sometimes there is some underlying electrical issue, but I think we have everything fixed now. Anyway after the fifth breakdown in a couple years it has been going pretty good for a year now. Now of course since an induction stovetop is one big piece, there are fewer parts that can fail. So maybe there actually is a higher failure on analog stoves, but I remember every time I had a failure on my analog stoves it was only one piece that failed, and sometimes it was easy to make it work again, like a broken knob, or it was only a partial failure like that cooking plate doesn't get as hot as it used to. When my current stovetop fails, it is all failed. A case in point I bought a small portable two cooking plate analog stove at the same time I bought the more modern induction one. One of the cooking plates got broken some years back but the other still works. We also need it to make espresso as the pot is too light to register on the induction stovetop. on edit: must be tired, changed in case of point to a case in point.

askvictor 5y ago

I've used quite a few toasters in my years (including this one), but don't understand why, as the toaster gets older, it tends to burn toast. I've noticed this from both cheap, and not-so-cheap toasters. Any ideas what changes in a toaster over a few years of use to cause this? I've picked up these from hard rubbish a couple of times, but they did tend to burn the toast a bit; kind of wishing I had tried to re-furbish them, now knowing how the mechanism works.

IncRnd 5y ago
A toaster will often start to burn toast when the toaster isn't clean. When there are a lot of food particles at the bottom that detritus can increase the heat from the heating elements. So, the best way to avoid this is to clean the appliance.
- askvictor 5y ago
  That's what I have been starting to figure, but while I can clean the bottom tray easily enough, there tends to be a build up of 'stuck-on' detritus in amongst the elements and other places that aren't really possible to clean without taking the whole thing apart.

cassepipe 5y ago

Ok I guess now is the time and place to complain to whomever cares about toaster design. Why is it that the metal grid that holds the bread has its bars so wide apart ? I don't toast only industrial square bread, I happen to regularly toast good state of the art european bakery bread that have very different slice sizes. It is maddenig to have your slice slip trhough the metal bars and prevent the toaster from going up or having to go fishing for your slice with whatever tool you think fit for the job, in 2021. Is my use case that specific ? I have been looking for a toaster with a tight grid bread holder but could not find one so far. Please help.

myself248 5y ago
Same problem! I bake a lot of my own bread and often end up with odd-shaped lumps of loaf-ends which fall between the wires. Also I wish I could get a narrow-slot toaster. I never toast bagels, and I feel like a the ubiquitous wide-slot designs waste energy and take longer because there's so much unnecessary room for air to convection-cool the bread.
- bombcar 5y ago
  Get a commercial one https://www.webstaurantstore.com/search/toaster.html https://www.webstaurantstore.com/search/toaster.html But probably not worth the space.
  - myself248 5y ago
    Literally all of the pop-up style toasters there are wide-slot types. And the conveyor style are clearly out of the question since my stated goal is to use less energy. I'm not sure I understand your suggestion.
52-6F-62 5y ago
My partner and I were given one of these: https://www.dualit.com/products/classic-toasters https://www.dualit.com/products/classic-toasters They're dead simple, and work excellently. The bars you're mentioning are single, wide and flat, so they'd support thin slices well.

JoshGlazebrook 5y ago

Honestly, I searched for a great toaster after going through a few cheap ones and I always came back to this Japanese "steam" toaster. - https://us.balmuda.com/products/balmuda-the-toaster https://us.balmuda.com/products/balmuda-the-toaster $300 for a toaster seems insane, but it honestly is worth it. You fill the little 5cc "cup" with water and pour it in, and it uses steam to lock in moisture and then toast. Toast (and honestly everything else) comes out perfectly crisp all over and the inside stays moist.

late2part 5y ago
I have this and the Mitsubishi T0-ST-1T. Both are good. Neither are great. I miss my Breville, it seemed more consistently better than good.

ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago

That reminds me of this old bit of Internet humor, called "The Parable of the Toaster"[0]: Once upon a time, in a kingdom not far from here, a king summoned two of his advisors for a test. He showed them both a shiny metal box with two slots in the top, a control knob, and a lever. "What do you think this is?" One advisor, an Electrical Engineer, answered first. "It is a toaster," he said. The king asked, "How would you design an embedded computer for it?" The advisor: "Using a four-bit microcontroller, I would write a simple program that reads the darkness knob and quantifies its position to one of 16 shades of darkness, from snow white to coal black. The program would use that darkness level as the index to a 16-element table of initial timer values. Then it would turn on the heating elements and start the timer with the initial value selected from the table. At the end of the time delay, it would turn off the heat and pop up the toast. Come back next week, and I'll show you a working prototype." The second advisor, an IT consultant, immediately recognized the danger of such short-sighted thinking. He said, "Toasters don't just turn bread into toast, they are also used to warm frozen waffles. What you see before you is really a breakfast food cooker. As the subjects of your kingdom become more sophisticated, they will demand more capabilities. They will need a breakfast food cooker that can also cook sausage, fry bacon, and make scrambled eggs. A toaster that only makes toast will soon be obsolete. If we don't look to the future, we will have to completely redesign the toaster in just a few years." "With this in mind, we can formulate a more intelligent solution to the problem. First, create a class of breakfast foods. Specialize this class into subclasses: grains, pork, and poultry. The specialization process should be repeated with grains divided into toast, muffins, pancakes, and waffles; pork divided into sausage, links, and bacon; and poultry divided into scrambled eggs, hard-boiled eggs, poached eggs, fried eggs, and various omelette classes." "The ham and cheese omelette class is worth special attention because it must inherit characteristics from the pork, dairy, and poultry classes. Thus, we see that the problem cannot be properly solved without multiple inheritance. At run time, the program must create the proper object and send a message to the object that says, 'Cook yourself.' The semantics of this message depend, of course, on the kind of object, so they have a different meaning to a piece of toast than to scrambled eggs." "Reviewing the process so far, we see that the analysis phase has revealed that the primary requirement is to cook any kind of breakfast food. In the design phase, we have discovered some derived requirements. Specifically, we need an object-oriented language with multiple inheritance. Of course, users don't want the eggs to get cold while the bacon is frying, so concurrent processing is required, too." "We must not forget the user interface. The lever that lowers the food lacks versatility, and the darkness knob is confusing. Users won't buy the product unless it has a user-friendly, graphical interface. When the breakfast cooker is plugged in, users should see a cowboy boot on the screen. Users click on it, and the message 'Booting UNIX v.8.3' appears on the screen. (UNIX 8.3 should be out by the time the product gets to the market.) Users can pull down a menu and click on the foods they want to cook." "Having made the wise decision of specifying the software first in the design phase, all that remains is to pick an adequate hardware platform for the implementation phase. An Intel Pentium with 48MB of memory, a 1.2GB hard disk, and a SVGA monitor should be sufficient. If you select a multitasking, object oriented language that supports multiple inheritance and has a built-in GUI, writing the program will be a snap." The king wisely had the IT consultant beheaded, and they all lived happily ever after. [0] http://www.solipsys.co.uk/new/TheParableOfTheToaster.html http://www.solipsys.co.uk/new/TheParableOfTheToaster.html (Although I believe that it is even older than this)

lost-found 5y ago

Ehh main problem with this is different people like their toast toasted to different levels.

throwaway0a5e 5y ago
Add a knob that moves the strip closer/further from the heat source. There. Done.
- fabbari 5y ago
  I have one of this toasters, it has a little knob to adjust how dark the toast needs to be. I have also replaced the power cord.
- lost-found 5y ago
  You just described every other toaster out there.

