4 ms·

I've done like three or four video calls at work since corona (=full remote). I don't get the US obsession with video calls. Voice is perfectly cromulent for al

I've done like three or four video calls at work since corona (=full remote). I don't get the US obsession with video calls. Voice is perfectly cromulent for almost everything (see: those 3-4 exceptions). In distributed teams involving people from multiple countries you probably want to avoid both video and voice calls because on average everyone is much better at writing and reading English compared to speaking and listening.

Hamuko 5y ago
Most of the meetings that I attend as a full-time remote employee are ones where someone is sharing a screen anyways. There's little screen real estate for anyone's webcam and I wouldn't really be interested in staring at them since I'm primarily looking at the shared screen.
- Scoundreller 5y ago
  That’s where voice comes in handy. I’d hate to have to type while demonstrating the issue or solutions in the screenshare. Then the difficulty on the other side of having to read since the host’s typing shows up in a side box instead of like a TV subtitle. Sometimes we’ll have stakeholders call in on their iPad or whatever, but they’re passive so it’s best to avoid text if they do need to jump in.
bgatl 5y ago
The obsession is clear at least: Video calls are the narcissist's prime weapon of choice to fake useful involvement in a project. Many managers grade people on presence and eloquence in meetings. What is not clear is why the actually productive people don't push back.
- nottorp 5y ago
  > What is not clear is why the actually productive people don't push back. Easier to change jobs until the culture fits. Especialy with remote jobs.
vaylian 5y ago
A lot of people had very little video/voicechat experience before the pandemic. It doesn't occur to them, that the "downgrade" to audio-only is actually better than video+audio. Text trumps audio in terms of communicating hard facts. But many people outside of the tech industry can't properly touch-type. Just consider how many people still make phone calls instead of writing an e-mail.
- lbriner 5y ago
  Many people in the tech industry can't touch-type! Certainly in the UK, and probably Europe, where you are much less likely to have a comp-sci degree, it is very hard to create consistent requirements for devs like "touch type 60 words per minute" or "understands patterns and principles". It would be great to have something, even an industry standard like exists for law, medicine and even some building trades to at least have a base-level of consistency. I think this would help communication a lot - the domain language like "this wouldn't work as a Singleton because we need to subclass it" is nice and terse but only if you know the words.
  - kgwgk 5y ago
    > much less likely to have a comp-sci degree > consistent requirements for devs like "touch type 60 words per minute" How are those two things related? Is typing part of the computer science curriculum?
    - Aeolun 5y ago
      It was part of my elementary school curriculum :/ and that was 22 years ago. (In the Netherlands, and of course we used typewriters, since we didn’t have that many computers yet) Edit: modified for clarity based on comment
      - kgwgk 5y ago
        I'm pretty sure computers were not so rare in the Netherlands in 1999!
anyfactor 5y ago
I do freelancing and I hate calls in general. There are people out there who would not even give a single sentence description of what they want rather it is "when can you jump on a call with me". They assume the task is difficult to explain in text but to me it often sounds like they don't even have an idea of what they want really. They want me to hold their hands and lead them through a journey of self discovery while on the ride we discover joy and surprise and at the end of the tunnel only to discover the project is radically abstract and the client is not happy to pay on a per hour basis.

Hamuko 5y ago

Most of the meetings that I attend as a full-time remote employee are ones where someone is sharing a screen anyways. There's little screen real estate for anyone's webcam and I wouldn't really be interested in staring at them since I'm primarily looking at the shared screen.

Scoundreller 5y ago
That’s where voice comes in handy. I’d hate to have to type while demonstrating the issue or solutions in the screenshare. Then the difficulty on the other side of having to read since the host’s typing shows up in a side box instead of like a TV subtitle. Sometimes we’ll have stakeholders call in on their iPad or whatever, but they’re passive so it’s best to avoid text if they do need to jump in.

bgatl 5y ago

The obsession is clear at least: Video calls are the narcissist's prime weapon of choice to fake useful involvement in a project. Many managers grade people on presence and eloquence in meetings. What is not clear is why the actually productive people don't push back.

nottorp 5y ago
> What is not clear is why the actually productive people don't push back. Easier to change jobs until the culture fits. Especialy with remote jobs.

vaylian 5y ago

A lot of people had very little video/voicechat experience before the pandemic. It doesn't occur to them, that the "downgrade" to audio-only is actually better than video+audio. Text trumps audio in terms of communicating hard facts. But many people outside of the tech industry can't properly touch-type. Just consider how many people still make phone calls instead of writing an e-mail.

lbriner 5y ago
Many people in the tech industry can't touch-type! Certainly in the UK, and probably Europe, where you are much less likely to have a comp-sci degree, it is very hard to create consistent requirements for devs like "touch type 60 words per minute" or "understands patterns and principles". It would be great to have something, even an industry standard like exists for law, medicine and even some building trades to at least have a base-level of consistency. I think this would help communication a lot - the domain language like "this wouldn't work as a Singleton because we need to subclass it" is nice and terse but only if you know the words.
- kgwgk 5y ago
  > much less likely to have a comp-sci degree > consistent requirements for devs like "touch type 60 words per minute" How are those two things related? Is typing part of the computer science curriculum?
  - Aeolun 5y ago
    It was part of my elementary school curriculum :/ and that was 22 years ago. (In the Netherlands, and of course we used typewriters, since we didn’t have that many computers yet) Edit: modified for clarity based on comment
    - kgwgk 5y ago
      I'm pretty sure computers were not so rare in the Netherlands in 1999!

anyfactor 5y ago

I do freelancing and I hate calls in general. There are people out there who would not even give a single sentence description of what they want rather it is "when can you jump on a call with me". They assume the task is difficult to explain in text but to me it often sounds like they don't even have an idea of what they want really. They want me to hold their hands and lead them through a journey of self discovery while on the ride we discover joy and surprise and at the end of the tunnel only to discover the project is radically abstract and the client is not happy to pay on a per hour basis.