19 ms·

Spiders are much smarter than you think

381 points by samizdis 5y ago

crocal 5y ago
The behaviour described in the article makes me think of a goal-oriented AI. It does not require a lot of complexity and can exhibit very advanced and quite surprising behaviour.
dd444fgdfg 5y ago
One of my favourite books is about how spiders evolve over a very long time to gain superior intelligence to humans, Children of Time, read it!
ravenstine 5y ago
As soon as I opened that article, I pressed CTRL+F and searched for "jumping spider". I knew it had to be about them! I'm not sure I would consider them "smart", but they are definitely exhibit an awareness of their surroundings that is not as obvious in other arachnids or arthropods. It's fun to watch them explore their terrain, stalk and catch prey much larger than they are, and of course jump relatively large distances like pros.
- Valmar 5y ago
  They're relatively smart in that they can quite intelligently navigate their environment to best get at prey that might otherwise kill them. Really, all animals are relatively smart (ignoring individual differences in a species), in that they have specific skills and abilities that allow them to be most effective for their biological makeup, and purpose in their respective ecosystems. We humans are no different in that regard ~ we are relatively smart, in that our biological makeups grant us leanings towards skills and abilities that other animals don't have.
- downut 5y ago
  In our house the rule is all fast and web spiders are removed. The jumping spiders and the big lazy floppy guys that hang on the ceiling are allies. They are non-aggressive and clearly eating something that shouldn't be in the house. My wife keeps walls of plants, it's basically a botanical greenhouse on the south side of the house. So a lively ecosystem. Here in AZ we get a fairly big jumping spider with a red on the top abdomen, we call 'em red butt spiders. No one harms the red butt spiders! If one is down at person level I like to gently interact with it. If you slowly move a finger near it, it will rotate and examine, and then scoot an inch away. Not too fearful. Usually a single one wins out, and will live with us until fall. A familiar housemate. We also get fairly big tarantulas, maybe 4" across the span. (Outside) They don't strike me as intelligent, not like jumping spiders. I always stop and scoot them off the road when I'm biking. I have seen a tarantula hawk hauling one much bigger than itself in my yard, off to its doom. Like you, on reading the title of the article, I thought, I bet it's about jumping spiders!
rob_c 5y ago
Cool I do wonder how much overlap there is between say nervous systems of insects and evolutionary far away species such as mammals. Spiders on drugs gives interesting results too, although when I was in school these were being used as part of a "drugs will destroy your life" message... (sun link I know, but worth a google): https://www.thesun.co.uk/tech/6818187/nasa-spider-webs-drugs-lsd-marijuana/ https://www.thesun.co.uk/tech/6818187/nasa-spider-webs-drugs...
dang 5y ago
Recent and related: Researchers are discovering surprising capabilities among a group of arachnids - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29066064 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29066064 - Nov 2021 (24 comments) Spiders are much smarter than you think - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29048443 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29048443 - Oct 2021 (1 comment)
jakear 5y ago
Not just spiders. I’ve a caterpillar solve puzzles I would have thought impossible via long running search with clear indications of evolving understanding of the environment and refinements to physical technique. I was hoping to keep it around to see if it’d remember me when it became a moth, but after being kept in captivity for a couple days it showed signs of depression and I let it return to the wild. I hope to some day create an interesting enough enclosure to keep them mentally occupied for a full development cycle. Shoutout to Ojo. Gone but not forgotten.
randomcarbloke 5y ago
Spiders play, give a tarantula a pingpong ball.
obiwan14 5y ago
Fact is, most other living things are much smarter than we give them credit for.
mewpmewp2 5y ago
What do we consider smarts? For example, with some examples there, like pretending to do a mating ritual for another group of spiders in order to lure the female out, this seems like it's something built in to their neural networks through thousands of years of evolution. It doesn't seem significantly smarter than the other group of species doing mating rituals themselves. They just have a neural network that reacts to certain input with this output that evolution created and honed through all this time of them being around such input and this output causing a better survival performance. I didn't see anything specific that could've indicated they could learn new things in new situations, so it seems like built in neural networks that come to them rather than them having special smarts to learn new things like humans have. > Although spiders can’t literally count one-two-three, the research suggests some jumping spiders have a sense of numbers roughly equivalent to that of 1-year-old humans. I wonder about conclusions like these. I don't know about 1-year-old humans, but it's understandable that they can measure strength levels depending on the amount of whatever they are observing and if situations change they should recalculate their new decision. I just don't think it's a sense of numbers, it would be more like some sort of amount of input (pheromones, image, whatever) that makes them pay attention that something has changed. And all in all it seems odd conclusion to compare sense of numbers based on that to 1-year-old humans. Trying to compare it to something, but the way they use those "skills" doesn't really make comparative sense.
- pjmlp 5y ago
  The issue is that we have millions of evolution for living beings, and even us in 2021 aren't the same that were running from Dinosaurs, so it is only natural that other species also enjoy some kind of intelligence, naturally they aren't writing books, however it is a scale from DNA programmed behaviours to some level of self conscience, ability to learn or even develop some kind of culture that is passed across generations. There is so much to learn from other species on our own planet.
  - mewpmewp2 5y ago
    While neural networks themselves are fantastic, are those species anything smarter than that? There's so much to learn from them yes, but I don't think based on this article that spiders would be "smarter than you think". I don't think they are necessary self-conscious in an intelligent way. I think all of this behaviour can be explained from evolution honing them to have some sort of biases and weights towards this input causing that output. And it's absolutely fascinating to learn to understand how they became to be the way they are. How environment affected, how all of it was stored in DNA so it can't be reproduced continuously and continuously. I think level of spider's intelligence doesn't differ that much from what Tesla FSD is for example. Tesla FSD needs quite a bit of honing still of course.
mensetmanusman 5y ago
This reminds me of the Canadian spider documentary: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sHzdsFiBbFc https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sHzdsFiBbFc
sgt101 5y ago
One of my school friends walked a different path from me and became a paramedic. He used to have to go to homes in "socioeconomically challenged areas" in order to revive people who had taken substances that they should not have taken - and also other things which were even less good. On one of these trips in a drug hell hole he saw a tank with a spider in it, and he realised that these people were likely mistreating it. So he asked if they wanted it and after a short conversation bought it off them for a nominal amount. So - he had a tarantula. I had never seen or met a thing like that and I was fascinated. It was very shy at first - it spent all day everyday hiding, possibly because of fear of drug addicts. But eventually it got a bit more confident. The thing was, it recognised and remembered individual humans. When it first met you or saw you it would hide. If you were calm and Kit (the paramedic) was calm with you it would come out and allow you to stroke it. This might take a few visits. But, once you had won it's confidence it would come right out and say hi as soon as you were in the room. I came to believe that it was self aware, and that it had a mental model that included social interactions and trust. It was just a belief, as it's really hard to see the anecdote and experience I have as data, but that's what interacting with it made me think. I thought it was as smart as a cat, or maybe even a dog.
