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The problem with this phrasing is it implies that motivation is an inherent aspect of individuals. Nobody is a do-er. Motivation is impacted by a variety of fac

The problem with this phrasing is it implies that motivation is an inherent aspect of individuals. Nobody is a do-er. Motivation is impacted by a variety of factors.

jacquesm 5y ago
Agreed, and key to both job negotiations and many other situations is to find out what motivates the other party to do as they do, even if it seems to be aligned with your own interests, if the motivation is a different one then that may spell trouble down the road.
jonny_eh 5y ago
While you're right that motivation isn't purely an inherent trait of the individual, it is certainly a factor. The old nature vs nurture (or circumstance) debate. The answer is usually a mix of both.
- Trasmatta 5y ago
  There's a neurochemical component to it for sure. Motivation is a complicated process that takes place in the brain, and can be influenced by genetics, lifestyle, and drugs. Some people's brains are just wired from the beginning to be more of a Do-er. Some people gain that skill through practice or drugs, and some people learn to Do in spite of a brain that seems to be constantly fighting against that.
  - meheleventyone 5y ago
    Motivation for a particular thing is also highly dependent on your material circumstances. I ski a lot more living by the mountains than I did when I lived two hours away. I ski a lot less than I did before I had kids.
phaker 5y ago
Rephrased it even sounds better: It's easier to educate the motivated than motivate the educated.
PragmaticPulp 5y ago
> Nobody is a do-er. Motivation is impacted by a variety of factors. Many people are motivated by the satisfaction of getting things done and working together with others toward accomplishing something. There are many people who are motivating more or less by doing. The people who would still be coding in their spare time if programming jobs paid minimum wage simply because they enjoy doing it. Counterintuitively, you usually have to pay those people more because they're usually in the highest demand.
nonethewiser 5y ago
I think it's clear that a "do-er" is someone who is more motivated, relatively speaking. Surely you can grant some people are consistently motivated than some others.
WithinReason 5y ago
The entire point of the quote is to say that education is easier to acquire than motivation
- Jensson 5y ago
  * If you are motivated. Unmotivated people tend to not get through college.
lazide 5y ago
Actually there are people who are do-ers. Not everyone is wired the same. Personally I can’t NOT do things. Regardless of if I get paid, it works out, or I even get yelled at for doing it - I fix things, pull things apart and make them better, clean things up, learn, and solve problems regardless of the discipline. If I’m not doing those things, I feel terrible. If I do those things (and the more the merrier), I feel good. I’ve built large scale engineering teams at FAANG’s and laid (inspected) foundations for buildings I’ve made myself without error - concurrently. It pays well, if I’m smart enough to do things that provide value and most people can’t. But even if it doesn’t, I can’t help myself. So far that includes networking, electrical (permitted, household and commercial), coding, welding, machining, commercial contracts, logging, real estate investment, piloting small aircraft, rock climbing, concrete work (inspected, residential and commercial), fathering 2 healthy strong and well adjusted boys, framing, hydraulic engineering and water delivery design, teaching and mentoring many strong leaders, bespoke financial instruments, and many more. All at a level equivalent or exceeding highly rated professionals or successful folks I’ve worked with or partnered with. It’s weird, but it is what it is. I can’t help myself, and it feels almost like a disease sometimes. I did El Capitan (Mescalito) solo aid in my early 20’s for my first big wall, ‘off the couch’. It causes friction because either people don’t believe it, or once they do they can’t understand it - sometimes they even get angry or resentful. I don’t do it because I’m trying to show off. It just is who I am.
- snailysnooze 5y ago
  > So far that includes networking, electrical (permitted, household and commercial), coding, welding, machining, commercial contracts, logging, real estate investment, piloting small aircraft, rock climbing, concrete work (inspected, residential and commercial), fathering 2 healthy strong and well adjusted boys, framing, hydraulic engineering and water delivery design, teaching and mentoring many strong leaders, bespoke financial instruments, and many more Is your name James Bond by any chance?
  - lazide 5y ago
    Nope, I don’t care for killing. I did get top gun in the academy though.

