12 ms·

Australian gov to use facial recognition and GPS tracking to enforce quarantine

80 points by throwawayfear 5y ago

throwawayfear 5y ago
To "enforce quarantine"
Ms-J 5y ago
Citizens need to enforce and assert their rights there before it's too late.
- s5300 5y ago
  Did you never learn that the definition of a government includes having a monopoly on violence? Australia would essentially become a failed state with your suggestion, and I don't exactly think the government is just going to let that happen.
  - bpodgursky 5y ago
    If governments all had a permanent monopoly on violence we would all be forever living under the eternal dynasty of God-Emperor Hammurabi CCCXXIVI in the all-kingdom stretching from the Euphrates to all the sun has ever touched. Sometimes you have to break the rules to make long-term positive changes.
  - anfilt 5y ago
    Armed rebellion is not always needed to make changes. However just letting the state do what it wants without push back certainly is not going to change things.
    - rajamaka 5y ago
      It's also currently illegal to organise protests or leave the country.
      - jimmaswell 5y ago
        The first being obvious enough in its abhorrence, and the second being a violation of human rights as defined by the UN. Unfortunately it seems like a large amount of Australians are eager for even more of this authoritarianism. By the time they learn their lesson it will be too late.
  - pclmulqdq 5y ago
    Australia is already a failed state. That happened the second they decided to imprison their populace and started talking about the "New world order." The state has failed its people, and the only thing left is for it to crumble.
    - mandelbrotwurst 5y ago
      Wow, who was it in their government who was discussing a NWO? Do you have any link / source / context?
      - Covzire 5y ago
        https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/australasia/australia-new-world-order-conspiracies-b1917082.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/australasia/austral...
      - pclmulqdq 5y ago
        The chief medical officer of New South Wales said it during a press conference recently
      - jwond 5y ago
        It was the chief health officer of New South Wales, Dr. Kerry Chant. Dr. Chant said: “We will be looking at what contact tracing looks like in the New World Order…yes it will be pubs and clubs and other things if we have a positive case there.” https://www.independent.co.uk/tv/news/new-world-order-australia-covid-v54072845 https://www.independent.co.uk/tv/news/new-world-order-austra...
        mandelbrotwurst 5y ago
        Oof, thanks.
    - hilbert42 5y ago
      There is nothing wrong with contact tracing during a pandemic. It's been used by many countries in the past including the US. Let's go back a long way to 1854 during the cholera epidemic in London when Dr John Snow found that the Broad Street pump was its cause and he located it by contact tracing those who contacted cholera and worked backwards to the source. This case is famous for the very fact it shows that contact tracing and isolating saves lives (please ensure that you look at the map he used to trace the pump): https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1854_Broad_Street_cholera_outbreak https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1854_Broad_Street_cholera_ou... I can attest to this, contact tracing put a quick end to the COVID outbreak near where I live and I'm very thankful for the work those tracers did under very arduous circumstances. In principle, contact tracing during a pandemic has nothing to do with the general increase in surveillance that's gripping the planet at the moment - it is an entirely separate matter. The fact that we have sleezebag governments prepared to subvert a decent legitimate process is - again - a separate and serious problem for democracy.
  - throwawayfear 5y ago
    Australia is already on its way to being a failed state by now. Police and military patrol the streets to enforce rules, “papers please” tyranny is required to live, and soon they’ll demand complete surveillance and control in your own house. Wake up before it is too late. https://theconversation.com/vaccine-passports-are-coming-to-australia-how-will-they-work-and-what-will-you-need-them-for-167531 https://theconversation.com/vaccine-passports-are-coming-to-... “NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian yesterday announced freedoms for fully vaccinated people once 70% of the state’s eligible population are double dosed. These include being able to go to hospitality venues, hairdressers and gyms, and have five people to your home.” They are even now trying to limit how many people you can have over in your own home. It is a failed state. Wake up before you are enslaved.
    - 6nf 5y ago
      No vaccine? You're never getting a haircut again. Or buying clothes in a store. Or meeting friends outside or going to a restaurant. Australia is done, I'm making plans to leave. And judging by the downvotes people think this stuff is acceptable?
      - hug 5y ago
        I would rather anti-vaxers leave the country than continue to hang around, yes. Do I think that it will be acceptable if lockdowns continue in Australia past the point at which the various state governments have agreed they will stop (i.e.: the 70% and 80% population vaccinated marks)? No. Do I think the reason why those targets are harder to meet than necessary is because of unscientific fearmongering idiots refusing to get the vaccine? Yes. In a way, I blame this more on you than on the government.
        drcross 5y ago
        If you think you need a vaccine for a disease with a median age of death that's 84 you've badly failed at basic risk analysis and you've been massaged by the machine.
- lwansbrough 5y ago
  What rights? Australia does not have a bill of rights. It has a very limited number of fundamental rights outlined in the Constitution but other than that you seem to be pretty much screwed, which explains why these draconian measures always seem to land in Australia first.
  - wyager 5y ago
    Presumably the GP is referring to a conception of rights that exist independently of a piece of paper declaring their existence.
    - skeletonjelly 5y ago
      Well how do you enforce a concept? One move would be to introduce a bill of rights
  - throwawaylinux 5y ago
    Rights exist by what people demand and exercise and do. A "bill of rights" is a piece of paper. A piece of paper which is ruled upon by a court that was granted its power by the very same collection of papers. For example, the right to keep and bear arms (obviously not for hunting but for war and security) has been infringed upon many times, but constitutional courts have decided that actually despite the bill of rights, some infringement is allowed. (EDIT: And this doesn't even address the problem of governments creating unconstitutional laws or executing unconstitutional actions which de facto strip your rights for some possibly significant time until it can be overturned by a court, but without much redress or punishment or deterrent) In the end the people are the ultimate arbiters and deciders of what rights they are willing to give up and what powers they are willing to be governed under. This plays out the same way in USA and Australia and Afghanistan and Libya.
    - dd444fgdfg 5y ago
      I for one agree with you. I've never understood why America puts of with basically being a police state, with the level of police brutality and incarceration that they have. And here in aussieland, we don't have that, but we do nothing to protect our liberties.
- gobookdev 5y ago
  We just had hundreds of thousands of people go to the beach yesterday ignoring lockdown orders, I was worried about my country having read things like Gulag Archipelago, but the general population have shown where their line is. Still we're now a police state and the general population doesn't seem to give a shit about that.
  - throwawayfear 5y ago
    Rally your people and take it to the politicians’ offices until they throw out these policies entirely. Wear masks and go in big numbers.
