11 ms·

I always tought a credit score was an American ism, maybe including UK and Ireland for the EU. Does anyone know if there exists something like credit scores in

I always tought a credit score was an American ism, maybe including UK and Ireland for the EU. Does anyone know if there exists something like credit scores in Belgium, and how you find out what yours is?

the_third_wave 5y ago
In Sweden it is common for companies to check on income and payment records before accepting purchase orders. Income data is provided by the tax authorities while payment records are available through the enforcement agency (state bailiff, "Kronofogden"). If your income is deemed to be too low or you have a derelict payment on record (these records are in place for 3 years after the payment has been completed) you will be denied credit in which case you'll have to pay up-front.
- zinekeller 5y ago
  But this is more like based on government data rather than, I know this is very American, private data shared by companies (and usually handled badly, whether in cybersecurity or identity correlation terms). Also, a credit checking association boasted that their members' data is 95% accurate - so that means that around 15 million Americans do have devastating errors on their credit score (through no fault of their own).
  - the_third_wave 5y ago
    The data comes from governmental institutions but the actual checking is done by private companies like UC [1] and Ratsit [2]. [1] https://www.uc.se/ https://www.uc.se/ [2] https://www.ratsit.se/ https://www.ratsit.se/
AnssiH 5y ago
Many (most?) EU countries have credit score systems and/or companies, and the details on how they work differ on a country-by-country basis: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_score#By_country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_score#By_country In some countries credit score registries are restricted by law to only holding information on delinquent debt, so an average person has no entries in the credit score registries. This is the case here in Finland currently, though a national positive credit register is being planned for 2024 (https://www.vero.fi/en/positivecreditregister/ https://www.vero.fi/en/positivecreditregister/).
- user5994461 5y ago
  You conclude that most EU countries have a credit score by linking to a Wikipedia article showing that almost none European country has a credit score?
  - Throwaway197401 5y ago
    It's not like the US system. It's a negative credit score meaning that you start as a good lender and then you can only fuck it up by not paying your bills. In the US we have positive credit score meaning you have to show you are a good lender to get a better score. The european ones are mostly much less granular.
  - AnssiH 5y ago
    > You conclude that most EU countries have a credit score by linking to a Wikipedia article showing that almost none European country has a credit score? The Wikipedia article does not show that almost no European country has a credit score or credit reporting system. It simply provides examples from various countries and is obviously not exhaustive, like most lists in Wikipedia. If you want to just see how many EU countries have any credit registries, these World Bank links have good data: - Public registries: https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/IC.CRD.PUBL.ZS https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/IC.CRD.PUBL.ZS - Private registries: https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/IC.CRD.PRVT.ZS https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/IC.CRD.PRVT.ZS They show most EU countries have such registries. I did go through a dozen countries manually before finding the above handy links, though... Of course one could argue whether or not those systems which only allow negative entries (and thus most people will have no data there) for a credit check should be considered credit score systems.
    - throw_m239339 5y ago
      Credit registry =/= credit score system. You are moving the goal post here. Your previous assertion is just false. the US system is brutal, unfair and shouldn't be reproduced anywhere else in the world at first place.
- 5y ago
Hamuko 5y ago
Finland only has a negative credit system (basically a record of payment delinquencies) but there are plans to introduce a positive credit system similar to the US.
- mimsee 5y ago
  Would you happen to have a source or link to an article mentioning about this?
  - AnssiH 5y ago
    Current private negative registries: - https://www.asiakastieto.fi/web/en/about-us/about-credit-data.html https://www.asiakastieto.fi/web/en/about-us/about-credit-dat... - https://www.dnb.com/fi-fi/tuotteet/bisnode-risk-guardian/ https://www.dnb.com/fi-fi/tuotteet/bisnode-risk-guardian/ (Finnish only) Current legislation: https://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/ajantasa/2007/20070527 https://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/ajantasa/2007/20070527 (Finnish and Swedish only, Google translate of Swedish text: https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=se&tl=en&u=https://www.finlex.fi/sv/laki/ajantasa/2007/20070527 https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=se&tl=en&u=https:/... ) I'm not aware of a good English page describing the current system in detail, though. The Finnish pages of e.g. the Asiakastieto registry are more detailed. Planned positive public registry: https://www.vero.fi/en/positivecreditregister/ https://www.vero.fi/en/positivecreditregister/
heurisko 5y ago
In Germany, there is SCHUFA, which is a credit score. To rent in Germany, I had to have a SCHUFA check and a letter from my previous landlord saying I didn't have any outstanding debts, the "Mietschuldenfreiheitsbescheinigung."
- bserge 5y ago
  Germany is like a proto-US. Ignore the media spin, it's the most capitalist country in Europe, where unequal contracts rule supreme and you get fines and prison time for nearly anything. I'm surprised the socialist policies stuck around, although there's still time to get rid of them.
  - throwaway210222 5y ago
    > where contracts rule supreme What, other than a contract that complies with the Basic Law for the Federal Republic of Germany, should be more supreme between two parties freely trading with each other? The weather report? A poem?
    - bserge 5y ago
      Somehow you replied before my edit. I meant unequal contracts, where one party has more power and the other is screwed if they, for whatever reason, cannot fulfill it. Which is to say, most contracts. The requirements and punishment for breach of contract are rather nutty even compared to the US.
  - heurisko 5y ago
    I don't get the media spin in the UK. I don't expect Germany to be anything other than capitalist, or as they say "ordoliberal", which is a market with strong state regulation. Considering their socialist policies started with Bismarck, I think they'll remain. But I think perhaps US-centric media somewhat over-eggs "socialist Europe".
  - luckylion 5y ago
    That's a weird take, meaningful fines are rare, except for parking/speeding tickets (because it's an easy way for cities to get cash), prison is very rare, you have to really go for the large crimes to not get probation. The one exception is coercive detention ("Beugehaft"), which they hand out instead of fines. It's a dumb concept, but it's also not that common. I also generally disagree that Germany is capitalist. Most markets are heavily regulated and full of subsidies, taxes are extremely high, and there's a fundamental mistrust of individualism.
Joeri 5y ago
Specifically for Belgium there is the CKP, which keeps track of all loans, including how timely they are paid, and which credit providers have to consult before granting any loan or line of credit. https://www.nbb.be/nl/kredietcentrales/centrale-voor-kredieten-aan-particulieren https://www.nbb.be/nl/kredietcentrales/centrale-voor-krediet... They also keep a black list of people who should be denied credit.
- kome 5y ago
  so, in Belgium there is no creepy credit score, but a public registry. That's a more intelligent solution to the problem, like in the rest of Europe.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
xen0 5y ago
Funnily enough, despite the advertising, there really is no such thing as a Credit 'Score' in the UK. Lenders get information about you from a Credit Reference Agency and will have their own internal systems to make decisions based on that. You can ask the reference agency for a copy of your credit report.
- TheOtherHobbes 5y ago
  The three "score" sites are partnered - and possibly funded - by Experian, TransUnion, and Equifax. The "scores" are only loosely related to actual credit ratings, which are somewhat context/application dependent. In reality the sites are mostly just marketing fronts for various consumer services - credit cards, loans, mobile and energy contracts, and so on. They're notoriously aggressive about getting you to log in and keep checking your score. Partly because this looks good for partner engagement metrics, but also because it trains you to keep checking your score in an obsessive and gamified way.
  - xen0 5y ago
    I briefly worked in that space for my first job; a small company that would essentially resell you your own credit report for a 'not insignificant" monthly subscription. The TV advertising for credit score checking was just about to start around then as far as I could tell.

