10 ms·

I hate to say that, but I am likely going to buy M2 Mac. I don't like Apple and their anti-competitive tactics, but I admit they won their spot for now. Howeve

I hate to say that, but I am likely going to buy M2 Mac. I don't like Apple and their anti-competitive tactics, but I admit they won their spot for now. However, as soon as good PC competitor comes in, I'll drop Apple like a hot potato.

tmccrary55 6y ago
I'm really hoping Alder Lake or a similar AMD product gets PC closer to M1+ performance and battery consumption. The M1 chip is amazing but I'm a tiling window manager man.
- hajile 6y ago
  https://ianyh.com/amethyst/ https://ianyh.com/amethyst/
  - ripply 6y ago
    I also am a tiling window manager man and tried that a few years back (as well as everything else on the market) when I had a mac from work, unfortunately, without real support from the OS, these are all just poor mans windows managers and can't compare to the real thing. I gave up trying to use any of them and ended up installing a virtual machine where I could actually use one.
    - galangalalgol 6y ago
      I'm a gnome addict. If you ever asked yourself "who are they building this monstrosity for?". That would be me, it fits my exact preferences in a workflow out of the box. Unity irritates me to no end, and my wife's mac is almost unusable for me which she greatly appreciates.
  - _joel 6y ago
    Not sure why you're being down voted, I use Amethyst and love it.
- reader_mode 6y ago
  It seems like apple is TSMC priority customer so I suspect they will always be a node ahead of AMD. Doesn't matter if Apple does mobile and low power stuff exclusively, but if they can scale this design into a higher TDP/core count it's going to get interesting.
- anuragsoni 6y ago
  This will obviously not be comparable to a tiling window manager, but I've been pretty happy with Rectangle [1] on my mac. The keyboard mappings are pretty easy to configure and i've found it to work well even in multi monitor setups. [1] https://github.com/rxhanson/Rectangle https://github.com/rxhanson/Rectangle
  - mwint 6y ago
    +1 for Rectangle; I've been using it ever since it was Spectacle. There's nothing I really miss about a proper tiling window manager (though I'm sure hardcore users would disagree)
    - anuragsoni 6y ago
      > There's nothing I really miss about a proper tiling window manager (though I'm sure hardcore users would disagree) Agreed. I mostly just needed the keyboard driven window snapping I was used to on Gnome and rectangle has filled than need 100%.
- totalZero 6y ago
  Alder Lake will get closer because of the big.LITTLE structure, but I don't know if we will really see a contender from Intel until Meteor Lake. Lithography size gets too much attention for its nomenclature, but it actually matters for battery consumption and thermal management. Intel must execute flawlessly on 7nm and spend generously on capex to keep the ball rolling.
- volta83 6y ago
  This is Mac OS: - https://www.reddit.com/r/unixporn/comments/jupmda/aquayabai_a_fun_colorful_rice_to_brighten_my/ https://www.reddit.com/r/unixporn/comments/jupmda/aquayabai_... - https://www.reddit.com/r/unixporn/comments/mvuplf/yabaimacos_proof_that_macos_can_look_good/ https://www.reddit.com/r/unixporn/comments/mvuplf/yabaimacos... Its called Yabai (+ skhd): https://github.com/koekeishiya/yabai https://github.com/koekeishiya/yabai That is, you can have a tilin WM today with all the advantages of running MacOS.
  - tl 6y ago
