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India protests: Internet cut to hunger-striking farmers in Delhi
- pantalaimon 6y agoWell that sure is a case for Starlink.
- ajsnigrutin 6y agoAs with every war, you have "freedom fighters" fighting the "bad dictator" and you have "terrorists" fighting the "democratically elected leader", depending on who the media like that day - https://imgur.com/gallery/NQ67u https://imgur.com/gallery/NQ67u . Same here.. if elon/us government/whoever sides with the protesters, then starlink is the solution. If they decide that the farmers are "oposition funded extremists" (or whatever) it isn't. Basically the only solution is the one that is independent on the government and international corporations... be it ham radio, wifi mesh networks, or some other kind of technology. Obviously all of that is easier in developed nations, where everyone can buy an extra router and a handheld radio for a price of a dinner at a shitty restaurant.
- Brozilean 6y agoYou think Elon Musk wouldn't cut starlink for folks if they were striking? Really?
- spoonjim 6y agoNot for the Indian government, at his level they are just for the lulz. For the US government, very likely.
- postmeta 6y agoAre you perhaps referring to the emerald-inheritance-richy-rich child-slave-loving-cobalt-mining 3rd-world-tweet-coup-leading union-busting-racist-workplace-of-terror-managing thai-pedo-twitter-bully covid-denier Elon that weird homeless hippy writers, wallstreetbros and proud-moms who didn't buy any $TSLA like to get their outrage chubs for?
- sandeeps_ 6y agoWow! You sure are salty about $TSLA!
- fakedang 6y agoYou think Elon wouldn't cut Starlink so that he can cozy up with a dictatorial regime? Edit:- keep 'em downvotes coming Muskie fanbois!
- dang 6y agoWould you please stop breaking the site guidelines? https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- actuator 6y agoSadly as much as I hate seeing essential communication links cut, though I don't have any data I am assuming a lot of people are going to buy in the public safety angle. It is not like the Indian state hasn't used that line of reasoning before for even bans lasting more than a year. Reading through the linked article on the violence related to the same protests that happened few days back reminded me of some tweets I had seen. People running around brandishing swords(and other melee weapons) attacking cops, which felt way worse than what we saw in US Capitol insurrection. https://twitter.com/ANI/status/1354088807424028673 https://twitter.com/ANI/status/1354088807424028673
- bsan3 6y agoNope, complete propaganda by the Indian govt. I have family there so I can confirm. The Indian media is completely sold out to the govt and will only present highly selected and curated pictures. Social media is where they can't control the narrative. The Indian govt unleash sate sanctioned mobs on these protestors, desperate resort to break up the protest. Now they had to ensure that the truth stays under wraps. Hence, cut off internet.
- actuator 6y agoI don't think we are talking about the same thing. I was talking about the protestors attacking cops of which there are a lot of videos on social media. The video I linked above shows them jumping from a fort to save themselves.
- alex_smart 6y agoThere is plenty of propaganda floating around from both sides. If you dislike muddy waters, I would recommend staying out of Indian politics. It is a clusterfuck. To add to your top comment, these events - protestors attacking police personnel and protestors raiding Red Fort and raising their own flags - happened on republic day, which is like a mini 4th of July for India (we have two: 15th August, which is when India became independent and 26th January, which is when India adopted its constitution). On Republic Day, India observes the president furl India's national flag from the Red Fort, so seeing these events unfold, especially seeing a flag other than the Indian flag at Red Fort on Republic Day, were of very big symbolic value.
- 0xFFFE 6y agoThere is always two sides to the story, here is a "protester" attacking a cop with a sword. They are coordinating attacks using whatsapp and other means. https://www.republicworld.com/india-news/law-and-order/singhu-clash-delhi-police-arrests-44-including-sword-brandishing-man-who-attacked-sho.html https://www.republicworld.com/india-news/law-and-order/singh...