- goldenkey 5y ago
  I've seen similar behavior from garden spiders that I've taken inside before winter. They are afraid at first but eventually warm up to me and let me pet them. Spiders are very cool creatures. An analog of human intelligence, as unique as octopi.
  - mkwarman 5y ago
    How do you care for a garden spider over winter? The yellow garden spider (argiope aurantia) is probably my favorite spider and I love when one takes up residence in my garden throughout the warmer months. I never considered caring for one when it gets too cold outside and then releasing it when it warms up.
    - goldenkey 5y ago
falsaberN1 5y ago
I was unpacking some computers we rented to a winery a few weeks ago, and all the boxes came with a different type of spider. My assistant is a young intern and just insisted on killing them (grave mistake, he got some sort of allergic reaction from that stupidity), while I just preferred to take them out the window and let them go (I don't want to hurt them but I don't want them to take residence inside our storage machines, cleaning the webbing is barely registrable as work, but I don't want them to get crushed with the fans or something. Guess I'm a softie at heart.) Anyway just that simple action shows you a lot about spiders. Some types just climbed on my hand and took the trip to the windowsill without any complaints, or they just somehow climbed off on their own with that parachute of theirs at the exact time I was intending to place them down. Others are more reluctant and they have to be running in a direction for them to climb. However, the most interesting of them was a jumping spider that was trying to make its home inside a crappy HP office computer. I had never seen a jumping spider in real life, and its behavior was really fascinating. It refused to climb on my hand until the very end, and would wander around, like checking out the place, in a way that looked more like a very weird lost puppy with too many legs, than a bug. After a couple tries it attempted to resist further attempts by putting a recognizable warning stance, so I instead tried to tap my finger on the table to make it run on the opposite direction. After a couple taps it must have realized my bluff and just stared at the finger, confident it won't get hit. In the end it kinda reluctantly climbed my hand and before I was even near the window, it just jumped off like greased lightning and landed exactly where I wanted to put it (not literally, but it did land on the windowsill neatly), paced around a bit scanning the environment, then parachuted down to the street. I always considered spiders relatively intelligent, specially compared to pests like the mosquito, whose only smarts seem to involve picking the worst time to show up, but otherwise behave like a crappy biological robot (the toy type not even the industrial type). But the way that jumping spider moved and behaved reminded me a lot more of how mammals and birds behave when put in an unknown place and being bothered by a human. I wonder if there's some relation to their eyesight. I wonder if that increases their awareness of what is what. Surely its brain has to be a bit more developed for visual processing, so perhaps that development has side effects in just making them smarter overall? I could be falling into the usual trapping of humanizing its behavior, but it really seemed like I was dealing with a very weird-looking mouse or bird than an arachnid. It surely gave the most resistance out of all the spiders I encountered, which just happily climbed my hand and took the train to exitville, but that little bugger seemed to be aware of all the standard bug-herding tricks. I even wonder if it only allowed me to take it near the window because it decided it was where it wanted to go after scanning the environment enough. It might not have known I was taking it towards the window, but it seemed to realize that whatever I was doing, I was giving it a vantage point to reach the window with a jump given the direction I tried to take it in previous attempts before it escaped, which perhaps indicates some degree of abstract thinking? I'm honestly fascinated about this, so if any of you is an entomologist or arachnid expert I'd like to know a more educated opinion. If I recall correctly jumping spiders are active hunters (as opposed to passive hunters like web spiders), so it'd make sense if they had some ability to think ahead and make basic plans. I don't recognize the specific species this spider was, but it was around the size of my thumb nail, light-ish brown with no particular markings and the first segment of its legs was much wider (around triple the width) than the rest. The boxes came from the northwestern region of Spain, somewhere in Galicia. I thought it was kinda cute even if its head looked like a weird tank turret.
dncornholio 5y ago
Jumping spiders are amazingly fun creatures! Even the smallest ones have personalities and most are curious. Very good eyes that see everything. They catch flies with blazing speed.
bamboozled 5y ago
Not spiders but crows in our area have cars open nuts for them by dropping them onto the busier roads and coming back every few hours to collect the goods.
swayvil 5y ago
Spiders can also get high on marijuana. It's true! They have the same thc-receptors in their brain as we do. It follows that they can get baked, enjoy an expanded consciousness and benefit from hallucinogenic insights just as we humans do. So get a spider high today.
- andai 5y ago
  Interesting... I reckon they need a much smaller dose than us though, wouldn't even a single puff lead to an uncomfortably intense trip?
- DonHopkins 5y ago
  Not only marijuana! Spiders on LSD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uvmt2hxRFs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uvmt2hxRFs
civilized 5y ago
But I already thought spiders were pretty smart. What is it now, they can do calculus too?
- DonHopkins 5y ago
  They're pretty good at web development.
yuuu 5y ago
If they're so smart, then why aren't _they_ smashing _me_?
deleted 5y ago
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smortaz 5y ago
they are! once i found a baby spider in the jacuzzi and just let it stay there out of laziness. it set up shop in one of the water jet holes. it gradually grew and started catching the real enemy, the mosquitoes. as a “thank you”, once every couple of days i’d catch a fly and feed it to him. i’d tap the electric fly swatter on the jacuzzi wall to drop the fly. this tapping sound quickly became sort of a pavlovian affair. as soon as i’d tap the fly swatter, he would rush out of the hole and grab its treat! here’s the video https://share.icloud.com/photos/0SkC9zuEe9JKh4t2M4DEz2A1w https://share.icloud.com/photos/0SkC9zuEe9JKh4t2M4DEz2A1w
- deleted 5y ago
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murat124 5y ago
Spiders are amazing. Of course you should stay away from some of them, like blackwidow, the brown recluse, or the brazilian wandering spider but for the most part, house spiders (unless you're in Australia), and jumping spiders are usually friendly. David Attenborough covered Portias in one of the documentaries: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDtlvZGmHYk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDtlvZGmHYk -- It's fascinating that they can strategize their attack.
b0rsuk 5y ago
Another example if incidental evolution: (European) jay has a yellow ring around its eye. This makes it easy to check where a jay is looking. So, unlike many other birds, jays pay attention to where you are looking. In an experiment, jays would snatch a treat if an assistant's eyes were looking elsewhere, but would leave it there if assistant's eyes were looking at the treat.
an9n 5y ago
> “Jumping spiders are remarkably clever animals,” says visual ecologist Nathan Morehouse, who studies the spiders at the University of Cincinnati. “I always find it delightful when something like a humble jumping spider punctures our sense of biological superiority.” I just find this notion bizarre, like we're all overblown ignoramuses strutting around thinking: 'I'm soooo much better than x pathetic creature!', and deserve to be taken down a peg or two. A really odd way to see things, most people I know are fascinated by nature.
- neuronic 5y ago
  As long as these spiders don't develop ICBMs I am sure a lot of people wont take thems seriously at all. It has always saddened me how many people just treat animals like lesser beings ready to be killed, tortured and controlled. Reading about animal cruelty makes me sick - we should be more like guardians than overlords. I suppose this will never sit well with a majority of people, especially if they have other things to worry about...
