8 ms·

Pfizer vaccine immunity diminishes, can reach as low as 20% after 4 months

19 points by AndrewBissell 5y ago

Bostonian 5y ago
This should be remembered: 'Still, Pfizer's protection against hospitalization and death remained "robust" at 90% or higher for six months after the second dose'
- AndrewBissell 5y ago
  Sure, but that's a very thin reed on which to hang mandates and vaccine passports. Just yesterday the POTUS was saying that being vaccinated means "you are protected and can't spread" COVID as part of his case for them: https://twitter.com/Breaking911/status/1446211115738931209 https://twitter.com/Breaking911/status/1446211115738931209
  - Arnt 5y ago
    Where I live, protecting the hospitals from overload was the main reason given for the lockdowns that started in March 2020. The vaccine succeeds in protecting hospitals (the rate of hospitalisation is now about one sixth of what it was at comparable infection incidence at the end of last year), so it maybe a thin reed but it's a reed that does the job.
    - AndrewBissell 5y ago
      The hospitals are in much worse shape after terminating all the unvaccinated staff. When they "give" you that as the reason for what they are doing, they are lying. If that was truly their motivation they would have increased hospital capacity, not reduced it. And now that "the hospitals are overwhelmed" is justification in the public's mind for sweeping emergency powers, you should expect them to be some level of 'overwhelmed' (at least, according to the press) in perpetuity.
      - zibzab 5y ago
        OP said hospitalizations has reduced to 1/6th. Unless you can prove to me that 5 of every 6 doctors and nurses have quite due to vaccin mandates i think we are in better shapes as before (even ignoring that anti-vaxxers in hospitals act as superspreaders)
        AndrewBissell 5y ago
        Covid hospitalizations were reduced to 1/6th. Are those the only kinds of hospitalizations?
        ericb 5y ago
        No, but they are the only ones with high hospital demand currently being driven by an explosive contagious vector.
        Arnt 5y ago
        No. But that's not the key question. The key question is: Did this reduction reduce the hospital requirement forecasts such that hospitals have free beds and can handle sudden and big accidents? An aircraft crash, a derailed train, a wave of food poisonings? And that is now the case, since the vaccines protect so well against severe effects.
    - Proven 5y ago
      Many people have built natural immunity since March 2020, so now vs then is not comparable at all.
    - might9900 5y ago
      This. I'm a doc covering our ICU and I'm seeing an endless stream of Delta COVID-19 patients which are 95% unvaccinated and younger than in 2020. There are many socio-politico-scientific issues/stories surrounding SARS-CoV-2 but, in my opinion, the most dangerous impact of this virus is the ability it has to massively deplete medical resources in a region. In real-time, SARS-CoV-2 is saturating our beds/resources and burning-out staff. No staff have been dismissed from our healthcare system (~20 hospitals) due to unvaccinated status and nurse staffing has been critical since spring of 2020. Considerable effort is expended daily just to find staffed beds for patients within our hospital (or within our region if we are at max). (Have been a long-time reader of HN and this is my first post. Just want to thank everyone for a great community over the years. Well done.)
- raxxorrax 5y ago
  How would that work? How is immunity defined? Anti-body count?
  - nradov 5y ago
    There is no simple definition of immunity. It's not a binary condition. The human immune system is complex with multiple mechanisms at work. Long term immunity tends to depend more on memory cells than circulating antibodies.
  - wbsss4412 5y ago
    Note that it didn’t say immunity. The quoted number is saying the rate of hospitalization and death among the vaccinated is 90% lower than it is among the unvaccinated. It’s a simple calculation. Group a had X hospitalizations, group b had Y. Adjusting for population sizes, X is 90% lower than Y.
