5 ms·

Plea: Help us get home from Afghanistan

51 points by tomohawk 5y ago

clarkevans 5y ago
Why is it that competence is so hard? This disaster was discussed in news media well over a year out, and yet, it happened anyway.
- cutemonster 5y ago
  Trump and Biden did what they thought would make them more popular politically. What do they care about that resulting in a disaster ... for poor people far away who don't get to vote in the US
- throwaway6734 5y ago
  What competence? The US surrendered to the Taliban (intentionally leaving the Afghani govt out of negotiations) in the March of 2020 with a planned pull out date of the next year and the release of 5,000 Taliban prisoners (including the current leader). Right after these negotiations were signed the Taliban broke the deals of agreement, continued to increase hostilities, and gained ground in the rural regions of Afghanistan all throughout 2020 and 2021. All the while, the visa/refugee process was hamstrung so claims were not processed.
- pigbearpig 5y ago
  I can't imagine it's that easy to coordinate travel from Afghanistan right now, even for the state dept.
slackfan 5y ago
But the news told me the only people remaining in Afghanistan are those that wanted to stay!
WithinReason 5y ago
October 15, 2021 The Honorable Joseph R. Biden President of the United States of America 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. N.W. Washington, DC 20500 Dear President Biden, I am pleading with you again as a fellow proud American and as a husband to help my wife and I get home from Afghanistan. We were just as surprised as you when this country fell to Taliban control so quickly, and we could not get to HKIA before attempts at evacuation became life threatening. Since then, we have waited patiently for assistance from the Department of State as directed, to no avail. In the past two weeks, DOS (points of contact below) purportedly manifested us for three flights. After we risked our lives getting through Taliban checkpoints, the 4 October flight was cancelled because passengers did not have visas for UAE, where the flight was to land. Another flight departed 11 October but we never got a call to go to the airport. The third scheduled for 13 October was apparently cancelled. We learned details of the latter flights from our Congressman, the Hon. Darrell Issa, who flew to Doha to meet us, and not from the DOS. These are not the only attempts we've made through DOS since August. We understood early on that one issue was my wife's immigration status — she has been waiting for her green card interview since 2019. We understand that we will have to continue the process in a third country before we can come home, and have completed all the E-visa requirements as directed by DOS. We simply do not understand why we were not called for the flight on Monday, and the DOS cannot explain it to us or to Congressman Issa. The information we are receiving from DOS is not consistent with what is happening. They also continue to use WhatsApp to communicate with us which, as evidenced by the blackout last week, is not secure or a reliable means of communication. I regretfully do not know whether to trust the DOS with our life and safety or to turn to other means to escape. This is not a position I would wish on anyone, and certainly not American citizens. There are a number of things for which we are grateful, however. We are fortunate to have our health (I have also been I have been helping female Americans without male escorts stuck in Kabul by retrieving critical medication from pharmacies), and the support of veterans with which I served alongside and NGOs. Those volunteers work 24 hours a day to help ensure our health and safety and that of the other Americans trapped here. [REDACTED] But I am an American and I am begging you to get us home. I know you will do the right thing, Sir. Sincerely, [REDACTED]