- didibus 6y agoI'm honestly not seeing two sides sorry. So a few people are breaking laws, you disconnect the internet? That's not two sides, that's only one side. If someone in my neighborhood is a criminal, they don't cut the power to my neighborhood and throw flair bombs at it. How is that the "other side"? Instead they just go after that criminal. To me it looks like a massive imbalance in power from one side over the other.
- 0xFFFE 6y agoI am all for peaceful protests, the constitution has given every citizen the right to protest. But not at the cost of damage to the public property, rioting and violence. Jfyi, there is already case in supreme court of India to hear the grievances that they may have. But some political leaders are taking advantage of the situation to incite violence. Please note, cops are human beings too, they have been asked not to use lethal force against the protestors.
- middleclick 6y ago> I am all for peaceful protests, the constitution has given every citizen the right to protest They have been peaceful protesting for literally months now. One bad incident does not mean anything and there is a lot of information about how the government goons infiltrated the protests. If you are all for peaceful protests, you wouldn't single out one single incident but that's exactly what you are doing and I think it's malicious. Which you are free to do, but please don't pretend otherwise.
- 6y ago
- monadic3 6y agoThe us is at least a year late from sanctioning Modi. What's taking so long?
- didibus 6y agoWould this be legal in the US? It's one thing for a private entity to choose to not extend services to someone, but for the government to censor communication channels, I hope this would not be legal in the US?
- trhway 6y agoI think BART was turning off the network during Oscar Grant protests.
- throwawaysea 6y agoIt would be completely legal in the US to cutoff those acting illegally. The US also regularly compels private entities to do so. Warrants, subpoenas, national security letters, and other such mechanisms are means to compel public and private entities when the law is being broken. But that’s the key requirement, that someone is acting illegally.
- blackoil 6y agoInternet in Kashmir is effectively blocked for more then a year.
- bsan3 6y agoExactly, this is the same thing. Hindu nationalist govt controlling media narrative.
- asfasfaasfas 6y agoPeople don't like to say it, but it's just India's Hinduism versus the minorities (Sikhs and Muslims), a bunch of Indians here throwing excuses know what's up. Also for the West, it's hard not to roll them all up in one category because inherently westerns do this with africans, asians, middle easterners
- iamsb 6y agoFor context - Just last year a different protest resulted in a massive riot in the same city, around similar time. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_Delhi_riots https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_Delhi_riots . This resulted in murders of at least 53 people, including a highly gruesome lynching of a police officer. Also again for context, as Kashmir internet ban keeps coming up in discussion, ni the 90s 500K minority (Hindu+Sikh) people were forced out of their houses in Kashmir, many of them still living in refugee camps. Thousands were murdered, thousands raped. This was coordinated using loudspeakers. I personally shudder to think what kind of genocide can be coordinated using Internet technologies. Especially when there are motivated, well funded enemies like Pakistan involved in both regions.
- systemvoltage 6y agoIs it fair to say that the pandemic has brewed more protests than ever, not just in India but worldwide? It's not to diminish the issues, but the pandemic is adding fuel? Most countries around the world are facing protests all simultaneously after the pandemic (except China)?
- throwawaysea 6y agoDefinitely. If people were employed and busy with either work or leisure activities, they would be less likely to choose to invest time into protests, particularly violent ones. The same is true for the George Floyd protests and all the numerous other protests we have seen - even if they did take place outside of a pandemic, the participation would be much smaller.
- bsan3 6y agoThe pandemic seems to be exposing the wealth inequality, which I think is the root issue here. The haves have even more and the nots bore the brunt. Judging by protests, approaching breaking point
- systemvoltage 6y agoPandemic also brought more wealth inequality. Tourism, restaurants, brick and mortar shops, malls, theaters, airlines, etc. are affected by no malicious cause but because of the virus. The wealthy class did not cause this. While, I think the wealthy should be heavily taxed and poverty must be abolished, I don't want to live in a world where there is zero wealth inequality. Also, wealth is not a zero sum game.
- logicchains 6y ago> Tourism, restaurants, brick and mortar shops, malls, theaters, airlines, etc. are affected by no malicious cause but because of the virus. The wealthy class did not cause this. This is what the wealthy want you to believe. There's no scientific evidence that places with lockdowns did better with regard to either economic or health outcomes; the lockdowns and economic destruction they caused were entirely unnecessary.