zibzab 5y ago
Not sure if this is against HN guidelines, but these are his submissions from THIS WEEK. I let you decide what is going on here: ----- Pfizer vaccine immunity diminishes, can reach as low as 20% after 4 months (insider.com) 6 points by AndrewBissell 1 hour ago | flag | past | 6 comments 2. Hospitals consider universal DNR orders for coronavirus patients (2020) (washingtonpost.com) 4 points by AndrewBissell 19 hours ago | flag | past | 1 comment 3. Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna vaccine in men under 30 (yahoo.com) 14 points by AndrewBissell 22 hours ago | flag | past | 6 comments 4. Pfizer Asks FDA to Authorize Its Covid-19 Vaccine for Children Aged 5 to 11 (nytimes.com) 2 points by AndrewBissell 1 day ago | flag | past | discuss 5. Contrived Spectacles of “Protecting and Caring for the People” (brownstone.org) 2 points by AndrewBissell 1 day ago | flag | past | discuss 6. A Report on Covid-19 Vaccine Associated Myocarditis Adverse Events in VAERS (sciencedirect.com) 20 points by AndrewBissell 1 day ago | flag | past | discuss 7. Mechanism of molnupiravir-induced SARS-CoV-2 mutagenesis (nature.com) 2 points by AndrewBissell 1 day ago | flag | past | discuss 8. Sweden pauses use of Moderna COVID vaccine for people under 30 (reuters.com) 7 points by AndrewBissell 2 days ago | flag | past | 1 comment 9. University of Colorado Health denies kidney transplant to unvaccinated patient (twitter.com/tgeitner) 10 points by AndrewBissell 2 days ago | flag | past | 6 comments 10. A ‘Pacemaker for the Brain’: No Treatment Helped Her Depression – Until This (nytimes.com) 9 points by AndrewBissell 2 days ago | flag | past | 1 comment 11. Predominance of antibody-resistant Covid variants in Bay Area breakthrough cases (medrxiv.org) 10 points by AndrewBissell 3 days ago | flag | past | discuss 12. A Company Family: The Untold History of Obama and the CIA (covertactionmagazine.com) 2 points by AndrewBissell 4 days ago | flag | past | discuss 13. How OSHA will enforce the vaccine mandate for 80 million workers (npr.org) 3 points by AndrewBissell 4 days ago | flag | past | 1 comment 14. 8 in 10 children suffered mental health issues due to Covid response (express.co.uk) 2 points by AndrewBissell 4 days ago | flag | past | discuss 15. Nosocomial Delta variant outbreak in a highly vaccinated and high PPE population (eurosurveillance.org) 3 points by AndrewBissell 5 days ago | flag | past | 1 comment 16. Increases in Covid-19 are unrelated to levels of vaccination across 68 countries (springer.com) 14 points by AndrewBissell 5 days ago | flag | past | 2 comments 17. “Look It Up, Check It Out”: REX 84 and the History of an American Conspiracy (wearethemutants.com) 3 points by AndrewBissell 5 days ago | flag | past | discuss 18. Tamiflu and influenza vaccines: More harm than good? (bmj.com) 9 points by AndrewBissell 5 days ago | flag | past | discuss 19. Merck created hit list to discredit dissenting doctors (2009) (cbsnews.com) 39 points by AndrewBissell 6 days ago | flag | past | 6 comments 20. Ontario university will not allow unvaccinated students to take online courses (ctvnews.ca) 5 points by AndrewBissell 6 days ago | flag | past | 3 comments 21. Molnupiravir inhibits SARS-CoV-2 in vitro but is mutagenic in mammalian cells (bvsalud.org) 3 points by AndrewBissell 6 days ago | flag | past | discuss 22. Durability of immune responses to the Pfizer vaccine (biorxiv.org) 2 points by AndrewBissell 7 days ago | flag | past | discuss 23. Vietnam abandons zero-Covid strategy after record drop in GDP (ft.com) 8 points by AndrewBissell 7 days ago | flag | past | 1 comment 24. IRS would track all bank transactions over $600 in Biden plan; Businesses revolt (yahoo.com) 12 points by AndrewBissell 7 days ago | flag | past | 4 comments 25. Incidence of Audiological Adverse Effects Induced by Covid-19 Vaccines (sagepub.com) 1 point by AndrewBissell 7 days ago | flag | past | discuss

