6 ms·

we’re a tech co - meatheads are nowhere to be found so programmers can't be athletic? I'm sure that's not what he meant, but that's how it comes across. also,

we’re a tech co - meatheads are nowhere to be found so programmers can't be athletic? I'm sure that's not what he meant, but that's how it comes across. also, the idea of group pushups as a "team building" activity - seriously? that just sounds awkward and weird. not to mention that pushups are not remotely sufficient as exercise if that's all you're doing. you want to help your employees stay in shape? commit to making sure they have time to get some exercise, however way they enjoy doing so.

larsberg 15y ago
Yeah, I found that statement funny, since the first tech company I worked for was MSFT. Out in that area (the pacific northwest), physical activity is a huge deal -- hiking, skiing, and snowboarding especially. On every team I was on, the vast majority of the people were in stunningly good shape. Even the 35+, multiple-kids crowd. I still remember one time that I almost killed an interview candidate by mistake. Ran down to pick him up in the lobby, and then started talking to him on the way up to our offices... realizing at the second of five floors that we needed to move this discussion to the elevator before he had a heart attack. We used the elevators so rarely that it hadn't even occurred to me! Of course, there were strange things about it. Many people got season-long Mt. Baker lift passes, and you could basically write off schedule estimates for the first week of the season that there was enough powder on the ground.
- checker 15y ago
  Taking the stairs is such an easy way to burn a few calories. It surprises me how few people do it in my office. Although, as shown by your story, some people just aren't able to!
  - matwood 15y ago
    It always amuses me to see non-handicap people taking the elevator at the gym.
    - sixtofour 15y ago
      I think a lot of people unconsciously see the stairs as a fallback method to the elevator. Stairs in a commercial building are usually minimally decorated. They're "the fire escape."
      - chrisbolt 15y ago
        The stairs in my office building are alarmed on the ground floor and only open on the 5th and 10th floors (from the stairs side).
      - tsotha 15y ago
        In a lot of local buildings where I live the doors are locked from the stairwell side on every floor and locked from the outside at ground level. So you can use them to go down during a fire, but you can't use them to go up.
        roundsquare 15y ago
        Yeah. Having been locked in stairwells before (luckily not for too long) I don't usually take the stairs unless they are out in the open.
    - ehsanu1 15y ago
      Unless you're strength training. In which case, you may not care to climb the stairs as they don't really further your goals.
      - finnomenon 15y ago
        If you are squatting heavy, as you should be doing if you are training with the goal to increase your overall strength, walking up a couple floors shouldn't be too hard of a task and I am pretty sure there are more benefits to it than it would hurt your other goals.
        StavrosK 15y ago
  - afterburner 15y ago
    Some people have knee problems. Although sometimes those knee problems are alleviated by regular stair use...
    - checker 15y ago
      Yeah I definitely have nothing against anyone who goes through actual pain, or anyone who has no reason for that matter. I was just stating that in my experience, very few of my officemates that I know are capable end up taking the stairs willingly. It's their choice to make.
  - macleodan 15y ago
    I put up a leader board in the office yesterday for stair climbing times. I've got one other person interested and the competition has started already. :) Current best time is 44s for 8 floors.
  - 2muchcoffeeman 15y ago
    Sometimes it is because of stupid building rules. The fire doors in my building are alarmed and you can't get in and out of them. You can only exit at the bottom and enter through upper floors in case of a fire.
goldmab 15y ago
"Meathead" is just a stupid thing to call someone. It's a stereotype that requires no mental effort, and it makes you feel superior.
Symmetry 15y ago
If think you're parsing that wrong. Being a meathead isn't at all the same as being athletic, I would hope that nobody would think that programmers couldn't be athletic. But when people think of programmers excercizing, they tend to think of running or biking or skiing or hiking rather than a "meathead" form of exercise like group pushups. And the fact that you find group pushups "awkward and weird" shows that the author had some justification in being defensive about it. Of course, I totally agree that they aren't a good enough form of exercise.
- jmonegro 15y ago
  Pushups are not a "meathead" form of exercise.
  - kd0amg 15y ago
    What makes something a "meathead" or "nonmeathead" exercise?
    - afterburner 15y ago
      Maybe because pushups sound like a standard army excercise/punishment? Anyways, many valid points being made about stereotypes.
    - sliverstorm 15y ago
      Curls in the squat rack?
      - Evgeny 15y ago
        Actually I mostly see the skinny guys doing this.
    - Evgeny 15y ago
      Maybe, if you can see it done in movies like "Pumping Iron" or "Blood and Guts" -> "meathead", otherwise not.
joe_the_user 15y ago
Indeed, this approach seems like a lawsuit waiting to happen. Push-ups are, at-best, a difficult exercise to get right (see http://thetoptwoinches.wordpress.com/2007/12/04/100/ http://thetoptwoinches.wordpress.com/2007/12/04/100/). Do them in bad form and you can injure yourself. Is the team leader going to be both an expert at management AND an expert at physical education? Does the company want the lawsuits if an employee is injured exercising at the direction of their team leaders? Are investors aware that their money is being used for this stuff? Oh, and considering this stuff is not related to the job at hand, you could also argue for a discrimination lawsuit considering it's creating a "hostile work environment" for anyone without a lot of shoulder strength (women, old people, the disabled).
- jrockway 15y ago
  That's not what "hostile work environment" means. Mandatory pushups are one of the dumbest ideas I've ever heard of, but I assume you are not going to be fired if you don't do them. When everyone starts doing pushups, go out for a quick run, or something.
  - SoftwareMaven 15y ago
    Depending on the situation, you could have a hostile work environment[0]. Take a guy who is over weight and weak, make him feel uncomfortable about not being "good enough" to do the push ups, add "good natured" ribbing from co-workers that goes on day after day and subtle "anti-team" vibe because the rest of the team is pushing up together. Likely? No. Possible? Yes. Something to watch for but not something to stress unduly about. [0] Remember, hostile work environment is not about any specific protected class (age, race, etc), but about general feelings of harassment and discomfort. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hostile_work_environment http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hostile_work_environment
    - jrockway 15y ago
      Intent is the key. Making you do pushups isn't intended to make you quit, it's intended to be fun. It's a dumb idea, but it's not hostile.
joelrunyon 15y ago
"Pushup aren't "remotely" sufficient if that's all you're doing." I don't think he wanted this to recreate the gym experience at work. It's just a little work break for exercise that they wouldn't get throughout the day. I think we can all agree, some pushups > no pushups at all. I don't see why it has to be an all or nothing philosophy. Also, you should respect the pushup more than you are. They're surprisingly difficult and much more varied than they first appear. :)
jcc80 15y ago
Athletic != Meathead. I think by meathead he meant that the cast of Jersey Shore isn't coding for them.
- tjogin 15y ago
  Working hard for years to build muscle doesn't make you stupid. It makes you determined.
brianobush 15y ago
that was my first reaction too. I run two miles per day and mountain bike on the weekends. That is when my mind clears up and allows ideas to take (new) form. One way to allow employees to get fit is offering discounts to gym and group after-work sports.

