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I never understood why people hate IKEA. Yes it's cheap. Yes it doesn't last a lifetime. Yes it needs a lot of wood. Yes it's highly optimized. But guess what,

by nom 6y ago

I never understood why people hate IKEA. Yes it's cheap. Yes it doesn't last a lifetime. Yes it needs a lot of wood. Yes it's highly optimized. But guess what, IKEA is a business responding to the needs of people. The negatives that are mentioned frequently are merely a symptom of our ever faster developing society. The people who complain are the same ones that just buy cheap crap from china without even thinking about it. IKEAs ability to produce products that people actually need, at such a scale, is amazing to me. It does what it promises. It's cheap. It fills most people's needs fully. Customer support is perfect. I know in 10 years replacements for their core products will still be available. Their way of innovating the products is genius. I can't think of any other company that even comes close. Well, maybe LEGO.

vilius 6y ago
I have IKEA socks (probably illegally made by https://theholeinmysock.com/shop/women/ikea-socks/ https://theholeinmysock.com/shop/women/ikea-socks/) and tend to wear them in summer. People often compliment me for this odd choice of socks. Others find it confusing. However when I ask them if they prefer IKEA or LEGO as a brand they still choose IKEA. Statistically insignificant but I thought I’d still share.
chrisseaton 6y ago
It's the junk food of furniture. Produced at scale with poor materials, satisfies people's immediate need, locations are functional and service is fast. But don't you want something more substantial and created with more craft? You probably don't need more than one adult bed in a lifetime, for example. I've got furniture that's been in use hundreds of years.
- enkid 6y ago
  That's great if it meets your needs, but I don't think that's a good argument for why other people shouldn't have the option to buy stuff from Ikea. Population growth alone dictates there's not enough furniture from a hundred years ago for everyone to furnish their homes.
  - chrisseaton 6y ago
    > I don't think that's a good argument for why other people shouldn't have the option to buy stuff from Ikea I didn't say it as an argument for this? But there is an impact on the environment that effects us all.
- rlpb 6y ago
  > But don't you want something more substantial and created with more craft? No. My furniture is...part of the furniture. I care about it being practical. I don't care about its heritage. IKEA quality is perfectly adequate for me, so I'm not inclined to pay for any more. I also appreciate light furniture that can be moved easily. Furniture that is more "substantial" and made from real wood[1], for example, is far more of a pain for me. [1] As opposed to chipboard; I don't mean to imply that IKEA aren't using trees.
  - chrisseaton 6y ago
    And that's fine, that's how some people view food and they're happy with junk food in the same way people are happy with junk furniture. Junk food and junk furniture are both consistent, cheap, simple, unsurprising, available anywhere, and sometimes that's what people want. But that's what it is - junk furniture.
    - olyjohn 6y ago
      Junk furniture probably won't give you diabetes.
- wycy 6y ago
  No. I have several pieces of Ikea furniture that've survived multiple moves and are still rock solid. It's light, cheap, and sturdy. I don't care if my furniture has craft or history.
  - saalweachter 6y ago
    Honestly a lot of the furniture I've purchased one or two steps up from IKEA ended up being thoroughly underwhelming. Based on my survey of what's available on the market, you have to go up nearly two orders of magnitude on price from IKEA to find solid wood furniture that feels like it has the craftsmanship to be an heirloom. And at those prices, it's not only more than most people can afford, it's more than most people who can are willing to spend.
- greyhair 6y ago
  There is a very high variability in the quality of their goods, that is for certain. Each of my daughters bought steel bed frames that will likely last a lifetime. They are really solid. The slats will probably need to be replaced someday, but they will last as long as any box spring. But yes, a lot of their MDF beds are junk. I bought a stand up desk from them a few years ago. They had three models available at the time, and two of them were 'wobbly' when fully extended, but one of them was not. After four (five?) years of use, both raised and lowered, it is still a great desk. It is hand cranked. It is solid, it is sturdy. So yes, when you shop at Ikea, you have to know what you are getting into, and you need to actually go and see the piece assembled on the floor. The quality from piece to piece is hard to tell from looking. One of my daughters bought an "Alex" dresser. The construction on that is solid, the drawers move beautifully. But many of their other dressers are fine for four years of college, or maybe a first apartment, and not much else. Having said that, that 'temporary' market is huge. Quick edit: If you are looking for a practical 'sit/stand' desk. Here is the one I have. It has been really good. It is not light (in case you live in a walk up). Available ina couple different lengths. Fully extended, it is very stable. https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/skarsta-desk-sit-stand-white-s89324812/ https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/skarsta-desk-sit-stand-white-s8...
- itsnot2020 6y ago
  Historically no it's not, my parents still have a lot of IKEA furniture bought in the 1970s made of real wood which gets used every day.
- Someone 6y ago
  If it’s junk food, it’s decent junk food. You can get much worse. Also, with the relative prices of labor and machines being what they are nowadays, fewer people can afford to buy the traditionally made stuff. It’s the same with housing. You may want a house built with hand-made bricks laid in complicated patterns, but few people can afford that.
- addicted 6y ago
  I don't think the junk food comparison is valid. IKEA design often deservedly wins awards, and their products are a great fit for many use cases that otehrs don't even cover. It's closer to fast casual than to junk food. More Shake Shack than McDonalds, but not a steakhouse.
  - violetgarden 6y ago
    I actually went to some high end furniture stores and was surprised that a lot of stuff on the floor was still IKEA quality. Maybe a slight step up, but a lot of it wasn’t solid wood. Additionally, a lot of it was a bit too fussy or looked like something my grandparents would like. When I went to IKEA, I was glad to see some simple furniture, as it suits my tastes.
- dkjaudyeqooe 6y ago
  Like every company, there is some good stuff and some trash. The materials tend to be the key to which is which. Anything made of solid wood or laminated wood is great because it will take knocks and bumps and ast basically forever. Things like chairs and tables. Lots of their all-metal stuff is good. One of their desk lamps with springs is a design classic, very cheap and amazing value. Their non-stick kitchen pans are very good value as is most of their kitchen stuff, including glass, ceramics and some plastic stuff. Anything made of MDF or manufactured wood is just pure trash.
deleted 6y ago
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0xTJ 6y ago
I consider IKEA to be more or less the ideal home shoppping experience. Some things are picked up along the way, larger things are grabbed at the end. The way they're laid out maximizes usable showroom space, while allowing for entire rooms to be built, with every part showing something you could buy. For anyone looking to furnish their place at a good quality/price, it's the first place I'd think of.
- Triv888 6y ago
  > [...] ideal home shopping experience. I don't like the huge maze, but luckily there are shortcuts...
- InitialLastName 6y ago
  The way they're laid out maximizes the amount of time it takes to get through them by the "natural" path, making customers repeatedly make the decision not to buy things, thereby wearing down their willpower until they get to the end and can load up their cart with trinkets they didn't need when they showed up.
  - SR2Z 6y ago
    If you go to a showroom and get offended when it does its job it sounds like you really shouldn't be going to a showroom at all.
    - InitialLastName 6y ago
      Oh, I don't and I'm not offended. I'm just pointing out that there was a design constraint other than "This is for the consumer's benefit"
etempleton 6y ago
I like IKEA furniture for what it is. It is thoughtfully designed, afordable and usually very easy to assemble. However, their US customer service is essentially non exsistent. I had items delivered damaged and could not get in touch with anyone. I eventually gave up as the effort was not worth it.
- adolph 6y ago
  As frustrating as that is (and I’ve had my share of it to know), if I turn the feeling upside down, maybe there is an iron triangle of cost, error rate and customer service responsiveness. If the price attraction rate is higher than the customer losses represented by product error times the fix error rate, then you win. If the error rate is pushed too far or the customer service white gloved, then costs must be higher. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_management_triangle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_management_triangle
