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What about humidity of the environment? Is that a reason behind the success of countries like Thailand, Vietnam in tackling Covid? Possibly relevant study: htt

What about humidity of the environment? Is that a reason behind the success of countries like Thailand, Vietnam in tackling Covid? Possibly relevant study: https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/10.1146/annurev-virology-012420-022445 https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/10.1146/annurev-virology-0...

xxpor 6y ago
Places like the US have wildly varying levels of humidity, seems like a good place to study that
- bpodgursky 6y ago
  You'd have to separate out the effect of AC though. In the hottest and wettest parts of the country, people may actually live more of their lives in cold and dry air-conditioned environments than in the north...
  - xxpor 6y ago
    Oof, that's a good point. And lots of people in the inland west (we're it's extremely dry) have whole home humidifiers...
doliveira 6y ago
Yeah Brazil and specifically Manaus in the middle of the Amazon rainforest is doing a great job.
- scythe 6y ago
  Considering that Brazilian scientists described the government's strategy as an "institutional strategy to spread the coronavirus"[1] and they're reporting a lower death rate than France[2], you have to figure something in Brazil is working in humanity's favor. It can't make up for (probably) the worst policies in the world, of course. [1]: https://english.elpais.com/americas/2021-01-29/study-finds-that-brazils-jair-bolsonaro-carried-out-an-institutional-strategy-to-spread-the-coronavirus.html https://english.elpais.com/americas/2021-01-29/study-finds-t... [2]: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/ https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
  - CorrectHorseBat 6y ago
    I don't think you can conclude anything from those numbers. On the one hand Brazil is very likely underreporting and has a much younger population, but on the other hand their medical care is not as good.
  - maxerickson 6y ago
    A bit more than 20% of the people in France are over 65. For Brazil, it's a bit more than 9%. We know very well that age is a significant factor.
    - doliveira 6y ago
      I've seen some estimates that with the same age distribution as Brazil France would have had half the number of deaths: https://www.bbc.com/portuguese/brasil-55847831 https://www.bbc.com/portuguese/brasil-55847831 (Portuguese link)
  - doliveira 6y ago
    It may be a factor, but it's a pretty big leap to say that's what is behind countries' successes and failures. I mean, I've even seen people claiming it's due to "Asians eating a lot of fish". The most obvious explanation is (even literally) right in front of our noses: politics, culture and age distribution.
  - sjg007 6y ago
    Your hypothesis does not square with the unfolding tragedy. https://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/what-we-do/news-stories/news/brazil-covid-19-disaster-unfolding-amazon https://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/what-we-do/news-storie...
- muststopmyths 6y ago
  Sarcasm? https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)00183-5/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6... ( Resurgence of COVID-19 in Manaus, Brazil, despite high seroprevalence )
  - doliveira 6y ago
    Yes, pure sarcasm. Quite a catastrophe there. And a cautionary tale for what happens when denialists get their way.
weberer 6y ago
It seems that way. Here's another analysis of studies that focused on indoor humidity. >"If the relative humidity of indoor air is below 40 percent, the particles emitted by infected people absorb less water, remain lighter, fly further through the room and are more likely to be inhaled by healthy people. In addition, dry air also makes the mucous membranes in our noses dry and more permeable to viruses," summarizes Dr. Ajit Ahlawat. https://www.tropos.de/en/current-issues/press-releases/details/coronavirus-sars-cov-2-breitet-sich-bei-niedriger-luftfeuchtigkeit-in-innenraeumen-staerker-aus https://www.tropos.de/en/current-issues/press-releases/detai... Actual paper: https://aaqr.org/articles/aaqr-20-06-covid-0302 https://aaqr.org/articles/aaqr-20-06-covid-0302
hn_throwaway_99 6y ago
Related, when it comes to youth sports as vectors for coronavirus transmission, ice hockey is a clear outlier, and the low humidity levels in ice rinks is a primary theorized reason: https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/12/04/hockey-covid-transmission-outbreaks/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/12/04/hockey-covi...
DennisP 6y ago
Thailand and Vietnam also had 95% compliance with mask wearing. https://www.worldpoliticsreview.com/articles/28979/what-s-behind-mainland-southeast-asia-s-surprising-success-against-covid-19 https://www.worldpoliticsreview.com/articles/28979/what-s-be...
- timr 6y ago
  And so does the US: https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20201022/mask-use-by-americans-now-tops-90-poll-finds https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20201022/mask-use-by-america... https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/08/27/more-americans-say-they-are-regularly-wearing-masks-in-stores-and-other-businesses/ https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/08/27/more-americ... Break it down by county or state, and you'll find that many of the the areas with the highest reported compliance have the worst overall metrics: https://delphi.cmu.edu/covidcast/?date=20210209&region=42003&sensor=fb-survey-smoothed_wearing_mask https://delphi.cmu.edu/covidcast/?date=20210209&region=42003... (and before anyone says it: sure, you can argue that mask-wearing correlates with population density or some other factor that leads to greater disease prevalence, but doesn't that just beg the original question? People are wearing masks the most in the places with the highest disease prevalence. If "the reason" that Vietnam did well is mask compliance...well, why didn't it work just as well here?)
  - hvac 6y ago
    How would those same places be doing without masks?
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
  - deepnet 6y ago
    SNIP " Our review of the literature offers evidence in favor of widespread mask use as source control to reduce community transmission: Nonmedical masks use materials that obstruct particles of the necessary size; people are most infectious in the initial period postinfection, where it is common to have few or no symptoms (45, 46, 141); nonmedical masks have been effective in reducing transmission of respiratory viruses; and places and time periods where mask usage is required or widespread have shown substantially lower community transmission. The available evidence suggests that near-universal adoption of nonmedical masks when out in public, in combination with complementary public health measures, could successfully reduce Re to below 1, thereby reducing community spread if such measures are sustained. Economic analysis suggests that mask wearing mandates could add 1 trillion dollars to the US GDP (32, 34). Models suggest that public mask wearing is most effective at reducing spread of the virus when compliance is high (39). " FROM An evidence review of face masks against COVID-19 by Jeremy Howard, Austin Huang, et al. https://www.pnas.org/content/118/4/e2014564118 https://www.pnas.org/content/118/4/e2014564118
JohnCohorn 6y ago
A recent paper showed that obesity was related to spreading sars-cov-2 more readily, not just the severity of disease of the obese individual. The US and UK are world leaders in both obesity and virus spread. And the countries doing well with the virus are healthy and well within the normal weight range. I don’t honestly believe it will be as simple as this, but it’s amusing to think this _could_ be the big surprise connection. https://www.pnas.org/content/118/8/e2021830118?fbclid=IwAR3qHQKOWf6D8q7NysgyUNcN5S91V4hr5rkCfMzV4dwhua1bH8rq1dNHkC4 https://www.pnas.org/content/118/8/e2021830118?fbclid=IwAR3q...

