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It doesn't seem like anyone believes cryptos are supposed to be currencies any more. All the talk around them is around them being a new, exciting, and potentia

by pradn 5y ago

It doesn't seem like anyone believes cryptos are supposed to be currencies any more. All the talk around them is around them being a new, exciting, and potentially very lucrative investment class. If you go to Coinbase's front page, you see that you can buy and sell them, like you can with Robinhood. It's not trying to be a PayPal. The currency-ness does serve an important purpose. It helps bring in investment for the nebulous future where using them as currencies will have advantages.

vmception 5y ago
USDC, DAI, USDT are all used more than ever, orders of magnitude more People dont have to talk about them as currencies because they just work No different than cellular reception in an underground subway, you dont have to think about it anymore
- kllrnohj 5y ago
  > People dont have to talk about them as currencies because they just work Well that's not really true, it was headline news when Tesla started accepting crypto payments (and then headline news when they stopped). Stores accepting crypto still makes the news, it's not common and not something that "just works." But what you can do is at least semi-reliably convert between crypto & things that stores do accept using the various conversions you listed. But you still do have to convert from crypto to a traditional currency to use it as a currency.
  - vmception 5y ago
    There have been debit cards loaded with crypto for almost a decade now Your fictional higher standard of currency would say that the euro is not a currency because my transferwise debit card converts it to dollars when I spend in the US The peer to peer payment mechanism works and all crypto assets inherit that
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
- cableshaft 5y ago
  Yep, used USDC just last night to buy a new computer, just before this big crash happened, thankfully (since I converted some crypto to do it). Actually using that for its intended purpose.
  - vmception 5y ago
    No didn't you read all the other comments, that didn't happen because nobody uses them as currencies, or it didnt happen because either the payment processor, merchant, or their daycare provider eventually converted to the state’s local fiat currency so your experience is invalid /s
  - zaphar 5y ago
    That's like saying I payed for my new house with stocks. Which is not the same thing as stocks being a currency. What actually happened is that you liquidated some crypto and used the proceeds to buy your new computer. You even say that directly in your parenthetical. (since I converted some crypto to do it)
    - cableshaft 5y ago
      I converted from one form of cryptocurrency to another cryptocurrency (USDC is USDCoin, a Stablecoin). I was paying on NewEgg using their BitPay method, which supports payment with only the following cryptocurrencies: Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, Ethereum, Wrapped Bitcoin, Dogecoin, and 5 stablecoins (GUSD, USDC, PAX, DAI, and BUSD). I have Bitcoin and could have paid directly with that, but I wanted to keep holding it and pay with Litecoin. So I converted that to USDC (for free, but I will have to pay taxes on the gains next year since every conversion or purchase is a taxable event in crypto in the US), and then sent that to Bitpay. So yes, I still maintain I used USDC for its intended purpose. I did, however, do what you said and liquidated some Ethereum to fiat several years ago (right at the previous bull run's top, by happenstance, got super lucky then) to pay for the downpayment on my home. I would have paid with it directly if I could but there was just no mechanism for it, at least not back then.
- marcusverus 5y ago
  > USDC, DAI, USDT are all used more than ever, orders of magnitude more Even these cryptos aren't being used as currencies per se. They're popular, sure, but they're popular because A) they allow traders to move funds between crypto 'investments' without converting to fiat (i.e. without triggering cap gains), and B) They allow investors to "avoid market volatility" (but in a manner far riskier than fiat, given that even DAI or USDT could go to zero tomorrow). ...but they're still not currencies. Nobody is buying a hamburger with DAI.
  - nostrademons 5y ago
    If the trader is being honest, converting cryptocurrencies to stablecoins is a taxable event triggering capital gains. The IRS considers any exchange of one cryptocurrency for another to be a sale of a capital asset and purchase of another.
    - erosenbe0 5y ago
      Yes. They are assets and you must pay tax every time you swap them or even use them to make a purchase. It's like making a purchase with Apple stock or swapping Apple stock for Google stock. Pay tax.
    - sizzle 5y ago
      How will the government track and get their dues?
      - vmception 5y ago
        Typically they use account information from the exchanges and follow that onchain But they generally rely on individuals to report accurately. Obviously wage-earners arent used to that as their employers withhold money for taxes and report to the IRS so this crowd may find this new found freedom to be foreign and a chance to “get away with” something, but everyone else has lived in a world where they report their taxes voluntarily and accurately
  - nikanj 5y ago
- Animats 5y ago
  USDT is a concern, because it probably can't survive a big net outflow. Right now, dumping Bitcoin and buying, say, yuan is something a hedge fund might do. Or may have been doing over the last few weeks. What happens when some trader cashes out a few billion dollars in USDT to buy yuan? Coinbase has to wire transfer out that cash.
ilaksh 5y ago
Well.. yes and no. A lot of people unfortunately never really understood the real concept of a cryptocurrency as a payment mechanism and instead believe they are for getting rich quick. That's the business Coinbase is in. Now, if you are using cryptocurrency for payments you don't need Coinbase. PayPal, since you mention it, knows that cryptocurrency is going to make it's business model obsolete as soon as it is widely deployed. That is why they pretend to allow you to keep and use Bitcoin on their platform.
matheusmoreira 5y ago
> It's not trying to be a PayPal. Binance already has a credit card service that lets people use their cryptocurrency holdings to buy anything.
- i386 5y ago
  Binance has to be the most cringeworthy term of 2021
  - matheusmoreira 5y ago
    What? Binance isn't a term, it's a cryptocurrency exchange.
  - arthurcolle 5y ago
    Binance is an exchange
asjdflakjsdf 5y ago
Doge is picking up steam in that regard. It has so many problems though
- 908087 5y ago
  Yes. The core problem being that it's a combination of an MLM and pump and dump scheme built on top of a joke.
divs1210 5y ago
I have used crypto (LTC, BUSD, XLM, XMR) to pay internet strangers so many times I've lost count. Looks like you just haven't tried it yet.
- cm2187 5y ago
  Perhaps he doesn't consume the same sort of products than you!
- mousepilot 5y ago
  yeah Ima have to update your file buddy
- nroets 5y ago
  It's a fad[1]. It won't last. [1]: https://Bitcoin.IsNot.Money https://Bitcoin.IsNot.Money
  - aparsons 5y ago
    Not sure why you’re downvoted
    - rebelos 5y ago
      There's a sizable cabal of delusional crypto fanatics that lurk HN. And they're extra salty after this latest correction.
  - xtracto 5y ago
    One more bitcoin obituary for the collection. https://99bitcoins.com/bitcoin-obituaries/ https://99bitcoins.com/bitcoin-obituaries/
stjohnswarts 5y ago
Yeah it's a value store. The only way it's not is if a nation state creates it and ties it to their currency. It's going to continue to go up and down forever.
remolacha 5y ago
Not all crypto assets are crypto currencies. Many DeFi tokens (ex. UNI, SUSHI, AAVE) govern projects with real cash flows and are poised to become more like equities on the blockchain
- lurkerasdfh8 5y ago
  > real cash flows you keep using that word...
sashimi-houdini 5y ago
It used to be that enthusiasts could claim "currency of the future", but a lot of time has passed and that future simply hasn't come. In fact, Bitcoin's top utility is already far behind us. Dropping "currency of the future" does come with the challenge of coming up with a new supposed benefit, which is where "store of value" comes in. Problem is: there is no inherent value in bitcoin.
- gverrilla 5y ago
  >a lot of time not really
  - sashimi-houdini 5y ago
    Just think what happened with PCs between 1975 and 1987... that's also 12 years
earnesti 5y ago
I use Bitcoin as payment for products and services all the time. I dont talk about it though, why would I? It is boring. I dont talk about how I use paypal or bank accounts to pay for stuff either. There are certain segments eg. travel where bitcoin/crypto has worked well for years. When I talk with friends about BTC, it is about price because that is the interesting part. The fact that I used it to pay for something is just not interesting.