    - the_third_wave 5y ago
      Better throw out the politicians together with the policies. Now that they've shown their true colours it would be foolhardy to expect them to restrain their authoritarian instincts come the next emergency - and if there is one thing easily come by these days it seems to be emergencies. Kick 'm out, elect a new batch and keep their feet to the fire.
      - HKH2 5y ago
        Both major parties are authoritarian. Australia has a good electoral system but people have to stop believing in major parties, or that it doesn't matter, and vote in droves for independents and minor parties (who, if unelected, give their votes to the party they prefer).
    - gobookdev 5y ago
      Dude that organised the last protest got 8 months prison. 75% of the population agrees with some of the totalitarian laws. Still a great country, but I'm looking at other places to live, Senior Engineer so it won't be hard to get sponsorship. Thinking about USA where people really understand the importance of their constitution, and the tech sector is the strongest in the world.
      - 5y ago
- threeseed 5y ago
  You are not being forced to do this. You can instead spend 2 weeks locked up in a hotel at your expense.
  - throwawayfear 5y ago
    What kind of insanity have we collectively tolerated that “you can pay to be locked up in a ‘hotel’ tor two weeks” is seen as some kind of evidence that there is no compulsion? That’s like saying people aren’t forced to vaccinate since you don’t “need” to work at that particular job and you don’t “need” to exercise in a gym or watch a movie in a theater. Everything in history shows the slope is slippery. They will pass this on to everyone. It’s a blatant power grab. They want to spy on you and track you. They don’t care about your health.
    - shkkmo 5y ago
      The kind of insanity that has been the law for well over a year. Getting outraged at an effort to make that policy less draconian is pretty silly.
      - throwawayfear 5y ago
        It can be a law for ten years. Doesn't make it less of a shitty law. And I think the outrage is useful. It will mobilize people until it boils over into action, if enough people do it when it actually counts. This is when it actually counts. Everyone has spent all their Outrage Points on useless shit some actor or celebrity said about something no one will care about on their deathbed, but so few are saying anything about this totalitarian nightmare.
        shkkmo 5y ago
        I was not defending the law. But the App that is the subject of the article serves to reduce the severity of that law and thus reduces government overreach. To be upset about the App, rather than the original quarantine law, is to be focusing attention in the wrong place.
- teclordphrack2 5y ago
  Did you even read the article?
blitz_skull 5y ago
Wow. It’s like the twilight zone over there. I’m quite concerned at the lengths governments are going to take away our rights. All in the name of “the good of others”.
- InvertedRhodium 5y ago
  Couldn't agree more - the fact that my request to go on a stabbing rampage was declined due to "the good of others" is a travesty against human rights and the freedoms that come with them.
  - blitz_skull 5y ago
    Don’t imagine many folks are making requests for those sort of shenanigans. Seems kinda like something you do of your own accord, yeah?
    - InvertedRhodium 5y ago
      But then I'd have to go on a stabbing spree, when simply complaining about it online is a much safer - and more importantly comfortable - if ultimately pointless endeavor.
- tootahe45 5y ago
  That's just the excuse, and the excuses don't come very often so you have to pass as many bs laws while the average voter is in a panic.
  - jimmaswell 5y ago
    Never let a crisis go to waste.
- kongin 5y ago
  Believing what you see on the news about covid is like believing the USSR's growth numbers. It's the terminally online and politicians who push the narrative, the rest don't care, including the police. In Australia it's under 20% of people that have gone insane. The rest have checked out and completely ignored it. It's like a long holiday where you get paid to pretend you work. But you can't say that in polite company so you just have ~40 percent compliance with whatever insanity is going on now. Hilariously enough the compliance from police is lower than from the general population so basically we have politicians and the terminally online talking about masks, jabs and sign ins and the people who are supposed to enforce it not being bothered with it. Standing in front of the super market something like one in three pull out their phone, unlock it, point it at the check in qr code and not log in. I'm reminded of the latter days of the USSR where no one took anything the government said seriously and just did whatever they felt like. Which does not bode well for the current incarnation of Australia long term.
ghuntley 5y ago
Source code for the South Australian app is at https://twitter.com/geoffreyhuntley/status/1430877183996690439?s=21 https://twitter.com/geoffreyhuntley/status/14308771839966904...
glaucon 5y ago
"... following a selective tender process in November" Remarkably slow process given that we are dealing with a pandemic. Worth pointing out that "Australian gov to use" should read "South Australian gov to use" (South Australia being a state of Australia). EDIT: As this thread is attracting attention from people who have views different from my own I'd just like to make it clear that I'm in favour of controlling the actions of people who choose to endanger public health and nothing I said above is meant to suggest otherwise.
- chrisco255 5y ago
  We're dealing with an endemic disease that is going on its third year. At some point, people and governments need to recognize that fact: it's not controllable and it will spread eventually no matter how dystopian you get.
  - notyourday 5y ago
    But we have not tried putting people into individual cages yet. We should do it for their own good. After all, COVID is terrible for grandma Suzi. If we space the cages at 10 feet rather than 6 it should totally work to stop the spread of COVID and it will all be good! #trustthescience
    - throwawayfear 5y ago
      This is tongue in cheek but there are absolutely people even in tech who are either stupid enough to go along with that or secretly want that because they are full of hate towards the “unvaxxed.” Which makes the media fearmongering about the “unvaxxed” even more dangerous. They never mention immunity from past infection which is now known to be superior protection. Here’s a recent source: https://www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-once-confers-much-greater-immunity-vaccine-vaccination-remains-vital https://www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-on... That they insist on vaccinated vs unvaccinated in the media narrative is worrisome because it is going to lead to dehumanization and division.
notyourday 5y ago
No, no, no. This is HN. We are, like, possible COVID restrictions are good thing! Violate quarantine?! Beat them all up! It is for the children! And grandma! Google tracking you to place an ad in front of you for a better set of headphones than the ones you are currently shopping for that you can simply not buy? Now that's a violation of human rights!
jp0d 5y ago
This might be an unpopular opinion! But there are some really bad people out there. The situation is getting out of hand here in Melbourne and there are people like this family who're Covid positive and still out and about in the community. We should blame selfish people like these for such measures from the government. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/melbourne/article-9964173/Moment-Covid-infected-family-confronts-health-officials-Melbourne-hotspot.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/melbourne/article-9964173/M...
- tosstoyevsky 5y ago
  The people aren’t to blame for an extreme government overreach.
  - jp0d 5y ago
