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It's interesting to me that people like this can continue to succeed in modern democracies. There seems to be no consequences for massive financial crimes anymo

It's interesting to me that people like this can continue to succeed in modern democracies. There seems to be no consequences for massive financial crimes anymore, and the more brazen you are the more you are rewarded. If I broke into the homes of millions of people to fleece them of their life savings I'd never be seeing the outside of a prison but these guys do it via a confidence scam and the internet and never see the inside of a prison. Then they become CEO of another company and start all over agin. I stop believing in democracy when I read stories like these.

adolph 5y ago
it has been said that democracy is the worst form of Government except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time https://richardlangworth.com/worst-form-of-government https://richardlangworth.com/worst-form-of-government
lainga 5y ago
The nuance is slightly different - it's like the CEO's breaking into the homes of millions of Americans. The fellow participants in his democracy (in Israel) were not affected; there are two separate jurisdictions.
- rchaud 5y ago
  "Well, we barred them from doing it within our borders" is not a great example of a democracy in action. These firms were allowed to operate a criminal enterprise until 2017 on the voters' home soil. Just because it wasn't against the laws at that time doesn't absolve the political leadership of responsibility.
  - andrewflnr 5y ago
    > "Well, we barred them from doing it within our borders" is not a great example of a democracy in action. It kind of is, though. The voters voted to protect themselves. And while you could think of that as selfish and not be wrong, at least they were able to protect themselves against a well-funded lobby that almost certainly would have liked to prevent them.
  - Animats 5y ago
    The entire Times of Israel series on binary options [1] tells a sad, sordid story. It came out slowly. At first, it just looked like a few minor scammers. But as the Times dug deeper, publishing over 50 articles, it came out that at peak, the binary options scam was 40% of the Israeli financial sector and had enough political connections to stall enforcement. The Israeli crackdown came only after the scam was starting to hurt Israel's foreign relations.[2] Israel's "public diplomacy" minister: “Leaving aside the profound moral questions this raises,” [referring to reports estimating that billions of dollars have been stolen from unwitting customers by fraudulent Israeli binary options firms], “I come from the field of foreign policy, protecting Israel from delegitimization and BDS [the boycott, divest and sanction movement]… These activities threaten Israel’s legitimacy. [The industry] will “contribute to those who want to delegitimize us if these charges turn out to be absolutely true. It’s very, very disturbing… horrible.” So now there's a large community of scammers who, having been kicked out of binary options in Israel, are looking for new areas in which to operate. Forex, contracts for difference, and cryptocurrency scams have been found. DraftKings has some of the same people involved. This is one of the worst things that can happen to a country - developing a large, successful criminal class. It's really hard to get rid of them, and they may end up running the country, as happened to Russia after the downfall of the USSR. [1] https://www.timesofisrael.com/topic/binary-options/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/topic/binary-options/ [2] https://www.timesofisrael.com/michael-oren-backs-knesset-probe-of-binary-options-which-threatens-israel/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/michael-oren-backs-knesset-pro...
api 5y ago
These things happen in autocracies too, and often with the blessing of the autocrats in exchange for huge bribes. Money talks... in all systems of government.
- rchaud 5y ago
  Autocracies don't posit themselves as a model of governance for the rest of the world.
  - chii 5y ago
    The propaganda coming from autocracies begs to differ.
- jandrese 5y ago
  The difference is that people in a Democracy are supposed to combat corruption like this. In an Autocracy it is just the order of the day, nobody tries to seriously oppose it. Or they die trying.
api 5y ago
> There seems to be no consequences for massive financial crimes anymore, and the more brazen you are the more you are rewarded. Finance is too big to fail. Number must go up or everything breaks and there is chaos in the streets. If we hold huge scale financial criminals accountable, it could spark financial contagion and number may not go up. Virtually all countries are in this boat to some extent.
tobyjsullivan 5y ago
Sorry but how does this relate to democracy? This seems like your issue would be with the sovereignty of the various countries involved. What does it matter if those countries are democratic or not?
- axus 5y ago
  They really mean "un-corrupted government that cares about the concerns of its average citizens".
  - droopyEyelids 5y ago
    And that is the root of the confusion. Democracies may be less prone to corruption, but they're certainly not immune to it.
  - pempem 5y ago
    They really mean "governments that uphold the rule of law and apply it equally to all"
jl2718 5y ago
White collar law enforcement picks easy targets. They know these guys will outspend their legal budgets.