larsberg 15y ago

Yeah, I found that statement funny, since the first tech company I worked for was MSFT. Out in that area (the pacific northwest), physical activity is a huge deal -- hiking, skiing, and snowboarding especially. On every team I was on, the vast majority of the people were in stunningly good shape. Even the 35+, multiple-kids crowd. I still remember one time that I almost killed an interview candidate by mistake. Ran down to pick him up in the lobby, and then started talking to him on the way up to our offices... realizing at the second of five floors that we needed to move this discussion to the elevator before he had a heart attack. We used the elevators so rarely that it hadn't even occurred to me! Of course, there were strange things about it. Many people got season-long Mt. Baker lift passes, and you could basically write off schedule estimates for the first week of the season that there was enough powder on the ground.

checker 15y ago
Taking the stairs is such an easy way to burn a few calories. It surprises me how few people do it in my office. Although, as shown by your story, some people just aren't able to!
- matwood 15y ago
  It always amuses me to see non-handicap people taking the elevator at the gym.
  - sixtofour 15y ago
    I think a lot of people unconsciously see the stairs as a fallback method to the elevator. Stairs in a commercial building are usually minimally decorated. They're "the fire escape."
    - chrisbolt 15y ago
      The stairs in my office building are alarmed on the ground floor and only open on the 5th and 10th floors (from the stairs side).
    - tsotha 15y ago
      In a lot of local buildings where I live the doors are locked from the stairwell side on every floor and locked from the outside at ground level. So you can use them to go down during a fire, but you can't use them to go up.
      - roundsquare 15y ago
        Yeah. Having been locked in stairwells before (luckily not for too long) I don't usually take the stairs unless they are out in the open.
  - ehsanu1 15y ago
    Unless you're strength training. In which case, you may not care to climb the stairs as they don't really further your goals.
    - finnomenon 15y ago
      If you are squatting heavy, as you should be doing if you are training with the goal to increase your overall strength, walking up a couple floors shouldn't be too hard of a task and I am pretty sure there are more benefits to it than it would hurt your other goals.
      - StavrosK 15y ago
- afterburner 15y ago
  Some people have knee problems. Although sometimes those knee problems are alleviated by regular stair use...
  - checker 15y ago
    Yeah I definitely have nothing against anyone who goes through actual pain, or anyone who has no reason for that matter. I was just stating that in my experience, very few of my officemates that I know are capable end up taking the stairs willingly. It's their choice to make.
- macleodan 15y ago
  I put up a leader board in the office yesterday for stair climbing times. I've got one other person interested and the competition has started already. :) Current best time is 44s for 8 floors.
- 2muchcoffeeman 15y ago
  Sometimes it is because of stupid building rules. The fire doors in my building are alarmed and you can't get in and out of them. You can only exit at the bottom and enter through upper floors in case of a fire.