    I think people like these deserve to be locked up! Either that or put a tracker on these people. I'm not saying that about all Covid positive people but just some of these extremely selfish pricks.
  - megablast 5y ago
    Yeah? What should the gov do in a health emergency?
  - shkkmo 5y ago
    > Downloading and using the G2G app is voluntary in WA, but the Government encourages people to use it, claiming it “keeps you safe and the rest of the community safe while freeing up more police resources that would otherwise be undertaking more regular physical checks”. Where is the overreach in a voluntary app that people are encouraged to use to save the government resources?
  - FridgeSeal 5y ago
    So we’re supposed to just sit around and let infectious people roam around the community (putting everyone’s health and safety at risk) because they didn’t do as politely asked? We had Katie Hopkins here earlier in the year bragging about how she was going to deliberately break quarantine etc etc. If people aren’t going to follow a reasonable precaution, this far into a pandemic, then I have little sympathy when harsher measures are employed.
oneepic 5y ago
From TFA: >Downloading and using the G2G app is voluntary in WA [Western Australia], but the Government encourages people to use it So not enforced, right...? (EDIT: my bad, this refers to an existing app; the new app sounds like it would be a mandated download)
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- shkkmo 5y ago
  The new app is part SA of creating an alternative to mandatory 2 week hotel quarantines. The app is only required for those who would rather do their 2 week quarantine in their own home.
etaioinshrdlu 5y ago
So, do the people support this? Is this a failure of a democracy, or do the people really want this?
- dmix 5y ago
  People are naturally scared of COVID and the 'unknown', they've never experienced anything like this in their lifetime so they don't really know what the limits should be and when to say no. So it's hard to ask whether the people support it in such a state. We should be very very careful relying on crisis moments to make major decisions. Which is always going to be a drawback in democracy (all systems have flaws). There will always be long term consequences as these things never have time limits. Any new capability adopted should be assumed to be permanent.
- mindwok 5y ago
  I'd say that in general Australians are more trusting of their government than our American friends. I often see poeple on Twitter like Joe Rogan and friends expressing total shock about how compliant Aussies are with what seems like draconian lockdown rules, but I think that misses the point. When our government says we can only go outside for an hour a day, there's a general sentiment that this is a shame but we understand these kind of things are necessary to get a handle on the pandemic. We don't assume this is an effort from our government to exert control, and believe this is a temporary measure in our best interests. That being said, each time I read a headline like this I get slightly more concerned that if one day this trust is ever abused, it'll be all the worse because we never fought hard against these measures.
  - throwawayfear 5y ago
    That trust will be abused. It is just a matter of time. History is full of examples. Why build this machine in the first place and then hope that whoever drives it is nice enough to not abuse the power? Why risk it? The pandemic is not dangerous enough to justify this blind faith.
    - mindwok 5y ago
nineteen999 5y ago
This headline is misleading ... "Australian gov" sounds like the Australian Federal government, but the government in question is the South Australian government, which is a State gov.
- skeletonjelly 5y ago
  Came here to point this out too Plus it's been done already by the Western Australian state government https://www.wa.gov.au/organisation/department-of-the-premier-and-cabinet/covid-19-coronavirus-g2g-now-frequently-asked-questions https://www.wa.gov.au/organisation/department-of-the-premier...
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- throwawayfear 5y ago
  It is the article's headline, and there wasn't enough space to edit in the specific state. But is it actually a meaningful distinction as far as these policies being constrained permanently to just one part of Australia? Will this spread everywhere or is there a reason why this would only be constrained to a really small town no one really notices?
  - nineteen999 5y ago
    > It is the article's headline, and there wasn't enough space to edit in the specific state. Sure - I noticed that and wasn't implying that you modified the article title. The article title is incorrect, at least in the way it reads at first glance - yes the South Australian government is "an Australian government", but it's not "The Australian Government". > But is it actually a meaningful distinction as far as these policies being constrained permanently to just one part of Australia? Will this spread everywhere or is there a reason why this would only be constrained to a really small town no one really notices? It's too early to tell - but it's worth noting that the main revenue generating states with the lion's share of attention in Australia are New South Wales and Victoria and so they usually set the tone of state policy countrywide. IMHO this is unlikely to spread to those states. More importantly: 1) the article indicates that its use will be voluntary anyway; 2) Australia has a long track record of paying millions of dollars for technology like this that actually never works properly. So as a Victorian I'm not too concerned.
swiley 5y ago
I’m done with this bullshit. Fuck Covid. Fuck extreme over reactions to it and Fuck Joe Biden.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- trainsplanes 5y ago
  Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Joe Biden is a political leader in Australia. I'm not sure if he's even Australian.
dudeinjapan 5y ago
Barreling towards Idiocracy, one dumb rule at a time.
shkkmo 5y ago
Before you jump on your outrage high horse, it would be worth your time to investigate the details. This is about South Australia adopting a new quarantine at home option for those who are entering the country. Allowing people to quaratine at home with an App rather than at designated quarantine hotels is a REDUCTION in government overreach. In Western Australia where something similar is in use, this is a voluntary part of a similar program that saves officers having to make more house calls. If you don't bother to do basic research before you get outraged, your outrage will eventually be discounted as "crying wolf" and won't be as effective the next time you need to push back against real government overreach.
- FridgeSeal 5y ago
  Ssshhhh, you’ll interrupt all the people who are desperate for an excuse to screech about their favourite topics of “failed states” and “taking up arms against the government”.
  - shkkmo 5y ago
    I share many aspects of their ideological viewpoints, I would just rather see them operate from a more informed position.
- throwawayfear 5y ago
  “It’s not government overreach, you have a choice of ‘temporary’ in-home facial recognition and GPS surveillance or staying at a quarantine hotel.” Not only is this a laughable “choice”, the kind of manipulative choice you’d expect a tech manager to pretend to offer you when all his projects suck but he wants you to feel like you “picked” a project, it’s also naive to present it as a choice. You don’t wait until it’s mandatory for everyone to say something. You say it now when the machine is rearing its ugly head and you can see the writing on the wall. Keep in mind you are writing this in defense of a gov that presumes itself to be in charge of how many people you can have over. Source: https://theconversation.com/vaccine-passports-are-coming-to-australia-how-will-they-work-and-what-will-you-need-them-for-167531 https://theconversation.com/vaccine-passports-are-coming-to-... “NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian yesterday announced freedoms for fully vaccinated people once 70% of the state’s eligible population are double dosed. These include being able to go to hospitality venues, hairdressers and gyms, and have five people to your home.” Seems more than NECESSARY to cry wolf right now. The slope is slippery. We all know they will push these systems as far as they can if they are allowed to. Cry wolf when the wolf is coming, not when it has eaten your chickens already.