xxpor 6y ago

Places like the US have wildly varying levels of humidity, seems like a good place to study that

bpodgursky 6y ago
You'd have to separate out the effect of AC though. In the hottest and wettest parts of the country, people may actually live more of their lives in cold and dry air-conditioned environments than in the north...
- xxpor 6y ago
  Oof, that's a good point. And lots of people in the inland west (we're it's extremely dry) have whole home humidifiers...

doliveira 6y ago

Yeah Brazil and specifically Manaus in the middle of the Amazon rainforest is doing a great job.

scythe 6y ago
Considering that Brazilian scientists described the government's strategy as an "institutional strategy to spread the coronavirus"[1] and they're reporting a lower death rate than France[2], you have to figure something in Brazil is working in humanity's favor. It can't make up for (probably) the worst policies in the world, of course. [1]: https://english.elpais.com/americas/2021-01-29/study-finds-that-brazils-jair-bolsonaro-carried-out-an-institutional-strategy-to-spread-the-coronavirus.html https://english.elpais.com/americas/2021-01-29/study-finds-t... [2]: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/ https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
- CorrectHorseBat 6y ago
  I don't think you can conclude anything from those numbers. On the one hand Brazil is very likely underreporting and has a much younger population, but on the other hand their medical care is not as good.
- maxerickson 6y ago
  A bit more than 20% of the people in France are over 65. For Brazil, it's a bit more than 9%. We know very well that age is a significant factor.
  - doliveira 6y ago
    I've seen some estimates that with the same age distribution as Brazil France would have had half the number of deaths: https://www.bbc.com/portuguese/brasil-55847831 https://www.bbc.com/portuguese/brasil-55847831 (Portuguese link)
- doliveira 6y ago
  It may be a factor, but it's a pretty big leap to say that's what is behind countries' successes and failures. I mean, I've even seen people claiming it's due to "Asians eating a lot of fish". The most obvious explanation is (even literally) right in front of our noses: politics, culture and age distribution.
- sjg007 6y ago
  Your hypothesis does not square with the unfolding tragedy. https://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/what-we-do/news-stories/news/brazil-covid-19-disaster-unfolding-amazon https://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/what-we-do/news-storie...
muststopmyths 6y ago
Sarcasm? https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)00183-5/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6... ( Resurgence of COVID-19 in Manaus, Brazil, despite high seroprevalence )
- doliveira 6y ago
  Yes, pure sarcasm. Quite a catastrophe there. And a cautionary tale for what happens when denialists get their way.