- throwawaysea 6y agoTo the people recoiling at this but in support of recent deplatforming/censorship against conservatives in America - what makes you think one is acceptable and the other isn’t? There are tons of videos online showing mass vandalism, property destruction, and violence promulgated by those participating in the farmer protests. These include violent disruptions of political events, breaking police barriers to occupy and vandalize historical monuments, setting vehicles on fire, injuring hundreds, and more. Surely the participants and those inciting violence need to be brought under control to restore order. There are peaceful ways to assemble and effect political change. Isn’t this just like American tech companies deplatforming people to curb mass criminality?
- dirtyid 6y agohttps://internetshutdowns.in/ https://internetshutdowns.in/ A database of India internet killswitch events.
- codesternews 6y agoSadly the Indian govt passed the laws without taking opposition and farmers in confidence. They passed the law very bluntly. Thats from where all this started. It's very simple thing to solve but current govt want to make it political. They are basically saying MSP(Minimum selling price) is not affected. But farmers protesting why you include this in bill. But because of govt ego millions of farmers are protesting for their own livelihood.
- quantgenius 6y agoThe bill was public. It was debated for a while, and anyone could have read it during that period if they chose to. There was none of the here is a 5000 page bill and you must pass it in 2 hours or the economy goes under like happens in the US Congress. They not only took the farmers into confidence, they took the opinions of the farmers into consideration and amended the bill. Each individual substantive line item being demanded by the protesters is already included in the bill. The bill literally cannot harm any actual farmer. It will prevent certain bureaucrats and politicians from receiving bribes from the buyers of produce and as a result will likely increase what the farmers receive by the amount of the bribe paid. They can quite literally only get MORE for produce than they get now, the bill obligates the government to guarantee this.
- imtringued 6y agoI don't think a single HN submission does this topic justice but the fact that there are so many small farmers to begin with is strange. It's highly inefficient. It would be better if they get a city job and let a big agriculture company take over. This would increase incomes on both sides.
- pkd 6y agoHaving many small players is not by itself inefficient. The inefficiencies come from lack of modernisation which is (in large part) a direct result of the stasis induced by the kind of government meddling that these farm bills are trying to reform.
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- bobobob420 6y agoJust don’t bother trying to understand Indian politics, especially if are living outside the country. It is a mess beyond any understanding and just a waste of time.
- saagarjha 6y agoThis seems like the wrong way to go for a site made to gratify intellectual curiosity.
- bobobob420 6y agoIf you know you know..
- bshepard 6y agoHere's a place to start: http://goodcat.news/cage-grh.html http://goodcat.news/cage-grh.html
- anaganisk 6y agoI was about to write a lengthy rant on why others must read it, but then realised yes, there is no point. Majority of people who support BJP, are much more in propaganda than trump supporters. They're past denial, they literally build up stories of master strokes, tho all of them were mega failures. We have a PM who is afraid of press conferences, who only speaks on his own air time. Never takes questions. I sometimes watch the comments under news channel sites they're a cesspool of hatred.
- bobobob420 6y agoI support modi ;)
- AntiImperialist 6y agoIt is rather simple. China and India are rivals. China fuels these anti-governments protests by using small political parties on the field, 50 cent army on the internet and surrounding narrative in the media.
- psingh88 6y agoGuys, you need to understand what media is showing in india is not true, as it is controlled by Govt and corporates. Media publish picture guy raising sword, but not explaining why. Media didn’t publish pictures about events that lead to. Day before govt supporters warned that they will tomorrow unless they vacate the protest site. Next day even police barricade in the view of warning , still they let govt supporters in and local senator arranged trucks dump stone piles close by. Govt rioters move in start stone pelting and police watching , infact escorting them eventually inside the protest site and rioters strat damage. Meanwhile police also fire tear gas at protest site even protesters weren’t attacking back as they know govt want to provoke them. Eventually one of guy picked up sword to scare the roiters to save women and others. That’s it, 6-8 police and government supporters beat him with batten mercilessly, strip him and took him. I can add all pictures if this platform allows.
