3 ms·

I do agree with 1 and I believe the influence was subtle. I also believe it might have depended on a lot of factors. Maybe some tribes were not near any animal

I do agree with 1 and I believe the influence was subtle. I also believe it might have depended on a lot of factors. Maybe some tribes were not near any animal reservoir. Maybe some diseases were transmitted due to injuries while hunting or while butchering meat. And maybe in some cases, this lead to disadvantages during inter-tribe wars. Maybe a infected tribe lost a war, their men killed and the women raped, resulting in infection of the victorious tribe and once symptoms appeared, some spiritually inclined member of the tribe blamed it on punishment for the rapes. I think it's hard to say for sure what the influence was. Probably the meme of monogamy developed as a set of superstitions initially. I think STDs would have played a role in this early stage. According to (1) at least 3 diseases originate form animal reservoir. Once the meme of Judaism and its fork Christianity (which merges Greek values - ancient Greece and Rome were monogamous) was on the scene it was almost certainly the greatest factor in spreading the meme of monogamy. I think by the time of antiquity, STDs were no longer the main factor in spreading the meme of monogamy. Wikipedia has a nice list of historic or current communities where polygamy was the norm. I also find your speculation about the average duration of emotional love, plausible. I wholeheartedly agree with 2 with the small note that theoretically we could have had it easier. I am not sure I agree with 3. Overall medicine is a very recent development. I am not sure what are the circumstances that would have enabled us to develop science and medicine significantly earlier. Also, not sure if lack of monogamy would motivate research today but probably would to a statistically relevant degree. The relationship the public and the state have with scientific research is complicated and changes over time. There is certainly a claim that there is a link between the rise of dating apps and a rise of STDs. I do not know if there are actual studies to prove this. It may be just speculation and moral panic. Theoretically this uptick might lead to more funds being directed towards finding cures. Heteronormative monogamy definitely played a role in delaying research of treatments for HIV. (1) “Two or three of the major STIs [in humans] have come from animals. We know, for example, that gonorrhoea came from cattle to humans. Syphilis also came to humans from cattle or sheep many centuries ago, possibly sexually”. The most recent and deadliest STI to have crossed the barrier separating humans and animals has been HIV, which humans got from the simian version of the virus in chimpanzees. https://www.understandinganimalresearch.org.uk/news/staff-blog/sti-day/ https://www.understandinganimalresearch.org.uk/news/staff-bl...

throwaway_sjfgd 5y ago
> I am not sure I agree with 3. Overall medicine is a very recent development. I am not sure what are the circumstances that would have enabled us to develop science and medicine significantly earlier. I'm not suggesting that had monogamy not been there, science and medicine (for STD et al) would have developed earlier. What I am saying is that now that the means are there, monogamy and marriage have a 'legacy' element to it. That legacy is currently too deep into people's minds, culture and the law. > Also, not sure if lack of monogamy would motivate research today but probably would to a statistically relevant degree. Consider for minute that non-monogamy were to come to the world today suddenly like COVID did, leading to severe spread of STDs. (Note that this is not putting COVID and non-monogany on an equal front, it is putting the situation around them as equal.) My expectations would be that the needed medical developments for STD would also come by soon like the developments against COVID, though with the unwarranted transitory losses. If we are in agreement on that, we can consider a slower version where non-monogamy gains grounds over the next few decades. I think that will happen.

throwaway_sjfgd 5y ago

> I am not sure I agree with 3. Overall medicine is a very recent development. I am not sure what are the circumstances that would have enabled us to develop science and medicine significantly earlier. I'm not suggesting that had monogamy not been there, science and medicine (for STD et al) would have developed earlier. What I am saying is that now that the means are there, monogamy and marriage have a 'legacy' element to it. That legacy is currently too deep into people's minds, culture and the law. > Also, not sure if lack of monogamy would motivate research today but probably would to a statistically relevant degree. Consider for minute that non-monogamy were to come to the world today suddenly like COVID did, leading to severe spread of STDs. (Note that this is not putting COVID and non-monogany on an equal front, it is putting the situation around them as equal.) My expectations would be that the needed medical developments for STD would also come by soon like the developments against COVID, though with the unwarranted transitory losses. If we are in agreement on that, we can consider a slower version where non-monogamy gains grounds over the next few decades. I think that will happen.