  - Spooky23 6y ago
    That makes sense if you're talking about getting a stale loaf of bread once in awhile. But if you're talking durable goods, the overhead of one incident erases all potential savings or efficiencies. I'm a fan of Ikea and their products, but their shipping in particular and any process that requires call center interaction are ridiculous and a complete waste of time.
itsnot2020 6y ago
It did used to last a lifetime though, my parents bought some items in the 1970s which they still use today (stools, shelves and the odd table), it still looks good as well.
- chpatrick 6y ago
  They still have hardwood furniture though. No one's forcing anyone to buy the cheap plywood ones.
  - bpicolo 6y ago
    What hard wood do they have other than the basic acacia pieces?
  - zucked 6y ago
    They definitely have solid wood furniture - I have some of it. But the solid wood furniture pieces I've seen are all pine. Pine is not a hardwood. Edit: ah, they've got some acacia pieces (dining room pieces, mostly).
- addicted 6y ago
  They have classic designs which last forever. IKEA is almost universally made with cheap materials, but not everything needs high quality materials to last.
- leokennis 6y ago
  IKEA has several “tranches” of cheap furniture. Some of it is solely designed to hit a price point (“a $10 chair”) and is made of cheap plywood, cheaply connected. Some of it is more the “can we pick some low hanging design fruit, apply massive scale, and create a decent chair for 20% of the price it would normally cost” variety. That furniture normally lasts a long time.
  - killtimeatwork 6y ago
    > Some of it is solely designed to hit a price point (“a $10 chair”) and is made of cheap plywood Isn't plywood actually stronger than real wood? It's even used for aircraft construction.
philjohn 6y ago
It all depends on what you buy there. I fitted two IKEA kitchens to past homes I lived in, 14 and 17 years ago. Not professionally fitted either, I did the hard work. I found the properties had both recently been sold and had a look at the listings - both of the kitchens were still doing great. The kitchen I fitted had solid oak door frames with a veneered panel, Quaker style if you will, with standard chipboard cabinets.
- at-fates-hands 6y ago
  I did the same thing in the last house we owned. We had a build and design company who quoted us around $50K to remodel the kitchen. We paid them $100 for the design they came up with and parted ways. We went to IKEA and picked everything out. IKEA hired a sub contractor and they came and installed everything in two days. We still had to do all the demo and prep for them, but we were able to get multiple discounts on everything we bought. In the end, our tiny kitchen remodel went from $50K to $15K. We moved out about a year later, but all the cabinets and quartz counter tops were still in pristine condition, even after a solid year of use.
- ashtonkem 6y ago
  IKEA cabinets are usually considered one of the best things they make. Plastic layered MDF works really well for cabinetry for whatever reason. Even most woodworkers seem to actually recommend Ikea cabinets, even if they despise the rest of their products.
  - Zimahl 6y ago
    With my knowledge as a non-professional woodworker, there's not a lot to cabinets. Even professionally made cabinets use veneered plywood for the bases so what IKEA does isn't any different than almost all cabinets here in the US. The US mostly uses 'framed' cabinets instead of European 'frameless' cabinets, but the cabinet box is essentially the same.
  - jacobrobbins 6y ago
    wood expansion is a big factor for wide flat pieces. Non directional wood products like MDF are used in cabinetry because they do not expand to anywhere near the same degree as solid wood. If you want to use solid wood you have to float it in panels, like you sometimes see on doors. But that adds a lot of complexity. For cabinets where you have dozens of moving pieces using MDF (or plywood) is much better for the reliability of the moving parts.
chaosbutters314 6y ago
probably because of its relationship to nazism https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2018/01/29/nazi-past-followed-ikea-founder-ingvar-kamprad-to-his-death/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2018/01/2...
- SpocksBrain 6y ago
  Seems from that article that that relationship is rather nuanced and only really pertains to the founder and not the company at large.
candu 6y ago
Personally, I dislike IKEA for registering as a non-profit, when they're very clearly not. To me, this belongs in the same bucket as any number of tax avoidance schemes that ensure wealthy individuals pay far lower tax rates than the average person, and that large corporations pay effectively nothing. If they're able to provide great customer service - well, good on them, but I'd much rather the public purse have the money necessary to support people in general. I'm very, very tired of "innovation" being used as an excuse to completely ignore relevant taxes and laws, especially when said innovation is often possible only because of extensive public investment in research, supply chain stability, etc. (If you're not sure what I'm talking about with that last sentence: read The Entrepreneurial State, or talk to anyone who's ever received a DARPA / NSF / etc. grant, or maybe even just go look at an actual public sector budget sometime.)
- istjohn 6y ago
  Wow, that is sketchy. Here's more info on IKEA's tax evasion scheme: https://www.fastcompany.com/3035734/ikea-is-a-nonprofit-and-yes-thats-every-bit-as-fishy-as-it-sounds https://www.fastcompany.com/3035734/ikea-is-a-nonprofit-and-...
  - sneak 6y ago
    avoidance != evasion
    - rychco 6y ago
      Fwiw, the first definition I found for the word evade is “escape or avoid, especially by cleverness or trickery.”
      - Sodman 6y ago
        In the US, they are very specific, distinct things. Tax Evasion[0] is not paying taxes you legally owe. Tax Avoidance[1] is finding ways to owe less tax. Evasion is considered illegal, but Avoidance can practically be considered encouraged, as it's perfectly legal and rewards practitioners with lower tax bills. [0]https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/taxevasion.asp https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/taxevasion.asp [1]https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/tax_avoidance.asp https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/tax_avoidance.asp
hiq 6y ago
> I never understood why people hate IKEA. Did you read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IKEA#Criticisms https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IKEA#Criticisms ? There seems to be many reasons to dislike the company, even as a happy customer. One thing that stuck with me is this: "The IKEA group has a complex corporate structure, which members of the European Parliament have alleged was designed to avoid over €1 billion in tax payments over the 2009–2014 period." It seems easy to sell cheaper if you just pay less taxes. I'm not hating IKEA, but it's obviously not black or white.
- lotsofpulp 6y ago
  That’s a problem of unnecessarily complicated tax laws.
  - reimertz 6y ago
    Agreed! Complexity introduces bugs and here that means loop holes.
  - ashtonkem 6y ago
    IKEA also has a will to abuse them to a degree that their peers don’t, and we should judge them as less ethical for it.
    - johnp314 6y ago
      'abuse' is a subjective word, you could have left off the 'ab' and you sentence would still be correct, arguably more correct. Also, why not consider that by using the complex web of tax laws to their advantage allows them to sell products at a lower price. This allows folks with lower incomes to enjoy similar products to those who can afford getting their stuff from more posh places. One could judge Ikea to be more ethical for this practice.
      - Jochim 6y ago
        This is the same kind of mental gymnastics that gave us trickle down economics. The societal ethics, morality and the spirit of the law should all be taken into account when judging behaviour. Exploiting tax structures in order to conceal income is absolutely immoral and shouldn't be tolerated. This is especially egregious when the tax loopholes are effectively gated behind behing a multi-national corporation. It leads to even greater concentrations of wealth in the hands of these companies which damages the health of the local markets they operate in.
snarf21 6y ago
I don't even think it is that cheap. It is better than the quality you get at most furniture stores for a lower price.
- bluGill 6y ago
  I don't buy the garbage at most furniture stores for the same reason. Real wood isn't that much more expensive and will last. Plenty of it to be found at the likes of goodwill for cheap.
throwaway349957 6y ago
Maybe because it's not an American company.
melling 6y ago
Fight Club effect? https://www.reddit.com/r/movies/comments/4dl14d/what_does_fight_club_have_against_ikea/ https://www.reddit.com/r/movies/comments/4dl14d/what_does_fi... https://youtu.be/C0xBX4xF3rs https://youtu.be/C0xBX4xF3rs
Ygg2 6y ago
I bought an IKEA desk and tried to assemble it myself. Between the poor wood quality, bad paint job, hard to connect components and painful assembly process, I gave up and got a refund. I asked a friend of a friend that's a carpenter and he made way better desk for same amount of money.
- jakupovic 6y ago