    From your third link: System Integrity Protection needs to be (partially) disabled for yabai to inject a scripting addition into Dock.app for controlling windows with functions that require elevated privileges. This enables control of the window server, which is the sole owner of all window connections, and enables additional features of yabai. The risk Apple kills yabai after you're adjusted to it is real.
    - volta83 6y ago
      > The risk Apple kills yabai after you're adjusted to it is real. This holds for anything in the Apple ecosystem, up to Fortnite. Yabai has been going for long, and every issue could be worked around relatively painlessly.
      - matwood 6y ago
        > This holds for anything in the Apple ecosystem. Holds for anything in almost any ecosystem. With that said, Apple has stated over and over the Mac will remain developer friendly. Being able to disable SIP, IMO is part of that.
    - athorax 6y ago
      FWIW, I run yabai without having disabled SIP and it works great. There is probably some subset of functionality I am missing out on, but it does what I need it to.
    - 6y ago
- zucker42 6y ago
  Zen 4 will probably at least match the M1, but it will be a while before those chips come out and Apple will soon improve even more.
  - intrasight 6y ago
    I have a feeling that Apple has pulled ahead and will stay ahead for a LONG time. They are extending their moat. And applying Mx to VR they will create a new moat.
    - Synaesthesia 6y ago
      They started pulling ahead in the A6-A7 days and never looked back. Amazing progression.
  - ravi-delia 6y ago
    I'm curious to see if Zen 4 manages actually. It'll be an interesting datapoint as to what actually makes the M1 better.
- kbd 6y ago
  It's not exactly a tiling window manager, but if you can program some simple Lua then Hammerspoon is a godsend. You can program anything any of the other window managers for Mac (like Rectangle, Spectacle, etc.) can do and have complete freedom to set up your own keyboard shortcuts for anything. I have some predefined layouts[1] for my most common usage. So, one keyboard shortcut arranges the screen how I want, and I have other keyboard shortcuts[2] (along with using Karabiner Elements for a 'hyper' key) to open or switch to common apps. [1] https://github.com/kbd/setup/blob/1a05e5df545db0133cf7b6f1bc59f012c1ed6f1b/HOME/.hammerspoon/init.lua#L59 https://github.com/kbd/setup/blob/1a05e5df545db0133cf7b6f1bc... [2] https://github.com/kbd/setup/blob/1a05e5df545db0133cf7b6f1bc59f012c1ed6f1b/HOME/.hammerspoon/init.lua#L163 https://github.com/kbd/setup/blob/1a05e5df545db0133cf7b6f1bc...
- shepherdjerred 6y ago
  https://github.com/koekeishiya/yabai https://github.com/koekeishiya/yabai
- aryik 6y ago
  You’ve gotten plenty of recommendations, but I’ll add one for Magnet [1]. I’ve been using it for years, and I love it. One of the best software purchases I’ve ever made - small, lightweight, does exactly one thing and does it very well, and made by a small developer to boot. [1] https://magnet.crowdcafe.com/index.html https://magnet.crowdcafe.com/index.html
2OEH8eoCRo0 6y ago
"Antitrust is okay if you have a fast processor"
- gpm 6y ago
  "It's not my personal responsibility to attempt to enforce antitrust against companies by boycotting them at significant personal expense".
  - varispeed 6y ago
    Exactly, there are bodies that are supposed to protect consumers from that behaviour, unfortunately they failed everyone massively. That in itself begs for an inquiry how those institutions actually work and whether it is worth spending tax payer money on them if they consistently fail to deliver.
    - jjoonathan 6y ago
      ...and if that exact kind of navel-gazing is why they don't work? What then?
      - varispeed 6y ago