by pradn 5y ago

vmception 5y ago

USDC, DAI, USDT are all used more than ever, orders of magnitude more People dont have to talk about them as currencies because they just work No different than cellular reception in an underground subway, you dont have to think about it anymore

kllrnohj 5y ago
> People dont have to talk about them as currencies because they just work Well that's not really true, it was headline news when Tesla started accepting crypto payments (and then headline news when they stopped). Stores accepting crypto still makes the news, it's not common and not something that "just works." But what you can do is at least semi-reliably convert between crypto & things that stores do accept using the various conversions you listed. But you still do have to convert from crypto to a traditional currency to use it as a currency.
- vmception 5y ago
  There have been debit cards loaded with crypto for almost a decade now Your fictional higher standard of currency would say that the euro is not a currency because my transferwise debit card converts it to dollars when I spend in the US The peer to peer payment mechanism works and all crypto assets inherit that
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
cableshaft 5y ago
Yep, used USDC just last night to buy a new computer, just before this big crash happened, thankfully (since I converted some crypto to do it). Actually using that for its intended purpose.
- vmception 5y ago
  No didn't you read all the other comments, that didn't happen because nobody uses them as currencies, or it didnt happen because either the payment processor, merchant, or their daycare provider eventually converted to the state’s local fiat currency so your experience is invalid /s
- zaphar 5y ago
  That's like saying I payed for my new house with stocks. Which is not the same thing as stocks being a currency. What actually happened is that you liquidated some crypto and used the proceeds to buy your new computer. You even say that directly in your parenthetical. (since I converted some crypto to do it)
  - cableshaft 5y ago
    I converted from one form of cryptocurrency to another cryptocurrency (USDC is USDCoin, a Stablecoin). I was paying on NewEgg using their BitPay method, which supports payment with only the following cryptocurrencies: Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, Ethereum, Wrapped Bitcoin, Dogecoin, and 5 stablecoins (GUSD, USDC, PAX, DAI, and BUSD). I have Bitcoin and could have paid directly with that, but I wanted to keep holding it and pay with Litecoin. So I converted that to USDC (for free, but I will have to pay taxes on the gains next year since every conversion or purchase is a taxable event in crypto in the US), and then sent that to Bitpay. So yes, I still maintain I used USDC for its intended purpose. I did, however, do what you said and liquidated some Ethereum to fiat several years ago (right at the previous bull run's top, by happenstance, got super lucky then) to pay for the downpayment on my home. I would have paid with it directly if I could but there was just no mechanism for it, at least not back then.
marcusverus 5y ago
> USDC, DAI, USDT are all used more than ever, orders of magnitude more Even these cryptos aren't being used as currencies per se. They're popular, sure, but they're popular because A) they allow traders to move funds between crypto 'investments' without converting to fiat (i.e. without triggering cap gains), and B) They allow investors to "avoid market volatility" (but in a manner far riskier than fiat, given that even DAI or USDT could go to zero tomorrow). ...but they're still not currencies. Nobody is buying a hamburger with DAI.
- nostrademons 5y ago
  If the trader is being honest, converting cryptocurrencies to stablecoins is a taxable event triggering capital gains. The IRS considers any exchange of one cryptocurrency for another to be a sale of a capital asset and purchase of another.
  - erosenbe0 5y ago
    Yes. They are assets and you must pay tax every time you swap them or even use them to make a purchase. It's like making a purchase with Apple stock or swapping Apple stock for Google stock. Pay tax.
  - sizzle 5y ago
    How will the government track and get their dues?
    - vmception 5y ago
      Typically they use account information from the exchanges and follow that onchain But they generally rely on individuals to report accurately. Obviously wage-earners arent used to that as their employers withhold money for taxes and report to the IRS so this crowd may find this new found freedom to be foreign and a chance to “get away with” something, but everyone else has lived in a world where they report their taxes voluntarily and accurately
- nikanj 5y ago
Animats 5y ago
USDT is a concern, because it probably can't survive a big net outflow. Right now, dumping Bitcoin and buying, say, yuan is something a hedge fund might do. Or may have been doing over the last few weeks. What happens when some trader cashes out a few billion dollars in USDT to buy yuan? Coinbase has to wire transfer out that cash.

