7 ms·

In fact, Facebook lists already do everything he praises Circles for in this article. They might even do a little more (e.g. share with List A, excluding anyone

by mrshoe 15y ago

In fact, Facebook lists already do everything he praises Circles for in this article. They might even do a little more (e.g. share with List A, excluding anyone in List B). As he correctly notes later in the article, the lists feature is not prominent on Facebook, and therefore few use it (or maybe few people actually want it?). But it definitely will not require a major architectural overhaul by Facebook.

nextparadigms 15y ago
Yes, it would because Google+ following system is asynchronous, kind of like Twitter (though not quit). Facebook doesn't work like that, and it would be a MAJOR change if they implemented it. I think a lot of users that are used to how Facebook currently works would be very upset about it.
- r00fus 15y ago
  Bingo. Thus the people wondering if Google isn't a bigger threat to Twitter than Facebook. The real issue for Facebook is that, if Google+ is successful (my feel is that it's a strategic fire-break to stop Facebook's possible domination of social search), it limits the ways Facebook can additionally monetize their social network. Google+ doesn't need to fail for Facebook to survive, but it does hem in their possible revenue growth. Now twitter...
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]
  - kkleiner 15y ago
    duh! fixed.
- snprbob86 15y ago
  asynchronous --> asymmetric
adbge 15y ago
> In fact, Facebook lists already do everything he praises Circles for in this article. Having used both Google+'s Circles and Facebook's lists, a lot of people are missing the point. Sure, Facebook's lists may be capable of some or even all of the functionality of Google+'s Circles, but that's not addressing the important difference in functionality between the two. Google+ has clearly been designed with Circles in mind. It's easy to tell just from using Google+ that the Circles idea is a core architectural component and not just something that was tacked on. Facebook's lists pale in comparison. They're clearly an afterthought and not many people use them. I extensively used one of Facebook's private groups to mimic the new functionality in Google's Circles with a group of my close friends for about three - four months and, while it was adequate, it's nowhere near as polished or fluid as my experience with Circles. It's really no contest. > But it definitely will not require a major architectural overhaul by Facebook. To those who are saying that it would be trivial to implement Circles functionality on top of Facebook, I sincerely doubt it. It'd be like saying that it wouldn't take much to for Blackberry to adopt the same UI polish of iOS. It's comparing a system that has clearly evolved (BlackBerry, Facebook) to one that has been designed (iOS, Google+). I think us nerds to be careful about just comparing Google+ and Facebook on what features they have, lest we need to be reminded of: "Less space than a Nomad. Lame."
- spullara 15y ago
  Facebook Friend Lists are far more powerful than Google Circles and Facebook Groups are an entirely different beast. At an architectural level Facebook Lists are a core feature. They even had them front and center for a few years as they asked you to populate them by "how do you know this person?" when you added them as a friend. The problem is that no one wanted to use them so they were gradually phased out of the UI.
  - ralfd 15y ago
    This may be a stupid question: How do you use lists? I made some lists with circlehack.com. But on Facebook I don't see a way to share something with a list. I am puzzled...?
MatthewPhillips 15y ago
Lists are not available on the Android app (not sure about iOS). I think the reason it isn't prominent is because it's not the direction the company wants to go. Every since Twitter became popular Facebook moved to become more like Twitter; more public and less private. They stuck the list feature in to placate those complaining about the removal of privacy but they never really wanted people to use it. Now with Google+ taking over the area of private social networking it would be interesting to see if Facebook does an about face and goes back in this direction.
- Lewisham 15y ago
  it's not the direction the company wants to go Nor has it ever been. While lists might appear to work now, I would not at all be surprised if lists are a leaky abstraction with all sorts of holes that would require the codebase rearchitecting that the original story believes. When you have such a fundamental design decision baked into everything you've ever done, it can't change overnight. Perhaps they've been working on it for months or years, but certainly its only in the last year that anyone has been talking about this problem earnestly.
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Jasber 15y ago
My problem with lists is it acts as a separate group rather than a filter. I want to see everyone's posts who is in a list. Instead I only see posts that have been specifically shared with a list. With circles, it automatically filters my stream without anyone having to post to my list or group. They just share it with me. This is a subtle but important difference for me.
- cemregr 15y ago
  At least at some point you could view the news feed of people in a given friend list in Facebook too.
  - spullara 15y ago
    Recent News -> Select friend list.
- zwily 15y ago
  People don't post to a list on Facebook. Your friends don't even know they're in a list, like Circles. You can filter your stream by lists, but it's not exposed on the UI and you have to do some URL mingling.
  - spullara 15y ago
    Recent News -> Select Friend List from drop down.
winsbe01 15y ago
exactly. i think more people would use the lists if it were a more prominent feature. with G+, they are center stage, so people can easily interface with them.
- zwily 15y ago
  They used to be more prominent. They were "hidden" only after it turned out that people didn't like classifying their friends. Either they just did it wrong, or Google will discover the same thing with Circles. (I already find myself pretty much just putting everyone in one of two circles now.)
  - winsbe01 15y ago
    interesting, I don't remember them ever being very prominent. maybe that's just me not paying attention to the software I use :) I'm not sure if Google will experience the same thing with Circles. I think what will happen (enter speculative mode) is there will be a large group that LOVES classifying their friends like this, and they will stick with G+. Another large group will HATE it, find it extremely annoying/pointless (possibly because of only using one or two circles, like you mentioned), and maybe stick with FB. Either way, people will most likely end up with an account on both, using one actively and one passively.
Apocryphon 15y ago
And therein lies one of the biggest issues with Facebook. They offer a lot of features that are hidden away, deliberately released without much fanfare, and are difficult to find.

