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>Very few current NFTs exist on-chain. Are you saying the underlying asset isn't stored in the blockchain? Or that the "title" isn't stored in the blockchain?

by ahepp 6y ago

>Very few current NFTs exist on-chain. Are you saying the underlying asset isn't stored in the blockchain? Or that the "title" isn't stored in the blockchain? How is the title associated with the asset? Presumably the title is something like a sha256 hash associated with a wallet. How do you know that hash means "beeple artwork"?

EMM_386 6y ago
> Are you saying the underlying asset isn't stored in the blockchain? Or that the "title" isn't stored in the blockchain? What even is the "asset" in a lot of cases? People are buying Tweets, which are generated in real time by querying a database and generating some HTML and CSS. Or some UI code on native platforms. Or some JSON via an API. What is the asset? The Twitter code that generates the Tweet? A JPEG of the Tweet itself? The text of the Tweet? If it's an image of the Tweet, does take into account whether or not my user agent is in light or dark mode? The rabbit hole is never-ending with such questions.
thebean11 6y ago
I think a hash of the file itself is stored on chain. So you could prove that your title matches the "artwork", but still need to store the artwork yourself or rely on the seller/platform to keep hosting it
machawinka 6y ago
It is bullshit all the way down to such details.
SpicyLemonZest 6y ago
As far as I can tell, most of the NFTs that have broken into popular consciousness are entirely non-public and nobody can verify or inspect them at all. I spent like an hour yesterday trying to figure out which blockchain, specifically, the $69M Beeple NFT is on; nobody seems to know, and nobody really seems to be asking.
- vmception 6y ago
  It is currently safe to assume Ethereum with the file stored on IPFS. Christie's interface didn't just lead with the transaction hashes, but your conclusion is pretty far off, for now. Try emailing them next time. I'm understanding of the frustration, it took me a year of asking similar questions about Venezuala's Petro coin, which was even subject to pre-emptive US sanctions, before it became official that the Petro didn't exist and was never issued. Nobody could tell me the contract address and people acted like I grew two-heads for even asking, when it should have taken two seconds. The technology allows for really basic things to be transparent, and when you don't lead with that stuff and nobody asks about that stuff, it does become pretty obvious that they aren't even using the technology.
  - tim333 6y ago
    The Petro coin was a weird one though much about Venezuela's economy is weird these days.
- Kiro 6y ago
  On https://onlineonly.christies.com/s/beeple-first-5000-days/beeple-b-1981-1/112924 https://onlineonly.christies.com/s/beeple-first-5000-days/be... you will see the token ID (40913) and the smart contract (0x2a46f2ffd99e19a89476e2f62270e0a35bbf0756). Enter 40913 in tokenURI at https://etherscan.io/token/0x2a46f2ffd99e19a89476e2f62270e0a35bbf0756#readContract https://etherscan.io/token/0x2a46f2ffd99e19a89476e2f62270e0a... You will see an IPFS URI which contains the metafile.json: https://cloudflare-ipfs.com/ipfs/QmPAg1mjxcEQPPtqsLoEcauVedaeMH81WXDPvPx3VC5zUz https://cloudflare-ipfs.com/ipfs/QmPAg1mjxcEQPPtqsLoEcauVeda... This in turn contains a URL to the image: https://ipfsgateway.makersplace.com/ipfs/QmZ15eQX8FPjfrtdX3QYbrhZxJpbLpvDpsgb2p3VEH8Bqq https://ipfsgateway.makersplace.com/ipfs/QmZ15eQX8FPjfrtdX3Q...
  - SpicyLemonZest 6y ago
    Thanks. That does seem to be it.
  - unclebucknasty 6y ago

What's odd is that the listing on Christie's references a larger christies.com-hosted version of the JPG (3000x3000), here: https://www.christies.com/img/LotImages/2021/NYR/2021_NYR_20447_0001_001(beeple_everydays_the_first_5000_days034733).jpg?mode=max https://www.christies.com/img/LotImages/2021/NYR/2021_NYR_20... Whereas the IPFS version of the image is merely 1200x1200. In this case, it really matters because the image is a mosaic that is virtually indecipherable at the 1200x1200 size. So, it begs the question what is the person actually buying? I get that it's the concept of "ownership" that's being sold, but ownership of what exactly? When the new owner then goes to sell "it", what do they reference? An illegible JPG?

Jasper_ 6y ago
No, the 21069x21069 URL is there in the token, too, if you just find the "raw_media_field" field: https://gateway.pinata.cloud/ipfs/QmPAg1mjxcEQPPtqsLoEcauVedaeMH81WXDPvPx3VC5zUz/ https://gateway.pinata.cloud/ipfs/QmPAg1mjxcEQPPtqsLoEcauVed... The NFT doesn't give you jack shit. As the Conditions of Sale [0] says: > You acknowledge that ownership of an NFT carries no rights, express or implied, other than property rights for the lot (specifically, digital artwork tokenized by the NFT). [0] https://www.christies.com/pdf/onlineonly/ECOMMERCE%20CONDITIONS%20OF%20SALE%20-%20NEW%20YORK-8Mar21.pdf https://www.christies.com/pdf/onlineonly/ECOMMERCE%20CONDITI...
- unclebucknasty 6y ago
  Ah, I see. Thanks. Yeah, interesting that this notion of ownership is separate from IP. And, of course anyone can download the file itself. So, they're essentially selling the right to declare you own it and the ability to sell that right to someone else.
  - m3mnoch 6y ago
    indeed. tho, the important piece is the network. the network doesn't know or care if random people have a locally downloaded copy of the art. all sites, services, validations, virtual worlds, whatever on the network will hit the ethereum contract which gives up an address which you've proved you own by key signature. the network can't see nor does it care about your local files. which means, basically, any other appearance of the art in any other place is just an ad for the current owner of the nft.