19 points by AndrewBissell 5y ago

This should be remembered: 'Still, Pfizer's protection against hospitalization and death remained "robust" at 90% or higher for six months after the second dose'

AndrewBissell 5y ago
Sure, but that's a very thin reed on which to hang mandates and vaccine passports. Just yesterday the POTUS was saying that being vaccinated means "you are protected and can't spread" COVID as part of his case for them: https://twitter.com/Breaking911/status/1446211115738931209 https://twitter.com/Breaking911/status/1446211115738931209
- Arnt 5y ago
  Where I live, protecting the hospitals from overload was the main reason given for the lockdowns that started in March 2020. The vaccine succeeds in protecting hospitals (the rate of hospitalisation is now about one sixth of what it was at comparable infection incidence at the end of last year), so it maybe a thin reed but it's a reed that does the job.
  - AndrewBissell 5y ago
    The hospitals are in much worse shape after terminating all the unvaccinated staff. When they "give" you that as the reason for what they are doing, they are lying. If that was truly their motivation they would have increased hospital capacity, not reduced it. And now that "the hospitals are overwhelmed" is justification in the public's mind for sweeping emergency powers, you should expect them to be some level of 'overwhelmed' (at least, according to the press) in perpetuity.
    - zibzab 5y ago
      OP said hospitalizations has reduced to 1/6th. Unless you can prove to me that 5 of every 6 doctors and nurses have quite due to vaccin mandates i think we are in better shapes as before (even ignoring that anti-vaxxers in hospitals act as superspreaders)
      - AndrewBissell 5y ago
        Covid hospitalizations were reduced to 1/6th. Are those the only kinds of hospitalizations?
        ericb 5y ago
        No, but they are the only ones with high hospital demand currently being driven by an explosive contagious vector.
        Arnt 5y ago
        No. But that's not the key question. The key question is: Did this reduction reduce the hospital requirement forecasts such that hospitals have free beds and can handle sudden and big accidents? An aircraft crash, a derailed train, a wave of food poisonings? And that is now the case, since the vaccines protect so well against severe effects.
  - Proven 5y ago
    Many people have built natural immunity since March 2020, so now vs then is not comparable at all.
  - might9900 5y ago
    This. I'm a doc covering our ICU and I'm seeing an endless stream of Delta COVID-19 patients which are 95% unvaccinated and younger than in 2020. There are many socio-politico-scientific issues/stories surrounding SARS-CoV-2 but, in my opinion, the most dangerous impact of this virus is the ability it has to massively deplete medical resources in a region. In real-time, SARS-CoV-2 is saturating our beds/resources and burning-out staff. No staff have been dismissed from our healthcare system (~20 hospitals) due to unvaccinated status and nurse staffing has been critical since spring of 2020. Considerable effort is expended daily just to find staffed beds for patients within our hospital (or within our region if we are at max). (Have been a long-time reader of HN and this is my first post. Just want to thank everyone for a great community over the years. Well done.)
raxxorrax 5y ago
How would that work? How is immunity defined? Anti-body count?
- nradov 5y ago
  There is no simple definition of immunity. It's not a binary condition. The human immune system is complex with multiple mechanisms at work. Long term immunity tends to depend more on memory cells than circulating antibodies.
- wbsss4412 5y ago
  Note that it didn’t say immunity. The quoted number is saying the rate of hospitalization and death among the vaccinated is 90% lower than it is among the unvaccinated. It’s a simple calculation. Group a had X hospitalizations, group b had Y. Adjusting for population sizes, X is 90% lower than Y.