goldmab 15y ago

"Meathead" is just a stupid thing to call someone. It's a stereotype that requires no mental effort, and it makes you feel superior.

Symmetry 15y ago

If think you're parsing that wrong. Being a meathead isn't at all the same as being athletic, I would hope that nobody would think that programmers couldn't be athletic. But when people think of programmers excercizing, they tend to think of running or biking or skiing or hiking rather than a "meathead" form of exercise like group pushups. And the fact that you find group pushups "awkward and weird" shows that the author had some justification in being defensive about it. Of course, I totally agree that they aren't a good enough form of exercise.

jmonegro 15y ago
Pushups are not a "meathead" form of exercise.
- kd0amg 15y ago
  What makes something a "meathead" or "nonmeathead" exercise?
  - afterburner 15y ago
    Maybe because pushups sound like a standard army excercise/punishment? Anyways, many valid points being made about stereotypes.
  - sliverstorm 15y ago
    Curls in the squat rack?
    - Evgeny 15y ago
      Actually I mostly see the skinny guys doing this.
  - Evgeny 15y ago
    Maybe, if you can see it done in movies like "Pumping Iron" or "Blood and Guts" -> "meathead", otherwise not.

joe_the_user 15y ago

Indeed, this approach seems like a lawsuit waiting to happen. Push-ups are, at-best, a difficult exercise to get right (see http://thetoptwoinches.wordpress.com/2007/12/04/100/ http://thetoptwoinches.wordpress.com/2007/12/04/100/). Do them in bad form and you can injure yourself. Is the team leader going to be both an expert at management AND an expert at physical education? Does the company want the lawsuits if an employee is injured exercising at the direction of their team leaders? Are investors aware that their money is being used for this stuff? Oh, and considering this stuff is not related to the job at hand, you could also argue for a discrimination lawsuit considering it's creating a "hostile work environment" for anyone without a lot of shoulder strength (women, old people, the disabled).

jrockway 15y ago
That's not what "hostile work environment" means. Mandatory pushups are one of the dumbest ideas I've ever heard of, but I assume you are not going to be fired if you don't do them. When everyone starts doing pushups, go out for a quick run, or something.
- SoftwareMaven 15y ago
  Depending on the situation, you could have a hostile work environment[0]. Take a guy who is over weight and weak, make him feel uncomfortable about not being "good enough" to do the push ups, add "good natured" ribbing from co-workers that goes on day after day and subtle "anti-team" vibe because the rest of the team is pushing up together. Likely? No. Possible? Yes. Something to watch for but not something to stress unduly about. [0] Remember, hostile work environment is not about any specific protected class (age, race, etc), but about general feelings of harassment and discomfort. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hostile_work_environment http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hostile_work_environment
  - jrockway 15y ago
    Intent is the key. Making you do pushups isn't intended to make you quit, it's intended to be fun. It's a dumb idea, but it's not hostile.

joelrunyon 15y ago

"Pushup aren't "remotely" sufficient if that's all you're doing." I don't think he wanted this to recreate the gym experience at work. It's just a little work break for exercise that they wouldn't get throughout the day. I think we can all agree, some pushups > no pushups at all. I don't see why it has to be an all or nothing philosophy. Also, you should respect the pushup more than you are. They're surprisingly difficult and much more varied than they first appear. :)

jcc80 15y ago

Athletic != Meathead. I think by meathead he meant that the cast of Jersey Shore isn't coding for them.

tjogin 15y ago
Working hard for years to build muscle doesn't make you stupid. It makes you determined.

brianobush 15y ago

that was my first reaction too. I run two miles per day and mountain bike on the weekends. That is when my mind clears up and allows ideas to take (new) form. One way to allow employees to get fit is offering discounts to gym and group after-work sports.