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Privacy watchdogs, data protection groups, and human rights councils have largely condemned these "vaccine passports". To date, I haven't seen their concerns m

Privacy watchdogs, data protection groups, and human rights councils have largely condemned these "vaccine passports". To date, I haven't seen their concerns mentioned - mentioned - in any of these pronouncements. I get that there are enough people willing to go along with this that they'll likely stick around for a bit - but another thing I haven't seen is an end game. Corona is in the deer, it's in pets. Are they all going to get vaccinated too? Are people going to willingly get shot up with Pfizer and Moderna every six months for the rest of their lives; living in a three-tier society?

tboyd47 5y ago
It seems that the endgame is to keep on pushing tighter and tighter restrictions on certain communities of people, strongly discouraging open debate, leaving dissenters no other option but to physically remove themselves, until only the most compliant remain, forming a tight-knit, ideologically homogenous group.
- Daishiman 5y ago
  That would be the point if it weren't for the fact that the "debate", from the point of view of those who have actually kept up with the medical, epidemiomological, and ethical literature has been settled. Yeah, I'm all for pushing willfully ignorant discussion out of the public eye.
- guntars 5y ago
  > certain communities of people What communities are being targeted? Everyone who leaves their house is affected. > strongly discouraging open debate We're debating it here just fine. > dissenters [..] physically remove themselves Voluntarily unvaccinated walking COVID vectors? Yes, that's exactly the point.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- ashtonkem 5y ago
  It’s distressing how such paranoid conspiracy theory mongering is just now accepted even here.
jayd16 5y ago
Obviously the end game isn't seen. We're nowhere close to the end game. We don't know about lasting immunity or about variants that don't even exist yet. Maybe we can eradicate it, maybe not. Literally no one knows what the future holds here.
- analyte123 5y ago
  Eradication is not happening. You might as well be talking about eradicating the flu, which is another contagious respiratory virus that rapidly mutates and is not completely controlled by vaccines. This was obvious even a month ago, when over 10% of a naval ship tested positive for Covid despite every single person being fully vaccinated [1]. I only hope that the "end game" is not permanent restrictions on travel, movement, and trade. [1] https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/07/14/covid-outbreak-aboard-hms-queen-elizabeth-strikes-100-sailors/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/07/14/covid-outbreak-a...
  - TheAdamAndChe 5y ago
    You're 100% right. This isn't Ebola or SARS where everyone who gets sick has obvious symptoms and becomes gravely ill. Asymptomatic carriers and transference to other animals like birds and cattle will ensure that it will persist in our population permanently. The good news is that viruses tend to get less dangerous over time. Death of the host provides selective pressure against those variants. Syphilis used to be extremely dangerous and rapidly fatal, but it has been around for so long that it has changed. But that process takes years typically.
    - AndrewBissell 5y ago
      > The good news is that viruses tend to get less dangerous over time. One notable exception was Marek's disease in chickens, where the widespread administration of leaky vaccines (which suppressed symptoms and complications but not transmission) led to the breeding of hotter and hotter strains in the vaccinated flocks, which became more lethal to unvaccinated chickens.
devit 5y ago
I don't really see what the problem would be with vaccinating every six months in case it turns out to be necessary to keep up immunity; in fact even vaccinating every month would be fine to avoid the risk of severe COVID. Indications though seems to be for only needing 2 or 3 doses or needing boosters multiple years apart.

tboyd47 5y ago

It seems that the endgame is to keep on pushing tighter and tighter restrictions on certain communities of people, strongly discouraging open debate, leaving dissenters no other option but to physically remove themselves, until only the most compliant remain, forming a tight-knit, ideologically homogenous group.

Daishiman 5y ago
That would be the point if it weren't for the fact that the "debate", from the point of view of those who have actually kept up with the medical, epidemiomological, and ethical literature has been settled. Yeah, I'm all for pushing willfully ignorant discussion out of the public eye.
guntars 5y ago
> certain communities of people What communities are being targeted? Everyone who leaves their house is affected. > strongly discouraging open debate We're debating it here just fine. > dissenters [..] physically remove themselves Voluntarily unvaccinated walking COVID vectors? Yes, that's exactly the point.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
ashtonkem 5y ago
It’s distressing how such paranoid conspiracy theory mongering is just now accepted even here.

jayd16 5y ago

Obviously the end game isn't seen. We're nowhere close to the end game. We don't know about lasting immunity or about variants that don't even exist yet. Maybe we can eradicate it, maybe not. Literally no one knows what the future holds here.

analyte123 5y ago
Eradication is not happening. You might as well be talking about eradicating the flu, which is another contagious respiratory virus that rapidly mutates and is not completely controlled by vaccines. This was obvious even a month ago, when over 10% of a naval ship tested positive for Covid despite every single person being fully vaccinated [1]. I only hope that the "end game" is not permanent restrictions on travel, movement, and trade. [1] https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/07/14/covid-outbreak-aboard-hms-queen-elizabeth-strikes-100-sailors/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/07/14/covid-outbreak-a...
- TheAdamAndChe 5y ago
  You're 100% right. This isn't Ebola or SARS where everyone who gets sick has obvious symptoms and becomes gravely ill. Asymptomatic carriers and transference to other animals like birds and cattle will ensure that it will persist in our population permanently. The good news is that viruses tend to get less dangerous over time. Death of the host provides selective pressure against those variants. Syphilis used to be extremely dangerous and rapidly fatal, but it has been around for so long that it has changed. But that process takes years typically.
  - AndrewBissell 5y ago
    > The good news is that viruses tend to get less dangerous over time. One notable exception was Marek's disease in chickens, where the widespread administration of leaky vaccines (which suppressed symptoms and complications but not transmission) led to the breeding of hotter and hotter strains in the vaccinated flocks, which became more lethal to unvaccinated chickens.

devit 5y ago

I don't really see what the problem would be with vaccinating every six months in case it turns out to be necessary to keep up immunity; in fact even vaccinating every month would be fine to avoid the risk of severe COVID. Indications though seems to be for only needing 2 or 3 doses or needing boosters multiple years apart.