4 ms·

The article briefly mentions RHR (resting heart rate) also. Anecdotally of course, but I notice my RHR being ~5 - 8 bpm lower when I abstain from alcohol for a

The article briefly mentions RHR (resting heart rate) also. Anecdotally of course, but I notice my RHR being ~5 - 8 bpm lower when I abstain from alcohol for a few days.

BiteCode_dev 5y ago
n = 1, but using my oura ring, I can see a diff of 10% higher RHR pmb during my sleep when drinking a single glass of beer after diner. It surprised me a lot.
blunte 5y ago
I have worn a Garmin watch with HR monitor for months at a time off and on for the last few years. My resting heart rate while sleeping is typically 64-68 without alcohol and 65-85 after drinking several glasses of wine. There is such a marked difference in RHR in the two scenarios that you could tell if I drank simply by looking at my heart rate chart during the night. Interestingly, I attempted to start running for one month about a year ago. My endurance is poor, but I would run/walk for several kilometers. Within the first week and continuing through that month, my RHR while sleeping was 52-62. Not only was it significantly lower, it took a long time after stopping exercise for the rate to return to what it usually is. I don't know what this all really means, but it is fascinating. Studies or not, I imagine that not drinking + regular cardio exercise is better for long life than the alternative combinations.
- sjg007 5y ago
  Elite athletes have RHR in the 40s. Exercise improves the heart.
  - clairity 5y ago
    be careful of the inverse inference though. a rhr in the 40s doesn’t necessarily mean you’re in good health. a low rhr could indicate a myriad of other cardiovascular issues (something of a personal concern for me). but contrary to the article, an evening whiskey ~3 times a week (in my experience) seems to be optimal for delivering antiseptic benefits with few/no downsides.
- tw04 5y ago
  It just means you're out of shape and as you get into shape your HR reflects it. I saw similar after "summer of covid" and now getting back to running every day and limiting alcohol to once a week.
- chubot 5y ago
  Yup, I also noticed this. I wore a pulse oximeter every night which measures your heart rate, and it jumped from around 60 to 80 just because of alcohol one night. Crazy! That was the biggest effect I saw by far, more than all the sleep apnea variables I was trying to measure! Granted I don't drink often, and metabolize alcohol poorly, but still that's a huge difference. FWIW I'm not out of shape; I commuted 1h / day by bike for over a decade, and was a medically normal weight, which is maybe 20-30th percentile in the population.
- nradov 5y ago
  I also wear a Garmin watch with HR monitor. Having a couple glasses of wine with dinner doesn't seem to noticeably change my RHR while sleeping. There are probably differences between individuals. An RHR that gets into the 85 range could indicate a cardiac problem. Might want to get that checked.
  - blunte 5y ago
    Probably due to _significant_ quantity of alcohol... and certainly not a good idea.
fraa-orolo 5y ago
Since we're talking anecdata anyway, it could be from decreased sleep quality instead of direct causation.
- antibuddy 5y ago
  That might indeed be a factor; however the processes to get rid of the alcohol (it's toxic after all) might be to blame as well.