- EmilioMartinez 5y ago
  Agreed, and then there are titles like the article's with a similar over-assuming sentiment. I always read them like eg "Spiders are much smarter than the writer of this piece thought"
BrandoElFollito 5y ago
Spiders are often evil in cartoons so children usually do not like them. My children did not watch tv much but still were vary (sometimes afraid) of spiders. I had them look at them when they work, in forests or sometimes at home and told how useful they are. And suddenly they were happy when a spider lived in they room. They even managed to convert their friends and recently, some 10 years later, I witnessed how one of said friends noticed a spider on the ceiling and smiled. If the stereotypes of spiders change, so will their level of acceptance.
snshn 5y ago
I knew it!
hyperpallium2 5y ago
Spiders have a higher https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Encephalization_quotient https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Encephalization_quotient than humans. Brains are so important, some species babies have brains extending into their stomachs and even their legs. IMHO the big barrier for spider intelligence and technology is their solitary nature.
WalterBright 5y ago
I once had a huge spider problem. Spiders all over the deck, etc. Called an exterminator, and he laughed. He said you don't have a spider problem, you have an ant problem. The ants inhabited the wood interior of the deck, and the spiders were eating them. The ants completely hollowed out the deck, though they left the paint alone, so it looked fine. I was horrified that I could just push a screwdriver through it. It had to be completely replaced. When I sawed it off of the house, it collapsed into a heap of wood chips and sawdust. I didn't load the lumber into a truck, I shoveled it in. I'm amazed the deck never collapsed under my weight. My deck is now iron and concrete. No more spiders. I also had yellowjackets everywhere. In the house, around the house, everywhere. The exterminator told me the problem was the wood roof shingles, as yellowjackets liked to nest in them. Replaced the shingles with asphalt ones, no more yellowjackets. I tend to leave the spiders alone because they eat the other annoying insects.
Borrible 5y ago
And too often I think I'm much smarter then others. Or consider as smart what really is just wishful. https://mindmatters.ai/2020/08/in-what-ways-are-spiders-intelligent/ https://mindmatters.ai/2020/08/in-what-ways-are-spiders-inte...
wombatmobile 5y ago
It’s easy to be blind to the intelligence of animals that inhabit places we don’t go or think about. Then one day, as so many accounts here attest, we notice a spider or an animal cross our realm and see that we have things in common - the urge to protect and nurture our young; the drive for self preservation; the call of hunger or thirst. We do this not just with insects and animals, but also with other people. That ability to shut out the recognition of other people’s basic needs and feelings helps us to prioritise our own families welfare, and to get ahead personally. That’s all understandable and ok to an extent. Taken too far, we risk alienating ourselves from something richly rewarding and powerfully good - the fellowship of people, insects and animals we haven’t met yet.
fsloth 5y ago
Another qurious work describing non-vertebrate cognition was the recent document "My octopus teacher". As a person without deep experience of them and while octopus are known to be smart that document kind of rubs in your face what it means to have such level of talent when they live in their natural habitat instead of an aquarium pool performing party tricks.
- hermitcrab 5y ago
  If you enjoyed "My octopus teacher" you might also find this book interesting: "OTHER MINDS: The Octopus and the Evolution of Intelligent Life" Godfrey-Smith The last common ancestor between humans and octopus was a flatworm. So their intelligence has evolved comletely separately from ours in a totally different environment. So they are truly an alien intelligence, here on earth.
  - javajosh 5y ago
    Does anyone know what the theory is about octupuses being solitary? It seems like a strange place to end up for highly intelligent creatures. (Although, now that I think about it being smart and specializing in/in charge of your own private hunting ground doesn't really sound like such a bad way to live.)
    - Cybiote 5y ago
      Sociality is not the only (and probably not an initial) driver of the evolution of intelligence in animals. Ecological and particularly foraging competency in less predictable environments is another and likely more primary stimulator for intelligence. Coordinating complex movements is another one that appears to drive intelligence. Vulnerability in a hostile environment. Together with foraging and coordinating complex movement plans, it is hypothesized that predation pressure when combined with the loss of their shell drove cephalopod intelligence. Trading defense for agility and int would also have provided a competitive advantage when competing for prey.
    - hermitcrab 5y ago
      The book I reference above says that octopus intelligence is a bit of a paradox due to their short life span and lack of sociability. Pretty much all other intelligent animals are long lived and social.
totorovirus 5y ago
Reminds me of an observation that humans developed imagination(seeing that is unseen) from avoiding threats of snakes which were the most dangerous predator to early primates. It required sharp visual skills to distinguish snakes from its ambush, and also imagination (second vision) of snake's potential ambush.
- deleted 5y ago
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- wruza 5y ago
  I’ve also seen the video/gif of quickly changed pictures, where after viewing you’re asked to estimate the percentage of spiders and snakes in it. People tend to 50%+, overestimating by an order of magnitude. We are evolutionarily aware of these little fuckers and that trait didn’t come for free. ps. Can’t find it anywhere, sorry.
Klaster_1 5y ago
Talking about Portias, I recommend reading "Children of Time" by Adrian Tchaikovsky, it's about the process of uplifting spiders and how humans re-establish contacts with them. Another great book about smart "spiders" is "A Deepness in the Sky" by Vernor Vinge, my favorite in the "Zones of Thought" series.
- dkobia 5y ago
  One of my favorite books and highly recommend.
- fho 5y ago
  Somebody had to mention Children of Time. It's a really good book
- adamgordonbell 5y ago
  A Deepness in the Sky is so good. The spiders are all experienced through the radio, which makes them more relatable in a way.
- sylens 5y ago
  Children of Time is fantastic, a really unique take on sci-fi
  - peatmoss 5y ago
    I saw it as a really fantastic riff on David Brin’s “uplift” series. In fact, Tchaikovsky calls this out explicitly in naming one of the (IIRC) habitat orbiters Brin.
- shostack 5y ago
  One of my favorite sci-fi books of all time. What makes it so good is how the author manages to get you to see the world through the (many) eyes of the Portia spider, and evolve it they get uplifted. The use of ants is pure genius. The sequel, Children of Ruin, is likewise compelling, but lacks some of the finesse and mystique of the first book.
- animal531 5y ago
hermitcrab 5y ago
It is probably just as well that spiders don't work in groups. A colony of thousands of venomous spiders working together is a terrifying thought (cf the novel "Children of time").
- forgotmyoldname 5y ago
  Some spiders do.[1] They protect their own and viciously attack outsiders. People are terrified when they see a single massive huntsman spider--imagine 300 angry ones coming at you because you offended one of their friends. And related to the main topic, I've sat bored at work and watched a jumping spider prowl around the office. It was initial terrified of me, and would face directly towards my face and follow my head around to see what I was doing. When it eventually realized I wasn't a threat, it continued prowling. I watched it often stop, gauge a distance, and squat a few times trying to find the perfect angle and location from which it could successfully make a jump. Sometimes getting it perfect, and sometimes failing, pulling itself up by its web, and trying again. Learning through trial and error seems to definitely cross the bar of intelligent life for me. It also later directly approached me (after having earlier avoided me) and started crawling on my hands as I typed. Felt almost like meeting a thumbnail sized cat. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delena_cancerides https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delena_cancerides
  - fignews 5y ago