  I call BS, you can't even buy the material to build something at IKEA prices, let alone assemble it.
  - cko 6y ago
    Probably didn't account for cost of labor.
    - Ygg2 6y ago
      Cost of labor was around 50% of the material value.
  - Ygg2 6y ago
    BS based on what? I can show you the desk. I did found his bill. It was $30 bucks more. The price for IKEA piece was materials plus delivery. The price for that desk was design, delivery and assembly on the spot.
    - eropple 6y ago
      IKEA has some "halo" items, but most people, when they're talking about IKEA, are talking about stuff like their GALANT table/desks. What IKEA item were you comparing it to?
      - Ygg2 6y ago
        HEMNES stain white writing desk. I need drawers to store stuff next to my computer.
- 6y ago
gwbas1c 6y ago
I once tried to return a defective $20 item... And waited... And waited... I sat in the return area for about 45 minutes while no one was helped. Their bold claims of "just bring it back" were totally bogus.
dalbasal 6y ago
I think IKEA represents plastic consumerism to people. A lot of people feel alienated from the modern world and IKEA registers as fake and therefore alienating. Mass produced, cheap culture with a copy in every house. The best criticisms of these kinds of "problems" are in pop art, as opposed to rational discourse. Fight Club is the canonical example. The film picks IKEA to symbolize the enemy and justification for subversive nihilism ... it resonated well. "Friends" features IKEA the alienation theme as well. Phoebe thinks she has an antique apothecary table. You can smell the history of opium and medicinal brews. Turns out it's IKEA. She has a similar storyline with Nestle. Her grandmother's mythical cookie recipe turns out to be Nestle's. I think the fact that IKEA does, in fact, have decent style/taste makes it a standout symbol of plastic consumerism. Does the cookie taste worse because it's Nestle. Does a handcrafted antique table actually have value? Is our culture worth anything or can it be replaced with mass produced, cheap alternatives? I personally quite admire IKEA for doing what they do well. The corporate structure under a a charitable, tax-free organization is totally bogus and crass... but tax evasion is so prevalent that it's hard to single them out. That said, the cultural aspect is the relevant one and rationalisations aren't necessarily relevant to that. As a side not, it's disheartening that what IKEA pretends to be doesn't actually exist. Imagine if an organisation with the size/competence of IKEA actually did exist for charitable reasons. 11,00 acres of wilderness might be an average afternoon.
- killtimeatwork 6y ago
  > Phoebe thinks she has an antique apothecary table. You can smell the history of opium and medicinal brews. Turns out it's IKEA. Off the top of my head, I think it was Pottery Barn, not IKEA.
  - dalbasal 6y ago
    oops.
    - mixmastamyk 6y ago
      Also in fight club, it isn’t ikea but a fictitious analog, named fürther or something.
at-fates-hands 6y ago
> Yes it's cheap. Yes it doesn't last a lifetime. I've found if you buy something from IKEA when you're putting it together, using wood glue and better screws actually lengthens the life of their stuff considerably. I feel its not the wood that is the issue, just the crappy hardware they send with their stuff that is the issue. But agreed on the rest of your points.
cedricbonhomme 6y ago
Personally I hate IKEA because they are selling pure crap.
- cedricbonhomme 6y ago
  Close to the quality of an Apple product.
  - xxs 6y ago
    ...but Ikea is highly repairable.
- throwaway894345 6y ago
  I've been very happy with my Ikea purchases. Some of the materials are cheaper, but usually the overall function is better than products that would cost some multiple of the price. We have the means to buy the more expensive furniture, but I can't find any retailers that offer things that are as well-designed as IKEA, and IKEA seems to concern itself with the environment (although it's frustratingly easy for a retailer to mislead about the degree to which they are environmentally friendly, and while I'm sure IKEA exaggerates, my other local retailers are far less convincing). I have been disappointed with IKEA's selection of bookcases, but otherwise I'm pretty happy. Most importantly, my wife and I really enjoy trips to IKEA as one of the few 'outings' we get to do during COVID (we like to browse around show rooms and get ideas for our home and also to try their Swedish-themed foods). That said, I really do welcome suggestions for other retailers, whether they be retailers that are more environmentally friendly, or better designed, or with a more enjoyable shopping experience. EDIT: one more grievance--somehow everything is still out of stock for the foreseeable future, and they are very tight-lipped about the specific nature of their supply chain woes and how they're going to work around them. I would expect that a year into the pandemic they'd have addressed some of their supply chain issues or at least managed to be more accurate about their shipping estimates (even if those estimates are still far off into the future).
  - caf 6y ago
    They're also a good source for certain fully manufactured products. Eg. If you want rechargeable NiMH batteries, IKEA's are some of the best you can get. Their smart bulbs also have a good reputation.
afterburner 6y ago
> I never understood why people hate IKEA Snobs, basically.
vidoc 6y ago
> I never understood why people hate IKEA Besides not providing the most durable furniture, albeit at the most competitive price and reasonably good looking designs, they've had a few PR disasters over the years like this one :p https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2013/02/25/172869585/horsemeat-found-in-ikeas-meatballs https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2013/02/25/172869585/ho...
- kwhitefoot 6y ago
  Pretty much everyone in Europe was caught up in the horse meat scandal. I suspect that IKEA was not the one at fault here. The horse meat was inserted into the supply chain right at the slaughtering stage.
  - vidoc 6y ago
    > I suspect that IKEA was not the one at fault here That's right, if I recall correctly, for some reason the press really obsessed about IKEA and another steakhouse chain whose name I forgot.
jordache 6y ago
Anecdotal I know, but I've compared furniture from Ikea to equivalently cheap stuff from big box stores like target. The equivalent furniture from Target going through the same use cases as the furniture from Ikea - The Target ones are easily several times worse than the Ikea ones, in terms of build quality, safety potentials, etc...
ashtonkem 6y ago
Their habit of using illegally harvested wood is a good reason to hate them.
- throwaway894345 6y ago
  Is that true? They make a big show of their environmentalism. In general, I'm very disappointed at how difficult it is to make informed consumer choices with respect to the environment. Maybe the idea is that consumer choices are small potatoes and we should all just pour our energy into campaigning for climate policy?
  - ashtonkem 6y ago
    They've been accused of illegal logging in Romania[0], but they're very secretive about where they get their lumber from. 0 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IKEA#Possible_illegal_timber_in_Romania https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IKEA#Possible_illegal_timber_i...
Spooky23 6y ago
I have alot of IKEA stuff, the quality complaints are mostly inaccurate IMO. If you buy mid-priced furniture from a big box furniture store, it costs more and very marginally much better. It does move better assembled though. High quality furniture requires skilled labor and is very expensive. I would say that having built an Ikea kitchen and dealing with a few relatively minor issues, their customer support sucks. The employees are great, but the friction in getting to them is awful. Maybe the NY/NJ/CT Ikeas are worse with this.
jeffrallen 6y ago
I'm not as sure that Ikea's manufacturing employees are paid a living wage as I am for Lego. Externalities count, all of them.
robertlagrant 6y ago
Older people who lived in a world of more resources per person and better craftsmen are used to high quality furniture. That luxury isn't really available at the moment, which is a shame, but IKEA have helped a lot of people.
agloeregrets 6y ago
I completely agree. Ikea really seems like a bit of unicorn in this space to my mind too. In the world of products that are affordable they tend to also be ugly or lacking consideration. Ikea offsets this by over-valuing considered design compared to nearly everyone and then making novel manufacturing concepts. There really is something about a company that provides incredibly cheap products with a LONG return policy and good design to the masses. Plus their products might use a lot of wood, but they also offset it with renewable initiatives and by putting a lot of time into efficient shipping.
titzer 6y ago
A close friend of mine filled his house entirely with furniture, including couches, from the 1800s. Antique grandfather clocks, pianos, tables, armoires, etc. Not surprisingly, this person is highly skilled with wood and works at a small furniture shop that makes high-quality tables and chairs. Things made out of wood can last centuries. There's no need to further accelerate our throwaway culture with throwaway furniture. For this reason primarily, I hate IKEA and do not buy from them. I prefer to buy actual furniture made by actual people. Reward local artisans, businesses, and shops and avoid waste. Reject globalism. It is what is eating the planet.