- cyrux004 6y agoThis account was created a few hours back and only has comments supporting this narrative
- mkbkn 6y agoSo? What he has written are facts. The central govt is destroying democracy as we speak.
- dlvktrsh 6y agoyou can upload the image to imgur and put a link here
- srean 6y agoPsingh88 had replied with these links in a separate comment down below. I am just surfacing them here as this is a more relevant subthread Language is Hindi.main stream media no showing this. This link shows how police let govt sponsored rioters attack sitting protesters https://twitter.com/antiitcelltask1/status/13551173784728412 https://twitter.com/antiitcelltask1/status/13551173784728412... This link shows before riots, govt person who is part of mob shaking hand with police before stone pelting at farmers protesting https://twitter.com/gs_atwal/status/1355103467124174849?s=21 https://twitter.com/gs_atwal/status/1355103467124174849?s=21 Now they intrude inside the site where protesters are camping provoking protesters by destruction https://twitter.com/immak02/status/1355124797202595841?s=21 https://twitter.com/immak02/status/1355124797202595841?s=21 Police helping rioters and then pulling a farmer who come out to defend with sword And beating along with govt sponsored rioters https://twitter.com/rajbirk08499553/status/13554995166784798 https://twitter.com/rajbirk08499553/status/13554995166784798... https://twitter.com/_dsbofficial/status/1355499255985790983 https://twitter.com/_dsbofficial/status/1355499255985790983?... https://twitter.com/specialkbrook/status/1355446339946106881 https://twitter.com/specialkbrook/status/1355446339946106881... Police braking cctv to erase evidence https://twitter.com/gsmanes/status/1355171604896993287?s=21 https://twitter.com/gsmanes/status/1355171604896993287?s=21
- psingh88 6y agoContinuing to below comment, media is doing govt propaganda to scare people as well so that they don’t come Delhi. People are relying on social media as news source, and mobile communication. That’s why govt suspended these services in nearby places. gGovt has been trying to uproot the protest, even Supereme court said protest is people’s right.
- psingh88 6y agoFact: 1. Ruling party in India is affiliated to right wing called RSS. RSS has planted their cadre at public services decision making posts such as Police head etc, even Governors ( who can override a province’s elected govt), and President of India. 3. It is clearly visible protest was peaceful for 2 months, and now Govt is trying incite violence and eventually excuse to uproot it by force. 3. Democracy is now questioned as judiciary as Election commission is also under govt influence.
- gbszza 6y agoThere is a consistent trend. modi Govt pushed policies written by crony capitalists ambani adani. wenever the govt sees any public dissent they shut down internet and meanwhile push misinformation campaign on ambani owned TV channels. Half bake distorted news of the level no western democracy can even imagine. Mukesh Ambani directly or indirectly controls almost whole mainstream media who is modi main financier. Farmer protest is genuine, peaceful and succeeding so they shut down internet in state of haryana and at the protest sites. If some journalists tried to reveal truth, he is being jailed. Just like happened to mandeep punia today. The violence on 26th Jan was orchestrated with direct support from Indias home minister using delhi police and Trojan moles in the farmers, which farmers leaders have already declared to be working by conniving with modi govt.
- gbszza 6y agoComplete failure of this protest or its conversion into violence will most likely lead to civil war and discontent in Indian armed forces as majority indiam soldiers come from the agriculture families of North India where this protest is concentrated giving China further confidence to balkanize India. chinese army is already testing indian resolve in past 12 months. Failure of india today will lead us into Chinese century. Indian govt knows knows it all , but still working for short sighted profit game. It is direct threat to American dominance in world politics.
- bshepard 6y agoMany people in "India" also wish to have their own nations. The Sikh people would, presumably, be much better off living in Khalistan than under the domination of far-right Hindu paramilitary organizations.