batiudrami 5y ago
I am fortunate enough to live in a country where we only had a lockdown for about 4 weeks of 2020, and during that time I didn't drink. See if you can see from my sleeping heart rate when that was: https://i.imgur.com/7VlYQ67.png https://i.imgur.com/7VlYQ67.png
- mannykannot 5y ago
  You appear to be demonstrating the opposite of what is claimed here: your heart-rate variability seems to have decreased when you were not drinking alcohol. When I went back to the article to check this, however, I saw that, while the text says that alchohol has "a negative effect on HRV", and their model explains this, the diagram shows alcohol increasing the HRV. As the text's version of the observed results and its explanation for them are consistent, I assume the diagram is incorrectly labelled. Update: Thanks to everyone for correcting me on what HRV means here.
  - Jtsummers 5y ago
    That image is of GP's heart rate, not heart rate variability.
  - enragedcacti 5y ago
    HRV is not a measure of change in your resting heart rate over time, its a measure of the difference on a per beat basis. Even if your BPM is 60, your heart doesn't beat exactly once a second, it will actually vary in length by some number of milliseconds back and forth. This is what is measured when talking about HRV. It is believed to occur as the parasympathetic and sympathetic nervous system "fight" over raising and lowering the heartrate. The symbiosis between them lands on a steady rate per minute with fluctuations on a per beat basis. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_rate_variability https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_rate_variability
  - tcskeptic 5y ago
    Heart rate variability really does not mean variability in heart rate (such as is shown on the graph linked) it is more at the 50-100ms level in change in timing between hear beats. The graph does seem to show a reduction in RHR but does not address HRV (as I understand it)
mathattack 5y ago
I’ve been largely alcohol free since the new year. Prior to that I thought alcohol helped me rest. Now even one or two glasses of beer or wine messes up my sleep. The contrast helps me understand it better. Of course this anecdote shouldn’t be construed as robust data....
- intergalplan 5y ago
  I've been working on switching most drinking for weed—for health reasons. Seriously. It's the best and lowest-side-effect sleep aid I've used. Hopefully it's not secretly doing horrible things to me, but my sleep quality's been amazing since I started to take a little a couple nights a week. Most consistently-decent sleep of my life.
  - JohnWhigham 5y ago
    Weed inhibits REM sleep. You may feel rested, but you're actually harming yourself long term.
    - intergalplan 5y ago
      Damnit. Well, it's that or lots of 5-6 hour nights, or worse. Or bad hangovers and other weird shit from sleeping pills. Maybe time to get a sleep-tracker watch.
      - criddell 5y ago
        It might be worth going to a specialist for help.
      - WindyCityBrew 5y ago
        Do you drink a lot of coffee or other caffeinated drinks, especially later in the day? I used to think caffeine didn't have much affect on my sleep, until I cut it out. Old habits die hard, but I just drink decaf coffee now and am getting better sleep then I can remember.