lnreddy 5y ago
Once a penal colony, always a penal colony.
amanzi 5y ago
The opening paragraph of the article describes what is actually happening and it's far less ominous that what the comments here suggest. "In an official statement, the State Government announced a contract to a Western Australian (WA) company for $1.1 million to develop a new smartphone app that uses facial recognition and GPS tracking technology to monitor people who are ordered to self-quarantine at home, reported InDaily." So this isn't an app meant to enforce state-wide quarantines or to enforce any additional restrictions or controls on the general public. This app is to enable those who are specifically ordered to self-quarantine (e.g. arriving from a Covid-hotspot, or close contacts of Covid-positive cases) to be able to check-in so that they can self-quarantine at home instead of at a managed isolation facility.
- notatoad 5y ago
  yeah, there's been a lot of freaking out about this, but it's much less oppressive than being forced to stay in a quarantine hotel.
  - throwawayfear 5y ago
    Read out loud what you are saying. You are saying that government ordering you to quarantine in your house, with facial recognition and GPS tracking in your own home, is less oppressive than being forced to stay in one of their quarantine hotels. And you're saying that in response to all the "freaking out" about this. Keep in mind that when quarantined this way, if you fail to respond to their random, RANDOM, pings...they will send police officers to your house to do an in-person quarantine check. And not only that, but these so-called leaders of Australia are celebrating it and rubbing it in Australian faces. Source: Returning travelers quarantining at home will be forced to download an app that combines facial recognition and geolocation. The state will text them at random times, and thereafter they will have 15 minutes to take a picture of their face in the location where they are supposed to be. Should they fail, the local police department will be sent to follow up in person. “We don’t tell them how often or when, on a random basis they have to reply within 15 minutes,” Premier Steven Marshall explained. “I think every South Australian should feel pretty proud that we are the national pilot for the home-based quarantine app.” https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/09/pandemic-australia-still-liberal-democracy/619940/ https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/09/pandemic-a... You see that? South Australians should feel pretty proud that they're the national pilot for this. What an honor.
shirro 5y ago
The Australian federal government has introduced wide ranging warrantless powers that allow for a lot of potential abuse of computers and communications. These have had bi-partisan support and been rushed through parliament with very little debate or discussion from the complicit mainstream media. This stuff is likely pushed by our large allies and it isn't going away and likely allows Australia to be used as a backdoor to spy on our allies citizens as well. This is potentially really serious long term problem and gets almost no debate in Australia. Meanwhile these localised state based measures aimed at fighting this pandemic are another thing entirely. Our state governments are not part of five eyes and aren't under pressure to maintain any of these measures indefinitely. They want to keep local businesses active by avoiding lockdowns and keep their tightly budgeted public health systems working. Our less populated states here managed to get through the pandemic basically virus free without much in the way of restrictions within their states. I don't think people understand how good we have had this. Our vaccines supply was delayed but now that has improved all the states are opening up once vaccine targets are reached and the state want to ease into the change. We still have very low vaccination rates compared to many countries where vaccinations were expedited as the only real viable solution. To reopen state borders and allow more potentially infected people in we need to be able to quarantine infectious people without locking them up and an app is a cheap solution. Once covid is endemic and as vaccination rates climb there won't be any point to quarantining people and the app will be discarded. It isn't for surveilling the entire population but for individuals for the relatively short time they might be shedding virus. People are right to be vigilant but you all have the wrong target here. The right target is the Australian federal government's mass surveillance laws. An app that will be used for a week or two by a sick person then discarded isn't the real problem.
jeeeb 5y ago
This probably doesn’t come across to an international audience but Australia is in a really weird state at the moment. On one hand you have QLD/SA/WA which are probably the places least effected in the world by COVID. QLD for example with a population of 5.2 million has had a total of 7 deaths from COVID over the entirety of the pandemic. Schools, shops and workplaces have all been pretty much running as normal the last 18 months in these states. On the other hand you have the South East states which have large active delta outbreaks and have gone through long lockdowns, especially Victoria. These states have given up eliminating COVID and are planning on letting COVID spread as vaccination rates meet targets. Residents from the SE states are effectively locked out from the rest of Australia. State borders are shut and have been on and off for much of the pandemic. Thus Australia is in some ways operating as two countries at this stage. What’s more international travel to Australia is effectively shutoff. The only people allowed back are Australians and there is a wait list and you better be planning on moving back to live permanently. Obviously no one wants to split the country in half. No one wants suspend international travel indefinitely. In particular the federal government views its reelection chances as effectively riding on getting things to a semblance of normality by Christmas. Yet residents of places like SA and WA obviously do not want to give up their COVID free status. Hence you see the search for solutions like this. The app does address a genuine problem. In particular, hotel quarantine was introduced in Australia after home quarantine failed due to wide spread non-compliance. Yet it is expensive , capacity is limited and hotels aren’t great quarantine facilities in the first place. Sealed windows and shared ventilation systems in particular are problematic. Whether or not the trade off in tracking people for two weeks is worth it, I’m not sure. I don’t think these measures will be around permanently though. The slightest suggestion of permanent measures has been slapped down hard so far.
Handytinge 5y ago
This is an interesting choice of article of the many on this matter. The title is wrong (it’s state government, not federal. You wouldn’t post “US government” when Florida enacts something). The intent of this program is as a trial to see if this improves things or not. I suspect a lot of the readers here are lacking any real knowledge of Australia’s treatment of COVID-19 beyond the odd random news article and are looking through their own localised lenses. Before criticising, it may be worth taking some time to research and understand. Our death toll in total in 18 months is about the same as the current daily death toll in the US. We have achieved this via means that simply would not work in the US due to dissension between states and differing views on the practically of temporarily giving up freedoms for the greater good.

