4 ms·

Well of course, that makes sense Windows 11 is an unfinished beta product, right? Wait, they went RTM? Four months after the first public insider builds? Withou

Well of course, that makes sense Windows 11 is an unfinished beta product, right? Wait, they went RTM? Four months after the first public insider builds? Without fixing most of the bugs/issues/complaints? By the way, this comment is posted from Windows 11. Trust me when I tell you that this isn't ready for most of the general public. It is still for early adopters willing to suck up problems. I'd wait until March 2022 or more, and then see where it is at. While they've made some positive moves forward UI wise, this still definitely feels like an insider build. I've had the DWM crash a few of times, requiring a hard reboot twice (even CTRL+ALT+Del or Win+Ctrl+Shift+B didn't work, while my mouse cursor still moved). That's more times than Windows 10's entire life. Plus it is missing very "101"/polish features (e.g. just today I discovered that moving pinned start menu icons between pages was impossible, you have to move it to the start of the second page then delete icons from the first page).

hoseja 5y ago
I hope it'll be feasible to skip this version, as is tradition.
AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
> It is still for early adopters willing to suck up problems. AKA suckers. Why do free beta testing for Microsoft?
- bserge 5y ago
  With Windows 10 updates, they made everyone a sucker. Updates that can lead to unbootable systems, loss of data, and hardware failure. We've seen it all.
- charwalker 5y ago
  ADHD aka is it New, Interesting, Challenging, or Urgent. It's new, interesting, challenging if you hit problems, and you can get in early. It is a direction change and if you could run it in a VM on older hardware I would. The official launch ISO won't boot while a dev version from the week before launch loads up in Hyper V fine.
oneweekwonder 5y ago
I understand the taskbar changed, but last time i tried win11 i could not move it to the top, and it was not pinning the app icon to the containing screen and main screen. Luckily I could revert to win10.
- jaywalk 5y ago
  The taskbar isn't allowed to be moved from the bottom anymore, so that's to be expected.
  - pope_meat 5y ago
    Microsoft continues the trend of "oh, you thought this was your machine? Nah, it's our machine"
  - baseballdork 5y ago
    This change floored me. I have so much horizontal space and much more limited vertical space. Let me move it to the side!
eumoria 5y ago
I've had 0 problems *but I am working on very new hardware that the manufacturer already claims support for Win11. I dislike the interface changes but I haven't liked changes since Windows 7 so I'm just in grumpy old man territory it seems. What is the hardware configuration you're experiencing these problems on?
- Someone1234 5y ago
  > What is the hardware configuration you're experiencing these problems on? I'm on supported hardware too. 3700X/2070 Super. Completely vanilla system.
  - jaywalk 5y ago
    I'm on a 3900X/2080 Super and have had zero issues.
  - aspenmayer 5y ago
    Did you in-place upgrade or clean install Windows 11?
jjoonathan 5y ago
Windows 10 is taking 3-4 minutes to log in, I've tried disabling startup services, but that didn't work, so reinstall is on the table... would you hop to Win 11 or reinstall Win 10?
- driverdan 5y ago
  If you have to run Windows install Windows 10 LTSC. You can get a stripped down version with no ads and no store. It's the way windows should be out of the box.
- chii 5y ago
  check how big your roaming home dir is (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roaming_user_profile#Profile_size https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roaming_user_profile#Profile_s... ) - sometimes applications tend to put a lot of stuff into this dir, which could end up slowing startup.
  - gruez 5y ago
    Note that this almost certainly isn't relevant unless you're on a corporate machine. I highly doubt that corporations are updating to windows 11 the month it's released.
  - jjoonathan 5y ago
    Thanks, but this is a personal computer. Then again, I'm not sure I should rule out some kind of wacky involuntary cloud sync these days.
    - Sohcahtoa82 5y ago
      To rule it out, have you tried booting with your network disabled?
- rasz 5y ago
  How hard have you tried disabling services? My optimized win10 has 27 services set to Automatic start, and 33 RUNNING total, while fresh install is around 70 Automatic and ~100 running (with stupid shit like few xbox services for people never playing games, or handwriting recognition on a desktop). Then there are 140 Tasks enabled by default. Half of the stuff I had to disable didnt really want to be disabled and required playing with permissions or impersonating TrustedInstaller - Microsoft really wants that clipboard and hand writing telemetry uploaded regularly.
kuroguro 5y ago
> Win+Ctrl+Shift+B First time I've heard of this shortcut - seems to reboot the video driver in case of any graphics glitches. May come in handy, thx!
- gruez 5y ago
  >seems to reboot the video driver in case of any graphics glitches sort of, but not really: https://superuser.com/a/1497556 https://superuser.com/a/1497556
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
cprecioso 5y ago
I read that the kernel has been in trial for a lot more, as it had been deployed to Windows 10 Insiders for almost a year; so they’ve “only” been testing the new shell. They already went RTM some time ago and made sure the OOBE would update the shell to the latest version.
- Mindwipe 5y ago
  And I mean that makes sense, because it's the shell changes that feel half finished.
ssully 5y ago
My understanding is that the majority of users aren't even able to upgrade currently. If your average user tries to upgrade from the Windows Update menu, they will just see if their computer is technically able to upgrade or not (based on CPU/TPM stuff I think). Even if it is, you won't be allowed or ping to upgrade until they deem your configuration viable. I am not by my home PC, but I think the messaging they give in the Windows Update page even says the upgrade should be available around spring of 2022. So while Windows 11 is "out" right now, it seems to be for people on the windows insider program, and will be slowly rolled out to the public into next year.
VortexDream 5y ago
I want to put everybody involved in the UI changes inside a cannon and shoot them into a sun. Seriously. Top left back button isn't flush with the edge and isn't an infinite button. Pure idiocy. Interacting with sound anything has become 10x worse and I want to strangle whoever removed the old volume mixer and made it impossible to cleanly switch audio devices over the icon. I want to waterboard whoever decided to remove the Task manager shortcut from the right-click menu of the Taskbar. It's near impossible to find the wifi security settings with how they're trying desperately to hide the classic interface without providing any way to do the same things I was able to before. after months of dealing with this shit and seeing none of it addressed, I've given up and I'm back on 10. Microsoft. What in the fuck. I was ready to give 11 a fair shot. I gave it more of a chance than it deserved. It made so many of my daily tasks harder and more tedious to do and I can't stand it. Interacting with 11 legit makes me angry.
- NoPicklez 5y ago
  I share in your frustration, I haven't migrated to Windows 11 but I noticed these challenges in Windows 10 starting the crop up. The half baked settings UI which when you actually get to the place you need to go is in the old settings UI anyway. But if what you say is difficult in Windows 11, it's going to be a bumpy ride
  - VortexDream 5y ago
    I'd say the most frustrating thing to me is that they have legit made some decent UI improvements. I did like 11 when I started using it. Overall, the settings app is better. Overall, the bottom right menu for quick access buttons is awesome. There actually is potential here for something great. But there are these "minor" issues around common tasks involving both that I do regularly that ruin the whole experience and I just feel so disappointed and frustrated. I hated giving up and going back to 10. While it is worse in some ways, it's better in the ways that matter to me.
solarkraft 5y ago
To be honest that's how I felt about Windows 10 and most other Microsoft products.
charwalker 5y ago
I try to shoot for the 3rd gen/iteration, or later if possible. Windows 8.1 was great for me with a new laptop and Surface tablet. 10 has treated me well enough especially with the features still in the Pro version. 11 should be good to go next spring or summer. I was burned by my first laptop, a lovely netbook with dGPU where the CPU hobbled everything you could drain the battery before finishing a level in Halo 2 PC. It took a few iterations for that low power CPU mobile gaming platform to balance out.

