6 ms·

The Metaverse Is Bullshit

90 points by freediver 5y ago

spicybright 5y ago
Wouldn't even call it a worse internet, it's just a bunch of their own servers you'll be forced to use through the internet.
HahaReally 5y ago
This is getting closer to the interior truth: most of these “visionaries” are rich morons who hit it lucky.
29athrowaway 5y ago
Most people do not have time to be in a VR world.
- spicybright 5y ago
  If VR tech replaces game consoles and TV I can see it happening. We already have dedicated TV rooms in most of our houses (at least in the US) It just depends if VR can step into that market or not.
  - echelon 5y ago
    It's at least half a decade from that. VR is great, but it's going to remain niche until the tech improves on the tracking, motion sickness, and resolution dimensions and becomes affordable for the long tail. There's also the issue of broad appeal. VR will remain a furry / anime / vtuber thing for awhile. Casual audiences aren't going to fit in. AR is bullshit beyond Snap and Instagram lenses. Nobody is going to wear that full time outside of an industrial application.
    - iamstupidsimple 5y ago
      Motion sickness and tracking are solved problems. The biggest barrier is content (value prop right now is still not huge) and hardware comfort.
      - jay_kyburz 5y ago
        I'll believe it when I see it. People get motion sick in a car or on a boat. Its not a software problem. If your are attempting to build your VR experiences without moving the camera through the world then you'll be extremely hamstrung. I really enjoyed Alyx, but building a simulation of this world that you can't actually walk around is just weird. VR "looks" cool, but you can't do anything in it that you can't do just as easily using a traditional screen.
      - mechanical_bear 5y ago
        Motion sickness is not a solved problem. My wife and I both tried fairly recent headsets, both terribly motion sick.
        charcircuit 5y ago
        It's not solved in consumer headsets, but the technology does exist.
    - amelius 5y ago
      By the way, do these AR goggles solve the problem of focus distance? (i.e. the eyes needs to focus onto an object if it is nearby, and shouldn't always focus on infinity)
    - jay_kyburz 5y ago
      Half a decade, try half a century. There is no way that it will become a mainstream activity until vr headsets are as comfortable as a pair of reading glasses. There also needs to be a major cultural shift. VR forces you to turn off your loved ones. You can't see or hear them at all. Whats more, VR will only every occupy the space that gaming does now because it's an "active" activity that requires you to do something. It will never replace TV which allows you to turn off the decision making part of your brain.
      - charcircuit 5y ago
        >VR forces you to turn off your loved ones. You can't see or hear them at all. Not everyone has loved ones and not everyone's loved ones are physically near them.
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
      - klyrs 5y ago
        > VR forces you to turn off your loved ones. You can't see or hear them at all. But if they're in the same room, you can punch 'em in the face...
        sharemywin 5y ago
        That made me laugh. I just pictured some kid in a VR headset punching is mom in the face. oops...sorry mom.....
        klyrs 5y ago
        Only, that's literally what happened. Thankfully, he's only 5, so it didn't actually hurt.
      - spicybright 5y ago
        Computer gaming shuts you off from your loved ones too. Most wear thick headphones. VR has always been very social for my friends an I as we mirror the display to the tv so people can see. And the headset we use doesn't cover your ears so you can still talk. Plus, vrchat and the likes feels much more intimate than any video game I've played. Many in my circle live too far to meet up IRL.
    - raxxorrax 5y ago
      I think the tracking is extremely precise by now. Using a browser is actually viable even with low res headsets (tested rift S). While the low res is a constraint, turning your head quickly adjusts the viewport, so that your "virtual" resolution is quite good.
- charcircuit 5y ago
  Anyone can make time for VR.
dorianmariefr 5y ago
Duplicate, made a the front page for a while when it was published https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29045930 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29045930
cynusx 5y ago
In my humble opinion, the immersive version of the internet requires an enabling technology first which would be something akin to a direct neural link or a nerve-link to our central nerve system. Only if it's perceived on the level of a separate arm can it really become intuitive. We're definitely several decades out on that type of human-computer interaction.
- collaborative 5y ago
  I certainly cannot use a vr set longer than 10 minutes or I feel like vomiting
lowbloodsugar 5y ago
The "metaverse" is a play to create a single 3D map that they (Facebook, somebody) own, so that they can sell real estate in the enforced public spaces. The ideal environment would be one where I can create my own "town square" and put the things I want there, including my friends "buildings". In Facebooks version, we won't be allowed to do this, because then they wouldn't be able to sell the real estate.
mettamage 5y ago
I wonder if they'd also make their own crypto for this metaverse.
- akacia 5y ago
  Is it possible to make something without a crypto?
- aahortwwy 5y ago
  They already have. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diem_(digital_currency) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diem_(digital_currency)
gigatexal 5y ago
Of course it is if Zuckerberg is going to be shaping the vision.
guidedlight 5y ago
I think where the Metaverse make the most sense, is to help people suffering from degenerative conditions such as dementia or paralysis, to participate in a virtual model of society. Other than that The Metaverse seems like a novelty, not the future of the Internet.
okareaman 5y ago
> Zuckerberg calls the metaverse "an embodied internet where you're in the experience, not just looking at it." A lot of the criticism is valid but it seems to me that many critics haven't experienced "embodiment". To me, that is the killer feature. Without it, the author is right, we already have the internet. I have a Oculus Quest that I don't use because there is not enough of that sense of embodiment. When the field of vision is extended to the periphery and the resolution is enough to not have the screen door effect, it will be much more likely to feel embodied. It's kind of mind blowing actually and the source of much of the quasi-religious fervor when some talk about VR.
- larsiusprime 5y ago
  I've experienced full "embodiment" with top end room-scale equipment. It's pretty cool, but it's nothing life changing, and certainly doesn't deserve the hype that is thankfully now starting to die down. I largely agree with the author.
  - westoncb 5y ago
    What did you do while embodied? It seems dismissive to say it was tried and wasn't a big deal when it's such a vast heterogenous space of possibilities that getting a set of examples indicating upper bounds on available experiences would be highly non-trivial, esp. because it's so dependent on software, which we're still just beginning to explore. And even in our early exploration there's already huge variety, from e.g. spatial CAD to novel social formats to new physical/coordination skill based games, virtual theaters, educational tools etc. There is a wide range in how much being embodied is going to matter depending what you're doing in software. I think for an artist virtually sculpting 3d works it's not a stretch to say this could be life-changing, for example.
    - lovecg 5y ago
      I was just thinking that experiencing live spectator sports in VR will be a big deal when the camera technology catches up. Imagine being _on_ the field with the players!
annadane 5y ago
Zuckerberg has always proven himself to be jealous and to go on the warpath with anyone who disagrees with him, you can see that in Instagram and Whatsapp - whether the metaverse is a good idea or not I absolutely don't want he or Facebook a part of it
29athrowaway 5y ago
The metaverse is about filling your surroundings with ads. Everywhere you look will be full of ads.