80 points by throwawayfear 5y ago

throwawayfear 5y ago

To "enforce quarantine"

Ms-J 5y ago

Citizens need to enforce and assert their rights there before it's too late.

s5300 5y ago
Did you never learn that the definition of a government includes having a monopoly on violence? Australia would essentially become a failed state with your suggestion, and I don't exactly think the government is just going to let that happen.
- bpodgursky 5y ago
  If governments all had a permanent monopoly on violence we would all be forever living under the eternal dynasty of God-Emperor Hammurabi CCCXXIVI in the all-kingdom stretching from the Euphrates to all the sun has ever touched. Sometimes you have to break the rules to make long-term positive changes.
- anfilt 5y ago
  Armed rebellion is not always needed to make changes. However just letting the state do what it wants without push back certainly is not going to change things.
  - rajamaka 5y ago
    It's also currently illegal to organise protests or leave the country.
    - jimmaswell 5y ago
      The first being obvious enough in its abhorrence, and the second being a violation of human rights as defined by the UN. Unfortunately it seems like a large amount of Australians are eager for even more of this authoritarianism. By the time they learn their lesson it will be too late.
- pclmulqdq 5y ago
  Australia is already a failed state. That happened the second they decided to imprison their populace and started talking about the "New world order." The state has failed its people, and the only thing left is for it to crumble.
  - mandelbrotwurst 5y ago
    Wow, who was it in their government who was discussing a NWO? Do you have any link / source / context?
    - Covzire 5y ago
      https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/australasia/australia-new-world-order-conspiracies-b1917082.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/australasia/austral...
    - pclmulqdq 5y ago
      The chief medical officer of New South Wales said it during a press conference recently
    - jwond 5y ago
      It was the chief health officer of New South Wales, Dr. Kerry Chant. Dr. Chant said: “We will be looking at what contact tracing looks like in the New World Order…yes it will be pubs and clubs and other things if we have a positive case there.” https://www.independent.co.uk/tv/news/new-world-order-australia-covid-v54072845 https://www.independent.co.uk/tv/news/new-world-order-austra...
      - mandelbrotwurst 5y ago
        Oof, thanks.
  - hilbert42 5y ago
    There is nothing wrong with contact tracing during a pandemic. It's been used by many countries in the past including the US. Let's go back a long way to 1854 during the cholera epidemic in London when Dr John Snow found that the Broad Street pump was its cause and he located it by contact tracing those who contacted cholera and worked backwards to the source. This case is famous for the very fact it shows that contact tracing and isolating saves lives (please ensure that you look at the map he used to trace the pump): https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1854_Broad_Street_cholera_outbreak https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1854_Broad_Street_cholera_ou... I can attest to this, contact tracing put a quick end to the COVID outbreak near where I live and I'm very thankful for the work those tracers did under very arduous circumstances. In principle, contact tracing during a pandemic has nothing to do with the general increase in surveillance that's gripping the planet at the moment - it is an entirely separate matter. The fact that we have sleezebag governments prepared to subvert a decent legitimate process is - again - a separate and serious problem for democracy.
- throwawayfear 5y ago
  Australia is already on its way to being a failed state by now. Police and military patrol the streets to enforce rules, “papers please” tyranny is required to live, and soon they’ll demand complete surveillance and control in your own house. Wake up before it is too late. https://theconversation.com/vaccine-passports-are-coming-to-australia-how-will-they-work-and-what-will-you-need-them-for-167531 https://theconversation.com/vaccine-passports-are-coming-to-... “NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian yesterday announced freedoms for fully vaccinated people once 70% of the state’s eligible population are double dosed. These include being able to go to hospitality venues, hairdressers and gyms, and have five people to your home.” They are even now trying to limit how many people you can have over in your own home. It is a failed state. Wake up before you are enslaved.
  - 6nf 5y ago
    No vaccine? You're never getting a haircut again. Or buying clothes in a store. Or meeting friends outside or going to a restaurant. Australia is done, I'm making plans to leave. And judging by the downvotes people think this stuff is acceptable?
    - hug 5y ago
      I would rather anti-vaxers leave the country than continue to hang around, yes. Do I think that it will be acceptable if lockdowns continue in Australia past the point at which the various state governments have agreed they will stop (i.e.: the 70% and 80% population vaccinated marks)? No. Do I think the reason why those targets are harder to meet than necessary is because of unscientific fearmongering idiots refusing to get the vaccine? Yes. In a way, I blame this more on you than on the government.
      - drcross 5y ago
        If you think you need a vaccine for a disease with a median age of death that's 84 you've badly failed at basic risk analysis and you've been massaged by the machine.
lwansbrough 5y ago
What rights? Australia does not have a bill of rights. It has a very limited number of fundamental rights outlined in the Constitution but other than that you seem to be pretty much screwed, which explains why these draconian measures always seem to land in Australia first.
- wyager 5y ago
  Presumably the GP is referring to a conception of rights that exist independently of a piece of paper declaring their existence.
  - skeletonjelly 5y ago
    Well how do you enforce a concept? One move would be to introduce a bill of rights
- throwawaylinux 5y ago
  Rights exist by what people demand and exercise and do. A "bill of rights" is a piece of paper. A piece of paper which is ruled upon by a court that was granted its power by the very same collection of papers. For example, the right to keep and bear arms (obviously not for hunting but for war and security) has been infringed upon many times, but constitutional courts have decided that actually despite the bill of rights, some infringement is allowed. (EDIT: And this doesn't even address the problem of governments creating unconstitutional laws or executing unconstitutional actions which de facto strip your rights for some possibly significant time until it can be overturned by a court, but without much redress or punishment or deterrent) In the end the people are the ultimate arbiters and deciders of what rights they are willing to give up and what powers they are willing to be governed under. This plays out the same way in USA and Australia and Afghanistan and Libya.
  - dd444fgdfg 5y ago
    I for one agree with you. I've never understood why America puts of with basically being a police state, with the level of police brutality and incarceration that they have. And here in aussieland, we don't have that, but we do nothing to protect our liberties.
gobookdev 5y ago
We just had hundreds of thousands of people go to the beach yesterday ignoring lockdown orders, I was worried about my country having read things like Gulag Archipelago, but the general population have shown where their line is. Still we're now a police state and the general population doesn't seem to give a shit about that.
- throwawayfear 5y ago
  Rally your people and take it to the politicians’ offices until they throw out these policies entirely. Wear masks and go in big numbers.
  - the_third_wave 5y ago
    Better throw out the politicians together with the policies. Now that they've shown their true colours it would be foolhardy to expect them to restrain their authoritarian instincts come the next emergency - and if there is one thing easily come by these days it seems to be emergencies. Kick 'm out, elect a new batch and keep their feet to the fire.
    - HKH2 5y ago
      Both major parties are authoritarian. Australia has a good electoral system but people have to stop believing in major parties, or that it doesn't matter, and vote in droves for independents and minor parties (who, if unelected, give their votes to the party they prefer).
  - gobookdev 5y ago
    Dude that organised the last protest got 8 months prison. 75% of the population agrees with some of the totalitarian laws. Still a great country, but I'm looking at other places to live, Senior Engineer so it won't be hard to get sponsorship. Thinking about USA where people really understand the importance of their constitution, and the tech sector is the strongest in the world.
    - 5y ago
threeseed 5y ago
You are not being forced to do this. You can instead spend 2 weeks locked up in a hotel at your expense.
- throwawayfear 5y ago
  What kind of insanity have we collectively tolerated that “you can pay to be locked up in a ‘hotel’ tor two weeks” is seen as some kind of evidence that there is no compulsion? That’s like saying people aren’t forced to vaccinate since you don’t “need” to work at that particular job and you don’t “need” to exercise in a gym or watch a movie in a theater. Everything in history shows the slope is slippery. They will pass this on to everyone. It’s a blatant power grab. They want to spy on you and track you. They don’t care about your health.
  - shkkmo 5y ago
    The kind of insanity that has been the law for well over a year. Getting outraged at an effort to make that policy less draconian is pretty silly.
    - throwawayfear 5y ago
      It can be a law for ten years. Doesn't make it less of a shitty law. And I think the outrage is useful. It will mobilize people until it boils over into action, if enough people do it when it actually counts. This is when it actually counts. Everyone has spent all their Outrage Points on useless shit some actor or celebrity said about something no one will care about on their deathbed, but so few are saying anything about this totalitarian nightmare.
      - shkkmo 5y ago
        I was not defending the law. But the App that is the subject of the article serves to reduce the severity of that law and thus reduces government overreach. To be upset about the App, rather than the original quarantine law, is to be focusing attention in the wrong place.
teclordphrack2 5y ago
Did you even read the article?