by mrshoe 15y ago

nextparadigms 15y ago

Yes, it would because Google+ following system is asynchronous, kind of like Twitter (though not quit). Facebook doesn't work like that, and it would be a MAJOR change if they implemented it. I think a lot of users that are used to how Facebook currently works would be very upset about it.

r00fus 15y ago
Bingo. Thus the people wondering if Google isn't a bigger threat to Twitter than Facebook. The real issue for Facebook is that, if Google+ is successful (my feel is that it's a strategic fire-break to stop Facebook's possible domination of social search), it limits the ways Facebook can additionally monetize their social network. Google+ doesn't need to fail for Facebook to survive, but it does hem in their possible revenue growth. Now twitter...
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
- kkleiner 15y ago
  duh! fixed.
snprbob86 15y ago
asynchronous --> asymmetric

adbge 15y ago

> In fact, Facebook lists already do everything he praises Circles for in this article. Having used both Google+'s Circles and Facebook's lists, a lot of people are missing the point. Sure, Facebook's lists may be capable of some or even all of the functionality of Google+'s Circles, but that's not addressing the important difference in functionality between the two. Google+ has clearly been designed with Circles in mind. It's easy to tell just from using Google+ that the Circles idea is a core architectural component and not just something that was tacked on. Facebook's lists pale in comparison. They're clearly an afterthought and not many people use them. I extensively used one of Facebook's private groups to mimic the new functionality in Google's Circles with a group of my close friends for about three - four months and, while it was adequate, it's nowhere near as polished or fluid as my experience with Circles. It's really no contest. > But it definitely will not require a major architectural overhaul by Facebook. To those who are saying that it would be trivial to implement Circles functionality on top of Facebook, I sincerely doubt it. It'd be like saying that it wouldn't take much to for Blackberry to adopt the same UI polish of iOS. It's comparing a system that has clearly evolved (BlackBerry, Facebook) to one that has been designed (iOS, Google+). I think us nerds to be careful about just comparing Google+ and Facebook on what features they have, lest we need to be reminded of: "Less space than a Nomad. Lame."

spullara 15y ago
Facebook Friend Lists are far more powerful than Google Circles and Facebook Groups are an entirely different beast. At an architectural level Facebook Lists are a core feature. They even had them front and center for a few years as they asked you to populate them by "how do you know this person?" when you added them as a friend. The problem is that no one wanted to use them so they were gradually phased out of the UI.
- ralfd 15y ago
  This may be a stupid question: How do you use lists? I made some lists with circlehack.com. But on Facebook I don't see a way to share something with a list. I am puzzled...?

MatthewPhillips 15y ago

Lists are not available on the Android app (not sure about iOS). I think the reason it isn't prominent is because it's not the direction the company wants to go. Every since Twitter became popular Facebook moved to become more like Twitter; more public and less private. They stuck the list feature in to placate those complaining about the removal of privacy but they never really wanted people to use it. Now with Google+ taking over the area of private social networking it would be interesting to see if Facebook does an about face and goes back in this direction.

Lewisham 15y ago
it's not the direction the company wants to go Nor has it ever been. While lists might appear to work now, I would not at all be surprised if lists are a leaky abstraction with all sorts of holes that would require the codebase rearchitecting that the original story believes. When you have such a fundamental design decision baked into everything you've ever done, it can't change overnight. Perhaps they've been working on it for months or years, but certainly its only in the last year that anyone has been talking about this problem earnestly.

deleted 15y ago

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deleted 15y ago
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- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]
  - deleted 15y ago
    [deleted]

Jasber 15y ago

My problem with lists is it acts as a separate group rather than a filter. I want to see everyone's posts who is in a list. Instead I only see posts that have been specifically shared with a list. With circles, it automatically filters my stream without anyone having to post to my list or group. They just share it with me. This is a subtle but important difference for me.

cemregr 15y ago
At least at some point you could view the news feed of people in a given friend list in Facebook too.
- spullara 15y ago
  Recent News -> Select friend list.
zwily 15y ago
People don't post to a list on Facebook. Your friends don't even know they're in a list, like Circles. You can filter your stream by lists, but it's not exposed on the UI and you have to do some URL mingling.
- spullara 15y ago
  Recent News -> Select Friend List from drop down.

winsbe01 15y ago

exactly. i think more people would use the lists if it were a more prominent feature. with G+, they are center stage, so people can easily interface with them.

zwily 15y ago
They used to be more prominent. They were "hidden" only after it turned out that people didn't like classifying their friends. Either they just did it wrong, or Google will discover the same thing with Circles. (I already find myself pretty much just putting everyone in one of two circles now.)
- winsbe01 15y ago
  interesting, I don't remember them ever being very prominent. maybe that's just me not paying attention to the software I use :) I'm not sure if Google will experience the same thing with Circles. I think what will happen (enter speculative mode) is there will be a large group that LOVES classifying their friends like this, and they will stick with G+. Another large group will HATE it, find it extremely annoying/pointless (possibly because of only using one or two circles, like you mentioned), and maybe stick with FB. Either way, people will most likely end up with an account on both, using one actively and one passively.

Apocryphon 15y ago

And therein lies one of the biggest issues with Facebook. They offer a lot of features that are hidden away, deliberately released without much fanfare, and are difficult to find.