- ranbirparmar 6y agoBjp which is in power never respected indian flag .people protesting gave their lives for indian flag their sons and daughters serve in the forces. They want remain in power by divide and rule.human lives don't matter to them. National media is totallay controlled
- bharateeya 6y agoBBC is heavily biased against India esp. against current government. It never publishes any good thing about india and belittles any progress made by India. It should appreciate that even passing the farm bill by the govt which is in majority, it is ready to negotiate. This is true democracy where just for the sake of 1-2 states, govt has put the reforms on hold. People should also understand that there is also foreign funding involved behind these protests for Khalistan movement which has nothing to do with the protests. Western media esp. Washington Post, BBC and NYTimes usually publishes articles against the current govt.
- amitheonlyone 6y agoBut you do fail to mention that the true democracy passed the bill without proper discussion and also with a voice vote even when the opposition asked for a division vote. Then there is the thing that even when the said governement is willing to discuss, they are not really ready to compromise. This is just the tip of the iceberg and I don't want to go on to a full length rant here on HN on a political post. But I believe that the media should always be against the government first. And not like Indian media which are dubbed as Godi media because it is so biased for the government, even reporting fake news at times.
- dragonsh 6y agoRemember The first morale of Buddhism is to keep your critics near you who will always help you improve. It’s good if critical media surrounds the government. This is common around the globe any media which questions the government is considered biased, in India more so. No need to look for media see UN and research report on India’s development on Human Development Index (HDI) which covers mal-nutrition, infant mortality, education and healthcare it has slipped continuously in last 5 years even before pandemic. Economic development i.e. livelihood is also in downward spiral before pandemic and made much worse. Indian neighbouring countries like Bangladesh did much better. Marginalisation of most minority community is accelerated. So the current ruling party in India use religious sentiments, divisions and false pride as tools to gain majority support. Blaming Gandhi, Nehru, Pakistan and foreigners for misery of India and its downward spiral and shooting the messenger with accusations of falsehood has become a practice and a weapon of choice in current Indian ruling establishment.
- wolfretcrap 6y agoTruth is somewhere in between: 1. It's true that media is controlled by Government now. It wasn't the case before this government came into action. 2. It's also true that existing power nexus like these farmer brokers who are spearheading the protest. You may ask where they get their money from go continue the protest? Basically from the existing network of exporters of fruits, vegetables, grains etc... These farmering group head ask for bribes and favours and then sell government subsidized produce to select companies who rendered those favours. But they make it as if this movement is to save the interest of the poor farmers, it's not. It's to save their own interest, they'll lose their power to ask for bribes like gst commissioners, custom officers have lost in last few months thanks to the government's faceless medium of interaction with the average citizen, no officer can put influence on a person now and convince them to offer bribes. 3. It's true that the government has brought reforms and removed medieval practises like triple talaq and polygamy for the Muslims but at the same time played hypocrite by banning beaf in multiple states. This doesn't look good at all. Is it going in good or bad direction? Well if I compare to the governments round the globe, this government isn't really that bad. It's very hard to govern a country as large and diverse as India where multiple groups of different ethnicities and religion are trying to step on each others head to undermine others interest and fight for their own. Many things have improved in infrastructure since this government came. 4. While they brought GST with goal to remove multiple taxation on good and services at every step of value addition. They've brought taxes on fuel to high, which if you look closely is also a "multiple taxation" at every step of production. So what gives? It means government simply failed to fund itself without this excessive taxation in production.
- mr_toad 6y ago> which if you look closely is also a "multiple taxation" at every step of production. Seems odd if true. In most countries GST/VAT/Sales Tax is deductible for everyone except the consumer.
- xrisk 6y ago> It's also true that existing power nexus like these farmer brokers who are spearheading the protest. You may ask where they get their money from go continue the protest? Basically from the existing network of exporters of fruits, vegetables, grains etc... These farmering group head ask for bribes and favours and then sell government subsidized produce to select companies who rendered those favours. Can you please address the issues highlighted by the farmers instead of speculating on where they obtain funding from? In particular how will the passage of the farm bills prevent this practice that you claim exists? As I see it, it would just allow large players to gobble up the competition (ala Jio).