blitz_skull 5y ago

Wow. It’s like the twilight zone over there. I’m quite concerned at the lengths governments are going to take away our rights. All in the name of “the good of others”.

InvertedRhodium 5y ago
Couldn't agree more - the fact that my request to go on a stabbing rampage was declined due to "the good of others" is a travesty against human rights and the freedoms that come with them.
- blitz_skull 5y ago
  Don’t imagine many folks are making requests for those sort of shenanigans. Seems kinda like something you do of your own accord, yeah?
  - InvertedRhodium 5y ago
    But then I'd have to go on a stabbing spree, when simply complaining about it online is a much safer - and more importantly comfortable - if ultimately pointless endeavor.
tootahe45 5y ago
That's just the excuse, and the excuses don't come very often so you have to pass as many bs laws while the average voter is in a panic.
- jimmaswell 5y ago
  Never let a crisis go to waste.
kongin 5y ago
Believing what you see on the news about covid is like believing the USSR's growth numbers. It's the terminally online and politicians who push the narrative, the rest don't care, including the police. In Australia it's under 20% of people that have gone insane. The rest have checked out and completely ignored it. It's like a long holiday where you get paid to pretend you work. But you can't say that in polite company so you just have ~40 percent compliance with whatever insanity is going on now. Hilariously enough the compliance from police is lower than from the general population so basically we have politicians and the terminally online talking about masks, jabs and sign ins and the people who are supposed to enforce it not being bothered with it. Standing in front of the super market something like one in three pull out their phone, unlock it, point it at the check in qr code and not log in. I'm reminded of the latter days of the USSR where no one took anything the government said seriously and just did whatever they felt like. Which does not bode well for the current incarnation of Australia long term.

ghuntley 5y ago

Source code for the South Australian app is at https://twitter.com/geoffreyhuntley/status/1430877183996690439?s=21 https://twitter.com/geoffreyhuntley/status/14308771839966904...

glaucon 5y ago

"... following a selective tender process in November" Remarkably slow process given that we are dealing with a pandemic. Worth pointing out that "Australian gov to use" should read "South Australian gov to use" (South Australia being a state of Australia). EDIT: As this thread is attracting attention from people who have views different from my own I'd just like to make it clear that I'm in favour of controlling the actions of people who choose to endanger public health and nothing I said above is meant to suggest otherwise.

chrisco255 5y ago
We're dealing with an endemic disease that is going on its third year. At some point, people and governments need to recognize that fact: it's not controllable and it will spread eventually no matter how dystopian you get.
- notyourday 5y ago
  But we have not tried putting people into individual cages yet. We should do it for their own good. After all, COVID is terrible for grandma Suzi. If we space the cages at 10 feet rather than 6 it should totally work to stop the spread of COVID and it will all be good! #trustthescience
  - throwawayfear 5y ago
    This is tongue in cheek but there are absolutely people even in tech who are either stupid enough to go along with that or secretly want that because they are full of hate towards the “unvaxxed.” Which makes the media fearmongering about the “unvaxxed” even more dangerous. They never mention immunity from past infection which is now known to be superior protection. Here’s a recent source: https://www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-once-confers-much-greater-immunity-vaccine-vaccination-remains-vital https://www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-on... That they insist on vaccinated vs unvaccinated in the media narrative is worrisome because it is going to lead to dehumanization and division.

notyourday 5y ago

No, no, no. This is HN. We are, like, possible COVID restrictions are good thing! Violate quarantine?! Beat them all up! It is for the children! And grandma! Google tracking you to place an ad in front of you for a better set of headphones than the ones you are currently shopping for that you can simply not buy? Now that's a violation of human rights!

jp0d 5y ago

This might be an unpopular opinion! But there are some really bad people out there. The situation is getting out of hand here in Melbourne and there are people like this family who're Covid positive and still out and about in the community. We should blame selfish people like these for such measures from the government. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/melbourne/article-9964173/Moment-Covid-infected-family-confronts-health-officials-Melbourne-hotspot.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/melbourne/article-9964173/M...

