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Facebook Dangerous Individuals and Organizations List (Reproduced Snapshot)
- jdhn 5y agoThey have Ted Kaczynski on that list despite the fact that he's in prison for the rest of his life, and that he wouldn't use Facebook even if he was out. Is his presence on this list an indicator that Facebook is paying more attention to users/groups that talk about him a lot or share his ideals?
- Sunspark 5y agoMaybe the latter. They have people on the list who have been dead for 76 years.
- busterarm 5y agoThey also have Aum Shinrikyo listed as such even though they changed their name to Aleph (which is not listed) decades ago.
- _ofdw 5y agoThey have a bunch of dead Nazis on that list, like Adolf Hitler, Rudolph Hess, and Adolf Eichmann. Presumably these folks aren't using facebook so I can only assume that, uh, younger nazis have adopted these names as noms de guerre?
- TaylorAlexander 5y agoSince Facebook creates profiles even for people not on Facebook, I wonder if their system has an internal profile for people like that…
- gorwell 5y agoLong dead Hitler and Goebbels are included too, but why stop there? Where's Joseph Stalin and Vlad the Impaler. https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/21083819/pages/facebook-dangerous-individuals-and-organizations-list-reproduced-snapshot-p65-large.gif https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/21083819/pages/facebo...
- woodruffw 5y agoI'm guessing the list is based on political salience, not just how "bad" a person is. There probably aren't that many Vlad the Impaler apologists in the world, given that he's a functionally irrelevant person to be an apologist for. That's perhaps less the case for Stalin, but even Marxist-Leninists (seem) to make fewer excuses for Stalin-the-human than neo-Nazis do for Hitler-the-human.
- legostormtroopr 5y ago> There probably aren't that many Vlad the Impaler apologists in the world Literally the entire genre of Vampire literature disagrees.
- woodruffw 5y ago> Literally the entire genre of Vampire literature disagrees. I wasn't under the impression that there was any particular political message behind contemporary vampire fiction. Dracula itself is full of political messages, but probably not the ones you're thinking of[1]. [1]: https://www.jstor.org/stable/3828327 https://www.jstor.org/stable/3828327
- lenkite 5y agoWhere is Mao ?
- adventured 5y agoExactly. Where's Che Guevara? Another of the monsters of the 20th century and still quite popular as an icon.
- petre 5y agoVlad the Impaler might have been overdoing things, but he did stuff that pretty much standard practice during the Middle Ages. Stalin on the other hand should totally be on that list.
- barbacoa 5y agoAnd don't get me started on the Romans. After the Romans captured Carthage they murdered 450,000 of its inhabitants. This makes Caesar's Place in Las Vegas very culturally problematic.
- syshum 5y agoThey have Adolf Hitler on the list, he is dead as far as I know unless Facebook as confirm the conspiracy that he never died?
- bellyfullofbac 5y agoEveryone missing the bleeding obvious: keywords for their moderation bots, if post contains keyword, flag it for manual moderation, or even downrank it so it doesn't show up that often in news feeds. Although with how much the MAGA-crowd evokes the name of Hitler/Nazis to compare the current administration with it, maybe not...
- BitwiseFool 5y ago>"Although with how much the MAGA-crowd evokes the name of Hitler/Nazis to compare the current administration with it, maybe not... " Okay, but I want you to acknowledge just how much Blue Team did this exact same thing during the last administration.
- refenestrator 5y agoConsider it an anti-godwin measure and it's still a win, whoever is saying it.
- syshum 5y ago>>Although with how much the MAGA-crowd evokes the name of Hitler/Nazis to compare the current administration with it, maybe not... I have not seen this widely used, and when it is often it is in the context of "And they called us Nazi's" or something to that effect. The number of "MAGA-Types" comparing Biden to WWII Germany is a faction of the number of people that used the same comparison for Trump. Neither are accurate, but Godwin demands that everything we dislike is just like fascism //for the record, because I have not. I am neither Republican or Democrat I support the largest 3rd party in the US, they who can not be named....
- nix23 5y agoAnd Benito Mussolini for hate :)
- Miner49er 5y agoGoodwill Charitable Organization is listed under terror. I wonder why that is.
- enjoyyourlife 5y agoIt's a Lebanese terrorist organization See https://www.treasury.gov/press-center/press-releases/Pages/hp503.aspx https://www.treasury.gov/press-center/press-releases/Pages/h...
- Miner49er 5y agoAh, I was getting it mixed up with the thrift store.