90 points by freediver 5y ago

Wouldn't even call it a worse internet, it's just a bunch of their own servers you'll be forced to use through the internet.

HahaReally 5y ago

This is getting closer to the interior truth: most of these “visionaries” are rich morons who hit it lucky.

29athrowaway 5y ago

Most people do not have time to be in a VR world.

spicybright 5y ago
If VR tech replaces game consoles and TV I can see it happening. We already have dedicated TV rooms in most of our houses (at least in the US) It just depends if VR can step into that market or not.
- echelon 5y ago
  It's at least half a decade from that. VR is great, but it's going to remain niche until the tech improves on the tracking, motion sickness, and resolution dimensions and becomes affordable for the long tail. There's also the issue of broad appeal. VR will remain a furry / anime / vtuber thing for awhile. Casual audiences aren't going to fit in. AR is bullshit beyond Snap and Instagram lenses. Nobody is going to wear that full time outside of an industrial application.
  - iamstupidsimple 5y ago
    Motion sickness and tracking are solved problems. The biggest barrier is content (value prop right now is still not huge) and hardware comfort.
    - jay_kyburz 5y ago
      I'll believe it when I see it. People get motion sick in a car or on a boat. Its not a software problem. If your are attempting to build your VR experiences without moving the camera through the world then you'll be extremely hamstrung. I really enjoyed Alyx, but building a simulation of this world that you can't actually walk around is just weird. VR "looks" cool, but you can't do anything in it that you can't do just as easily using a traditional screen.
    - mechanical_bear 5y ago
      Motion sickness is not a solved problem. My wife and I both tried fairly recent headsets, both terribly motion sick.
      - charcircuit 5y ago
        It's not solved in consumer headsets, but the technology does exist.
  - amelius 5y ago
    By the way, do these AR goggles solve the problem of focus distance? (i.e. the eyes needs to focus onto an object if it is nearby, and shouldn't always focus on infinity)
  - jay_kyburz 5y ago
    Half a decade, try half a century. There is no way that it will become a mainstream activity until vr headsets are as comfortable as a pair of reading glasses. There also needs to be a major cultural shift. VR forces you to turn off your loved ones. You can't see or hear them at all. Whats more, VR will only every occupy the space that gaming does now because it's an "active" activity that requires you to do something. It will never replace TV which allows you to turn off the decision making part of your brain.
    - charcircuit 5y ago
      >VR forces you to turn off your loved ones. You can't see or hear them at all. Not everyone has loved ones and not everyone's loved ones are physically near them.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - klyrs 5y ago
      > VR forces you to turn off your loved ones. You can't see or hear them at all. But if they're in the same room, you can punch 'em in the face...
      - sharemywin 5y ago
        That made me laugh. I just pictured some kid in a VR headset punching is mom in the face. oops...sorry mom.....
        klyrs 5y ago
        Only, that's literally what happened. Thankfully, he's only 5, so it didn't actually hurt.
    - spicybright 5y ago
      Computer gaming shuts you off from your loved ones too. Most wear thick headphones. VR has always been very social for my friends an I as we mirror the display to the tv so people can see. And the headset we use doesn't cover your ears so you can still talk. Plus, vrchat and the likes feels much more intimate than any video game I've played. Many in my circle live too far to meet up IRL.
  - raxxorrax 5y ago
    I think the tracking is extremely precise by now. Using a browser is actually viable even with low res headsets (tested rift S). While the low res is a constraint, turning your head quickly adjusts the viewport, so that your "virtual" resolution is quite good.
charcircuit 5y ago
Anyone can make time for VR.