- Kalium 6y ago
  An interesting proposition! In 2008, I was on my own for the first time. I had to furnish my first apartment into livability. A family friend gave me a $300 gift card to IKEA. That gift got me a fully functional one-bedroom apartment that I could never have afforded at the time. Now, as a well-paid adult advanced in my career, I can afford to buy high-quality things. I do this knowing full well that I'm buying status symbols. I'm a little skeptical that a highly skilled woodworker's output would have been available to 2008 me, or the modern equivalent, but I would love to be wrong.
  - titzer 6y ago
    Sure, nice things usually cost a premium. But used, secondhand stuff can be affordable too. There should be an economy of downcycling that allows for more affordable stuff, too. I just don't think that IKEA is that. Case in point. When I moved in 2013 I had a ~$1500 dining table that I had paid $800 for. Due to the abruptness of my move, I ended up selling it on Craigslist for something like $200. Keep an eye out for deals, I guess? BTW none of the 1800s furniture that my friend collected were particularly expensive. Just always looking for good deals and willing to driving 200+ miles for them.
    - citrusybread 6y ago
      >Just always looking for good deals and willing to driving 200+ miles for them. for a lot of us city dwellers, that already makes it unaffordable. I think the Buy Nothing movement is really accelerating this trend of trying to connect people to drive the recycling community. Don't throw out old furniture, your local Buy Nothing group will be full of people happy to rehome it.
tshaddox 6y ago
Also, the furniture market is just insane. If you want a chest of drawers, you either pay $100 for a cheap flat pack self-assembled one from IKEA and take it home today, or similar prices for a similar one online from Wayfair.com (a bit more of a gamble), or you pay over $1000 for something that won’t show up for 6 months. It’s bizarre that you can buy a brand new car with cash and take it home today, but the supply chain for wooden rectangles is extremely underdeveloped.
- kebman 6y ago
  I'd love some insight in how this industry works. I know there's some shops that literally do woodworking and upholstry for that bespoke furniture, but as far as I know, most of it is designed for industry production and mass produced. And indeed, if it's one thing IKEA is doing, it's exactly design for mass production at scale, but the quality is not super-high, perhaps even intentionally. I think, when it comes down to it, lots of people can afford those $1000—or more—furnitures. When people here in the Nordics are done with their furniture, it's often just given away for free on our Craigslist equivalents. And not just the cheap stuff! Often you find really high quality stuff being given away for free. In fact, I found my favourite antique chair in a dumpster! All it needed was a bit of dusting off, and I've had it for over 20 years now. It's simply a very sturdy and high quality armchair. And their previous owners opted to throw it away rather than to even list it. Personally I really like to list stuff, though, because it's an easy way to get others to do the heavy lifting for you. So probably that explains at least some of it. ;)
  - eurasiantiger 6y ago
    Ikea definitely has tiers of quality. A $50 desk is basically cardboard, a $500 desk has some MDF around the edges to make it feel sturdier, and the $1000 desk might even have some real wood in it. The real problem with IKEA is that they use a supply chain that tends to bribe officials into cutting down old growth forests, destroying wildlife habitats.
    - hedora 6y ago
Kalium 6y ago
> I never understood why people hate IKEA. Yes it's cheap. Yes it doesn't last a lifetime. Yes it needs a lot of wood. Yes it's highly optimized. It's mass production without the opportunity to posture about your means. It's also often a complicated and confusing experience to put together if you don't heed the instruction booklet carefully. Personally, I think IKEA's instructions are dramatically better than the norm. An exploded engine diagram is a common approach from other vendors.
Waterluvian 6y ago
FWIW IKEA has a lot of solid wood (often pine) options that do last a very long time. My favourite thing is that they degrade gracefully. You get scuffs and dents rather than peeling laminate and engineered wood shavings falling out.
- bebop 6y ago
  My wife and I bought a kitchen worktable from Ikea almost 10 years ago. It is made entirely out of pine and is actually pretty nice. The surface was getting very well used, as I had it in the garage for a workbench for a little while. I took the power planer to it and put some tung oil on it, it looks brand new.
notatoad 6y ago
It's not Ikea that people hate, it's Ikea customers. People like to think of the moment they upgrades from Ikea furniture to something else as a life milestone where they ascend to another social class, and once they have done that they get to look down on the classes that buy Ikea furniture. Sure, there's a whole list of supposed justifications, but most people's "upgrade" furniture is the same mass-produced crap, but with some marketing to position it as for the class of people who are too good for ikea. Restoration Hardware and Wayfair are making great money selling people what is essentially Ikea furniture plus a little bit of snobbery.
- stretchcat 6y ago
  Heh, the first time I bought IKEA furniture I felt like a rich person, because that was the first time I even owned new furniture. Before then, all my furniture (except mattresses) came from the side of the road on large trash pickup days, or was second/third hand from relatives.
- samkater 6y ago
  I previously would have dismissed this sort of comment with the thought "surely they are missing something." But recently we were looking for simple cabinets and found some we liked on Wayfair but just seemed expensive to me. On a whim I checked Target and found the exact same thing - same model number, even the same marketing pictures for about 33% less. The only difference, as you say, was the snobbery in the description.
miguelmota 6y ago
The cheap stuff is ok but the 'higher-end' of IKEA products are just not good. For example, their couches are in the hundreds of dollars range but the cushions become flat and uncomfortable after a very short period of time. Investing a little more in a non-IKEA quality couch will feel like night and day.
peter_d_sherman 6y ago
IKEA is to furniture -- what Walmart is to general consumer goods and groceries...
- nitrogen 6y ago
  Walmart sells furniture, so Walmart is the Walmart of furniture.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
RHSeeger 6y ago
Maybe it's because of those people that got trapped in the IKEA forever.... http://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/scp-3008 http://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/scp-3008 ^ It's fiction. I just thought people here are the kind that would enjoy it.
headsupftw 6y ago
Wait a sec. When the products are sold by IKEA, they are cheap but they are "products that people actually need". But when they are from China, they are "cheap crap from china"?
- tpmx 6y ago
  Wooden IKEA products (which is what this thread is about) tend to be produced close to the forests, so northern/central/eastern Europe.
- skratlo 6y ago
  Actually, you are kinda right here
megablast 6y ago
The world biggest charging ikea?? How can anyone hate them. Unless they just do it for tax purposes.
dirtyid 6y ago
>I know in 10 years replacements for their core products will still be available. Lots of iterative design revisions and deprecation makes many of IKEA systems not particularly future proof. But in general I think there's massive ecological benefits to how far IKEA goes to value engineer their products. Though ironically this means all the savings are going to be redirected at other consumption.
jb775 6y ago
I like IKEA stores, but I don't believe for a second this land purchase was made for forestry altruism.
na85 6y ago
Exactly. >it's cheap. Yes it doesn't last a lifetime. It lasts longer than most people think. I have a few IKEA dressers that I bought in 2012 that still look like new. Will they become antiques? No, but I only paid 80 dollars for them so I don't care. >Yes it needs a lot of wood. Carbon sink. Better than plastic.
mikepurvis 6y ago
The quality is such a big differentiator. In my household we have a mix of IKEA furniture and flat-pack stuff from other vendors (the Brick, Wayfair, etc), and IKEA is so much better on all fronts— the materials are thicker and tougher, the fasteners are larger and stronger, the designs are better thought out and easier to assemble; there's just no comparison.
drewzero1 6y ago
>Yes it's cheap. Yes it doesn't last a lifetime. Honestly, I haven't found IKEA to be all that cheap? When I was looking for a bed frame they seemed comparable to other midrange furniture places. I could definitely have found a similar thing cheaper online or maybe even at Walmart. I guess I'm used to buying furniture used, where the floor's the limit for how cheap it can be, but my impression of IKEA was that people go there for the showroom experience and the meatballs more than the price.