        Charge people for failing to deliver, dispense huge fines and jail time. Then rebuild it in a way to avoid mistakes why the previous solution didn't work.
  - sneak 6y ago
    Additionally, it is still (for the moment) possible to engage with Apple computer hardware without using any of their bullshit services (like the App Store) into which all their anticompetitive behavior has so far been constrained. This is of course not so on Apple mobile devices: it's dox yourself to the App Store or GTFO over there.
- varispeed 6y ago
  The thing is, every competitor is going to upgrade to these and if you stay with inferior Intel products, you give yourself competitive disadvantage. Unfortunately this is the current state of play. If I won't be able to achieve something the same speed competitor can, I put myself in a bad spot. I try to not mix emotions and business, however for a personal machine, I am rocking 5950X and it is awesome.
jonplackett 6y ago
The Apple's second version of everything is always the one to get. The first version is always exciting, but usually comes at some large expense. - iPhone 2 had 3G and was so much better than 1 - iPad 2 was about 3 X slimmer/lighter than 1 Lots of other examples if I though about it.
- varispeed 6y ago
  I still have an iPad 2. I use it in the kitchen to browse recipes.
  - mobilio 6y ago
    I still have another one near bed for reading eBooks
    - intergalplan 6y ago
      I have a first-gen iPad Mini that still sees light use. Approximately the same internals as the iPad 2, AFAIK.
- niels_bom 6y ago
  What, in your opinion, is the drawback of the M1 product series? I haven’t read many negative reviews.
  - outside1234 6y ago
    Memory, ports. That might be more of a product level issue but its a blocker for me.
  - Dennip 6y ago
    The RAM is limited to 16GB, IIRC the max I/O throughout is also somewhat limited as well, so you have to compromise on number of USB4/10Gb Lan etc
  - ajuc 6y ago
    Dedicated graphic cards doesn't work. No Linux support.
geodel 6y ago
No need to hate. Nowadays people in general do make necessity out of convenience and virtue out of necessity.
sigzero 6y ago
I almost went for the M1 but "1.0" kept me sane. I will definitely go for the M2.
oblio 6y ago
Well, here's hoping that both Linux and Windows work flawlessly on their hardware at some point.
- moooo99 6y ago
  Not even macOS works flawlessly on the hardware, why should Windows and Linux do. But as far as it goes for Windows, not having every other update completely break my system would be a welcome change.
  - lofi_lory 6y ago
    Because with Linux excitement can change things. What are you gonna do if you miss something in iOS/macOS? The right people can in principle make anything work in Linux but with macOS you are left praying Apple decides your use case is their business case. Imagine what would happen if the compute/$ M1 laptops would perform in some respect better with Linux than macOS. Things may get out of hand, when huge chunks of the Linux community gets involved.
  - oblio 6y ago
    > Not even macOS works flawlessly on the hardware, why should Windows and Linux do. This is just pedantry and needless nitpicking. Replace "work flawlessly" with "work well" in my previous comment.
vbezhenar 6y ago
Of all the operating systems, I'm finding macOS to be less annoying than the rest. So far Apple did not make a single computer suitable for me, but if they would release something like Mac Pro Cheap Edition (or whatever, I just want workstation-level specs for $2k), I'll switch to it. I don't really care about M1 or Intel, I think that any modern CPUs are fast enough for any tasks.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