hoseja 5y ago

I hope it'll be feasible to skip this version, as is tradition.

AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago

> It is still for early adopters willing to suck up problems. AKA suckers. Why do free beta testing for Microsoft?

bserge 5y ago
With Windows 10 updates, they made everyone a sucker. Updates that can lead to unbootable systems, loss of data, and hardware failure. We've seen it all.
charwalker 5y ago
ADHD aka is it New, Interesting, Challenging, or Urgent. It's new, interesting, challenging if you hit problems, and you can get in early. It is a direction change and if you could run it in a VM on older hardware I would. The official launch ISO won't boot while a dev version from the week before launch loads up in Hyper V fine.

oneweekwonder 5y ago

I understand the taskbar changed, but last time i tried win11 i could not move it to the top, and it was not pinning the app icon to the containing screen and main screen. Luckily I could revert to win10.

jaywalk 5y ago
The taskbar isn't allowed to be moved from the bottom anymore, so that's to be expected.
- pope_meat 5y ago
  Microsoft continues the trend of "oh, you thought this was your machine? Nah, it's our machine"
- baseballdork 5y ago
  This change floored me. I have so much horizontal space and much more limited vertical space. Let me move it to the side!

eumoria 5y ago

I've had 0 problems *but I am working on very new hardware that the manufacturer already claims support for Win11. I dislike the interface changes but I haven't liked changes since Windows 7 so I'm just in grumpy old man territory it seems. What is the hardware configuration you're experiencing these problems on?

