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> Federal Court Orders Man to Pay $572 Million > Reynolds solicited at least 22,190 bitcoin ₿22,190 × $57,916 ≈ $1,285 Million. Looks like crime does pay –

> Federal Court Orders Man to Pay $572 Million > Reynolds solicited at least 22,190 bitcoin ₿22,190 × $57,916 ≈ $1,285 Million. Looks like crime does pay – pays around $713 Million. Not a bad return for around 6 months of work.

Filligree 6y ago
Well, except if he tried to sell them all the bottom would fall out of the 'market'.
- dylkil 6y ago
  according to livecoinwatch[1] a $1.8 billion sell would have a 2% price impact on bitcoin [1]https://www.livecoinwatch.com/price/Bitcoin-BTC https://www.livecoinwatch.com/price/Bitcoin-BTC
  - londons_explore 6y ago
    This is a lie. Lots of that apparent liquidity is fake buy/sell orders that will disappear milliseconds before you manage to use them... Even a sell of $10M can move the market 2%.
    - ur-whale 6y ago
      > This is a lie. Source?
      - londons_explore 6y ago
        I'm not sure how to cite "I placed a sell order to match an existing market order, and the majority of the market order was withdrawn 1 millisecond before my order was confirmed, as seen on the websocket message timestamps, and this happened multiple times".
        gruez 6y ago
        That's not too surprising if you consider that orders are added/removed multiple times every second.
        ben_w 6y ago
        IMO, probably better to say “incorrect” rather than “lie”, as the latter implies intent to deceive. While I am extremely skeptical about BTC (and even though this post is about a BTC scam), I don’t doubt the sincerity of its proponents.
        antb123 6y ago
        10 million market order shouldn't move the market too much if against USD on a US exchange. You can always just call an OTC broker and the spread is typically 0.3-0.5%
        ur-whale 6y ago
        What you describe is highly dependent on the exchange you use and doesn't match my experience at all. Also, advice, if I may: use limit orders, you're trading in a bot ecosystem, market orders are rarely a good idea.
        smabie 6y ago
        You think some players are getting last look? I am very interested in this, email me if you would like to disclose more info (products, exchanges, etc where this happened).
      - 55555 6y ago
        Some volume is fake. A lot of real volume is from market makers and other bots. The rest is from people. Almost all of this volume dries up in the face of volatility. If the market moves, people wonder if maybe the seller knows something they don't, and so they pull their limit buy orders and wait. This means slippage occurs in practice more than it would appear.
        55555 6y ago
        To be clear, I mean all types of volume will dry up. The bots will pause, and the people will be scared.
    - imtringued 6y ago
      You can just wait for your order to clear.
  - loceng 6y ago
    Because the financial VC-industrial complex has stock piles of money now, they've learned their lessons enough times, billions of $ they control and are waiting to use to buy Bitcoin for institutional buyers; Coinbase has been promoting this service for years - and on the other end their tightening the funnel of their service by access to sell failing many times now when the price starts to skyrocket - likely to quell the impulse selling of enough of the "army of HODLers." Will the complex have $100 billion in money waiting to buy up Bitcoin once there's such an event, or has the mantra of "HODL" worked and enough will hold to allow enough institutional money to slowly be moved in (by small handful of decision makers who's gains aren't usually well aligned with who owns the money)?
- ur-whale 6y ago
  > the bottom would fall out of the 'market'. That is a valueless statement. You have no idea of what the actual supply/demand and liquidity for BTC actually is. Even if you were to aggregate all the order books of all the existing exchanges, you'd still have no idea because of the number of deals that happen OTC.
  - Jenk 6y ago
    I think you mean UTC - as in Under the counter. :)
- solotronics 6y ago
  Tesla bought $1.5 billion of BTC just a few weeks ago. The demand is there. https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/08/tesla-buys-1point5-billion-in-bitcoin.html https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/08/tesla-buys-1point5-billion-i...
pjc50 6y ago
That's an astonishing amount of money and raises the question of who lost that.
- 55555 6y ago
  No, it doesn't. The amount of revenue (at the time) is well within the normal range for a well-marketed ponzi.
hashingroll 6y ago
This makes me curious that suppose value of bitcoin since then had dropped to say less than $1 for some reasons, would he still be fined the same amount?
- fjeifisjf 6y ago
  Yes.
ur-whale 6y ago
>Looks like crime does pay – pays around $713 Million It only pays because BTCUSD shot up since the crime was committed. It could have gone the other way and the scammer would owe way more than he stole at the time. At any rate, I doubt this guy's asset are within reach of either government (UK or US) unless the throw him in a cage until he regurgitates his private keys.
- botwriter 6y ago
  UK proceeds of crime act that's what happens.
- JumpCrisscross 6y ago
  > I doubt this guy's asset are within reach of either government (UK or US) unless the throw him in a cage until he regurgitates his private keys What do you think happens when you wilfully violate a court order? At best, he will have to avoid touching those assets to avoid being detected. They’re tainted on a public ledger.
  - carmen_sandiego 6y ago
    > What do you think happens when you wilfully violate a court order? You exchange a couple of years for $700 million and move to Thailand?
    - ur-whale 6y ago
      > You exchange a couple of years for $700 million and move to Thailand? Couldn't have put it better.
  - ur-whale 6y ago
    > They’re tainted on a public ledger. They're tainted in the UK, a small and foggy island lost somewhere in the north atlantic. Against 700+ MUSD, that doesn't carry much weight. Also, isn't there some sort of double-jeopardy rule in the UK?
- hardlianotion 6y ago
csomar 6y ago
Maybe because he distributed some of these as part of his Ponzi scheme? So he is being order to pay the remaining amount.
FartyMcFarter 6y ago
> ₿ Am I the only one who is somehow surprised and annoyed that Bitcoin has its own unicode character?
- chipaca 6y ago
  I mean, yes, but so does the Austral and it lasted less than Bitcoin has already.
  - AnIdiotOnTheNet 6y ago
    Yet Klingon script was rejected. Unicode character acceptance seems to be entirely arbitrary. Gotta make space for all the new poop emoji somehow I suppose.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
    - fjeifisjf 6y ago
      Bitcoin symbol is used far more than Klingon characters. Simple as that. And anyone Klingon is declared for use in the private use area, like other niche languages.
- ChrisArchitect 6y ago
  hm. yes. The other day I wanted to share a windows keyboard shortcut and thought it would be nice to use the windows logo to represent the key but was surprised it didn't exist like the Mac CMD one does... :\ At least it's been around longer....
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]