dang 5y ago

Past related threads: The Classic Sunbeam Radiant Control Toaster (2006) - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23723112 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23723112 - July 2020 (47 comments) How to design a good toaster with lessons from the 1940s [video] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23363646 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23363646 - May 2020 (17 comments) An Antique Toaster That's Better Than Today’s [video] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21164014 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21164014 - Oct 2019 (232 comments) Also slightly related: Toaster Central: Antique and Vintage Toasters and Waffle Irons - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21432144 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21432144 - Nov 2019 (7 comments)

silisili 5y ago

Serious question - do most folks still own toasters today? They just seem so... specifically single function and take up counterspace. In my house, we have a sandwich press which we use for 4 or less pieces of toast at a time. And of course it doubles as a press for paninis or cubanos, too. And you never have to worry about unevenness, as it's just two hot plates basically. If cooking a lot of toast for a get together or really large meal, just throw them in the oven. I haven't owned a toaster as an adult, so I'm really curious how popular they are these days.

exhilaration 5y ago
Toaster oven FTW, it's probably our most used appliance. Get one with the convection setting and it'll beat any air fryer too [1]. [1] Wirecutter review: https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/best-air-fryer/ https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/best-air-fryer/
- silisili 5y ago
  See that I understand, very versatile choice. Would you day it works better than a fullsize convection oven, or about the same?
  - exhilaration 5y ago
    I didn't even know there were full size convection ovens! We've got the toaster oven and a gas oven, I would say they work about the same, it's just so much more efficient to use the electric toaster oven (assuming what you're trying to cook fits in there).
- Nition 5y ago
  Funnily enough, convection toaster ovens are rebranding their same old models as being air friers now. Because of course an air fryer is just a weirdly shaped convection toaster oven in the first place.
jmisavage 5y ago
I've had the same toaster for the better part of 15 years now I don't think its any weirder than owning a dedicated sandwich press. It's usually a set it and forget it kinda of item that doesn't take long to do its job.

hapless 5y ago

They bury the lede in the last fucking paragraph. The reason this toaster is immensely better than the toaster you have at home is very, very simple: this toaster's 1949 price would be hundreds of dollars in 2021 terms. You can still buy really, truly excellent toasters made for industrial/commercial use, or for the homes of the very rich, and they're quite a lot better than the trash people keep in their houses. And they cost a lot more, too. Last time I checked, a commercial 2-slice toaster was in the $300-$400 range. This is true for lots of home appliances. My favorite example is the Kitchenaid mixer. The modern mixers are very thoroughly "value engineered" to keep the price down. If you want to buy an original "Kitchenaid," like they made in the 1930s, you can call up Hobart and buy a miniature mixer. And it will cost you ~$2,000 in 2021, just as it did in 1935. You can have the good toaster, the good mixer, etc, but it sure looks like people don't actually want that. The pattern of product offerings in your average store suggests people want something affordable, and it doesn't particularly matter whether it is good at its job.

jonahx 5y ago
> and it doesn't particularly matter whether it is good at its job. I would amend that to: "it doesn't matter whether it excels at its job, as long as it's good enough." And those modern, cheap toasters are good enough.
throwawaylinux 5y ago
> They bury the lede in the last fucking paragraph. The reason this toaster is immensely better than the toaster you have at home is very, very simple: this toaster's 1949 price would be hundreds of dollars in 2021 terms. From the article it seemed that it's better because it has a radiant temperature sensor rather than a simple timer. Unless you're disputing that and saying it's good for some other reason that would cost a lot of money, a temperature sensor and little control system for it would not cost hundreds of dollars to make today. EDIT: The problem seems to be that regular consumer appliances seem to have raced to the bottom in the past 30 years or so. It's not that a significantly better toaster would cost hundreds of dollars more, it's that it would cost a few dollars more. The high end things that are 10x the price seem to be priced that way mostly because there is not a strong mid range market, or maybe they compete on gimmicks rather than basics. Because you don't need a $300 powder coated steel toaster with an a glass oven door and 5 cooking regimes including steaming that was mentioned in the article (https://us.balmuda.com/collections/toaster https://us.balmuda.com/collections/toaster) to get the functionality and robustness of their simple 1940s sunbeam toaster.