tosstoyevsky 5y ago
The people aren’t to blame for an extreme government overreach.
- jp0d 5y ago
  I think people like these deserve to be locked up! Either that or put a tracker on these people. I'm not saying that about all Covid positive people but just some of these extremely selfish pricks.
- megablast 5y ago
  Yeah? What should the gov do in a health emergency?
- shkkmo 5y ago
  > Downloading and using the G2G app is voluntary in WA, but the Government encourages people to use it, claiming it “keeps you safe and the rest of the community safe while freeing up more police resources that would otherwise be undertaking more regular physical checks”. Where is the overreach in a voluntary app that people are encouraged to use to save the government resources?
- FridgeSeal 5y ago
  So we’re supposed to just sit around and let infectious people roam around the community (putting everyone’s health and safety at risk) because they didn’t do as politely asked? We had Katie Hopkins here earlier in the year bragging about how she was going to deliberately break quarantine etc etc. If people aren’t going to follow a reasonable precaution, this far into a pandemic, then I have little sympathy when harsher measures are employed.

oneepic 5y ago

From TFA: >Downloading and using the G2G app is voluntary in WA [Western Australia], but the Government encourages people to use it So not enforced, right...? (EDIT: my bad, this refers to an existing app; the new app sounds like it would be a mandated download)

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
shkkmo 5y ago
The new app is part SA of creating an alternative to mandatory 2 week hotel quarantines. The app is only required for those who would rather do their 2 week quarantine in their own home.

etaioinshrdlu 5y ago

So, do the people support this? Is this a failure of a democracy, or do the people really want this?

dmix 5y ago
People are naturally scared of COVID and the 'unknown', they've never experienced anything like this in their lifetime so they don't really know what the limits should be and when to say no. So it's hard to ask whether the people support it in such a state. We should be very very careful relying on crisis moments to make major decisions. Which is always going to be a drawback in democracy (all systems have flaws). There will always be long term consequences as these things never have time limits. Any new capability adopted should be assumed to be permanent.
mindwok 5y ago
I'd say that in general Australians are more trusting of their government than our American friends. I often see poeple on Twitter like Joe Rogan and friends expressing total shock about how compliant Aussies are with what seems like draconian lockdown rules, but I think that misses the point. When our government says we can only go outside for an hour a day, there's a general sentiment that this is a shame but we understand these kind of things are necessary to get a handle on the pandemic. We don't assume this is an effort from our government to exert control, and believe this is a temporary measure in our best interests. That being said, each time I read a headline like this I get slightly more concerned that if one day this trust is ever abused, it'll be all the worse because we never fought hard against these measures.
- throwawayfear 5y ago
  That trust will be abused. It is just a matter of time. History is full of examples. Why build this machine in the first place and then hope that whoever drives it is nice enough to not abuse the power? Why risk it? The pandemic is not dangerous enough to justify this blind faith.
  - mindwok 5y ago

nineteen999 5y ago

This headline is misleading ... "Australian gov" sounds like the Australian Federal government, but the government in question is the South Australian government, which is a State gov.

skeletonjelly 5y ago
Came here to point this out too Plus it's been done already by the Western Australian state government https://www.wa.gov.au/organisation/department-of-the-premier-and-cabinet/covid-19-coronavirus-g2g-now-frequently-asked-questions https://www.wa.gov.au/organisation/department-of-the-premier...
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
throwawayfear 5y ago
It is the article's headline, and there wasn't enough space to edit in the specific state. But is it actually a meaningful distinction as far as these policies being constrained permanently to just one part of Australia? Will this spread everywhere or is there a reason why this would only be constrained to a really small town no one really notices?
- nineteen999 5y ago
  > It is the article's headline, and there wasn't enough space to edit in the specific state. Sure - I noticed that and wasn't implying that you modified the article title. The article title is incorrect, at least in the way it reads at first glance - yes the South Australian government is "an Australian government", but it's not "The Australian Government". > But is it actually a meaningful distinction as far as these policies being constrained permanently to just one part of Australia? Will this spread everywhere or is there a reason why this would only be constrained to a really small town no one really notices? It's too early to tell - but it's worth noting that the main revenue generating states with the lion's share of attention in Australia are New South Wales and Victoria and so they usually set the tone of state policy countrywide. IMHO this is unlikely to spread to those states. More importantly: 1) the article indicates that its use will be voluntary anyway; 2) Australia has a long track record of paying millions of dollars for technology like this that actually never works properly. So as a Victorian I'm not too concerned.

swiley 5y ago

I’m done with this bullshit. Fuck Covid. Fuck extreme over reactions to it and Fuck Joe Biden.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
trainsplanes 5y ago
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Joe Biden is a political leader in Australia. I'm not sure if he's even Australian.

dudeinjapan 5y ago

Barreling towards Idiocracy, one dumb rule at a time.

shkkmo 5y ago

Before you jump on your outrage high horse, it would be worth your time to investigate the details. This is about South Australia adopting a new quarantine at home option for those who are entering the country. Allowing people to quaratine at home with an App rather than at designated quarantine hotels is a REDUCTION in government overreach. In Western Australia where something similar is in use, this is a voluntary part of a similar program that saves officers having to make more house calls. If you don't bother to do basic research before you get outraged, your outrage will eventually be discounted as "crying wolf" and won't be as effective the next time you need to push back against real government overreach.