tmccrary55 6y ago

I'm really hoping Alder Lake or a similar AMD product gets PC closer to M1+ performance and battery consumption. The M1 chip is amazing but I'm a tiling window manager man.

hajile 6y ago
https://ianyh.com/amethyst/ https://ianyh.com/amethyst/
- ripply 6y ago
  I also am a tiling window manager man and tried that a few years back (as well as everything else on the market) when I had a mac from work, unfortunately, without real support from the OS, these are all just poor mans windows managers and can't compare to the real thing. I gave up trying to use any of them and ended up installing a virtual machine where I could actually use one.
  - galangalalgol 6y ago
    I'm a gnome addict. If you ever asked yourself "who are they building this monstrosity for?". That would be me, it fits my exact preferences in a workflow out of the box. Unity irritates me to no end, and my wife's mac is almost unusable for me which she greatly appreciates.
- _joel 6y ago
  Not sure why you're being down voted, I use Amethyst and love it.
reader_mode 6y ago
It seems like apple is TSMC priority customer so I suspect they will always be a node ahead of AMD. Doesn't matter if Apple does mobile and low power stuff exclusively, but if they can scale this design into a higher TDP/core count it's going to get interesting.
anuragsoni 6y ago
This will obviously not be comparable to a tiling window manager, but I've been pretty happy with Rectangle [1] on my mac. The keyboard mappings are pretty easy to configure and i've found it to work well even in multi monitor setups. [1] https://github.com/rxhanson/Rectangle https://github.com/rxhanson/Rectangle
- mwint 6y ago
  +1 for Rectangle; I've been using it ever since it was Spectacle. There's nothing I really miss about a proper tiling window manager (though I'm sure hardcore users would disagree)
  - anuragsoni 6y ago
    > There's nothing I really miss about a proper tiling window manager (though I'm sure hardcore users would disagree) Agreed. I mostly just needed the keyboard driven window snapping I was used to on Gnome and rectangle has filled than need 100%.
totalZero 6y ago
Alder Lake will get closer because of the big.LITTLE structure, but I don't know if we will really see a contender from Intel until Meteor Lake. Lithography size gets too much attention for its nomenclature, but it actually matters for battery consumption and thermal management. Intel must execute flawlessly on 7nm and spend generously on capex to keep the ball rolling.
volta83 6y ago
This is Mac OS: - https://www.reddit.com/r/unixporn/comments/jupmda/aquayabai_a_fun_colorful_rice_to_brighten_my/ https://www.reddit.com/r/unixporn/comments/jupmda/aquayabai_... - https://www.reddit.com/r/unixporn/comments/mvuplf/yabaimacos_proof_that_macos_can_look_good/ https://www.reddit.com/r/unixporn/comments/mvuplf/yabaimacos... Its called Yabai (+ skhd): https://github.com/koekeishiya/yabai https://github.com/koekeishiya/yabai That is, you can have a tilin WM today with all the advantages of running MacOS.
- tl 6y ago
  From your third link: System Integrity Protection needs to be (partially) disabled for yabai to inject a scripting addition into Dock.app for controlling windows with functions that require elevated privileges. This enables control of the window server, which is the sole owner of all window connections, and enables additional features of yabai. The risk Apple kills yabai after you're adjusted to it is real.
  - volta83 6y ago
    > The risk Apple kills yabai after you're adjusted to it is real. This holds for anything in the Apple ecosystem, up to Fortnite. Yabai has been going for long, and every issue could be worked around relatively painlessly.
    - matwood 6y ago
      > This holds for anything in the Apple ecosystem. Holds for anything in almost any ecosystem. With that said, Apple has stated over and over the Mac will remain developer friendly. Being able to disable SIP, IMO is part of that.
  - athorax 6y ago
    FWIW, I run yabai without having disabled SIP and it works great. There is probably some subset of functionality I am missing out on, but it does what I need it to.
  - 6y ago
zucker42 6y ago
Zen 4 will probably at least match the M1, but it will be a while before those chips come out and Apple will soon improve even more.
- intrasight 6y ago
  I have a feeling that Apple has pulled ahead and will stay ahead for a LONG time. They are extending their moat. And applying Mx to VR they will create a new moat.
  - Synaesthesia 6y ago
    They started pulling ahead in the A6-A7 days and never looked back. Amazing progression.
- ravi-delia 6y ago
  I'm curious to see if Zen 4 manages actually. It'll be an interesting datapoint as to what actually makes the M1 better.
kbd 6y ago
It's not exactly a tiling window manager, but if you can program some simple Lua then Hammerspoon is a godsend. You can program anything any of the other window managers for Mac (like Rectangle, Spectacle, etc.) can do and have complete freedom to set up your own keyboard shortcuts for anything. I have some predefined layouts[1] for my most common usage. So, one keyboard shortcut arranges the screen how I want, and I have other keyboard shortcuts[2] (along with using Karabiner Elements for a 'hyper' key) to open or switch to common apps. [1] https://github.com/kbd/setup/blob/1a05e5df545db0133cf7b6f1bc59f012c1ed6f1b/HOME/.hammerspoon/init.lua#L59 https://github.com/kbd/setup/blob/1a05e5df545db0133cf7b6f1bc... [2] https://github.com/kbd/setup/blob/1a05e5df545db0133cf7b6f1bc59f012c1ed6f1b/HOME/.hammerspoon/init.lua#L163 https://github.com/kbd/setup/blob/1a05e5df545db0133cf7b6f1bc...
shepherdjerred 6y ago
https://github.com/koekeishiya/yabai https://github.com/koekeishiya/yabai
aryik 6y ago
You’ve gotten plenty of recommendations, but I’ll add one for Magnet [1]. I’ve been using it for years, and I love it. One of the best software purchases I’ve ever made - small, lightweight, does exactly one thing and does it very well, and made by a small developer to boot. [1] https://magnet.crowdcafe.com/index.html https://magnet.crowdcafe.com/index.html