- korethr 5y agoThat's probably deliberate. An intentional name collision seems a good way to run a front.
- elliekelly 5y agoIt’s a fairly common money laundering/terrorist financing scheme. They “hide in plain sight” and it often works.
- h2odragon 5y agoThere's only so many dirty underclothes people can be expected to sort through before they snap. "Who did you think wanted half a jar of olives?!?"
- mikestew 5y agohttps://www.irs.gov/charities-non-profits/charitable-organizations/suspensions-pursuant-to-code-section-501p https://www.irs.gov/charities-non-profits/charitable-organiz...
- gxt 5y agoIs there a stated goal for this list? There's around 1k names in the list but over 400k homicides worldwide every year. I assume there's lots more hate and misc. crimes every year, so what's the usefulness of having only 1k users flagged?
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- elliekelly 5y agoI’m guessing at least part of the goal is OFAC compliance but this list seems to go far beyond OFAC sanctions.
- farmerstan 5y agoIs this not just the OFAC list that all financial institutions need to check against during KYC?
- rdl 5y agoI think it's a superset.
- gootler 5y agoOh I thought this was people like Mark Zuckerburger. Not sure what it's supposed to be.
- Lendal 5y agoTrue. Title could be interpreted either way. Dangerous people associated with the Facebook organization, or people the Facebook organization decided are dangerous?
- korethr 5y agoHuh. There's a lot bands in the "Hate" section. Looking up the various names I'm finding various death metal and black metal bands. I can't help but wonder how many of those bands on are on that list because someone at Facebook took heavy metal imagery and lyrical themes too seriously and literally. More Edit: Turns out I picked a bad example. I missed reference to a name collision with an actual National Socialist band using the original name. The original edit is below. Edit: Figured I should support my thesis with an example. Let us take the band Sturmtruppen, from the Hate section of the linked article. From Encyclopaedia Metallum[1][2], they are a Black/Death metal band with themes of war and genocide. Per and interview referenced on their Encyclopedia Metallum page, their choice of those themes is not to glorify them, but to have something evil sounding enough to fit the style of music. I am not saying that all the listed bands don't belong there. I know that actual neo nazi bands that take their imagery and themes seriously are a real thing that exist. But I do suspect at least some bands are on that list because of imagery and lyrical themes alone. 1. https://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Sturmtruppen/12143 https://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Sturmtruppen/12143 2. https://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Truppensturm/98034 https://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Truppensturm/98034
- psyc 5y agoIt’s not that. They’re pretty clearly white supremacist / neonazi metal bands, and that’s definitely a thing.
- jazzyjackson 5y agoPoe’s law applies, impossible to tell who is parody and who is genuine without being familiar with the source.
- dymk 5y agoIf you can't tell without being familiar with the source (aka almost everybody else), it doesn't really matter if white supremacist material is ironic/parody/joking or not
- deleted 5y ago
- bitlax 5y agoSo what's the deal with the militia groups? Are these groups listed particularly heinous groups or is this an editorial decision by Facebook, that they don't want militia groups to organize using their platform?
- pwned1 5y agoLOL. Michigan Militia of Love.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- viro 5y agomost militia groups are very boogaloo boysish. Which tend to be far-right anti-government extremists.
- jazzyjackson 5y agothe US has a militia, its called the national guard, any other militias might be called “paramilitary”, and a private company might choose not to be the platform of paramilitary groups
- Jon_Lowtek 5y agoI don't think this list is the result of a private companies (facebooks) choice. What we are looking at seems state mandated
- syshum 5y agoThe US has 2 Militia's under federal law, the organized Militia aka the national guard, and the unorganized militia which is 10 U.S. Code § 246 which states "The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at least 17 years of age and,... under 45 years of age who are, or who have made a declaration of intention to become, citizens of the United States and of female citizens of the United States who are members of the National Guard."
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- andrepew 5y agoBlue Airways — a Romanian budget airline is on the list as a “Terror” organization. I guess their service isn’t very good.
- joshuamorton 5y agoOr its the Turkish terror affiliated group: https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/sm0395 https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/sm0395
- AdrianB1 5y agoThat is Blue Air, not Airways.
- silverpepsi 5y agoNow imagine that accompanying all your new Facebook posts with a clearly positive sentiment, you randomly throw in one name from the list. Could be very interesting
- Arrath 5y agoNext up, set up a site to include a randomly selected word from NSA's Prism trigger list within the pages.