adolph 5y ago

it has been said that democracy is the worst form of Government except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time https://richardlangworth.com/worst-form-of-government https://richardlangworth.com/worst-form-of-government

lainga 5y ago

The nuance is slightly different - it's like the CEO's breaking into the homes of millions of Americans. The fellow participants in his democracy (in Israel) were not affected; there are two separate jurisdictions.

rchaud 5y ago
"Well, we barred them from doing it within our borders" is not a great example of a democracy in action. These firms were allowed to operate a criminal enterprise until 2017 on the voters' home soil. Just because it wasn't against the laws at that time doesn't absolve the political leadership of responsibility.
- andrewflnr 5y ago
  > "Well, we barred them from doing it within our borders" is not a great example of a democracy in action. It kind of is, though. The voters voted to protect themselves. And while you could think of that as selfish and not be wrong, at least they were able to protect themselves against a well-funded lobby that almost certainly would have liked to prevent them.
- Animats 5y ago
  The entire Times of Israel series on binary options [1] tells a sad, sordid story. It came out slowly. At first, it just looked like a few minor scammers. But as the Times dug deeper, publishing over 50 articles, it came out that at peak, the binary options scam was 40% of the Israeli financial sector and had enough political connections to stall enforcement. The Israeli crackdown came only after the scam was starting to hurt Israel's foreign relations.[2] Israel's "public diplomacy" minister: “Leaving aside the profound moral questions this raises,” [referring to reports estimating that billions of dollars have been stolen from unwitting customers by fraudulent Israeli binary options firms], “I come from the field of foreign policy, protecting Israel from delegitimization and BDS [the boycott, divest and sanction movement]… These activities threaten Israel’s legitimacy. [The industry] will “contribute to those who want to delegitimize us if these charges turn out to be absolutely true. It’s very, very disturbing… horrible.” So now there's a large community of scammers who, having been kicked out of binary options in Israel, are looking for new areas in which to operate. Forex, contracts for difference, and cryptocurrency scams have been found. DraftKings has some of the same people involved. This is one of the worst things that can happen to a country - developing a large, successful criminal class. It's really hard to get rid of them, and they may end up running the country, as happened to Russia after the downfall of the USSR. [1] https://www.timesofisrael.com/topic/binary-options/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/topic/binary-options/ [2] https://www.timesofisrael.com/michael-oren-backs-knesset-probe-of-binary-options-which-threatens-israel/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/michael-oren-backs-knesset-pro...

api 5y ago

These things happen in autocracies too, and often with the blessing of the autocrats in exchange for huge bribes. Money talks... in all systems of government.

rchaud 5y ago
Autocracies don't posit themselves as a model of governance for the rest of the world.
- chii 5y ago
  The propaganda coming from autocracies begs to differ.
jandrese 5y ago
The difference is that people in a Democracy are supposed to combat corruption like this. In an Autocracy it is just the order of the day, nobody tries to seriously oppose it. Or they die trying.

api 5y ago

> There seems to be no consequences for massive financial crimes anymore, and the more brazen you are the more you are rewarded. Finance is too big to fail. Number must go up or everything breaks and there is chaos in the streets. If we hold huge scale financial criminals accountable, it could spark financial contagion and number may not go up. Virtually all countries are in this boat to some extent.

tobyjsullivan 5y ago

Sorry but how does this relate to democracy? This seems like your issue would be with the sovereignty of the various countries involved. What does it matter if those countries are democratic or not?

axus 5y ago
They really mean "un-corrupted government that cares about the concerns of its average citizens".
- droopyEyelids 5y ago
  And that is the root of the confusion. Democracies may be less prone to corruption, but they're certainly not immune to it.
- pempem 5y ago
  They really mean "governments that uphold the rule of law and apply it equally to all"

jl2718 5y ago

White collar law enforcement picks easy targets. They know these guys will outspend their legal budgets.