weberer 6y ago

It seems that way. Here's another analysis of studies that focused on indoor humidity. >"If the relative humidity of indoor air is below 40 percent, the particles emitted by infected people absorb less water, remain lighter, fly further through the room and are more likely to be inhaled by healthy people. In addition, dry air also makes the mucous membranes in our noses dry and more permeable to viruses," summarizes Dr. Ajit Ahlawat. https://www.tropos.de/en/current-issues/press-releases/details/coronavirus-sars-cov-2-breitet-sich-bei-niedriger-luftfeuchtigkeit-in-innenraeumen-staerker-aus https://www.tropos.de/en/current-issues/press-releases/detai... Actual paper: https://aaqr.org/articles/aaqr-20-06-covid-0302 https://aaqr.org/articles/aaqr-20-06-covid-0302

hn_throwaway_99 6y ago

Related, when it comes to youth sports as vectors for coronavirus transmission, ice hockey is a clear outlier, and the low humidity levels in ice rinks is a primary theorized reason: https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/12/04/hockey-covid-transmission-outbreaks/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/12/04/hockey-covi...

DennisP 6y ago

Thailand and Vietnam also had 95% compliance with mask wearing. https://www.worldpoliticsreview.com/articles/28979/what-s-behind-mainland-southeast-asia-s-surprising-success-against-covid-19 https://www.worldpoliticsreview.com/articles/28979/what-s-be...

timr 6y ago
And so does the US: https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20201022/mask-use-by-americans-now-tops-90-poll-finds https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20201022/mask-use-by-america... https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/08/27/more-americans-say-they-are-regularly-wearing-masks-in-stores-and-other-businesses/ https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/08/27/more-americ... Break it down by county or state, and you'll find that many of the the areas with the highest reported compliance have the worst overall metrics: https://delphi.cmu.edu/covidcast/?date=20210209&region=42003&sensor=fb-survey-smoothed_wearing_mask https://delphi.cmu.edu/covidcast/?date=20210209&region=42003... (and before anyone says it: sure, you can argue that mask-wearing correlates with population density or some other factor that leads to greater disease prevalence, but doesn't that just beg the original question? People are wearing masks the most in the places with the highest disease prevalence. If "the reason" that Vietnam did well is mask compliance...well, why didn't it work just as well here?)
- hvac 6y ago
  How would those same places be doing without masks?
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
- deepnet 6y ago
  SNIP " Our review of the literature offers evidence in favor of widespread mask use as source control to reduce community transmission: Nonmedical masks use materials that obstruct particles of the necessary size; people are most infectious in the initial period postinfection, where it is common to have few or no symptoms (45, 46, 141); nonmedical masks have been effective in reducing transmission of respiratory viruses; and places and time periods where mask usage is required or widespread have shown substantially lower community transmission. The available evidence suggests that near-universal adoption of nonmedical masks when out in public, in combination with complementary public health measures, could successfully reduce Re to below 1, thereby reducing community spread if such measures are sustained. Economic analysis suggests that mask wearing mandates could add 1 trillion dollars to the US GDP (32, 34). Models suggest that public mask wearing is most effective at reducing spread of the virus when compliance is high (39). " FROM An evidence review of face masks against COVID-19 by Jeremy Howard, Austin Huang, et al. https://www.pnas.org/content/118/4/e2014564118 https://www.pnas.org/content/118/4/e2014564118

JohnCohorn 6y ago

A recent paper showed that obesity was related to spreading sars-cov-2 more readily, not just the severity of disease of the obese individual. The US and UK are world leaders in both obesity and virus spread. And the countries doing well with the virus are healthy and well within the normal weight range. I don’t honestly believe it will be as simple as this, but it’s amusing to think this _could_ be the big surprise connection. https://www.pnas.org/content/118/8/e2021830118?fbclid=IwAR3qHQKOWf6D8q7NysgyUNcN5S91V4hr5rkCfMzV4dwhua1bH8rq1dNHkC4 https://www.pnas.org/content/118/8/e2021830118?fbclid=IwAR3q...