- yesbabyyes 5y agoWhen I was in high school (early-mid 90s) we would use a list of ECHELON keywords as our email signatures.
- throwaway0a5e 5y agoMight as well throw the Eurion into all your pictures while you're at it just to cause shenanigans with the parts of their stack that support that DRM.
- janandonly 5y agohm... Half of the Organizations in the "Hate: category seem to be based in Germany. Almost all of the Organizations in the "Terror" category seem to be Islamic. In the category "Crime" Brazil is overly represented. There seem to be a shocking amount of "Armed Militia Groups". I was surprised to find that "A.K. Chesterton" is affiliated with the "British Union of Fascists" ?? Is that correct? I seemed to be confusing "G.K. Chesterton" with "A.K. Chesterton" pfffffiew...
- raxxorrax 5y agoAs a German this is quite embarrassing, it seamlessly connects to bad legislation for anything digital. A free internet could never have been developed in a country like Germany. There are probably some very indicting statistics on some sites that have an international audience but 80% of complaints still come from Germans.
- detaro 5y agoLikely matches what the respective countries or organizations there put pressure on Facebook for, or which pose a legal problem for Facebook there. E.g. lots of German neonazi stuff in the hate category.
- throwawayboise 5y agoNazism is illegal in Germany. Militias are constitutionally protected in the USA, so there's not really a legal argument for all of those to be included.
- detaro 5y agoyou'll note that legal arguments are only one of the things I listed. (And as far as I understand, the situation around private militias is far less legally obvious than you state it, and I don't think any of the militias of the states is listed)
- nl 5y ago> Militias are constitutionally protected in the USA Not private militias! In-fact, they are banned by all 50 states: https://www.npr.org/2020/08/30/907720068/are-citizen-militias-legal https://www.npr.org/2020/08/30/907720068/are-citizen-militia...
- chroem- 5y agoWhere are the left wing insurrectionist groups that terrorized Seattle and Portland last year? In Seattle they seceded from the US and shot six people with fully automatic weapons, in addition to thowing pipe bombs into occupied buildings. Edit: Is it okay when we do it?
- cwkoss 5y agoDo we have any conclusive evidence that those acts were committed by particular groups rather than unaffiliated individuals? In my limited experience, the grouped-up folks tend to take more measured actions, the lone wolves are more likely to cause trouble.
- tomjakubowski 5y ago"Seattle Antifascist Action" is on the list. What is the name of the missing group you're complaining about?
- chroem- 5y agoI did not see the PNW Youth Liberation Front and John Brown Gun Club (among others)
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- tomjakubowski 5y agoI think your original post would have been better received if you had been more specific and named the groups you'd like to see censored.
- chroem- 5y agoThat's part of the problem though: there is nobody keeping track of left wing terrorist groups in the US. We only have a clear picture of the PNWYLF and JBGC because they went around bombing and shooting people all last summer. To say the problem is limited to just a few groups is difficult, because A.) they are numerous with varying objectives, and B.) we just don't know how deep the rabbit hole goes.
- kragen 5y agoThere's a lot of potential for false positives in a list like this. "Houthis", one of the groups in the "Terror" list, is actually the name of an ethnicity in northern Yemen (which is currently in insurrection against the Saudi-backed government of Yemen). "Ammar", another, is also the name of the prostitutes' union here in Argentina, AMMAR, which is not to my knowledge a violent group (despite having had one of their leaders assassinated). "Taliban" literally means "seminary students". I'm guessing there are a lot of "Tamil Foundations for X" in India, given that there are almost 80 million Tamils in India, Sri Lanka, and Malaysia. 5 million people live in Michoacán, and any of their families would be a "familia michoacana" in Spanish. "Sureños" are people from the South, which could mean South America or the Southern United States. "Asatru" is commonly used as the term for attempted revivals of pre-Christian Scandinavian religion (you know, the one with Thor and Freya and Odin); some factions are super racist (this is why Nazi SS uniforms used the "S" rune) while others reject racism. It's easy to imagine French speakers seeking "egalité et réconciliation" without endorsing the hate group. And of course there are a number of people out there named "Ben Jones", "Arthur Jones", "Charlie Fox", "Ian Stuart", "James Mason", "Jared Taylor", "Mario Machado", "Richard Spencer", "Robert Ray", "Alejandro Estrada", "Mario Jackson", "Omar Romero", "Abdul Aziz", "Abdul Jabbar", "Hafiz Saeed", "Mohammad Hejazi", "Mohammed Omar", and "Omar Hussain", and any of the numerous Hassans from Baghdad could reasonably be called "Hassan al-Baghdadi". In many cases the names on the list are of people who died many generations ago, so the evident intent is not even to prevent them from setting up Facebook accounts, but to prevent others from discussing them on Facebook; that is, to suppress comments like this one. — ⁂ — However, aside from questions of false positives, the broader issue is that nominally the issue over which the Cold War was fought was over whether to have such a list of prohibited groups and dangerous individuals whose voice was too dangerous to allow people to hear it, or subjects too dangerous to allow people to discuss them; the USSR argued that it was essential, the US that it was intolerable, in both cases somewhat inconsistently. This theory of liberalism was fundamental to the foundation of the US — not, as some would argue, as a mere limitation on government action, but as a fundamental aspect of what distinguishes a good society from a bad one. So it's disquieting to see liberalism so thoroughly rejected by modern centralized communications media.