dorianmariefr 5y ago

Duplicate, made a the front page for a while when it was published https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29045930 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29045930

cynusx 5y ago

In my humble opinion, the immersive version of the internet requires an enabling technology first which would be something akin to a direct neural link or a nerve-link to our central nerve system. Only if it's perceived on the level of a separate arm can it really become intuitive. We're definitely several decades out on that type of human-computer interaction.

collaborative 5y ago
I certainly cannot use a vr set longer than 10 minutes or I feel like vomiting

lowbloodsugar 5y ago

The "metaverse" is a play to create a single 3D map that they (Facebook, somebody) own, so that they can sell real estate in the enforced public spaces. The ideal environment would be one where I can create my own "town square" and put the things I want there, including my friends "buildings". In Facebooks version, we won't be allowed to do this, because then they wouldn't be able to sell the real estate.

mettamage 5y ago

I wonder if they'd also make their own crypto for this metaverse.

akacia 5y ago
Is it possible to make something without a crypto?
aahortwwy 5y ago
They already have. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diem_(digital_currency) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diem_(digital_currency)

gigatexal 5y ago

Of course it is if Zuckerberg is going to be shaping the vision.

guidedlight 5y ago

I think where the Metaverse make the most sense, is to help people suffering from degenerative conditions such as dementia or paralysis, to participate in a virtual model of society. Other than that The Metaverse seems like a novelty, not the future of the Internet.

okareaman 5y ago

> Zuckerberg calls the metaverse "an embodied internet where you're in the experience, not just looking at it." A lot of the criticism is valid but it seems to me that many critics haven't experienced "embodiment". To me, that is the killer feature. Without it, the author is right, we already have the internet. I have a Oculus Quest that I don't use because there is not enough of that sense of embodiment. When the field of vision is extended to the periphery and the resolution is enough to not have the screen door effect, it will be much more likely to feel embodied. It's kind of mind blowing actually and the source of much of the quasi-religious fervor when some talk about VR.

larsiusprime 5y ago
I've experienced full "embodiment" with top end room-scale equipment. It's pretty cool, but it's nothing life changing, and certainly doesn't deserve the hype that is thankfully now starting to die down. I largely agree with the author.
- westoncb 5y ago
  What did you do while embodied? It seems dismissive to say it was tried and wasn't a big deal when it's such a vast heterogenous space of possibilities that getting a set of examples indicating upper bounds on available experiences would be highly non-trivial, esp. because it's so dependent on software, which we're still just beginning to explore. And even in our early exploration there's already huge variety, from e.g. spatial CAD to novel social formats to new physical/coordination skill based games, virtual theaters, educational tools etc. There is a wide range in how much being embodied is going to matter depending what you're doing in software. I think for an artist virtually sculpting 3d works it's not a stretch to say this could be life-changing, for example.
  - lovecg 5y ago
    I was just thinking that experiencing live spectator sports in VR will be a big deal when the camera technology catches up. Imagine being _on_ the field with the players!

annadane 5y ago

Zuckerberg has always proven himself to be jealous and to go on the warpath with anyone who disagrees with him, you can see that in Instagram and Whatsapp - whether the metaverse is a good idea or not I absolutely don't want he or Facebook a part of it

29athrowaway 5y ago

The metaverse is about filling your surroundings with ads. Everywhere you look will be full of ads.