    Thumbnail sized cat indeed. They also chase laser pointers
- pvaldes 5y ago
  Meanwhile in Texas, Tetragnata guatemaltensis is having a lot of fun in the "burning fly's" international cross-stitch knitters meeting... https://texashillcountry.com/wp-content/uploads/nature-1-660x400.jpg https://texashillcountry.com/wp-content/uploads/nature-1-660...
meerita 5y ago
The portia genus are incredibly smart. I believe it is because its vision system, comparing to other spiders. Watch some videos on youtube and it chills how calculated the hunt is.
- jcims 5y ago
  They seem to be in a class entirely unto themselves. There is something about the way they move and observe the world that gives them an apparent intellect beyond any other 'bug' I've seen. I used to keep bees and they are amazing in both their individual and collective ability, but it's hard to interact with them. Portia and other in the Salticidae family are almost like little dogs or something. They watch you, seem to make eye contact even, and generally are tolerant of handling and attention. Really cool little critters. Predictably, the BBC and David Attenborough have some amazing videos about them: Hunting a spider - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDtlvZGmHYk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDtlvZGmHYk Hunting a mantid (you have to watch the end) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wKu13wmHog https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wKu13wmHog Crazy mating ritual - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_udvnFCl7s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_udvnFCl7s Another intense mating ritual - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQbScg3r1oQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQbScg3r1oQ They let you pet them - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPo8MG1pJ8w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPo8MG1pJ8w All of this with a brain of approximately 100,000 neurons.
  - drblah 5y ago
    Huh, interesting. That "Hunting of a spider" clip almost follows part of the intro sections in Children of Time 1-to-1. Feels like someone took 'inspiration' in someone else's homework. I wonder if it was BBC or Adrian Tchaikovsky who came first. Oh, well. It is a really cool clip nonetheless.
    - mellavora 5y ago
      hint: BBC
Indy9000 5y ago
This article and the magazine seems to be well designed and put together. Nice!
- samizdis 5y ago
  Well said. I have the sharp-eyed HN mods to thank for introducing me to Knowable Magazine: the link I posted was to the article as syndicated in The Atlantic [1]; I'd not spotted the credit at the bottom of the page (usually I'd change to that, as long as the original wasn't paywalled). I noticed about 10 mins after posting that the originating site in HN's list had changed from The Atlantic to Knowable, so I've been exploring its content, and like it. Thanks to whichever mod is responsible for swapping the link. Also, the credit in The Atlantic was merely a link to Knowable's home page (which seems odd, really), so kudos to HN for thoroughness. [1] https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2021/11/spiders-are-way-smarter-you-think/620634/ https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2021/11/spiders-...
perth 5y ago
Turns out being too lazy to clean up spider corpses after I killed them actually was like putting out heads on pikes as a warning to future spiders entering my home.
bryans 5y ago
A couple years ago I had an experience with a spider that entirely changed my perspective on them and most insects, and now I make a conscious effort to help them as much as possible, instead of kill or even repel them. This particular spider kept running back and forth between my monitor and a window, and when it'd get to my monitor, it would wave its front legs at me. If I moved to the left, it would run across to the left side of the monitor and waves it legs again. If I stood up and moved closer to it, it would run back to the window, turn around, and waves its legs at me. From watching YouTube too much, I was always under the impression that this was either a sign of aggression or a defensive stance. But after a few times of going back and forth like this, I realized there were approximately 50 baby spiders around a light by the window, which had been closed since the previous day. Normally this would be a nightmare for me (I've always had a fear of spiders), but after a while, I had this crazy notion that the spider was trying to get me to open the window. So I did, and it immediately ran to the babies, wrapped a single strand of silk around the old webbing, and started dragging swaths of the babies' webbing toward the window. I have no idea if the room was just dry and they needed some humidity, or if the food had been too scarce for too long. Whatever it was, that parent spider was in full blown panic mode, and managed to effectively communicate their problem to a human. I haven't killed any spiders or insects since (aside from a few particularly asshole-ish mosquitos), and actually keep small water dishes in my bathroom for two spiders who've now lived with me for nearly a year. If any babies hatch inside and get close to me, I use my phone's flash to guide them back to a corner with a light on -- they are seemingly always drawn to the brightest light source. Spiders are incredible creatures, and I deeply regret not realizing that sooner.
- 2ion 5y ago
  This is a bit more elaborate behaviour than what I have observed from our (small) spiders here, but as a general rule, I don't do anything to spiders in my apartment as well. They keep their territory clean of other insects and do not get into my way, so I like keeping them. Unless the spider is really large, aggressive or poisonous, I do not get why so many people are afraid of them either. Perhaps that the Australian Exception :)
  - 5y ago
dekken_ 5y ago
I have a rule, if they're too big, or in a bad position, they go outside, otherwise I leave them, I prefer spiders to mosquitoes
- prawn 5y ago
  I leave daddy-long legs in the house because they are no issue to humans (just leave unsightly webs) and can prey on spiders I'd rather not have around - red backs, huntsman, etc. Not sure if they eat white-tailed spiders too, but hopefully - we get a few of them. Anything roaming near the kids' bedrooms gets treated more harshly.
  - interfixus 5y ago
    Yes, I have noticed this too. Despite my best intentions and full knowledge that we have none here which can hurt me, I am still shit phobic about spiders. The daddy longlegs are a protected species in my household since I first realized their stunning efficiency as resident security corps.
    - hermitcrab 5y ago
      My wife was terrified of spiders. She want to a hypnotherapy session along with a arachnaphobic friend some years ago. She wasn't completely cured, but has been much better ever since (now calmly asks me to remove my "8 legged friend" instead of freaking out). I think the friend also became significantly less phobic.
  - koheripbal 5y ago
    I once had a basement full of cellar spiders and killed them all. Literally the next day the basement was FILLED with much more annoying more mobile spiders. One crawled into my water bottle and I didn't realize until I pulled off my tongue. Cellar spiders are now my best friends. I didn't realize until then, but you can actually pick them up by hand and they don't bite if you're gentle. I thought my kids not to be afraid of them and they handle them regularly. My wife is another matter and she has a very distinctive spider scream that I can hear from anywhere in the house.
tdrdt 5y ago
I get tired of reading from webpages like this. - Spiders are much smarter than you think - SUBSCRIBE TO OUR NEWSLETTER - some text - YOU MAY ALSO LIKE - some text - Shutterstock image with a big description - ... Context switching is hard for the brain. Even in readabilty mode I get substracted by the image descriptions. It's a pitty because it's a nice article.
- imiric 5y ago
  Agreed, but be grateful it doesn't have an obnoxious and hostile cookie consent form, or is full of ads mixed with the content. This is actually a relatively enjoyable website compared to similar ones in this category.
- peanut_worm 5y ago
  SEO has really ruined the internet
  - nolok 5y ago
    This is not about SEO, this newsletter and you may also like serve no purpose for this. It's user acquisition.
    - gverrilla 5y ago
      Advertising has really ruined the internet
      - alok-g 5y ago
        And many other things. It biases the consumers, which has futher repercussions on the economy.
    - toast0 5y ago
      SEO gets you in the door, the newsletter gets you coming back, and you may also like pays the bills. It's all related.
- 5y ago