by nom 6y ago

vilius 6y ago

I have IKEA socks (probably illegally made by https://theholeinmysock.com/shop/women/ikea-socks/ https://theholeinmysock.com/shop/women/ikea-socks/) and tend to wear them in summer. People often compliment me for this odd choice of socks. Others find it confusing. However when I ask them if they prefer IKEA or LEGO as a brand they still choose IKEA. Statistically insignificant but I thought I’d still share.

chrisseaton 6y ago

It's the junk food of furniture. Produced at scale with poor materials, satisfies people's immediate need, locations are functional and service is fast. But don't you want something more substantial and created with more craft? You probably don't need more than one adult bed in a lifetime, for example. I've got furniture that's been in use hundreds of years.

enkid 6y ago
That's great if it meets your needs, but I don't think that's a good argument for why other people shouldn't have the option to buy stuff from Ikea. Population growth alone dictates there's not enough furniture from a hundred years ago for everyone to furnish their homes.
- chrisseaton 6y ago
  > I don't think that's a good argument for why other people shouldn't have the option to buy stuff from Ikea I didn't say it as an argument for this? But there is an impact on the environment that effects us all.
rlpb 6y ago
> But don't you want something more substantial and created with more craft? No. My furniture is...part of the furniture. I care about it being practical. I don't care about its heritage. IKEA quality is perfectly adequate for me, so I'm not inclined to pay for any more. I also appreciate light furniture that can be moved easily. Furniture that is more "substantial" and made from real wood[1], for example, is far more of a pain for me. [1] As opposed to chipboard; I don't mean to imply that IKEA aren't using trees.
- chrisseaton 6y ago
  And that's fine, that's how some people view food and they're happy with junk food in the same way people are happy with junk furniture. Junk food and junk furniture are both consistent, cheap, simple, unsurprising, available anywhere, and sometimes that's what people want. But that's what it is - junk furniture.
  - olyjohn 6y ago
    Junk furniture probably won't give you diabetes.
wycy 6y ago
No. I have several pieces of Ikea furniture that've survived multiple moves and are still rock solid. It's light, cheap, and sturdy. I don't care if my furniture has craft or history.
- saalweachter 6y ago
  Honestly a lot of the furniture I've purchased one or two steps up from IKEA ended up being thoroughly underwhelming. Based on my survey of what's available on the market, you have to go up nearly two orders of magnitude on price from IKEA to find solid wood furniture that feels like it has the craftsmanship to be an heirloom. And at those prices, it's not only more than most people can afford, it's more than most people who can are willing to spend.
greyhair 6y ago
There is a very high variability in the quality of their goods, that is for certain. Each of my daughters bought steel bed frames that will likely last a lifetime. They are really solid. The slats will probably need to be replaced someday, but they will last as long as any box spring. But yes, a lot of their MDF beds are junk. I bought a stand up desk from them a few years ago. They had three models available at the time, and two of them were 'wobbly' when fully extended, but one of them was not. After four (five?) years of use, both raised and lowered, it is still a great desk. It is hand cranked. It is solid, it is sturdy. So yes, when you shop at Ikea, you have to know what you are getting into, and you need to actually go and see the piece assembled on the floor. The quality from piece to piece is hard to tell from looking. One of my daughters bought an "Alex" dresser. The construction on that is solid, the drawers move beautifully. But many of their other dressers are fine for four years of college, or maybe a first apartment, and not much else. Having said that, that 'temporary' market is huge. Quick edit: If you are looking for a practical 'sit/stand' desk. Here is the one I have. It has been really good. It is not light (in case you live in a walk up). Available ina couple different lengths. Fully extended, it is very stable. https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/skarsta-desk-sit-stand-white-s89324812/ https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/skarsta-desk-sit-stand-white-s8...
itsnot2020 6y ago
Historically no it's not, my parents still have a lot of IKEA furniture bought in the 1970s made of real wood which gets used every day.
Someone 6y ago
If it’s junk food, it’s decent junk food. You can get much worse. Also, with the relative prices of labor and machines being what they are nowadays, fewer people can afford to buy the traditionally made stuff. It’s the same with housing. You may want a house built with hand-made bricks laid in complicated patterns, but few people can afford that.
addicted 6y ago
I don't think the junk food comparison is valid. IKEA design often deservedly wins awards, and their products are a great fit for many use cases that otehrs don't even cover. It's closer to fast casual than to junk food. More Shake Shack than McDonalds, but not a steakhouse.
- violetgarden 6y ago
  I actually went to some high end furniture stores and was surprised that a lot of stuff on the floor was still IKEA quality. Maybe a slight step up, but a lot of it wasn’t solid wood. Additionally, a lot of it was a bit too fussy or looked like something my grandparents would like. When I went to IKEA, I was glad to see some simple furniture, as it suits my tastes.
dkjaudyeqooe 6y ago
Like every company, there is some good stuff and some trash. The materials tend to be the key to which is which. Anything made of solid wood or laminated wood is great because it will take knocks and bumps and ast basically forever. Things like chairs and tables. Lots of their all-metal stuff is good. One of their desk lamps with springs is a design classic, very cheap and amazing value. Their non-stick kitchen pans are very good value as is most of their kitchen stuff, including glass, ceramics and some plastic stuff. Anything made of MDF or manufactured wood is just pure trash.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

0xTJ 6y ago

I consider IKEA to be more or less the ideal home shoppping experience. Some things are picked up along the way, larger things are grabbed at the end. The way they're laid out maximizes usable showroom space, while allowing for entire rooms to be built, with every part showing something you could buy. For anyone looking to furnish their place at a good quality/price, it's the first place I'd think of.

Triv888 6y ago
> [...] ideal home shopping experience. I don't like the huge maze, but luckily there are shortcuts...
InitialLastName 6y ago
The way they're laid out maximizes the amount of time it takes to get through them by the "natural" path, making customers repeatedly make the decision not to buy things, thereby wearing down their willpower until they get to the end and can load up their cart with trinkets they didn't need when they showed up.
- SR2Z 6y ago
  If you go to a showroom and get offended when it does its job it sounds like you really shouldn't be going to a showroom at all.
  - InitialLastName 6y ago
    Oh, I don't and I'm not offended. I'm just pointing out that there was a design constraint other than "This is for the consumer's benefit"

etempleton 6y ago

I like IKEA furniture for what it is. It is thoughtfully designed, afordable and usually very easy to assemble. However, their US customer service is essentially non exsistent. I had items delivered damaged and could not get in touch with anyone. I eventually gave up as the effort was not worth it.

adolph 6y ago
As frustrating as that is (and I’ve had my share of it to know), if I turn the feeling upside down, maybe there is an iron triangle of cost, error rate and customer service responsiveness. If the price attraction rate is higher than the customer losses represented by product error times the fix error rate, then you win. If the error rate is pushed too far or the customer service white gloved, then costs must be higher. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_management_triangle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_management_triangle
- Spooky23 6y ago
  That makes sense if you're talking about getting a stale loaf of bread once in awhile. But if you're talking durable goods, the overhead of one incident erases all potential savings or efficiencies. I'm a fan of Ikea and their products, but their shipping in particular and any process that requires call center interaction are ridiculous and a complete waste of time.

itsnot2020 6y ago

It did used to last a lifetime though, my parents bought some items in the 1970s which they still use today (stools, shelves and the odd table), it still looks good as well.