- ngcc_hk 6y agoWhen you see egg fighting the wall, I always stand with the eggs and listen. When they say public safety I would think of nazi, hk under china, ... and whilst my mind is open, I will start with the farmers. I may be wrong. The reading about Muslim women in here seems to tell a different story. And india is a democracy. Hope it resolve peacefully. And cutting mobile is ... wrong.
- sonoffarmer 6y agoHumanitarians around the world should support Indian farmers.India is a so-called democracy, in fact the rights of minorities and oppressed people are greatly oppressed here.Let's fulfill our duty as human beings and become the voice of Indian farmers.
- gruez 6y agometa: why is there an influx of green users in this thread, and why does it look like they're pushing a specific narrative?
- windex 6y agoAlmost all India threads that mention the Indian government and the ruling BJP have supporters jumping in to support their party. I assume this happens a little more when the parties are extreme right/left wing. They arrive via whatsapp groups asking members for support and a link. Soon enough the targeted sites end up being downvote/upvote bot parties unless there is strong moderation. The media in India is muzzled similarly unless you do propaganda. Individuals online are equally bullied, muzzled, and in some cases killed. The country has currently imprisoned a stand up comedian for jokes "he might" make because he is not of the right religion.
- Thorrez 6y agoYou're saying that people are creating brand new HN accounts to support the Indian government? I don't see that. I looked at all the comments by green accounts in this thread: Pro Indian government: 1 comment, 1 account Anti Indian government: 8 comments, 4 accounts Unknown: 2 comments, 1 account
- ffiw 6y agoYou won't get a reply. For presenting any evidence like that on /r/india you would be promptly get banned. These guys ruined /r/india it's now full of anti modi bhajan 24/7. The only reason I still stick with reddit is because of some technical subs like /r/programming. Now these people aren't leaving even hacker news.
- windex 6y agoModi is India's Trump I hear. Lot of similarities except for the genocide.
- jangid 6y ago> protected India's farmers from the free market What does this line mean in the article? The author is highly biased against free markets.
- mds101 6y agoWith good reason. The free market is not effectively regulated against collusion in India. On the 'free' market, the middle men band together, fix prices, and the farmer ends up getting the short end of the stick. The mandis were originally established to prevent the farmers getting completely squeezed by scrupulous middle men.
- boruto 6y agoIndia does not have free market in Agriculture. The sector itself is extremely subsidised. No political party has the capability nor will to touch those provisions. The current farm laws are teeny tiny step towards that. The current ruling party would oppose them had they been introduced by previous Government. As with every thread on India here, There are a ton of people who feel strongly about things, Including some Canadian citizens :)
- wtmt 6y agoIf you’re someone outside India, please write to your representatives (or organize something) on matters like Internet access being cut off. We live in an age where this can be a matter of life and death. It is standard practice in India to cut off Internet access in places where there are riots or riots expected to happen or for some nebulous “national security” concern. In fact, India tops the list of countries with the most Internet shutdowns in the last few years (you can check this out online). In one state (where wired broadband penetration is quite low), mobile Internet access was disabled for several months even during the pandemic! The government and its law enforcement agencies do not know of other ways to handle these and resort to more of a “control and crush” mode. Maybe certain circumstances lead to certain decisions. What’s more shocking is that there’s no transparency on why access is blocked, who got it done, when the block will be lifted (and for what reasons). A democracy cannot thrive when the ruling powers along with law enforcement hold everything as a secret and don’t appreciate questions from the citizens. It’s sad to see India becoming more closed and authoritarian. Internet Freedom Foundation (https://internetfreedom.in https://internetfreedom.in) fights for digital rights in India. Follow and support it.
- bythckr 6y agoYou missed out to mention the fact that the protesters first destroyed the cell towers and stole the generators and are now complaining about the internet being cut. No cell tower == no cell service == no internet.