381 points by samizdis 5y ago

The behaviour described in the article makes me think of a goal-oriented AI. It does not require a lot of complexity and can exhibit very advanced and quite surprising behaviour.

dd444fgdfg 5y ago

One of my favourite books is about how spiders evolve over a very long time to gain superior intelligence to humans, Children of Time, read it!

ravenstine 5y ago

As soon as I opened that article, I pressed CTRL+F and searched for "jumping spider". I knew it had to be about them! I'm not sure I would consider them "smart", but they are definitely exhibit an awareness of their surroundings that is not as obvious in other arachnids or arthropods. It's fun to watch them explore their terrain, stalk and catch prey much larger than they are, and of course jump relatively large distances like pros.

Valmar 5y ago
They're relatively smart in that they can quite intelligently navigate their environment to best get at prey that might otherwise kill them. Really, all animals are relatively smart (ignoring individual differences in a species), in that they have specific skills and abilities that allow them to be most effective for their biological makeup, and purpose in their respective ecosystems. We humans are no different in that regard ~ we are relatively smart, in that our biological makeups grant us leanings towards skills and abilities that other animals don't have.
downut 5y ago
In our house the rule is all fast and web spiders are removed. The jumping spiders and the big lazy floppy guys that hang on the ceiling are allies. They are non-aggressive and clearly eating something that shouldn't be in the house. My wife keeps walls of plants, it's basically a botanical greenhouse on the south side of the house. So a lively ecosystem. Here in AZ we get a fairly big jumping spider with a red on the top abdomen, we call 'em red butt spiders. No one harms the red butt spiders! If one is down at person level I like to gently interact with it. If you slowly move a finger near it, it will rotate and examine, and then scoot an inch away. Not too fearful. Usually a single one wins out, and will live with us until fall. A familiar housemate. We also get fairly big tarantulas, maybe 4" across the span. (Outside) They don't strike me as intelligent, not like jumping spiders. I always stop and scoot them off the road when I'm biking. I have seen a tarantula hawk hauling one much bigger than itself in my yard, off to its doom. Like you, on reading the title of the article, I thought, I bet it's about jumping spiders!

rob_c 5y ago

Cool I do wonder how much overlap there is between say nervous systems of insects and evolutionary far away species such as mammals. Spiders on drugs gives interesting results too, although when I was in school these were being used as part of a "drugs will destroy your life" message... (sun link I know, but worth a google): https://www.thesun.co.uk/tech/6818187/nasa-spider-webs-drugs-lsd-marijuana/ https://www.thesun.co.uk/tech/6818187/nasa-spider-webs-drugs...

dang 5y ago

Recent and related: Researchers are discovering surprising capabilities among a group of arachnids - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29066064 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29066064 - Nov 2021 (24 comments) Spiders are much smarter than you think - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29048443 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29048443 - Oct 2021 (1 comment)

jakear 5y ago

Not just spiders. I’ve a caterpillar solve puzzles I would have thought impossible via long running search with clear indications of evolving understanding of the environment and refinements to physical technique. I was hoping to keep it around to see if it’d remember me when it became a moth, but after being kept in captivity for a couple days it showed signs of depression and I let it return to the wild. I hope to some day create an interesting enough enclosure to keep them mentally occupied for a full development cycle. Shoutout to Ojo. Gone but not forgotten.

randomcarbloke 5y ago

Spiders play, give a tarantula a pingpong ball.

obiwan14 5y ago

Fact is, most other living things are much smarter than we give them credit for.

mewpmewp2 5y ago

What do we consider smarts? For example, with some examples there, like pretending to do a mating ritual for another group of spiders in order to lure the female out, this seems like it's something built in to their neural networks through thousands of years of evolution. It doesn't seem significantly smarter than the other group of species doing mating rituals themselves. They just have a neural network that reacts to certain input with this output that evolution created and honed through all this time of them being around such input and this output causing a better survival performance. I didn't see anything specific that could've indicated they could learn new things in new situations, so it seems like built in neural networks that come to them rather than them having special smarts to learn new things like humans have. > Although spiders can’t literally count one-two-three, the research suggests some jumping spiders have a sense of numbers roughly equivalent to that of 1-year-old humans. I wonder about conclusions like these. I don't know about 1-year-old humans, but it's understandable that they can measure strength levels depending on the amount of whatever they are observing and if situations change they should recalculate their new decision. I just don't think it's a sense of numbers, it would be more like some sort of amount of input (pheromones, image, whatever) that makes them pay attention that something has changed. And all in all it seems odd conclusion to compare sense of numbers based on that to 1-year-old humans. Trying to compare it to something, but the way they use those "skills" doesn't really make comparative sense.

pjmlp 5y ago
The issue is that we have millions of evolution for living beings, and even us in 2021 aren't the same that were running from Dinosaurs, so it is only natural that other species also enjoy some kind of intelligence, naturally they aren't writing books, however it is a scale from DNA programmed behaviours to some level of self conscience, ability to learn or even develop some kind of culture that is passed across generations. There is so much to learn from other species on our own planet.
- mewpmewp2 5y ago
  While neural networks themselves are fantastic, are those species anything smarter than that? There's so much to learn from them yes, but I don't think based on this article that spiders would be "smarter than you think". I don't think they are necessary self-conscious in an intelligent way. I think all of this behaviour can be explained from evolution honing them to have some sort of biases and weights towards this input causing that output. And it's absolutely fascinating to learn to understand how they became to be the way they are. How environment affected, how all of it was stored in DNA so it can't be reproduced continuously and continuously. I think level of spider's intelligence doesn't differ that much from what Tesla FSD is for example. Tesla FSD needs quite a bit of honing still of course.

mensetmanusman 5y ago

This reminds me of the Canadian spider documentary: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sHzdsFiBbFc https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sHzdsFiBbFc

sgt101 5y ago

One of my school friends walked a different path from me and became a paramedic. He used to have to go to homes in "socioeconomically challenged areas" in order to revive people who had taken substances that they should not have taken - and also other things which were even less good. On one of these trips in a drug hell hole he saw a tank with a spider in it, and he realised that these people were likely mistreating it. So he asked if they wanted it and after a short conversation bought it off them for a nominal amount. So - he had a tarantula. I had never seen or met a thing like that and I was fascinated. It was very shy at first - it spent all day everyday hiding, possibly because of fear of drug addicts. But eventually it got a bit more confident. The thing was, it recognised and remembered individual humans. When it first met you or saw you it would hide. If you were calm and Kit (the paramedic) was calm with you it would come out and allow you to stroke it. This might take a few visits. But, once you had won it's confidence it would come right out and say hi as soon as you were in the room. I came to believe that it was self aware, and that it had a mental model that included social interactions and trust. It was just a belief, as it's really hard to see the anecdote and experience I have as data, but that's what interacting with it made me think. I thought it was as smart as a cat, or maybe even a dog.