chpatrick 6y ago
They still have hardwood furniture though. No one's forcing anyone to buy the cheap plywood ones.
- bpicolo 6y ago
  What hard wood do they have other than the basic acacia pieces?
- zucked 6y ago
  They definitely have solid wood furniture - I have some of it. But the solid wood furniture pieces I've seen are all pine. Pine is not a hardwood. Edit: ah, they've got some acacia pieces (dining room pieces, mostly).
addicted 6y ago
They have classic designs which last forever. IKEA is almost universally made with cheap materials, but not everything needs high quality materials to last.
leokennis 6y ago
IKEA has several “tranches” of cheap furniture. Some of it is solely designed to hit a price point (“a $10 chair”) and is made of cheap plywood, cheaply connected. Some of it is more the “can we pick some low hanging design fruit, apply massive scale, and create a decent chair for 20% of the price it would normally cost” variety. That furniture normally lasts a long time.
- killtimeatwork 6y ago
  > Some of it is solely designed to hit a price point (“a $10 chair”) and is made of cheap plywood Isn't plywood actually stronger than real wood? It's even used for aircraft construction.

philjohn 6y ago

It all depends on what you buy there. I fitted two IKEA kitchens to past homes I lived in, 14 and 17 years ago. Not professionally fitted either, I did the hard work. I found the properties had both recently been sold and had a look at the listings - both of the kitchens were still doing great. The kitchen I fitted had solid oak door frames with a veneered panel, Quaker style if you will, with standard chipboard cabinets.

at-fates-hands 6y ago
I did the same thing in the last house we owned. We had a build and design company who quoted us around $50K to remodel the kitchen. We paid them $100 for the design they came up with and parted ways. We went to IKEA and picked everything out. IKEA hired a sub contractor and they came and installed everything in two days. We still had to do all the demo and prep for them, but we were able to get multiple discounts on everything we bought. In the end, our tiny kitchen remodel went from $50K to $15K. We moved out about a year later, but all the cabinets and quartz counter tops were still in pristine condition, even after a solid year of use.
ashtonkem 6y ago
IKEA cabinets are usually considered one of the best things they make. Plastic layered MDF works really well for cabinetry for whatever reason. Even most woodworkers seem to actually recommend Ikea cabinets, even if they despise the rest of their products.
- Zimahl 6y ago
  With my knowledge as a non-professional woodworker, there's not a lot to cabinets. Even professionally made cabinets use veneered plywood for the bases so what IKEA does isn't any different than almost all cabinets here in the US. The US mostly uses 'framed' cabinets instead of European 'frameless' cabinets, but the cabinet box is essentially the same.
- jacobrobbins 6y ago
  wood expansion is a big factor for wide flat pieces. Non directional wood products like MDF are used in cabinetry because they do not expand to anywhere near the same degree as solid wood. If you want to use solid wood you have to float it in panels, like you sometimes see on doors. But that adds a lot of complexity. For cabinets where you have dozens of moving pieces using MDF (or plywood) is much better for the reliability of the moving parts.

chaosbutters314 6y ago

probably because of its relationship to nazism https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2018/01/29/nazi-past-followed-ikea-founder-ingvar-kamprad-to-his-death/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2018/01/2...

SpocksBrain 6y ago
Seems from that article that that relationship is rather nuanced and only really pertains to the founder and not the company at large.

candu 6y ago

Personally, I dislike IKEA for registering as a non-profit, when they're very clearly not. To me, this belongs in the same bucket as any number of tax avoidance schemes that ensure wealthy individuals pay far lower tax rates than the average person, and that large corporations pay effectively nothing. If they're able to provide great customer service - well, good on them, but I'd much rather the public purse have the money necessary to support people in general. I'm very, very tired of "innovation" being used as an excuse to completely ignore relevant taxes and laws, especially when said innovation is often possible only because of extensive public investment in research, supply chain stability, etc. (If you're not sure what I'm talking about with that last sentence: read The Entrepreneurial State, or talk to anyone who's ever received a DARPA / NSF / etc. grant, or maybe even just go look at an actual public sector budget sometime.)

istjohn 6y ago
Wow, that is sketchy. Here's more info on IKEA's tax evasion scheme: https://www.fastcompany.com/3035734/ikea-is-a-nonprofit-and-yes-thats-every-bit-as-fishy-as-it-sounds https://www.fastcompany.com/3035734/ikea-is-a-nonprofit-and-...
- sneak 6y ago
  avoidance != evasion
  - rychco 6y ago
    Fwiw, the first definition I found for the word evade is “escape or avoid, especially by cleverness or trickery.”
    - Sodman 6y ago
      In the US, they are very specific, distinct things. Tax Evasion[0] is not paying taxes you legally owe. Tax Avoidance[1] is finding ways to owe less tax. Evasion is considered illegal, but Avoidance can practically be considered encouraged, as it's perfectly legal and rewards practitioners with lower tax bills. [0]https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/taxevasion.asp https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/taxevasion.asp [1]https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/tax_avoidance.asp https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/tax_avoidance.asp

hiq 6y ago

> I never understood why people hate IKEA. Did you read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IKEA#Criticisms https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IKEA#Criticisms ? There seems to be many reasons to dislike the company, even as a happy customer. One thing that stuck with me is this: "The IKEA group has a complex corporate structure, which members of the European Parliament have alleged was designed to avoid over €1 billion in tax payments over the 2009–2014 period." It seems easy to sell cheaper if you just pay less taxes. I'm not hating IKEA, but it's obviously not black or white.

lotsofpulp 6y ago
That’s a problem of unnecessarily complicated tax laws.
- reimertz 6y ago
  Agreed! Complexity introduces bugs and here that means loop holes.
- ashtonkem 6y ago
  IKEA also has a will to abuse them to a degree that their peers don’t, and we should judge them as less ethical for it.
  - johnp314 6y ago
    'abuse' is a subjective word, you could have left off the 'ab' and you sentence would still be correct, arguably more correct. Also, why not consider that by using the complex web of tax laws to their advantage allows them to sell products at a lower price. This allows folks with lower incomes to enjoy similar products to those who can afford getting their stuff from more posh places. One could judge Ikea to be more ethical for this practice.
    - Jochim 6y ago
      This is the same kind of mental gymnastics that gave us trickle down economics. The societal ethics, morality and the spirit of the law should all be taken into account when judging behaviour. Exploiting tax structures in order to conceal income is absolutely immoral and shouldn't be tolerated. This is especially egregious when the tax loopholes are effectively gated behind behing a multi-national corporation. It leads to even greater concentrations of wealth in the hands of these companies which damages the health of the local markets they operate in.

snarf21 6y ago

I don't even think it is that cheap. It is better than the quality you get at most furniture stores for a lower price.

bluGill 6y ago
I don't buy the garbage at most furniture stores for the same reason. Real wood isn't that much more expensive and will last. Plenty of it to be found at the likes of goodwill for cheap.

throwaway349957 6y ago

Maybe because it's not an American company.

melling 6y ago

Fight Club effect? https://www.reddit.com/r/movies/comments/4dl14d/what_does_fight_club_have_against_ikea/ https://www.reddit.com/r/movies/comments/4dl14d/what_does_fi... https://youtu.be/C0xBX4xF3rs https://youtu.be/C0xBX4xF3rs

Ygg2 6y ago

I bought an IKEA desk and tried to assemble it myself. Between the poor wood quality, bad paint job, hard to connect components and painful assembly process, I gave up and got a refund. I asked a friend of a friend that's a carpenter and he made way better desk for same amount of money.