baybal2 5y ago
I remember, I once stumbled on an ex-Googler who went to Syria to open an IT business there before the civil war, in Moscow airport, who fled when the civil war started, and he had to flee with just his credit card, and ID documents. He was stuck there, living in the no man's land between gates and the immigration. And he also was pleading every English speaker he met there to contact his congress rep. I never found out how the story ended.
- tata71 5y ago
  Didn't contact his Congress rep, presumably?
  - baybal2 5y ago
    I went to US embassy with his letter, and was turned around at the gates.
anovikov 5y ago
Why not just drop these people a geo and a time in some empty place where they can't be afraid of stumbling upon Talibs (only if by pure accident), and then pull them out by helicopter?
- meibo 5y ago
  You probably underestimate how hard it is to escape their "watchful eye". It would have to be at night and covert, it would only work for a very small amount of people at once, and the Taliban would notice and make sure that it doesn't happen again pretty quickly. How do you expect people to get into the desert far enough while staying unseen, additionally to the heli noise?
  - ascar 5y ago
    Not to mention helis have limited range and altitude. They might have trouble reaching the destination from a friendly heliport and might be shot down by the Taliban. The logistics of such a mission are hard as evident by Operation Eagle Claw https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Eagle_Claw https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Eagle_Claw
    - anovikov 5y ago
      Never undestood it. Why not take out 1 Iranian city per day with a nuke till they return hostages?
- pigbearpig 5y ago
  There are no US bases there anymore, so there are no helicopters in range. A heli range is around 400 miles max and about the closest the US could get is a navy ship 600+ miles away, requiring a helicopter with a 1200+ mile range.
xwdv 5y ago
Is there any way they can walk into Pakistan? There will be more options there.
- pigbearpig 5y ago
  It's only a 58 hour (334 km) walk from Kabul to Peshawar, through a desert mountain range in Taliban strongholds.
  - xwdv 5y ago
    If they walk carefully at 4 hours for a few weeks, especially under the cover of night, they could easily do it. It’s the only way. The key challenge isn’t the distance, it’s planning the route.
    - tata71 5y ago
      The other key is to discard their remaining false hope for the establishment they were previously safely anchored to.
      - xwdv 5y ago
        There should be no hope. They have been left for dead.
  - selimthegrim 5y ago
    There’s footage of people crossing the southern borders in Nimroz but that would mean they’d have to get to Nimroz first
- ascar 5y ago
  Have you ever tried walking a considerable distance? It takes a lot of time, energy and at least water supply. A 10km hike is considered hard and takes 4 to 5 hours with reasonable fitness, if the terrain is friendly (somewhat pathed ways and not a lot of up and down). From a quick Google maps measurement we're talking at least 20km but more likely 100km of unfriendly uneven desert from ditching your car until you reach a settlement in Pakistan. It's possible, but it's a very rough multiple day journey and I would certainly not attempt it if not everyone involved did regular cardio training. And cross your fingers Taliban don't notice your car close to the border and start a manhunt, if they even let you through the checkpoints on your way there.
tata71 5y ago
> I know you will do the right thing Probably won't age well.