goldenkey 5y ago
I've seen similar behavior from garden spiders that I've taken inside before winter. They are afraid at first but eventually warm up to me and let me pet them. Spiders are very cool creatures. An analog of human intelligence, as unique as octopi.
- mkwarman 5y ago
  How do you care for a garden spider over winter? The yellow garden spider (argiope aurantia) is probably my favorite spider and I love when one takes up residence in my garden throughout the warmer months. I never considered caring for one when it gets too cold outside and then releasing it when it warms up.
  - goldenkey 5y ago

falsaberN1 5y ago

I was unpacking some computers we rented to a winery a few weeks ago, and all the boxes came with a different type of spider. My assistant is a young intern and just insisted on killing them (grave mistake, he got some sort of allergic reaction from that stupidity), while I just preferred to take them out the window and let them go (I don't want to hurt them but I don't want them to take residence inside our storage machines, cleaning the webbing is barely registrable as work, but I don't want them to get crushed with the fans or something. Guess I'm a softie at heart.) Anyway just that simple action shows you a lot about spiders. Some types just climbed on my hand and took the trip to the windowsill without any complaints, or they just somehow climbed off on their own with that parachute of theirs at the exact time I was intending to place them down. Others are more reluctant and they have to be running in a direction for them to climb. However, the most interesting of them was a jumping spider that was trying to make its home inside a crappy HP office computer. I had never seen a jumping spider in real life, and its behavior was really fascinating. It refused to climb on my hand until the very end, and would wander around, like checking out the place, in a way that looked more like a very weird lost puppy with too many legs, than a bug. After a couple tries it attempted to resist further attempts by putting a recognizable warning stance, so I instead tried to tap my finger on the table to make it run on the opposite direction. After a couple taps it must have realized my bluff and just stared at the finger, confident it won't get hit. In the end it kinda reluctantly climbed my hand and before I was even near the window, it just jumped off like greased lightning and landed exactly where I wanted to put it (not literally, but it did land on the windowsill neatly), paced around a bit scanning the environment, then parachuted down to the street. I always considered spiders relatively intelligent, specially compared to pests like the mosquito, whose only smarts seem to involve picking the worst time to show up, but otherwise behave like a crappy biological robot (the toy type not even the industrial type). But the way that jumping spider moved and behaved reminded me a lot more of how mammals and birds behave when put in an unknown place and being bothered by a human. I wonder if there's some relation to their eyesight. I wonder if that increases their awareness of what is what. Surely its brain has to be a bit more developed for visual processing, so perhaps that development has side effects in just making them smarter overall? I could be falling into the usual trapping of humanizing its behavior, but it really seemed like I was dealing with a very weird-looking mouse or bird than an arachnid. It surely gave the most resistance out of all the spiders I encountered, which just happily climbed my hand and took the train to exitville, but that little bugger seemed to be aware of all the standard bug-herding tricks. I even wonder if it only allowed me to take it near the window because it decided it was where it wanted to go after scanning the environment enough. It might not have known I was taking it towards the window, but it seemed to realize that whatever I was doing, I was giving it a vantage point to reach the window with a jump given the direction I tried to take it in previous attempts before it escaped, which perhaps indicates some degree of abstract thinking? I'm honestly fascinated about this, so if any of you is an entomologist or arachnid expert I'd like to know a more educated opinion. If I recall correctly jumping spiders are active hunters (as opposed to passive hunters like web spiders), so it'd make sense if they had some ability to think ahead and make basic plans. I don't recognize the specific species this spider was, but it was around the size of my thumb nail, light-ish brown with no particular markings and the first segment of its legs was much wider (around triple the width) than the rest. The boxes came from the northwestern region of Spain, somewhere in Galicia. I thought it was kinda cute even if its head looked like a weird tank turret.

dncornholio 5y ago

Jumping spiders are amazingly fun creatures! Even the smallest ones have personalities and most are curious. Very good eyes that see everything. They catch flies with blazing speed.

bamboozled 5y ago

Not spiders but crows in our area have cars open nuts for them by dropping them onto the busier roads and coming back every few hours to collect the goods.

swayvil 5y ago

Spiders can also get high on marijuana. It's true! They have the same thc-receptors in their brain as we do. It follows that they can get baked, enjoy an expanded consciousness and benefit from hallucinogenic insights just as we humans do. So get a spider high today.

andai 5y ago
Interesting... I reckon they need a much smaller dose than us though, wouldn't even a single puff lead to an uncomfortably intense trip?
DonHopkins 5y ago
Not only marijuana! Spiders on LSD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uvmt2hxRFs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uvmt2hxRFs

civilized 5y ago

But I already thought spiders were pretty smart. What is it now, they can do calculus too?

DonHopkins 5y ago
They're pretty good at web development.

yuuu 5y ago

If they're so smart, then why aren't _they_ smashing _me_?

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smortaz 5y ago

they are! once i found a baby spider in the jacuzzi and just let it stay there out of laziness. it set up shop in one of the water jet holes. it gradually grew and started catching the real enemy, the mosquitoes. as a “thank you”, once every couple of days i’d catch a fly and feed it to him. i’d tap the electric fly swatter on the jacuzzi wall to drop the fly. this tapping sound quickly became sort of a pavlovian affair. as soon as i’d tap the fly swatter, he would rush out of the hole and grab its treat! here’s the video https://share.icloud.com/photos/0SkC9zuEe9JKh4t2M4DEz2A1w https://share.icloud.com/photos/0SkC9zuEe9JKh4t2M4DEz2A1w

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murat124 5y ago

Spiders are amazing. Of course you should stay away from some of them, like blackwidow, the brown recluse, or the brazilian wandering spider but for the most part, house spiders (unless you're in Australia), and jumping spiders are usually friendly. David Attenborough covered Portias in one of the documentaries: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDtlvZGmHYk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDtlvZGmHYk -- It's fascinating that they can strategize their attack.

b0rsuk 5y ago

Another example if incidental evolution: (European) jay has a yellow ring around its eye. This makes it easy to check where a jay is looking. So, unlike many other birds, jays pay attention to where you are looking. In an experiment, jays would snatch a treat if an assistant's eyes were looking elsewhere, but would leave it there if assistant's eyes were looking at the treat.

an9n 5y ago

> “Jumping spiders are remarkably clever animals,” says visual ecologist Nathan Morehouse, who studies the spiders at the University of Cincinnati. “I always find it delightful when something like a humble jumping spider punctures our sense of biological superiority.” I just find this notion bizarre, like we're all overblown ignoramuses strutting around thinking: 'I'm soooo much better than x pathetic creature!', and deserve to be taken down a peg or two. A really odd way to see things, most people I know are fascinated by nature.

neuronic 5y ago
As long as these spiders don't develop ICBMs I am sure a lot of people wont take thems seriously at all. It has always saddened me how many people just treat animals like lesser beings ready to be killed, tortured and controlled. Reading about animal cruelty makes me sick - we should be more like guardians than overlords. I suppose this will never sit well with a majority of people, especially if they have other things to worry about...
EmilioMartinez 5y ago
Agreed, and then there are titles like the article's with a similar over-assuming sentiment. I always read them like eg "Spiders are much smarter than the writer of this piece thought"

BrandoElFollito 5y ago

Spiders are often evil in cartoons so children usually do not like them. My children did not watch tv much but still were vary (sometimes afraid) of spiders. I had them look at them when they work, in forests or sometimes at home and told how useful they are. And suddenly they were happy when a spider lived in they room. They even managed to convert their friends and recently, some 10 years later, I witnessed how one of said friends noticed a spider on the ceiling and smiled. If the stereotypes of spiders change, so will their level of acceptance.

snshn 5y ago

I knew it!

hyperpallium2 5y ago

Spiders have a higher https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Encephalization_quotient https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Encephalization_quotient than humans. Brains are so important, some species babies have brains extending into their stomachs and even their legs. IMHO the big barrier for spider intelligence and technology is their solitary nature.