ilaksh 5y ago

Well.. yes and no. A lot of people unfortunately never really understood the real concept of a cryptocurrency as a payment mechanism and instead believe they are for getting rich quick. That's the business Coinbase is in. Now, if you are using cryptocurrency for payments you don't need Coinbase. PayPal, since you mention it, knows that cryptocurrency is going to make it's business model obsolete as soon as it is widely deployed. That is why they pretend to allow you to keep and use Bitcoin on their platform.

matheusmoreira 5y ago

> It's not trying to be a PayPal. Binance already has a credit card service that lets people use their cryptocurrency holdings to buy anything.

i386 5y ago
Binance has to be the most cringeworthy term of 2021
- matheusmoreira 5y ago
  What? Binance isn't a term, it's a cryptocurrency exchange.
- arthurcolle 5y ago
  Binance is an exchange

asjdflakjsdf 5y ago

Doge is picking up steam in that regard. It has so many problems though

908087 5y ago
Yes. The core problem being that it's a combination of an MLM and pump and dump scheme built on top of a joke.

divs1210 5y ago

I have used crypto (LTC, BUSD, XLM, XMR) to pay internet strangers so many times I've lost count. Looks like you just haven't tried it yet.

cm2187 5y ago
Perhaps he doesn't consume the same sort of products than you!
mousepilot 5y ago
yeah Ima have to update your file buddy
nroets 5y ago
It's a fad[1]. It won't last. [1]: https://Bitcoin.IsNot.Money https://Bitcoin.IsNot.Money
- aparsons 5y ago
  Not sure why you’re downvoted
  - rebelos 5y ago
    There's a sizable cabal of delusional crypto fanatics that lurk HN. And they're extra salty after this latest correction.
- xtracto 5y ago
  One more bitcoin obituary for the collection. https://99bitcoins.com/bitcoin-obituaries/ https://99bitcoins.com/bitcoin-obituaries/

stjohnswarts 5y ago

Yeah it's a value store. The only way it's not is if a nation state creates it and ties it to their currency. It's going to continue to go up and down forever.

remolacha 5y ago

Not all crypto assets are crypto currencies. Many DeFi tokens (ex. UNI, SUSHI, AAVE) govern projects with real cash flows and are poised to become more like equities on the blockchain

lurkerasdfh8 5y ago
> real cash flows you keep using that word...

sashimi-houdini 5y ago

It used to be that enthusiasts could claim "currency of the future", but a lot of time has passed and that future simply hasn't come. In fact, Bitcoin's top utility is already far behind us. Dropping "currency of the future" does come with the challenge of coming up with a new supposed benefit, which is where "store of value" comes in. Problem is: there is no inherent value in bitcoin.

gverrilla 5y ago
>a lot of time not really
- sashimi-houdini 5y ago
  Just think what happened with PCs between 1975 and 1987... that's also 12 years

earnesti 5y ago

I use Bitcoin as payment for products and services all the time. I dont talk about it though, why would I? It is boring. I dont talk about how I use paypal or bank accounts to pay for stuff either. There are certain segments eg. travel where bitcoin/crypto has worked well for years. When I talk with friends about BTC, it is about price because that is the interesting part. The fact that I used it to pay for something is just not interesting.