The problem with this phrasing is it implies that motivation is an inherent aspect of individuals. Nobody is a do-er. Motivation is impacted by a variety of factors.

jacquesm 5y ago

Agreed, and key to both job negotiations and many other situations is to find out what motivates the other party to do as they do, even if it seems to be aligned with your own interests, if the motivation is a different one then that may spell trouble down the road.

jonny_eh 5y ago

While you're right that motivation isn't purely an inherent trait of the individual, it is certainly a factor. The old nature vs nurture (or circumstance) debate. The answer is usually a mix of both.

Trasmatta 5y ago
There's a neurochemical component to it for sure. Motivation is a complicated process that takes place in the brain, and can be influenced by genetics, lifestyle, and drugs. Some people's brains are just wired from the beginning to be more of a Do-er. Some people gain that skill through practice or drugs, and some people learn to Do in spite of a brain that seems to be constantly fighting against that.
- meheleventyone 5y ago
  Motivation for a particular thing is also highly dependent on your material circumstances. I ski a lot more living by the mountains than I did when I lived two hours away. I ski a lot less than I did before I had kids.

phaker 5y ago

Rephrased it even sounds better: It's easier to educate the motivated than motivate the educated.

PragmaticPulp 5y ago

> Nobody is a do-er. Motivation is impacted by a variety of factors. Many people are motivated by the satisfaction of getting things done and working together with others toward accomplishing something. There are many people who are motivating more or less by doing. The people who would still be coding in their spare time if programming jobs paid minimum wage simply because they enjoy doing it. Counterintuitively, you usually have to pay those people more because they're usually in the highest demand.

nonethewiser 5y ago

I think it's clear that a "do-er" is someone who is more motivated, relatively speaking. Surely you can grant some people are consistently motivated than some others.

WithinReason 5y ago

The entire point of the quote is to say that education is easier to acquire than motivation

Jensson 5y ago
* If you are motivated. Unmotivated people tend to not get through college.

lazide 5y ago

Actually there are people who are do-ers. Not everyone is wired the same. Personally I can’t NOT do things. Regardless of if I get paid, it works out, or I even get yelled at for doing it - I fix things, pull things apart and make them better, clean things up, learn, and solve problems regardless of the discipline. If I’m not doing those things, I feel terrible. If I do those things (and the more the merrier), I feel good. I’ve built large scale engineering teams at FAANG’s and laid (inspected) foundations for buildings I’ve made myself without error - concurrently. It pays well, if I’m smart enough to do things that provide value and most people can’t. But even if it doesn’t, I can’t help myself. So far that includes networking, electrical (permitted, household and commercial), coding, welding, machining, commercial contracts, logging, real estate investment, piloting small aircraft, rock climbing, concrete work (inspected, residential and commercial), fathering 2 healthy strong and well adjusted boys, framing, hydraulic engineering and water delivery design, teaching and mentoring many strong leaders, bespoke financial instruments, and many more. All at a level equivalent or exceeding highly rated professionals or successful folks I’ve worked with or partnered with. It’s weird, but it is what it is. I can’t help myself, and it feels almost like a disease sometimes. I did El Capitan (Mescalito) solo aid in my early 20’s for my first big wall, ‘off the couch’. It causes friction because either people don’t believe it, or once they do they can’t understand it - sometimes they even get angry or resentful. I don’t do it because I’m trying to show off. It just is who I am.

snailysnooze 5y ago
> So far that includes networking, electrical (permitted, household and commercial), coding, welding, machining, commercial contracts, logging, real estate investment, piloting small aircraft, rock climbing, concrete work (inspected, residential and commercial), fathering 2 healthy strong and well adjusted boys, framing, hydraulic engineering and water delivery design, teaching and mentoring many strong leaders, bespoke financial instruments, and many more Is your name James Bond by any chance?
- lazide 5y ago
  Nope, I don’t care for killing. I did get top gun in the academy though.