- MichaelMoser123 6y ago> Agriculture employs about half of India's 1.3 billion population I am not familiar with politics in India, so my question is: how does the BJP manage to push laws that (seem to) adversly affect the interest of half of the population? Isn't that political suicide for the BJP?
- hashhar 6y agoThey counter for it pulling on religion and hyper-nationalistic views like banning beef, uniform civil laws (even though almost each religion has their own including Hindus).
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- lord_washington 6y agoIt's not clear if the laws do "adversly" affect interest of all farmers. The laws target APMC's monopsony which has been already diluted by many states, which means that farmers are not totally dependent on APMC. Hence in many areas farmers are largely indifferent and in certain are clearly supporting the laws[1]. In Punjab and Haryana, the mandatory procurement by FCI(regardless of the demand) and the APMC system works to its maximum efficiency[2]. Hence the large scale support there. 1. https://indianexpress.com/article/explained/who-are-shetkari-sanghatana-the-group-backing-govt-on-the-farm-laws-7107905/ https://indianexpress.com/article/explained/who-are-shetkari... 2. https://m.economictimes.com/news/economy/agriculture/how-indias-grain-policies-have-stoked-fcis-debt-binge/articleshow/80006240.cms https://m.economictimes.com/news/economy/agriculture/how-ind...
- bgdam 6y agoAs always for any polarizing topic in India on which the current ruling party has strong opinions, it's better to disregard Indian media, since they always carry a biased, pro government narrative.
- yinyang_in 6y agoNot BJP fanatic, but as I see these laws. These are pro-farmer and anti-madis laws. There was monopolies of mandis(farmer are restricted only to sell here) now government allows them to make contract or sell anywhere. I wrote posts on it : https://iamamitmurari.medium.com/farm-laws-farmer-issues-and-resolutions-bc1aa353dfa https://iamamitmurari.medium.com/farm-laws-farmer-issues-and...
- ngc248 6y agoIn India there are Farmer organizations, labour organizations etc of all parties. The current agitation is by farmer orgs belonging to opposition parties. This is just politics nothing else.
- ngc248 6y agoDude, you really think, we Indians cant govern ourselves, I mean what is this calling your representatives. I think anytime anything happens to some minority in the the Great USA, us Indians also need to call our MP and ask them to create noise. I mean this is utterly condescending and racist.
- loopz 6y agoNot really. Lots of people worldwide were very concerned about the lies the past 4 years in US. Of course people write about their concerns. Lots of people care for Indians, the Chinese and Russians too!
- ngc248 6y agoLots care, but while caring they are feeding into their own biases. >>> Lots of people care for Indians, the Chinese and Russians too! One of them is not like the others. India is not an authoritarian, one party system like the others. It was that for a few years when the congress held sway. Now it is a vibrant democracy. At the state level there are state parties and at the national level there are national parties which get elected. There is no authoritarianism here. BJP may not come to power next time because of a myriad reasons. If they actually come to power it is because people want them to. Of course people may detract this saying populist (which has become a dirty word now), but whatever all the power to the people man.
- deepglacier 6y ago> I mean this is utterly condescending and racist. There is nothing racist about the international community raising concerns about violations of basic democratic rights such as free speech and right of assembly. > I think anytime anything happens to some minority in the the Great USA, us Indians also need to call our MP and ask them to create noise. I would support Indians doing this. Please raise concerns with your representatives when you see human rights violations in any part of the world and ask them to speak about it in international forums. In the past, India has done a commendable job in helping minorities persecuted by the CCP. Many Tibetian Buddhists were given refuge in India, including Dalai Lama, who fled Tibet in 1959. Contrary to it's history, India is staying mum on contemporary persecution of religious minorities in neighboring countries such as Rohingyas in Myanmar and Uyghurs in China.