swayvil 5y ago

Poverty could be defined as an unavailability of high-quality resources. So if the quality of the available resources goes down, that's poverty?

stjohnswarts 5y ago

Also more likely to burn your house down :)

ddingus 5y ago

What I like most about devices like this is how robust the world is has a whole lot to do with how robust the device is. My Grandparents had a custom camp trailer made in '74. I have it now. Grannie lived the longest and knew I loved it. BTW, she went white water kayaking the year before she died. Lived well, no regrets. I got so much from her, but I digress... That trailer ran on propane gas. Still does, except for lighting. Originally, it had all gas lights too, but those are just a bit dangerous and I helped them replace those as a teen years ago. The rest runs on gas. Fridge, Stove, Range, Heater. Just this year, the heater decided it needed a new thermocouple. I'll get one, clean it up a little, and it will run just fine the same way it has for all those years. The fridge works on a simple chemical solution that boils up through restricted openings, and as the material trickles down, it works to carry heat out of the fridge. That fridge does have an AC option. We've only used it once, and it was to see whether it worked, and how well. Basically, it works and isn't any better than the little gas flame needed to make the fridge work. It will run a couple weeks on a few gallons of propane, has a freezer, and works well up to a little under 110 degrees F. (Yeah, rough year)' Over the years, I've picked up a few of these kinds of devices and I love them. Mixer, toaster, various old clocks, washer, dryer, weather instruments... And I've had some professional experience. Older industrial machines that rely on springs, relays, R/C circuits, bimetal elements, just work. The engineering on these is kind of a lost art in some ways. In others, we have such great material science these days! The same kind of approach might actually have serious merit. Repair can be a challenge, until one has worked on a few. The basic ideas are broadly applicable. Once those are in mind, and a person has some mastery, these devices are like an open book! Count me a fan. I like simple things that just do that which they are designed for. One downside can be overall efficiency. While that counts, I can see people just choosing to live a little smaller, leaner and that can largely balance out, or at the least not be terrible. That's basically what we do. Re: Smart home There are very compelling possibilities. But, I am just not up for the maintenance and or the work to really hit the upper level of what can be done, not to mention it's either expensive, or takes considerable time, understanding and skill to roll one's own. In my 30's I was wanting a lot of those things. However, as time has passed and I see the classics just work, and work, and work, and I don't see people struggling with them, odd states, modes, extras that get in the way, or one uses so seldom it's always a bigger time investment than the value derived. Less is more in my home and life. Professionally, that's not going to fly most of the time. And the use cases are different, returns different too. But, there is a whole lot to be said for robust gear for living. It's simple, life can be simple, with few surprises, all of which frees time and energy for doing other things. One last thing, and that's the idea of buying once and using for a long time, even handing the thing off to someone else to use. I like this and have employed it in my life. Saved a ton. Sure, these kinds of things are expensive, but one can chip away at things and before we know it, are pretty well equipped and it's gonna last. Worth it. Where one is inclined to fix things up, or buy used, seeking these kinds of devices, there are deals. Many people get caught up in things like "digital toasters", and that's fine. I'm happy to pick up the good stuff while it's an option.

ltbarcly3 5y ago

I absolutely hate low effort articles like this. Just restating the contents of a TikToc or in this case plagerizing a Youtube video (Technology Connections, aka Alec Watson) to generate content is lazy, even if you 'credit' the source you are stealing all your content from in some cursory way. Alec noticed something truley interesting and did many days of research and first hand investigation to build this content from scratch, this article just steals it outright and links to his YouTube video as though that makes it cool?

quokka 5y ago

Years ago I had one of these. It slowly stopped working and my wife got sick of it. Without any way to fix it I got rid of it, which I now regret. The toaster we have now browns unevenly and is wildly inconsistent from run to run.