WalterBright 5y ago

I once had a huge spider problem. Spiders all over the deck, etc. Called an exterminator, and he laughed. He said you don't have a spider problem, you have an ant problem. The ants inhabited the wood interior of the deck, and the spiders were eating them. The ants completely hollowed out the deck, though they left the paint alone, so it looked fine. I was horrified that I could just push a screwdriver through it. It had to be completely replaced. When I sawed it off of the house, it collapsed into a heap of wood chips and sawdust. I didn't load the lumber into a truck, I shoveled it in. I'm amazed the deck never collapsed under my weight. My deck is now iron and concrete. No more spiders. I also had yellowjackets everywhere. In the house, around the house, everywhere. The exterminator told me the problem was the wood roof shingles, as yellowjackets liked to nest in them. Replaced the shingles with asphalt ones, no more yellowjackets. I tend to leave the spiders alone because they eat the other annoying insects.

Borrible 5y ago

And too often I think I'm much smarter then others. Or consider as smart what really is just wishful. https://mindmatters.ai/2020/08/in-what-ways-are-spiders-intelligent/ https://mindmatters.ai/2020/08/in-what-ways-are-spiders-inte...

wombatmobile 5y ago

It’s easy to be blind to the intelligence of animals that inhabit places we don’t go or think about. Then one day, as so many accounts here attest, we notice a spider or an animal cross our realm and see that we have things in common - the urge to protect and nurture our young; the drive for self preservation; the call of hunger or thirst. We do this not just with insects and animals, but also with other people. That ability to shut out the recognition of other people’s basic needs and feelings helps us to prioritise our own families welfare, and to get ahead personally. That’s all understandable and ok to an extent. Taken too far, we risk alienating ourselves from something richly rewarding and powerfully good - the fellowship of people, insects and animals we haven’t met yet.

fsloth 5y ago

Another qurious work describing non-vertebrate cognition was the recent document "My octopus teacher". As a person without deep experience of them and while octopus are known to be smart that document kind of rubs in your face what it means to have such level of talent when they live in their natural habitat instead of an aquarium pool performing party tricks.

hermitcrab 5y ago
If you enjoyed "My octopus teacher" you might also find this book interesting: "OTHER MINDS: The Octopus and the Evolution of Intelligent Life" Godfrey-Smith The last common ancestor between humans and octopus was a flatworm. So their intelligence has evolved comletely separately from ours in a totally different environment. So they are truly an alien intelligence, here on earth.
- javajosh 5y ago
  Does anyone know what the theory is about octupuses being solitary? It seems like a strange place to end up for highly intelligent creatures. (Although, now that I think about it being smart and specializing in/in charge of your own private hunting ground doesn't really sound like such a bad way to live.)
  - Cybiote 5y ago
    Sociality is not the only (and probably not an initial) driver of the evolution of intelligence in animals. Ecological and particularly foraging competency in less predictable environments is another and likely more primary stimulator for intelligence. Coordinating complex movements is another one that appears to drive intelligence. Vulnerability in a hostile environment. Together with foraging and coordinating complex movement plans, it is hypothesized that predation pressure when combined with the loss of their shell drove cephalopod intelligence. Trading defense for agility and int would also have provided a competitive advantage when competing for prey.
  - hermitcrab 5y ago
    The book I reference above says that octopus intelligence is a bit of a paradox due to their short life span and lack of sociability. Pretty much all other intelligent animals are long lived and social.

totorovirus 5y ago

Reminds me of an observation that humans developed imagination(seeing that is unseen) from avoiding threats of snakes which were the most dangerous predator to early primates. It required sharp visual skills to distinguish snakes from its ambush, and also imagination (second vision) of snake's potential ambush.

deleted 5y ago
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wruza 5y ago
I’ve also seen the video/gif of quickly changed pictures, where after viewing you’re asked to estimate the percentage of spiders and snakes in it. People tend to 50%+, overestimating by an order of magnitude. We are evolutionarily aware of these little fuckers and that trait didn’t come for free. ps. Can’t find it anywhere, sorry.

Klaster_1 5y ago

Talking about Portias, I recommend reading "Children of Time" by Adrian Tchaikovsky, it's about the process of uplifting spiders and how humans re-establish contacts with them. Another great book about smart "spiders" is "A Deepness in the Sky" by Vernor Vinge, my favorite in the "Zones of Thought" series.

dkobia 5y ago
One of my favorite books and highly recommend.
fho 5y ago
Somebody had to mention Children of Time. It's a really good book
adamgordonbell 5y ago
A Deepness in the Sky is so good. The spiders are all experienced through the radio, which makes them more relatable in a way.
sylens 5y ago
Children of Time is fantastic, a really unique take on sci-fi
- peatmoss 5y ago
  I saw it as a really fantastic riff on David Brin’s “uplift” series. In fact, Tchaikovsky calls this out explicitly in naming one of the (IIRC) habitat orbiters Brin.
shostack 5y ago
One of my favorite sci-fi books of all time. What makes it so good is how the author manages to get you to see the world through the (many) eyes of the Portia spider, and evolve it they get uplifted. The use of ants is pure genius. The sequel, Children of Ruin, is likewise compelling, but lacks some of the finesse and mystique of the first book.
animal531 5y ago

hermitcrab 5y ago

It is probably just as well that spiders don't work in groups. A colony of thousands of venomous spiders working together is a terrifying thought (cf the novel "Children of time").

forgotmyoldname 5y ago
Some spiders do.[1] They protect their own and viciously attack outsiders. People are terrified when they see a single massive huntsman spider--imagine 300 angry ones coming at you because you offended one of their friends. And related to the main topic, I've sat bored at work and watched a jumping spider prowl around the office. It was initial terrified of me, and would face directly towards my face and follow my head around to see what I was doing. When it eventually realized I wasn't a threat, it continued prowling. I watched it often stop, gauge a distance, and squat a few times trying to find the perfect angle and location from which it could successfully make a jump. Sometimes getting it perfect, and sometimes failing, pulling itself up by its web, and trying again. Learning through trial and error seems to definitely cross the bar of intelligent life for me. It also later directly approached me (after having earlier avoided me) and started crawling on my hands as I typed. Felt almost like meeting a thumbnail sized cat. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delena_cancerides https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delena_cancerides
- fignews 5y ago
  Thumbnail sized cat indeed. They also chase laser pointers
pvaldes 5y ago
Meanwhile in Texas, Tetragnata guatemaltensis is having a lot of fun in the "burning fly's" international cross-stitch knitters meeting... https://texashillcountry.com/wp-content/uploads/nature-1-660x400.jpg https://texashillcountry.com/wp-content/uploads/nature-1-660...