- aparsons 6y agoLived in India in the 1980s - going there on a spiritual journey (yes, I know) and stayed for a few years. When I left the country, two events had occurred for which I don’t think I’ll be able to see that country in a good light ever again. The first was the anti-Sikh riots after Indira Gandhi’s murder. Politicians were compliant, including the newly elected PM Rajiv Gandhi who at the time famously said “When a tree falls, it’s normal for the earth to shake”. Of course, I haven’t even touched on the events leading up to this, most notably the destruction of the Golden Temple. I spoke to people who saw the riots first-hand, and it tainted my view of that country forever. The second was the Indian intervention in neighboring Sri Lanka. The oppressed Tamil minority were waging a war against the government. India sent in its forces, in the name of brokering peace and then killed thousands of innocent civilians. The Indian man’s propensity for rape was on full display, as the Indian “Peacekeeping” Force (IPKF) weaponized rape against the same populace they came to protect. For what it’s worth, India was humiliated a la Vietnam, and lost thousands of soldiers. The rape issue is also very apparent in modern day Indian society, but I’d rather not open that can of worms in this thread. In either case, after witnessing these happenings from relatively close, I gave up on all hope for that country. Too many rotten apples.
- boring_baduku 6y agoBoth the things you are talking about were perpetrated by the Congress party. The current crisis is also their gift. Why are you generalizing the country based on that? It seems you just witnessed these things but never understood why they happened and who were the perpetrators.
- aparsons 6y agoI posted it expecting downvotes. On the surface, yes I am generalizing the country. But really - and perhaps I should have made it more clear - the reason for my disillusionment were structural/cultural issues: - Willingness to oppress people, and keep the oppressed down when you’re supposed to be helping them. Current events are very relevant to the past events. - Party-over-people politics and crippling corruption - regardless of party - Hindu extremism (brahmanism to be specific) - current government is very much guilty of this - Rape and weaponization of rape - cultural issue across India. Will not be fixed for a long time - it is engrained in the fabric of their society.
- boring_baduku 6y agoHN seems to be promoting only anti-India narratives these days. One of the outrageous comments is asking US persons to get involved in this. This is a direct attack on the sovereignty of India. Anyone questioning this line of thinking is getting flagged. The general consensus seems to be that the Western powers are paragons of justice who can dictate what other countries (note that India is a democracy. Most of these people asking to curb India are mum on the actions of countries like China, Pakistan and even the US.) can do to control protests. Combine this with who can flag the comments, HN is now nothing more than an echo chamber that seems to promote only one kind of narrative.
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- boring_baduku 6y agoEdit: To whoever downvoted me, thanks for proving my point. This is not a debate but a propaganda warfare.
- srean 6y ago> HN is now nothing more than an echo chamber that seems to promote only one kind of narrative Yeah the correct and the logically sound kind :) For everything else there are government cosy media channels
- boring_baduku 6y agoYeah sure. You can choose to believe whatever you want.
- dang 6y agoWe've banned this account for posting flamewar comments and breaking the site guidelines. If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- jitendrac 6y agoIn reality its complex matter farmers have more to gain than lose. For my personal belief I support the farmer reform proposed by the governments, but there are many fake news and political propaganda acting against it. If its about Indian politics never trust what you see on Internet news most are fake.
- dang 6y agoAll: this thread turned into a wretched nationalistic and religious flamewar. I've scolded and/or banned many of the accounts that did that. If you see a comment that didn't get scolded that should have been, it's simply because there isn't time or energy to read everything here, let alone respond. We're not secretly agreeing with it. You can always email hn@ycombinator.com about egregious cases. To the commenters who perpetuated this flamewar: it's not what HN is for and we ban accounts that do this kind of thing. Please don't do it again, regardless of how right you are or feel you are, or how wrong someone else is or you feel they are. This is a site for curious conversation, not a battleground. If you're feeling warlike (including flamewarlike) rather than curious, please don't post until that changes. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- known 6y agoWhat else can we expect when Brahmin, 3% in India are 50% Ministers in Modi Cabinet, 80% Judges in Indian Courts and grabbed 50% jobs in Govt/Private; https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varna_(Hinduism) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varna_(Hinduism) https://www.quora.com/Which-caste-is-looting-India/answers/220938900 https://www.quora.com/Which-caste-is-looting-India/answers/2...