2OEH8eoCRo0 6y ago

"Antitrust is okay if you have a fast processor"

gpm 6y ago
"It's not my personal responsibility to attempt to enforce antitrust against companies by boycotting them at significant personal expense".
- varispeed 6y ago
  Exactly, there are bodies that are supposed to protect consumers from that behaviour, unfortunately they failed everyone massively. That in itself begs for an inquiry how those institutions actually work and whether it is worth spending tax payer money on them if they consistently fail to deliver.
  - jjoonathan 6y ago
    ...and if that exact kind of navel-gazing is why they don't work? What then?
    - varispeed 6y ago
      Charge people for failing to deliver, dispense huge fines and jail time. Then rebuild it in a way to avoid mistakes why the previous solution didn't work.
- sneak 6y ago
  Additionally, it is still (for the moment) possible to engage with Apple computer hardware without using any of their bullshit services (like the App Store) into which all their anticompetitive behavior has so far been constrained. This is of course not so on Apple mobile devices: it's dox yourself to the App Store or GTFO over there.
varispeed 6y ago
The thing is, every competitor is going to upgrade to these and if you stay with inferior Intel products, you give yourself competitive disadvantage. Unfortunately this is the current state of play. If I won't be able to achieve something the same speed competitor can, I put myself in a bad spot. I try to not mix emotions and business, however for a personal machine, I am rocking 5950X and it is awesome.

jonplackett 6y ago

The Apple's second version of everything is always the one to get. The first version is always exciting, but usually comes at some large expense. - iPhone 2 had 3G and was so much better than 1 - iPad 2 was about 3 X slimmer/lighter than 1 Lots of other examples if I though about it.

varispeed 6y ago
I still have an iPad 2. I use it in the kitchen to browse recipes.
- mobilio 6y ago
  I still have another one near bed for reading eBooks
  - intergalplan 6y ago
    I have a first-gen iPad Mini that still sees light use. Approximately the same internals as the iPad 2, AFAIK.
niels_bom 6y ago
What, in your opinion, is the drawback of the M1 product series? I haven’t read many negative reviews.
- outside1234 6y ago
  Memory, ports. That might be more of a product level issue but its a blocker for me.
- Dennip 6y ago
  The RAM is limited to 16GB, IIRC the max I/O throughout is also somewhat limited as well, so you have to compromise on number of USB4/10Gb Lan etc
- ajuc 6y ago
  Dedicated graphic cards doesn't work. No Linux support.

geodel 6y ago

No need to hate. Nowadays people in general do make necessity out of convenience and virtue out of necessity.

sigzero 6y ago

I almost went for the M1 but "1.0" kept me sane. I will definitely go for the M2.

oblio 6y ago

Well, here's hoping that both Linux and Windows work flawlessly on their hardware at some point.

moooo99 6y ago
Not even macOS works flawlessly on the hardware, why should Windows and Linux do. But as far as it goes for Windows, not having every other update completely break my system would be a welcome change.
- lofi_lory 6y ago
  Because with Linux excitement can change things. What are you gonna do if you miss something in iOS/macOS? The right people can in principle make anything work in Linux but with macOS you are left praying Apple decides your use case is their business case. Imagine what would happen if the compute/$ M1 laptops would perform in some respect better with Linux than macOS. Things may get out of hand, when huge chunks of the Linux community gets involved.
- oblio 6y ago
  > Not even macOS works flawlessly on the hardware, why should Windows and Linux do. This is just pedantry and needless nitpicking. Replace "work flawlessly" with "work well" in my previous comment.

vbezhenar 6y ago

Of all the operating systems, I'm finding macOS to be less annoying than the rest. So far Apple did not make a single computer suitable for me, but if they would release something like Mac Pro Cheap Edition (or whatever, I just want workstation-level specs for $2k), I'll switch to it. I don't really care about M1 or Intel, I think that any modern CPUs are fast enough for any tasks.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]