meerita 5y ago

The portia genus are incredibly smart. I believe it is because its vision system, comparing to other spiders. Watch some videos on youtube and it chills how calculated the hunt is.

jcims 5y ago
They seem to be in a class entirely unto themselves. There is something about the way they move and observe the world that gives them an apparent intellect beyond any other 'bug' I've seen. I used to keep bees and they are amazing in both their individual and collective ability, but it's hard to interact with them. Portia and other in the Salticidae family are almost like little dogs or something. They watch you, seem to make eye contact even, and generally are tolerant of handling and attention. Really cool little critters. Predictably, the BBC and David Attenborough have some amazing videos about them: Hunting a spider - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDtlvZGmHYk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDtlvZGmHYk Hunting a mantid (you have to watch the end) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wKu13wmHog https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wKu13wmHog Crazy mating ritual - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_udvnFCl7s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_udvnFCl7s Another intense mating ritual - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQbScg3r1oQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQbScg3r1oQ They let you pet them - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPo8MG1pJ8w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPo8MG1pJ8w All of this with a brain of approximately 100,000 neurons.
- drblah 5y ago
  Huh, interesting. That "Hunting of a spider" clip almost follows part of the intro sections in Children of Time 1-to-1. Feels like someone took 'inspiration' in someone else's homework. I wonder if it was BBC or Adrian Tchaikovsky who came first. Oh, well. It is a really cool clip nonetheless.
  - mellavora 5y ago
    hint: BBC

Indy9000 5y ago

This article and the magazine seems to be well designed and put together. Nice!

samizdis 5y ago
Well said. I have the sharp-eyed HN mods to thank for introducing me to Knowable Magazine: the link I posted was to the article as syndicated in The Atlantic [1]; I'd not spotted the credit at the bottom of the page (usually I'd change to that, as long as the original wasn't paywalled). I noticed about 10 mins after posting that the originating site in HN's list had changed from The Atlantic to Knowable, so I've been exploring its content, and like it. Thanks to whichever mod is responsible for swapping the link. Also, the credit in The Atlantic was merely a link to Knowable's home page (which seems odd, really), so kudos to HN for thoroughness. [1] https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2021/11/spiders-are-way-smarter-you-think/620634/ https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2021/11/spiders-...

perth 5y ago

Turns out being too lazy to clean up spider corpses after I killed them actually was like putting out heads on pikes as a warning to future spiders entering my home.

bryans 5y ago

A couple years ago I had an experience with a spider that entirely changed my perspective on them and most insects, and now I make a conscious effort to help them as much as possible, instead of kill or even repel them. This particular spider kept running back and forth between my monitor and a window, and when it'd get to my monitor, it would wave its front legs at me. If I moved to the left, it would run across to the left side of the monitor and waves it legs again. If I stood up and moved closer to it, it would run back to the window, turn around, and waves its legs at me. From watching YouTube too much, I was always under the impression that this was either a sign of aggression or a defensive stance. But after a few times of going back and forth like this, I realized there were approximately 50 baby spiders around a light by the window, which had been closed since the previous day. Normally this would be a nightmare for me (I've always had a fear of spiders), but after a while, I had this crazy notion that the spider was trying to get me to open the window. So I did, and it immediately ran to the babies, wrapped a single strand of silk around the old webbing, and started dragging swaths of the babies' webbing toward the window. I have no idea if the room was just dry and they needed some humidity, or if the food had been too scarce for too long. Whatever it was, that parent spider was in full blown panic mode, and managed to effectively communicate their problem to a human. I haven't killed any spiders or insects since (aside from a few particularly asshole-ish mosquitos), and actually keep small water dishes in my bathroom for two spiders who've now lived with me for nearly a year. If any babies hatch inside and get close to me, I use my phone's flash to guide them back to a corner with a light on -- they are seemingly always drawn to the brightest light source. Spiders are incredible creatures, and I deeply regret not realizing that sooner.

2ion 5y ago
This is a bit more elaborate behaviour than what I have observed from our (small) spiders here, but as a general rule, I don't do anything to spiders in my apartment as well. They keep their territory clean of other insects and do not get into my way, so I like keeping them. Unless the spider is really large, aggressive or poisonous, I do not get why so many people are afraid of them either. Perhaps that the Australian Exception :)
- 5y ago

dekken_ 5y ago

I have a rule, if they're too big, or in a bad position, they go outside, otherwise I leave them, I prefer spiders to mosquitoes

prawn 5y ago
I leave daddy-long legs in the house because they are no issue to humans (just leave unsightly webs) and can prey on spiders I'd rather not have around - red backs, huntsman, etc. Not sure if they eat white-tailed spiders too, but hopefully - we get a few of them. Anything roaming near the kids' bedrooms gets treated more harshly.
- interfixus 5y ago
  Yes, I have noticed this too. Despite my best intentions and full knowledge that we have none here which can hurt me, I am still shit phobic about spiders. The daddy longlegs are a protected species in my household since I first realized their stunning efficiency as resident security corps.
  - hermitcrab 5y ago
    My wife was terrified of spiders. She want to a hypnotherapy session along with a arachnaphobic friend some years ago. She wasn't completely cured, but has been much better ever since (now calmly asks me to remove my "8 legged friend" instead of freaking out). I think the friend also became significantly less phobic.
- koheripbal 5y ago
  I once had a basement full of cellar spiders and killed them all. Literally the next day the basement was FILLED with much more annoying more mobile spiders. One crawled into my water bottle and I didn't realize until I pulled off my tongue. Cellar spiders are now my best friends. I didn't realize until then, but you can actually pick them up by hand and they don't bite if you're gentle. I thought my kids not to be afraid of them and they handle them regularly. My wife is another matter and she has a very distinctive spider scream that I can hear from anywhere in the house.

tdrdt 5y ago

I get tired of reading from webpages like this. - Spiders are much smarter than you think - SUBSCRIBE TO OUR NEWSLETTER - some text - YOU MAY ALSO LIKE - some text - Shutterstock image with a big description - ... Context switching is hard for the brain. Even in readabilty mode I get substracted by the image descriptions. It's a pitty because it's a nice article.

imiric 5y ago
Agreed, but be grateful it doesn't have an obnoxious and hostile cookie consent form, or is full of ads mixed with the content. This is actually a relatively enjoyable website compared to similar ones in this category.
peanut_worm 5y ago
SEO has really ruined the internet
- nolok 5y ago
  This is not about SEO, this newsletter and you may also like serve no purpose for this. It's user acquisition.
  - gverrilla 5y ago
    Advertising has really ruined the internet
    - alok-g 5y ago
      And many other things. It biases the consumers, which has futher repercussions on the economy.
  - toast0 5y ago
    SEO gets you in the door, the newsletter gets you coming back, and you may also like pays the bills. It's all related.
5y ago