jakupovic 6y ago
I call BS, you can't even buy the material to build something at IKEA prices, let alone assemble it.
- cko 6y ago
  Probably didn't account for cost of labor.
  - Ygg2 6y ago
    Cost of labor was around 50% of the material value.
- Ygg2 6y ago
  BS based on what? I can show you the desk. I did found his bill. It was $30 bucks more. The price for IKEA piece was materials plus delivery. The price for that desk was design, delivery and assembly on the spot.
  - eropple 6y ago
    IKEA has some "halo" items, but most people, when they're talking about IKEA, are talking about stuff like their GALANT table/desks. What IKEA item were you comparing it to?
    - Ygg2 6y ago
      HEMNES stain white writing desk. I need drawers to store stuff next to my computer.
6y ago

gwbas1c 6y ago

I once tried to return a defective $20 item... And waited... And waited... I sat in the return area for about 45 minutes while no one was helped. Their bold claims of "just bring it back" were totally bogus.

dalbasal 6y ago

I think IKEA represents plastic consumerism to people. A lot of people feel alienated from the modern world and IKEA registers as fake and therefore alienating. Mass produced, cheap culture with a copy in every house. The best criticisms of these kinds of "problems" are in pop art, as opposed to rational discourse. Fight Club is the canonical example. The film picks IKEA to symbolize the enemy and justification for subversive nihilism ... it resonated well. "Friends" features IKEA the alienation theme as well. Phoebe thinks she has an antique apothecary table. You can smell the history of opium and medicinal brews. Turns out it's IKEA. She has a similar storyline with Nestle. Her grandmother's mythical cookie recipe turns out to be Nestle's. I think the fact that IKEA does, in fact, have decent style/taste makes it a standout symbol of plastic consumerism. Does the cookie taste worse because it's Nestle. Does a handcrafted antique table actually have value? Is our culture worth anything or can it be replaced with mass produced, cheap alternatives? I personally quite admire IKEA for doing what they do well. The corporate structure under a a charitable, tax-free organization is totally bogus and crass... but tax evasion is so prevalent that it's hard to single them out. That said, the cultural aspect is the relevant one and rationalisations aren't necessarily relevant to that. As a side not, it's disheartening that what IKEA pretends to be doesn't actually exist. Imagine if an organisation with the size/competence of IKEA actually did exist for charitable reasons. 11,00 acres of wilderness might be an average afternoon.

killtimeatwork 6y ago
> Phoebe thinks she has an antique apothecary table. You can smell the history of opium and medicinal brews. Turns out it's IKEA. Off the top of my head, I think it was Pottery Barn, not IKEA.
- dalbasal 6y ago
  oops.
  - mixmastamyk 6y ago
    Also in fight club, it isn’t ikea but a fictitious analog, named fürther or something.

at-fates-hands 6y ago

> Yes it's cheap. Yes it doesn't last a lifetime. I've found if you buy something from IKEA when you're putting it together, using wood glue and better screws actually lengthens the life of their stuff considerably. I feel its not the wood that is the issue, just the crappy hardware they send with their stuff that is the issue. But agreed on the rest of your points.

cedricbonhomme 6y ago

Personally I hate IKEA because they are selling pure crap.

cedricbonhomme 6y ago
Close to the quality of an Apple product.
- xxs 6y ago
  ...but Ikea is highly repairable.
throwaway894345 6y ago
I've been very happy with my Ikea purchases. Some of the materials are cheaper, but usually the overall function is better than products that would cost some multiple of the price. We have the means to buy the more expensive furniture, but I can't find any retailers that offer things that are as well-designed as IKEA, and IKEA seems to concern itself with the environment (although it's frustratingly easy for a retailer to mislead about the degree to which they are environmentally friendly, and while I'm sure IKEA exaggerates, my other local retailers are far less convincing). I have been disappointed with IKEA's selection of bookcases, but otherwise I'm pretty happy. Most importantly, my wife and I really enjoy trips to IKEA as one of the few 'outings' we get to do during COVID (we like to browse around show rooms and get ideas for our home and also to try their Swedish-themed foods). That said, I really do welcome suggestions for other retailers, whether they be retailers that are more environmentally friendly, or better designed, or with a more enjoyable shopping experience. EDIT: one more grievance--somehow everything is still out of stock for the foreseeable future, and they are very tight-lipped about the specific nature of their supply chain woes and how they're going to work around them. I would expect that a year into the pandemic they'd have addressed some of their supply chain issues or at least managed to be more accurate about their shipping estimates (even if those estimates are still far off into the future).
- caf 6y ago
  They're also a good source for certain fully manufactured products. Eg. If you want rechargeable NiMH batteries, IKEA's are some of the best you can get. Their smart bulbs also have a good reputation.

afterburner 6y ago

> I never understood why people hate IKEA Snobs, basically.

vidoc 6y ago

> I never understood why people hate IKEA Besides not providing the most durable furniture, albeit at the most competitive price and reasonably good looking designs, they've had a few PR disasters over the years like this one :p https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2013/02/25/172869585/horsemeat-found-in-ikeas-meatballs https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2013/02/25/172869585/ho...

kwhitefoot 6y ago
Pretty much everyone in Europe was caught up in the horse meat scandal. I suspect that IKEA was not the one at fault here. The horse meat was inserted into the supply chain right at the slaughtering stage.
- vidoc 6y ago
  > I suspect that IKEA was not the one at fault here That's right, if I recall correctly, for some reason the press really obsessed about IKEA and another steakhouse chain whose name I forgot.

jordache 6y ago

Anecdotal I know, but I've compared furniture from Ikea to equivalently cheap stuff from big box stores like target. The equivalent furniture from Target going through the same use cases as the furniture from Ikea - The Target ones are easily several times worse than the Ikea ones, in terms of build quality, safety potentials, etc...

ashtonkem 6y ago

Their habit of using illegally harvested wood is a good reason to hate them.

throwaway894345 6y ago
Is that true? They make a big show of their environmentalism. In general, I'm very disappointed at how difficult it is to make informed consumer choices with respect to the environment. Maybe the idea is that consumer choices are small potatoes and we should all just pour our energy into campaigning for climate policy?
- ashtonkem 6y ago
  They've been accused of illegal logging in Romania[0], but they're very secretive about where they get their lumber from. 0 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IKEA#Possible_illegal_timber_in_Romania https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IKEA#Possible_illegal_timber_i...

Spooky23 6y ago

I have alot of IKEA stuff, the quality complaints are mostly inaccurate IMO. If you buy mid-priced furniture from a big box furniture store, it costs more and very marginally much better. It does move better assembled though. High quality furniture requires skilled labor and is very expensive. I would say that having built an Ikea kitchen and dealing with a few relatively minor issues, their customer support sucks. The employees are great, but the friction in getting to them is awful. Maybe the NY/NJ/CT Ikeas are worse with this.

jeffrallen 6y ago

I'm not as sure that Ikea's manufacturing employees are paid a living wage as I am for Lego. Externalities count, all of them.

robertlagrant 6y ago

Older people who lived in a world of more resources per person and better craftsmen are used to high quality furniture. That luxury isn't really available at the moment, which is a shame, but IKEA have helped a lot of people.

agloeregrets 6y ago

I completely agree. Ikea really seems like a bit of unicorn in this space to my mind too. In the world of products that are affordable they tend to also be ugly or lacking consideration. Ikea offsets this by over-valuing considered design compared to nearly everyone and then making novel manufacturing concepts. There really is something about a company that provides incredibly cheap products with a LONG return policy and good design to the masses. Plus their products might use a lot of wood, but they also offset it with renewable initiatives and by putting a lot of time into efficient shipping.

titzer 6y ago

A close friend of mine filled his house entirely with furniture, including couches, from the 1800s. Antique grandfather clocks, pianos, tables, armoires, etc. Not surprisingly, this person is highly skilled with wood and works at a small furniture shop that makes high-quality tables and chairs. Things made out of wood can last centuries. There's no need to further accelerate our throwaway culture with throwaway furniture. For this reason primarily, I hate IKEA and do not buy from them. I prefer to buy actual furniture made by actual people. Reward local artisans, businesses, and shops and avoid waste. Reject globalism. It is what is eating the planet.