Someone1234 5y ago
> What is the hardware configuration you're experiencing these problems on? I'm on supported hardware too. 3700X/2070 Super. Completely vanilla system.
- jaywalk 5y ago
  I'm on a 3900X/2080 Super and have had zero issues.
- aspenmayer 5y ago
  Did you in-place upgrade or clean install Windows 11?

jjoonathan 5y ago

Windows 10 is taking 3-4 minutes to log in, I've tried disabling startup services, but that didn't work, so reinstall is on the table... would you hop to Win 11 or reinstall Win 10?

driverdan 5y ago
If you have to run Windows install Windows 10 LTSC. You can get a stripped down version with no ads and no store. It's the way windows should be out of the box.
chii 5y ago
check how big your roaming home dir is (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roaming_user_profile#Profile_size https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roaming_user_profile#Profile_s... ) - sometimes applications tend to put a lot of stuff into this dir, which could end up slowing startup.
- gruez 5y ago
  Note that this almost certainly isn't relevant unless you're on a corporate machine. I highly doubt that corporations are updating to windows 11 the month it's released.
- jjoonathan 5y ago
  Thanks, but this is a personal computer. Then again, I'm not sure I should rule out some kind of wacky involuntary cloud sync these days.
  - Sohcahtoa82 5y ago
    To rule it out, have you tried booting with your network disabled?
rasz 5y ago
How hard have you tried disabling services? My optimized win10 has 27 services set to Automatic start, and 33 RUNNING total, while fresh install is around 70 Automatic and ~100 running (with stupid shit like few xbox services for people never playing games, or handwriting recognition on a desktop). Then there are 140 Tasks enabled by default. Half of the stuff I had to disable didnt really want to be disabled and required playing with permissions or impersonating TrustedInstaller - Microsoft really wants that clipboard and hand writing telemetry uploaded regularly.

kuroguro 5y ago

> Win+Ctrl+Shift+B First time I've heard of this shortcut - seems to reboot the video driver in case of any graphics glitches. May come in handy, thx!

gruez 5y ago
>seems to reboot the video driver in case of any graphics glitches sort of, but not really: https://superuser.com/a/1497556 https://superuser.com/a/1497556

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

cprecioso 5y ago

I read that the kernel has been in trial for a lot more, as it had been deployed to Windows 10 Insiders for almost a year; so they’ve “only” been testing the new shell. They already went RTM some time ago and made sure the OOBE would update the shell to the latest version.

Mindwipe 5y ago
And I mean that makes sense, because it's the shell changes that feel half finished.

ssully 5y ago

My understanding is that the majority of users aren't even able to upgrade currently. If your average user tries to upgrade from the Windows Update menu, they will just see if their computer is technically able to upgrade or not (based on CPU/TPM stuff I think). Even if it is, you won't be allowed or ping to upgrade until they deem your configuration viable. I am not by my home PC, but I think the messaging they give in the Windows Update page even says the upgrade should be available around spring of 2022. So while Windows 11 is "out" right now, it seems to be for people on the windows insider program, and will be slowly rolled out to the public into next year.

VortexDream 5y ago

I want to put everybody involved in the UI changes inside a cannon and shoot them into a sun. Seriously. Top left back button isn't flush with the edge and isn't an infinite button. Pure idiocy. Interacting with sound anything has become 10x worse and I want to strangle whoever removed the old volume mixer and made it impossible to cleanly switch audio devices over the icon. I want to waterboard whoever decided to remove the Task manager shortcut from the right-click menu of the Taskbar. It's near impossible to find the wifi security settings with how they're trying desperately to hide the classic interface without providing any way to do the same things I was able to before. after months of dealing with this shit and seeing none of it addressed, I've given up and I'm back on 10. Microsoft. What in the fuck. I was ready to give 11 a fair shot. I gave it more of a chance than it deserved. It made so many of my daily tasks harder and more tedious to do and I can't stand it. Interacting with 11 legit makes me angry.

NoPicklez 5y ago
I share in your frustration, I haven't migrated to Windows 11 but I noticed these challenges in Windows 10 starting the crop up. The half baked settings UI which when you actually get to the place you need to go is in the old settings UI anyway. But if what you say is difficult in Windows 11, it's going to be a bumpy ride
- VortexDream 5y ago
  I'd say the most frustrating thing to me is that they have legit made some decent UI improvements. I did like 11 when I started using it. Overall, the settings app is better. Overall, the bottom right menu for quick access buttons is awesome. There actually is potential here for something great. But there are these "minor" issues around common tasks involving both that I do regularly that ruin the whole experience and I just feel so disappointed and frustrated. I hated giving up and going back to 10. While it is worse in some ways, it's better in the ways that matter to me.

solarkraft 5y ago

To be honest that's how I felt about Windows 10 and most other Microsoft products.

charwalker 5y ago

I try to shoot for the 3rd gen/iteration, or later if possible. Windows 8.1 was great for me with a new laptop and Surface tablet. 10 has treated me well enough especially with the features still in the Pro version. 11 should be good to go next spring or summer. I was burned by my first laptop, a lovely netbook with dGPU where the CPU hobbled everything you could drain the battery before finishing a level in Halo 2 PC. It took a few iterations for that low power CPU mobile gaming platform to balance out.