FridgeSeal 5y ago
Ssshhhh, you’ll interrupt all the people who are desperate for an excuse to screech about their favourite topics of “failed states” and “taking up arms against the government”.
- shkkmo 5y ago
  I share many aspects of their ideological viewpoints, I would just rather see them operate from a more informed position.
throwawayfear 5y ago
“It’s not government overreach, you have a choice of ‘temporary’ in-home facial recognition and GPS surveillance or staying at a quarantine hotel.” Not only is this a laughable “choice”, the kind of manipulative choice you’d expect a tech manager to pretend to offer you when all his projects suck but he wants you to feel like you “picked” a project, it’s also naive to present it as a choice. You don’t wait until it’s mandatory for everyone to say something. You say it now when the machine is rearing its ugly head and you can see the writing on the wall. Keep in mind you are writing this in defense of a gov that presumes itself to be in charge of how many people you can have over. Source: https://theconversation.com/vaccine-passports-are-coming-to-australia-how-will-they-work-and-what-will-you-need-them-for-167531 https://theconversation.com/vaccine-passports-are-coming-to-... “NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian yesterday announced freedoms for fully vaccinated people once 70% of the state’s eligible population are double dosed. These include being able to go to hospitality venues, hairdressers and gyms, and have five people to your home.” Seems more than NECESSARY to cry wolf right now. The slope is slippery. We all know they will push these systems as far as they can if they are allowed to. Cry wolf when the wolf is coming, not when it has eaten your chickens already.

lnreddy 5y ago

Once a penal colony, always a penal colony.

amanzi 5y ago

The opening paragraph of the article describes what is actually happening and it's far less ominous that what the comments here suggest. "In an official statement, the State Government announced a contract to a Western Australian (WA) company for $1.1 million to develop a new smartphone app that uses facial recognition and GPS tracking technology to monitor people who are ordered to self-quarantine at home, reported InDaily." So this isn't an app meant to enforce state-wide quarantines or to enforce any additional restrictions or controls on the general public. This app is to enable those who are specifically ordered to self-quarantine (e.g. arriving from a Covid-hotspot, or close contacts of Covid-positive cases) to be able to check-in so that they can self-quarantine at home instead of at a managed isolation facility.

notatoad 5y ago
yeah, there's been a lot of freaking out about this, but it's much less oppressive than being forced to stay in a quarantine hotel.
- throwawayfear 5y ago
  Read out loud what you are saying. You are saying that government ordering you to quarantine in your house, with facial recognition and GPS tracking in your own home, is less oppressive than being forced to stay in one of their quarantine hotels. And you're saying that in response to all the "freaking out" about this. Keep in mind that when quarantined this way, if you fail to respond to their random, RANDOM, pings...they will send police officers to your house to do an in-person quarantine check. And not only that, but these so-called leaders of Australia are celebrating it and rubbing it in Australian faces. Source: Returning travelers quarantining at home will be forced to download an app that combines facial recognition and geolocation. The state will text them at random times, and thereafter they will have 15 minutes to take a picture of their face in the location where they are supposed to be. Should they fail, the local police department will be sent to follow up in person. “We don’t tell them how often or when, on a random basis they have to reply within 15 minutes,” Premier Steven Marshall explained. “I think every South Australian should feel pretty proud that we are the national pilot for the home-based quarantine app.” https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/09/pandemic-australia-still-liberal-democracy/619940/ https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/09/pandemic-a... You see that? South Australians should feel pretty proud that they're the national pilot for this. What an honor.

shirro 5y ago

The Australian federal government has introduced wide ranging warrantless powers that allow for a lot of potential abuse of computers and communications. These have had bi-partisan support and been rushed through parliament with very little debate or discussion from the complicit mainstream media. This stuff is likely pushed by our large allies and it isn't going away and likely allows Australia to be used as a backdoor to spy on our allies citizens as well. This is potentially really serious long term problem and gets almost no debate in Australia. Meanwhile these localised state based measures aimed at fighting this pandemic are another thing entirely. Our state governments are not part of five eyes and aren't under pressure to maintain any of these measures indefinitely. They want to keep local businesses active by avoiding lockdowns and keep their tightly budgeted public health systems working. Our less populated states here managed to get through the pandemic basically virus free without much in the way of restrictions within their states. I don't think people understand how good we have had this. Our vaccines supply was delayed but now that has improved all the states are opening up once vaccine targets are reached and the state want to ease into the change. We still have very low vaccination rates compared to many countries where vaccinations were expedited as the only real viable solution. To reopen state borders and allow more potentially infected people in we need to be able to quarantine infectious people without locking them up and an app is a cheap solution. Once covid is endemic and as vaccination rates climb there won't be any point to quarantining people and the app will be discarded. It isn't for surveilling the entire population but for individuals for the relatively short time they might be shedding virus. People are right to be vigilant but you all have the wrong target here. The right target is the Australian federal government's mass surveillance laws. An app that will be used for a week or two by a sick person then discarded isn't the real problem.

jeeeb 5y ago

This probably doesn’t come across to an international audience but Australia is in a really weird state at the moment. On one hand you have QLD/SA/WA which are probably the places least effected in the world by COVID. QLD for example with a population of 5.2 million has had a total of 7 deaths from COVID over the entirety of the pandemic. Schools, shops and workplaces have all been pretty much running as normal the last 18 months in these states. On the other hand you have the South East states which have large active delta outbreaks and have gone through long lockdowns, especially Victoria. These states have given up eliminating COVID and are planning on letting COVID spread as vaccination rates meet targets. Residents from the SE states are effectively locked out from the rest of Australia. State borders are shut and have been on and off for much of the pandemic. Thus Australia is in some ways operating as two countries at this stage. What’s more international travel to Australia is effectively shutoff. The only people allowed back are Australians and there is a wait list and you better be planning on moving back to live permanently. Obviously no one wants to split the country in half. No one wants suspend international travel indefinitely. In particular the federal government views its reelection chances as effectively riding on getting things to a semblance of normality by Christmas. Yet residents of places like SA and WA obviously do not want to give up their COVID free status. Hence you see the search for solutions like this. The app does address a genuine problem. In particular, hotel quarantine was introduced in Australia after home quarantine failed due to wide spread non-compliance. Yet it is expensive , capacity is limited and hotels aren’t great quarantine facilities in the first place. Sealed windows and shared ventilation systems in particular are problematic. Whether or not the trade off in tracking people for two weeks is worth it, I’m not sure. I don’t think these measures will be around permanently though. The slightest suggestion of permanent measures has been slapped down hard so far.

Handytinge 5y ago

This is an interesting choice of article of the many on this matter. The title is wrong (it’s state government, not federal. You wouldn’t post “US government” when Florida enacts something). The intent of this program is as a trial to see if this improves things or not. I suspect a lot of the readers here are lacking any real knowledge of Australia’s treatment of COVID-19 beyond the odd random news article and are looking through their own localised lenses. Before criticising, it may be worth taking some time to research and understand. Our death toll in total in 18 months is about the same as the current daily death toll in the US. We have achieved this via means that simply would not work in the US due to dissension between states and differing views on the practically of temporarily giving up freedoms for the greater good.