51 points by tomohawk 5y ago

Why is it that competence is so hard? This disaster was discussed in news media well over a year out, and yet, it happened anyway.

cutemonster 5y ago
Trump and Biden did what they thought would make them more popular politically. What do they care about that resulting in a disaster ... for poor people far away who don't get to vote in the US
throwaway6734 5y ago
What competence? The US surrendered to the Taliban (intentionally leaving the Afghani govt out of negotiations) in the March of 2020 with a planned pull out date of the next year and the release of 5,000 Taliban prisoners (including the current leader). Right after these negotiations were signed the Taliban broke the deals of agreement, continued to increase hostilities, and gained ground in the rural regions of Afghanistan all throughout 2020 and 2021. All the while, the visa/refugee process was hamstrung so claims were not processed.
pigbearpig 5y ago
I can't imagine it's that easy to coordinate travel from Afghanistan right now, even for the state dept.

slackfan 5y ago

But the news told me the only people remaining in Afghanistan are those that wanted to stay!

WithinReason 5y ago

October 15, 2021 The Honorable Joseph R. Biden President of the United States of America 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. N.W. Washington, DC 20500 Dear President Biden, I am pleading with you again as a fellow proud American and as a husband to help my wife and I get home from Afghanistan. We were just as surprised as you when this country fell to Taliban control so quickly, and we could not get to HKIA before attempts at evacuation became life threatening. Since then, we have waited patiently for assistance from the Department of State as directed, to no avail. In the past two weeks, DOS (points of contact below) purportedly manifested us for three flights. After we risked our lives getting through Taliban checkpoints, the 4 October flight was cancelled because passengers did not have visas for UAE, where the flight was to land. Another flight departed 11 October but we never got a call to go to the airport. The third scheduled for 13 October was apparently cancelled. We learned details of the latter flights from our Congressman, the Hon. Darrell Issa, who flew to Doha to meet us, and not from the DOS. These are not the only attempts we've made through DOS since August. We understood early on that one issue was my wife's immigration status — she has been waiting for her green card interview since 2019. We understand that we will have to continue the process in a third country before we can come home, and have completed all the E-visa requirements as directed by DOS. We simply do not understand why we were not called for the flight on Monday, and the DOS cannot explain it to us or to Congressman Issa. The information we are receiving from DOS is not consistent with what is happening. They also continue to use WhatsApp to communicate with us which, as evidenced by the blackout last week, is not secure or a reliable means of communication. I regretfully do not know whether to trust the DOS with our life and safety or to turn to other means to escape. This is not a position I would wish on anyone, and certainly not American citizens. There are a number of things for which we are grateful, however. We are fortunate to have our health (I have also been I have been helping female Americans without male escorts stuck in Kabul by retrieving critical medication from pharmacies), and the support of veterans with which I served alongside and NGOs. Those volunteers work 24 hours a day to help ensure our health and safety and that of the other Americans trapped here. [REDACTED] But I am an American and I am begging you to get us home. I know you will do the right thing, Sir. Sincerely, [REDACTED]

baybal2 5y ago

I remember, I once stumbled on an ex-Googler who went to Syria to open an IT business there before the civil war, in Moscow airport, who fled when the civil war started, and he had to flee with just his credit card, and ID documents. He was stuck there, living in the no man's land between gates and the immigration. And he also was pleading every English speaker he met there to contact his congress rep. I never found out how the story ended.

tata71 5y ago
Didn't contact his Congress rep, presumably?
- baybal2 5y ago
  I went to US embassy with his letter, and was turned around at the gates.

anovikov 5y ago

Why not just drop these people a geo and a time in some empty place where they can't be afraid of stumbling upon Talibs (only if by pure accident), and then pull them out by helicopter?

meibo 5y ago
You probably underestimate how hard it is to escape their "watchful eye". It would have to be at night and covert, it would only work for a very small amount of people at once, and the Taliban would notice and make sure that it doesn't happen again pretty quickly. How do you expect people to get into the desert far enough while staying unseen, additionally to the heli noise?
- ascar 5y ago
  Not to mention helis have limited range and altitude. They might have trouble reaching the destination from a friendly heliport and might be shot down by the Taliban. The logistics of such a mission are hard as evident by Operation Eagle Claw https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Eagle_Claw https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Eagle_Claw
  - anovikov 5y ago
    Never undestood it. Why not take out 1 Iranian city per day with a nuke till they return hostages?
pigbearpig 5y ago
There are no US bases there anymore, so there are no helicopters in range. A heli range is around 400 miles max and about the closest the US could get is a navy ship 600+ miles away, requiring a helicopter with a 1200+ mile range.

xwdv 5y ago

Is there any way they can walk into Pakistan? There will be more options there.

pigbearpig 5y ago
It's only a 58 hour (334 km) walk from Kabul to Peshawar, through a desert mountain range in Taliban strongholds.
- xwdv 5y ago
  If they walk carefully at 4 hours for a few weeks, especially under the cover of night, they could easily do it. It’s the only way. The key challenge isn’t the distance, it’s planning the route.
  - tata71 5y ago
    The other key is to discard their remaining false hope for the establishment they were previously safely anchored to.
    - xwdv 5y ago
      There should be no hope. They have been left for dead.
- selimthegrim 5y ago
  There’s footage of people crossing the southern borders in Nimroz but that would mean they’d have to get to Nimroz first
ascar 5y ago
Have you ever tried walking a considerable distance? It takes a lot of time, energy and at least water supply. A 10km hike is considered hard and takes 4 to 5 hours with reasonable fitness, if the terrain is friendly (somewhat pathed ways and not a lot of up and down). From a quick Google maps measurement we're talking at least 20km but more likely 100km of unfriendly uneven desert from ditching your car until you reach a settlement in Pakistan. It's possible, but it's a very rough multiple day journey and I would certainly not attempt it if not everyone involved did regular cardio training. And cross your fingers Taliban don't notice your car close to the border and start a manhunt, if they even let you through the checkpoints on your way there.

tata71 5y ago

> I know you will do the right thing Probably won't age well.