the_third_wave 5y ago

In Sweden it is common for companies to check on income and payment records before accepting purchase orders. Income data is provided by the tax authorities while payment records are available through the enforcement agency (state bailiff, "Kronofogden"). If your income is deemed to be too low or you have a derelict payment on record (these records are in place for 3 years after the payment has been completed) you will be denied credit in which case you'll have to pay up-front.

zinekeller 5y ago
But this is more like based on government data rather than, I know this is very American, private data shared by companies (and usually handled badly, whether in cybersecurity or identity correlation terms). Also, a credit checking association boasted that their members' data is 95% accurate - so that means that around 15 million Americans do have devastating errors on their credit score (through no fault of their own).
- the_third_wave 5y ago
  The data comes from governmental institutions but the actual checking is done by private companies like UC [1] and Ratsit [2]. [1] https://www.uc.se/ https://www.uc.se/ [2] https://www.ratsit.se/ https://www.ratsit.se/

AnssiH 5y ago

Many (most?) EU countries have credit score systems and/or companies, and the details on how they work differ on a country-by-country basis: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_score#By_country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_score#By_country In some countries credit score registries are restricted by law to only holding information on delinquent debt, so an average person has no entries in the credit score registries. This is the case here in Finland currently, though a national positive credit register is being planned for 2024 (https://www.vero.fi/en/positivecreditregister/ https://www.vero.fi/en/positivecreditregister/).

user5994461 5y ago
You conclude that most EU countries have a credit score by linking to a Wikipedia article showing that almost none European country has a credit score?
- Throwaway197401 5y ago
  It's not like the US system. It's a negative credit score meaning that you start as a good lender and then you can only fuck it up by not paying your bills. In the US we have positive credit score meaning you have to show you are a good lender to get a better score. The european ones are mostly much less granular.
- AnssiH 5y ago
  > You conclude that most EU countries have a credit score by linking to a Wikipedia article showing that almost none European country has a credit score? The Wikipedia article does not show that almost no European country has a credit score or credit reporting system. It simply provides examples from various countries and is obviously not exhaustive, like most lists in Wikipedia. If you want to just see how many EU countries have any credit registries, these World Bank links have good data: - Public registries: https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/IC.CRD.PUBL.ZS https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/IC.CRD.PUBL.ZS - Private registries: https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/IC.CRD.PRVT.ZS https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/IC.CRD.PRVT.ZS They show most EU countries have such registries. I did go through a dozen countries manually before finding the above handy links, though... Of course one could argue whether or not those systems which only allow negative entries (and thus most people will have no data there) for a credit check should be considered credit score systems.
  - throw_m239339 5y ago
    Credit registry =/= credit score system. You are moving the goal post here. Your previous assertion is just false. the US system is brutal, unfair and shouldn't be reproduced anywhere else in the world at first place.
5y ago