- torben-friis 5y ago
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- hellojesus 5y agoI didn't make the cut. That's sad.
- m0zg 5y agoNo Antifa? Why, of course not. What's a few dead people and billions of dollars in damage between friends.
- amirkdv 5y agoDo you really think Facebook has a soft spot for Antifa? (whatever that amorphous "organization" is) Tip: there's a toggle on the page where you can get the raw text of the document, then use ctrl+f.
- tomjakubowski 5y agoYou obviously did not bother to read the list, which includes several Antifa groups. (as well as some calling themselves Anti-Antifa)
- cwkoss 5y agoYep, I found the local leftist milita (they have antifa ideology but don't name the group antifa) on the list.
- woodruffw 5y agoThe FBI and DHS, two agencies whose relationships with America's left have never been described as "friendly," have consistently determined that antifascists are neither organized as a movement[1] nor a serious violent threat to the United States[2]. [1]: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/11/us/antifa-protests-george-floyd.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/11/us/antifa-protests-george... [2]: https://www.politico.com/news/2020/09/04/white-supremacists-terror-threat-dhs-409236 https://www.politico.com/news/2020/09/04/white-supremacists-...
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- LinuxBender 5y agoIs there a text/plain version of the list somewhere? If I click their text button there are no line feeds or carriage returns. Maybe it's my browser.
- justin_oaks 5y agoI can appreciate that this is a "Reproduced Snapshot". I don't see anywhere that clarifies what it means, but I assume that this means it's not a simple copy/paste of text, nor a screenshot. The reason for avoiding both of those is to avoid passing through watermarking that can reveal how the data was leaked. Text can be watermarked by including unicode characters that look identical to ASCII characters or including invisible characters like zero-width spaces. Copy-pasting text will keep those characters. Images from screenshots can be watermarked by having subtly differently colored pixels, subtle differences in text spacing, etc.
- InternalRun 5y agoI believe you’re right especially since they’ve blown a source before by posting a original copy of leaked documents https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/13/business/media/the-intercept-source-reality-winner.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/13/business/media/the-interc...
- lights0123 5y agoOne example from a few years ago: Genius.com was accusing Google of taking lyrics data from their site and displaying them on search results. They changed some apostrophes into the similar-but-different ’ U+2019 RIGHT SINGLE QUOTATION MARK in a specific pattern. https://www.pcmag.com/news/genius-we-caught-google-red-handed-stealing-lyrics-data https://www.pcmag.com/news/genius-we-caught-google-red-hande...
- r721 5y agoAccompanying article: >Revealed: Facebook’s Secret Blacklist of “Dangerous Individuals and Organizations” >Experts say the public deserves to see the list, a clear embodiment of U.S. foreign policy priorities that could disproportionately censor marginalized groups. https://theintercept.com/2021/10/12/facebook-secret-blacklist-dangerous/ https://theintercept.com/2021/10/12/facebook-secret-blacklis... UPD Twitter thread by author: https://twitter.com/samfbiddle/status/1447974771522564097 https://twitter.com/samfbiddle/status/1447974771522564097
- adminscoffee 5y agoso there is a lot of islamic groups, at least on top 20 or so pages and on bottom up 20 pages, skimmed. but yeah that's well a it's a terror network list, and just in time for halloween. not serious, idk people just stay up at night plotting evil shit for whatever reason with their buddies. might be better laying off the terror and chilling out a little, watch some netflix. maybe something more positive than terror, idk, they spend too much time on twitter. surprised facebook posted this.