Filligree 6y ago

Well, except if he tried to sell them all the bottom would fall out of the 'market'.

dylkil 6y ago
according to livecoinwatch[1] a $1.8 billion sell would have a 2% price impact on bitcoin [1]https://www.livecoinwatch.com/price/Bitcoin-BTC https://www.livecoinwatch.com/price/Bitcoin-BTC
- londons_explore 6y ago
  This is a lie. Lots of that apparent liquidity is fake buy/sell orders that will disappear milliseconds before you manage to use them... Even a sell of $10M can move the market 2%.
  - ur-whale 6y ago
    > This is a lie. Source?
    - londons_explore 6y ago
      I'm not sure how to cite "I placed a sell order to match an existing market order, and the majority of the market order was withdrawn 1 millisecond before my order was confirmed, as seen on the websocket message timestamps, and this happened multiple times".
      - gruez 6y ago
        That's not too surprising if you consider that orders are added/removed multiple times every second.
      - ben_w 6y ago
        IMO, probably better to say “incorrect” rather than “lie”, as the latter implies intent to deceive. While I am extremely skeptical about BTC (and even though this post is about a BTC scam), I don’t doubt the sincerity of its proponents.
      - antb123 6y ago
        10 million market order shouldn't move the market too much if against USD on a US exchange. You can always just call an OTC broker and the spread is typically 0.3-0.5%
      - ur-whale 6y ago
        What you describe is highly dependent on the exchange you use and doesn't match my experience at all. Also, advice, if I may: use limit orders, you're trading in a bot ecosystem, market orders are rarely a good idea.
      - smabie 6y ago
        You think some players are getting last look? I am very interested in this, email me if you would like to disclose more info (products, exchanges, etc where this happened).
    - 55555 6y ago
      Some volume is fake. A lot of real volume is from market makers and other bots. The rest is from people. Almost all of this volume dries up in the face of volatility. If the market moves, people wonder if maybe the seller knows something they don't, and so they pull their limit buy orders and wait. This means slippage occurs in practice more than it would appear.
      - 55555 6y ago
        To be clear, I mean all types of volume will dry up. The bots will pause, and the people will be scared.
  - imtringued 6y ago
    You can just wait for your order to clear.
- loceng 6y ago
  Because the financial VC-industrial complex has stock piles of money now, they've learned their lessons enough times, billions of $ they control and are waiting to use to buy Bitcoin for institutional buyers; Coinbase has been promoting this service for years - and on the other end their tightening the funnel of their service by access to sell failing many times now when the price starts to skyrocket - likely to quell the impulse selling of enough of the "army of HODLers." Will the complex have $100 billion in money waiting to buy up Bitcoin once there's such an event, or has the mantra of "HODL" worked and enough will hold to allow enough institutional money to slowly be moved in (by small handful of decision makers who's gains aren't usually well aligned with who owns the money)?
ur-whale 6y ago
> the bottom would fall out of the 'market'. That is a valueless statement. You have no idea of what the actual supply/demand and liquidity for BTC actually is. Even if you were to aggregate all the order books of all the existing exchanges, you'd still have no idea because of the number of deals that happen OTC.
- Jenk 6y ago
  I think you mean UTC - as in Under the counter. :)
solotronics 6y ago
Tesla bought $1.5 billion of BTC just a few weeks ago. The demand is there. https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/08/tesla-buys-1point5-billion-in-bitcoin.html https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/08/tesla-buys-1point5-billion-i...