Hamuko 5y ago

Finland only has a negative credit system (basically a record of payment delinquencies) but there are plans to introduce a positive credit system similar to the US.

mimsee 5y ago
Would you happen to have a source or link to an article mentioning about this?
- AnssiH 5y ago
  Current private negative registries: - https://www.asiakastieto.fi/web/en/about-us/about-credit-data.html https://www.asiakastieto.fi/web/en/about-us/about-credit-dat... - https://www.dnb.com/fi-fi/tuotteet/bisnode-risk-guardian/ https://www.dnb.com/fi-fi/tuotteet/bisnode-risk-guardian/ (Finnish only) Current legislation: https://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/ajantasa/2007/20070527 https://www.finlex.fi/fi/laki/ajantasa/2007/20070527 (Finnish and Swedish only, Google translate of Swedish text: https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=se&tl=en&u=https://www.finlex.fi/sv/laki/ajantasa/2007/20070527 https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=se&tl=en&u=https:/... ) I'm not aware of a good English page describing the current system in detail, though. The Finnish pages of e.g. the Asiakastieto registry are more detailed. Planned positive public registry: https://www.vero.fi/en/positivecreditregister/ https://www.vero.fi/en/positivecreditregister/

heurisko 5y ago

In Germany, there is SCHUFA, which is a credit score. To rent in Germany, I had to have a SCHUFA check and a letter from my previous landlord saying I didn't have any outstanding debts, the "Mietschuldenfreiheitsbescheinigung."

bserge 5y ago
Germany is like a proto-US. Ignore the media spin, it's the most capitalist country in Europe, where unequal contracts rule supreme and you get fines and prison time for nearly anything. I'm surprised the socialist policies stuck around, although there's still time to get rid of them.
- throwaway210222 5y ago
  > where contracts rule supreme What, other than a contract that complies with the Basic Law for the Federal Republic of Germany, should be more supreme between two parties freely trading with each other? The weather report? A poem?
  - bserge 5y ago
    Somehow you replied before my edit. I meant unequal contracts, where one party has more power and the other is screwed if they, for whatever reason, cannot fulfill it. Which is to say, most contracts. The requirements and punishment for breach of contract are rather nutty even compared to the US.
- heurisko 5y ago
  I don't get the media spin in the UK. I don't expect Germany to be anything other than capitalist, or as they say "ordoliberal", which is a market with strong state regulation. Considering their socialist policies started with Bismarck, I think they'll remain. But I think perhaps US-centric media somewhat over-eggs "socialist Europe".
- luckylion 5y ago
  That's a weird take, meaningful fines are rare, except for parking/speeding tickets (because it's an easy way for cities to get cash), prison is very rare, you have to really go for the large crimes to not get probation. The one exception is coercive detention ("Beugehaft"), which they hand out instead of fines. It's a dumb concept, but it's also not that common. I also generally disagree that Germany is capitalist. Most markets are heavily regulated and full of subsidies, taxes are extremely high, and there's a fundamental mistrust of individualism.

Joeri 5y ago

Specifically for Belgium there is the CKP, which keeps track of all loans, including how timely they are paid, and which credit providers have to consult before granting any loan or line of credit. https://www.nbb.be/nl/kredietcentrales/centrale-voor-kredieten-aan-particulieren https://www.nbb.be/nl/kredietcentrales/centrale-voor-krediet... They also keep a black list of people who should be denied credit.

kome 5y ago
so, in Belgium there is no creepy credit score, but a public registry. That's a more intelligent solution to the problem, like in the rest of Europe.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

xen0 5y ago

Funnily enough, despite the advertising, there really is no such thing as a Credit 'Score' in the UK. Lenders get information about you from a Credit Reference Agency and will have their own internal systems to make decisions based on that. You can ask the reference agency for a copy of your credit report.

TheOtherHobbes 5y ago
The three "score" sites are partnered - and possibly funded - by Experian, TransUnion, and Equifax. The "scores" are only loosely related to actual credit ratings, which are somewhat context/application dependent. In reality the sites are mostly just marketing fronts for various consumer services - credit cards, loans, mobile and energy contracts, and so on. They're notoriously aggressive about getting you to log in and keep checking your score. Partly because this looks good for partner engagement metrics, but also because it trains you to keep checking your score in an obsessive and gamified way.
- xen0 5y ago
  I briefly worked in that space for my first job; a small company that would essentially resell you your own credit report for a 'not insignificant" monthly subscription. The TV advertising for credit score checking was just about to start around then as far as I could tell.