The article briefly mentions RHR (resting heart rate) also. Anecdotally of course, but I notice my RHR being ~5 - 8 bpm lower when I abstain from alcohol for a few days.

BiteCode_dev 5y ago

n = 1, but using my oura ring, I can see a diff of 10% higher RHR pmb during my sleep when drinking a single glass of beer after diner. It surprised me a lot.

blunte 5y ago

I have worn a Garmin watch with HR monitor for months at a time off and on for the last few years. My resting heart rate while sleeping is typically 64-68 without alcohol and 65-85 after drinking several glasses of wine. There is such a marked difference in RHR in the two scenarios that you could tell if I drank simply by looking at my heart rate chart during the night. Interestingly, I attempted to start running for one month about a year ago. My endurance is poor, but I would run/walk for several kilometers. Within the first week and continuing through that month, my RHR while sleeping was 52-62. Not only was it significantly lower, it took a long time after stopping exercise for the rate to return to what it usually is. I don't know what this all really means, but it is fascinating. Studies or not, I imagine that not drinking + regular cardio exercise is better for long life than the alternative combinations.

sjg007 5y ago
Elite athletes have RHR in the 40s. Exercise improves the heart.
- clairity 5y ago
  be careful of the inverse inference though. a rhr in the 40s doesn’t necessarily mean you’re in good health. a low rhr could indicate a myriad of other cardiovascular issues (something of a personal concern for me). but contrary to the article, an evening whiskey ~3 times a week (in my experience) seems to be optimal for delivering antiseptic benefits with few/no downsides.
tw04 5y ago
It just means you're out of shape and as you get into shape your HR reflects it. I saw similar after "summer of covid" and now getting back to running every day and limiting alcohol to once a week.
chubot 5y ago
Yup, I also noticed this. I wore a pulse oximeter every night which measures your heart rate, and it jumped from around 60 to 80 just because of alcohol one night. Crazy! That was the biggest effect I saw by far, more than all the sleep apnea variables I was trying to measure! Granted I don't drink often, and metabolize alcohol poorly, but still that's a huge difference. FWIW I'm not out of shape; I commuted 1h / day by bike for over a decade, and was a medically normal weight, which is maybe 20-30th percentile in the population.
nradov 5y ago
I also wear a Garmin watch with HR monitor. Having a couple glasses of wine with dinner doesn't seem to noticeably change my RHR while sleeping. There are probably differences between individuals. An RHR that gets into the 85 range could indicate a cardiac problem. Might want to get that checked.
- blunte 5y ago
  Probably due to _significant_ quantity of alcohol... and certainly not a good idea.

fraa-orolo 5y ago

Since we're talking anecdata anyway, it could be from decreased sleep quality instead of direct causation.

antibuddy 5y ago
That might indeed be a factor; however the processes to get rid of the alcohol (it's toxic after all) might be to blame as well.

batiudrami 5y ago

I am fortunate enough to live in a country where we only had a lockdown for about 4 weeks of 2020, and during that time I didn't drink. See if you can see from my sleeping heart rate when that was: https://i.imgur.com/7VlYQ67.png https://i.imgur.com/7VlYQ67.png

mannykannot 5y ago
You appear to be demonstrating the opposite of what is claimed here: your heart-rate variability seems to have decreased when you were not drinking alcohol. When I went back to the article to check this, however, I saw that, while the text says that alchohol has "a negative effect on HRV", and their model explains this, the diagram shows alcohol increasing the HRV. As the text's version of the observed results and its explanation for them are consistent, I assume the diagram is incorrectly labelled. Update: Thanks to everyone for correcting me on what HRV means here.
- Jtsummers 5y ago
  That image is of GP's heart rate, not heart rate variability.
- enragedcacti 5y ago
  HRV is not a measure of change in your resting heart rate over time, its a measure of the difference on a per beat basis. Even if your BPM is 60, your heart doesn't beat exactly once a second, it will actually vary in length by some number of milliseconds back and forth. This is what is measured when talking about HRV. It is believed to occur as the parasympathetic and sympathetic nervous system "fight" over raising and lowering the heartrate. The symbiosis between them lands on a steady rate per minute with fluctuations on a per beat basis. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_rate_variability https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_rate_variability
- tcskeptic 5y ago
  Heart rate variability really does not mean variability in heart rate (such as is shown on the graph linked) it is more at the 50-100ms level in change in timing between hear beats. The graph does seem to show a reduction in RHR but does not address HRV (as I understand it)

mathattack 5y ago

I’ve been largely alcohol free since the new year. Prior to that I thought alcohol helped me rest. Now even one or two glasses of beer or wine messes up my sleep. The contrast helps me understand it better. Of course this anecdote shouldn’t be construed as robust data....

intergalplan 5y ago
I've been working on switching most drinking for weed—for health reasons. Seriously. It's the best and lowest-side-effect sleep aid I've used. Hopefully it's not secretly doing horrible things to me, but my sleep quality's been amazing since I started to take a little a couple nights a week. Most consistently-decent sleep of my life.
- JohnWhigham 5y ago
  Weed inhibits REM sleep. You may feel rested, but you're actually harming yourself long term.
  - intergalplan 5y ago
    Damnit. Well, it's that or lots of 5-6 hour nights, or worse. Or bad hangovers and other weird shit from sleeping pills. Maybe time to get a sleep-tracker watch.
    - criddell 5y ago
      It might be worth going to a specialist for help.
    - WindyCityBrew 5y ago
      Do you drink a lot of coffee or other caffeinated drinks, especially later in the day? I used to think caffeine didn't have much affect on my sleep, until I cut it out. Old habits die hard, but I just drink decaf coffee now and am getting better sleep then I can remember.