pjc50 6y ago

That's an astonishing amount of money and raises the question of who lost that.

55555 6y ago
No, it doesn't. The amount of revenue (at the time) is well within the normal range for a well-marketed ponzi.

hashingroll 6y ago

This makes me curious that suppose value of bitcoin since then had dropped to say less than $1 for some reasons, would he still be fined the same amount?

fjeifisjf 6y ago
Yes.

ur-whale 6y ago

>Looks like crime does pay – pays around $713 Million It only pays because BTCUSD shot up since the crime was committed. It could have gone the other way and the scammer would owe way more than he stole at the time. At any rate, I doubt this guy's asset are within reach of either government (UK or US) unless the throw him in a cage until he regurgitates his private keys.

botwriter 6y ago
UK proceeds of crime act that's what happens.
JumpCrisscross 6y ago
> I doubt this guy's asset are within reach of either government (UK or US) unless the throw him in a cage until he regurgitates his private keys What do you think happens when you wilfully violate a court order? At best, he will have to avoid touching those assets to avoid being detected. They’re tainted on a public ledger.
- carmen_sandiego 6y ago
  > What do you think happens when you wilfully violate a court order? You exchange a couple of years for $700 million and move to Thailand?
  - ur-whale 6y ago
    > You exchange a couple of years for $700 million and move to Thailand? Couldn't have put it better.
- ur-whale 6y ago
  > They’re tainted on a public ledger. They're tainted in the UK, a small and foggy island lost somewhere in the north atlantic. Against 700+ MUSD, that doesn't carry much weight. Also, isn't there some sort of double-jeopardy rule in the UK?
hardlianotion 6y ago

csomar 6y ago

Maybe because he distributed some of these as part of his Ponzi scheme? So he is being order to pay the remaining amount.

FartyMcFarter 6y ago

> ₿ Am I the only one who is somehow surprised and annoyed that Bitcoin has its own unicode character?

chipaca 6y ago
I mean, yes, but so does the Austral and it lasted less than Bitcoin has already.
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 6y ago
  Yet Klingon script was rejected. Unicode character acceptance seems to be entirely arbitrary. Gotta make space for all the new poop emoji somehow I suppose.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - fjeifisjf 6y ago
    Bitcoin symbol is used far more than Klingon characters. Simple as that. And anyone Klingon is declared for use in the private use area, like other niche languages.
ChrisArchitect 6y ago
hm. yes. The other day I wanted to share a windows keyboard shortcut and thought it would be nice to use the windows logo to represent the key but was surprised it didn't exist like the Mac CMD one does... :\ At least it's been around longer....
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]