Kalium 6y ago
An interesting proposition! In 2008, I was on my own for the first time. I had to furnish my first apartment into livability. A family friend gave me a $300 gift card to IKEA. That gift got me a fully functional one-bedroom apartment that I could never have afforded at the time. Now, as a well-paid adult advanced in my career, I can afford to buy high-quality things. I do this knowing full well that I'm buying status symbols. I'm a little skeptical that a highly skilled woodworker's output would have been available to 2008 me, or the modern equivalent, but I would love to be wrong.
- titzer 6y ago
  Sure, nice things usually cost a premium. But used, secondhand stuff can be affordable too. There should be an economy of downcycling that allows for more affordable stuff, too. I just don't think that IKEA is that. Case in point. When I moved in 2013 I had a ~$1500 dining table that I had paid $800 for. Due to the abruptness of my move, I ended up selling it on Craigslist for something like $200. Keep an eye out for deals, I guess? BTW none of the 1800s furniture that my friend collected were particularly expensive. Just always looking for good deals and willing to driving 200+ miles for them.
  - citrusybread 6y ago
    >Just always looking for good deals and willing to driving 200+ miles for them. for a lot of us city dwellers, that already makes it unaffordable. I think the Buy Nothing movement is really accelerating this trend of trying to connect people to drive the recycling community. Don't throw out old furniture, your local Buy Nothing group will be full of people happy to rehome it.

tshaddox 6y ago

Also, the furniture market is just insane. If you want a chest of drawers, you either pay $100 for a cheap flat pack self-assembled one from IKEA and take it home today, or similar prices for a similar one online from Wayfair.com (a bit more of a gamble), or you pay over $1000 for something that won’t show up for 6 months. It’s bizarre that you can buy a brand new car with cash and take it home today, but the supply chain for wooden rectangles is extremely underdeveloped.

kebman 6y ago
I'd love some insight in how this industry works. I know there's some shops that literally do woodworking and upholstry for that bespoke furniture, but as far as I know, most of it is designed for industry production and mass produced. And indeed, if it's one thing IKEA is doing, it's exactly design for mass production at scale, but the quality is not super-high, perhaps even intentionally. I think, when it comes down to it, lots of people can afford those $1000—or more—furnitures. When people here in the Nordics are done with their furniture, it's often just given away for free on our Craigslist equivalents. And not just the cheap stuff! Often you find really high quality stuff being given away for free. In fact, I found my favourite antique chair in a dumpster! All it needed was a bit of dusting off, and I've had it for over 20 years now. It's simply a very sturdy and high quality armchair. And their previous owners opted to throw it away rather than to even list it. Personally I really like to list stuff, though, because it's an easy way to get others to do the heavy lifting for you. So probably that explains at least some of it. ;)
- eurasiantiger 6y ago
  Ikea definitely has tiers of quality. A $50 desk is basically cardboard, a $500 desk has some MDF around the edges to make it feel sturdier, and the $1000 desk might even have some real wood in it. The real problem with IKEA is that they use a supply chain that tends to bribe officials into cutting down old growth forests, destroying wildlife habitats.
  - hedora 6y ago

Kalium 6y ago

> I never understood why people hate IKEA. Yes it's cheap. Yes it doesn't last a lifetime. Yes it needs a lot of wood. Yes it's highly optimized. It's mass production without the opportunity to posture about your means. It's also often a complicated and confusing experience to put together if you don't heed the instruction booklet carefully. Personally, I think IKEA's instructions are dramatically better than the norm. An exploded engine diagram is a common approach from other vendors.

Waterluvian 6y ago

FWIW IKEA has a lot of solid wood (often pine) options that do last a very long time. My favourite thing is that they degrade gracefully. You get scuffs and dents rather than peeling laminate and engineered wood shavings falling out.

bebop 6y ago
My wife and I bought a kitchen worktable from Ikea almost 10 years ago. It is made entirely out of pine and is actually pretty nice. The surface was getting very well used, as I had it in the garage for a workbench for a little while. I took the power planer to it and put some tung oil on it, it looks brand new.

notatoad 6y ago

It's not Ikea that people hate, it's Ikea customers. People like to think of the moment they upgrades from Ikea furniture to something else as a life milestone where they ascend to another social class, and once they have done that they get to look down on the classes that buy Ikea furniture. Sure, there's a whole list of supposed justifications, but most people's "upgrade" furniture is the same mass-produced crap, but with some marketing to position it as for the class of people who are too good for ikea. Restoration Hardware and Wayfair are making great money selling people what is essentially Ikea furniture plus a little bit of snobbery.

stretchcat 6y ago
Heh, the first time I bought IKEA furniture I felt like a rich person, because that was the first time I even owned new furniture. Before then, all my furniture (except mattresses) came from the side of the road on large trash pickup days, or was second/third hand from relatives.
samkater 6y ago
I previously would have dismissed this sort of comment with the thought "surely they are missing something." But recently we were looking for simple cabinets and found some we liked on Wayfair but just seemed expensive to me. On a whim I checked Target and found the exact same thing - same model number, even the same marketing pictures for about 33% less. The only difference, as you say, was the snobbery in the description.

miguelmota 6y ago

The cheap stuff is ok but the 'higher-end' of IKEA products are just not good. For example, their couches are in the hundreds of dollars range but the cushions become flat and uncomfortable after a very short period of time. Investing a little more in a non-IKEA quality couch will feel like night and day.

peter_d_sherman 6y ago

IKEA is to furniture -- what Walmart is to general consumer goods and groceries...

nitrogen 6y ago
Walmart sells furniture, so Walmart is the Walmart of furniture.
- deleted 6y ago
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RHSeeger 6y ago

Maybe it's because of those people that got trapped in the IKEA forever.... http://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/scp-3008 http://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/scp-3008 ^ It's fiction. I just thought people here are the kind that would enjoy it.

headsupftw 6y ago

Wait a sec. When the products are sold by IKEA, they are cheap but they are "products that people actually need". But when they are from China, they are "cheap crap from china"?

tpmx 6y ago
Wooden IKEA products (which is what this thread is about) tend to be produced close to the forests, so northern/central/eastern Europe.
skratlo 6y ago
Actually, you are kinda right here

megablast 6y ago

The world biggest charging ikea?? How can anyone hate them. Unless they just do it for tax purposes.

dirtyid 6y ago

>I know in 10 years replacements for their core products will still be available. Lots of iterative design revisions and deprecation makes many of IKEA systems not particularly future proof. But in general I think there's massive ecological benefits to how far IKEA goes to value engineer their products. Though ironically this means all the savings are going to be redirected at other consumption.

jb775 6y ago

I like IKEA stores, but I don't believe for a second this land purchase was made for forestry altruism.

na85 6y ago

Exactly. >it's cheap. Yes it doesn't last a lifetime. It lasts longer than most people think. I have a few IKEA dressers that I bought in 2012 that still look like new. Will they become antiques? No, but I only paid 80 dollars for them so I don't care. >Yes it needs a lot of wood. Carbon sink. Better than plastic.

mikepurvis 6y ago

The quality is such a big differentiator. In my household we have a mix of IKEA furniture and flat-pack stuff from other vendors (the Brick, Wayfair, etc), and IKEA is so much better on all fronts— the materials are thicker and tougher, the fasteners are larger and stronger, the designs are better thought out and easier to assemble; there's just no comparison.

drewzero1 6y ago

>Yes it's cheap. Yes it doesn't last a lifetime. Honestly, I haven't found IKEA to be all that cheap? When I was looking for a bed frame they seemed comparable to other midrange furniture places. I could definitely have found a similar thing cheaper online or maybe even at Walmart. I guess I'm used to buying furniture used, where the floor's the limit for how cheap it can be, but my impression of IKEA was that people go there for the showroom experience and the meatballs more than the price.