zibzab 5y ago

Not sure if this is against HN guidelines, but these are his submissions from THIS WEEK. I let you decide what is going on here: ----- Pfizer vaccine immunity diminishes, can reach as low as 20% after 4 months (insider.com) 6 points by AndrewBissell 1 hour ago | flag | past | 6 comments 2. Hospitals consider universal DNR orders for coronavirus patients (2020) (washingtonpost.com) 4 points by AndrewBissell 19 hours ago | flag | past | 1 comment 3. Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna vaccine in men under 30 (yahoo.com) 14 points by AndrewBissell 22 hours ago | flag | past | 6 comments 4. Pfizer Asks FDA to Authorize Its Covid-19 Vaccine for Children Aged 5 to 11 (nytimes.com) 2 points by AndrewBissell 1 day ago | flag | past | discuss 5. Contrived Spectacles of “Protecting and Caring for the People” (brownstone.org) 2 points by AndrewBissell 1 day ago | flag | past | discuss 6. A Report on Covid-19 Vaccine Associated Myocarditis Adverse Events in VAERS (sciencedirect.com) 20 points by AndrewBissell 1 day ago | flag | past | discuss 7. Mechanism of molnupiravir-induced SARS-CoV-2 mutagenesis (nature.com) 2 points by AndrewBissell 1 day ago | flag | past | discuss 8. Sweden pauses use of Moderna COVID vaccine for people under 30 (reuters.com) 7 points by AndrewBissell 2 days ago | flag | past | 1 comment 9. University of Colorado Health denies kidney transplant to unvaccinated patient (twitter.com/tgeitner) 10 points by AndrewBissell 2 days ago | flag | past | 6 comments 10. A ‘Pacemaker for the Brain’: No Treatment Helped Her Depression – Until This (nytimes.com) 9 points by AndrewBissell 2 days ago | flag | past | 1 comment 11. Predominance of antibody-resistant Covid variants in Bay Area breakthrough cases (medrxiv.org) 10 points by AndrewBissell 3 days ago | flag | past | discuss 12. A Company Family: The Untold History of Obama and the CIA (covertactionmagazine.com) 2 points by AndrewBissell 4 days ago | flag | past | discuss 13. How OSHA will enforce the vaccine mandate for 80 million workers (npr.org) 3 points by AndrewBissell 4 days ago | flag | past | 1 comment 14. 8 in 10 children suffered mental health issues due to Covid response (express.co.uk) 2 points by AndrewBissell 4 days ago | flag | past | discuss 15. Nosocomial Delta variant outbreak in a highly vaccinated and high PPE population (eurosurveillance.org) 3 points by AndrewBissell 5 days ago | flag | past | 1 comment 16. Increases in Covid-19 are unrelated to levels of vaccination across 68 countries (springer.com) 14 points by AndrewBissell 5 days ago | flag | past | 2 comments 17. “Look It Up, Check It Out”: REX 84 and the History of an American Conspiracy (wearethemutants.com) 3 points by AndrewBissell 5 days ago | flag | past | discuss 18. Tamiflu and influenza vaccines: More harm than good? (bmj.com) 9 points by AndrewBissell 5 days ago | flag | past | discuss 19. Merck created hit list to discredit dissenting doctors (2009) (cbsnews.com) 39 points by AndrewBissell 6 days ago | flag | past | 6 comments 20. Ontario university will not allow unvaccinated students to take online courses (ctvnews.ca) 5 points by AndrewBissell 6 days ago | flag | past | 3 comments 21. Molnupiravir inhibits SARS-CoV-2 in vitro but is mutagenic in mammalian cells (bvsalud.org) 3 points by AndrewBissell 6 days ago | flag | past | discuss 22. Durability of immune responses to the Pfizer vaccine (biorxiv.org) 2 points by AndrewBissell 7 days ago | flag | past | discuss 23. Vietnam abandons zero-Covid strategy after record drop in GDP (ft.com) 8 points by AndrewBissell 7 days ago | flag | past | 1 comment 24. IRS would track all bank transactions over $600 in Biden plan; Businesses revolt (yahoo.com) 12 points by AndrewBissell 7 days ago | flag | past | 4 comments 25. Incidence of Audiological Adverse Effects Induced by Covid-19 Vaccines (sagepub.com) 1 point by AndrewBissell 7 days ago | flag | past | discuss