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GitHub admits fault in firing of Jewish employee, head of HR resigns
- 458aperta 6y agoThe warning sparked criticism from a colleague who took offense at the use of the word “Nazi” and prompted GitHub’s HR team to reprimand the Jewish employee. Two days later, he was fired. Just what the hell is going on with the US? A professor also got sacked because he was using a Chinese filler word "Nai Ge" which sounded like the N word after a bunch of students reported him for racism. I only expect to see this hypersensitivity and language policing to increase in America as the rest of the world glances at each other in bewilderment. Amen and awomen.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- nagshtr 6y agoThe US is under siege but hardcore leftists bent on the total and complete destruction of the US. They lied about covid. The burnt down all of our cities last summer. They stole an election. This is really nothing short of war.
- rglover 6y agoThis is a worthwhile read and a great breakdown: https://newdiscourses.com/2020/12/psychopathy-origins-totalitarianism/ https://newdiscourses.com/2020/12/psychopathy-origins-totali...
- frongpik 6y agoThat's a good one. The article must be describing one particular pseudo reality in our society.
- 458aperta 6y agoIt doesnt help that they constantly shut down criticism of it which only emboldens those who live in this new borderline thought police order as the norm. The side effect of this is that it aggravates hostility towards those very groups that society is "protecting". I just see no way out of this downward spiral. Pretty soon we will be "reeducated" when it offends the hypersensitive hive mind in a semi totalitarian "western democracy" I do believe that we will see secession of states like Texas who has their own conventional military and tech giants relocating there signals tax cuts. This would seriously undermine the Biden-Harris administration and I don't believe that Texas in particular will end up like Quebec where it needs to rely on Federal subsidies and generous tax credit for businesses.
- rglover 6y agoThe way out is to call out the absurdity, ignorance, and hypocrisy of it all. In simpler terms: be the pin that pops the bubble. It will hurt people's feelings, it will trigger their tendency toward victimization, but if we're going to avoid another mass genocide (the logical conclusion of this sort of behavior), it's time to call it what it is: mass delusion operating as a stand-in for traditional systems of morality like religion.
- frongpik 6y agoI wouldn't even call it "mass" delusion. Who really supports it? Surely not inland or eastern states, that are very orthodox, and I doubt it's Indian or Chinese immigrants who have their own and rather sophisticated philosophy (I mean hinduism and such) and I doubt it's high-tech whites who at most politely ignore slurs in their address. This draws a rather depressing picture of our "culture" if I may use this word. The said delusion is really just a policy enforced at the very top, i.e. in places like DoD and WH. Twitter creates an illusion of majority, but I bet that if this majority were to organise a picnic, they would fit on a smallish park.
- rglover 6y ago
- frongpik 6y agoAxen, not amen or awomen. 3 points to your speech license. Beware, that with 20 points your rights to speech may be suspended until you pass an exam on the 56 pronouns.
- crumbshot 6y agohttps://github.blog/2021-01-17-update-on-an-employee-matter https://github.blog/2021-01-17-update-on-an-employee-matter > On Friday, January 8th, GitHub separated with an employee. What an absurdly passive corporate euphemism for GitHub wrongfully firing one of their employees.
- SpicyLemonZest 6y agoI don't know if I'd read that much into it. It's possible that the employee was asked to resign for severance instead of getting fired outright, and Github just wants to make sure they're being accurate. After all, the rest of the post makes it pretty clear they acknowledge their mistake.
- pseudalopex 6y agoSaying they coerced the employee to resign would be accurate too then. The euphemism isn't needed.
- the-dude 6y agoWasn't there a similar, but different euphemism used in the Google vs the histrionic AI researcher? I try to remember, but can't. Yet.
- ReptileMan 6y agoI think that with google she resigned. She offered her resignation if her demands were not met.
- pseudalopex 6y agoShe proposed discussing a resignation date if her conditions weren't met. Google fired her immediately.
- oauea 6y ago> In the post, GitHub COO Erica Brescia said: “To the employee we wish to say publicly: we sincerely apologize.” How about offering the employee a generous severance package and their job back? edit: Based on their blog it seems like they did, the linked article just didn't mention this.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- eropple 6y agoFrom the original blog post: we immediately reversed the decision to separate with the employee and are in communication with his representative. They probably can't say more than that.
- oauea 6y agoAh, I see they mentioned that on the blog but it wasn't in the linked article in the OP. Good to know!
- stanulilic 6y agoI think they have offered his job back. That's the impression I got reading from their blog: https://github.blog/2021-01-17-update-on-an-employee-matter/ https://github.blog/2021-01-17-update-on-an-employee-matter/ "In light of these findings, we immediately reversed the decision to separate with the employee and are in communication with his representative."
- notyourday 6y agoThe fish rots from the head. They need to terminate the CEO and everyone else who has been involved in firing the employee in question. It is not that the CEO was not informed about that kind of "action" and did not decide not to overrule it.
- az226 6y agoAlready before this received two months pay and now also has job offered back
- _Microft 6y agoIs there more to this story? It is not clear why it mattered that the employee is Jewish and seems like that could have happened to anyone else as well.
- neom 6y agohttps://www.theverge.com/2021/1/15/22232766/github-employees-protest-jewish-employee-firing-warn-nazi https://www.theverge.com/2021/1/15/22232766/github-employees...
- monocasa 6y agoI think the fact that the employee is Jewish just points to the egregiousness of the decision rather than tipping the scale one way or another.
- SpicyLemonZest 6y agoWhat specifically does it point to, though? I don't see what would have been different here if the employee were a gentile.
- monocasa 6y agoYou don't see why Jewish employees might be more concerned and in tune with safety considerations of the presence of literal Nazis than gentile employees? Like I was saying, the decision would have been the same either way, but it's more egregious when weaponized against a Jewish employee.
- SpicyLemonZest 6y agoI mean, I guess, but it just seems bizarre and unnecessary to force a racial angle on this story. I would be pretty unhappy if I were in this guy's place and reporters insisted on calling me a "Mexican employee".
- monocasa 6y ago
- detaro 6y agoprevious thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25812655 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25812655
- choppaface 6y ago^^^ This is Github’s official statement which is absolutely worth reading. However, the title is rather unfortunate: “Update on an employee matter.” That title is extraordinarily biased. While I didn’t really anticipate how this submission would get flagged, I don’t think the corporate-speak title is at all fair to the situation. That said, duly noted how the mods treated that story versus this one.
- detaro 6y agoflagging isn't done by mods, but by users. And I assume a large part of it being flagged is because it's a duplicate of the other discussion.
- dannyw 6y agoAbsolutely unfortunate situation but quite pleased with how GitHub has promptly responded to this situation.
- fortran77 6y agoLet me get this straight: A Github employee used the them "Nazi" in an appropriate context. Other employees, who many not be targets of Nazis, took "offense" at this, and got this employee fired. I'd say that Microsoft should fire all of GitHub management for this -- as well as the other employees who stirred the pot.
- DiabloD3 6y agoThe Verge seems to, again, not be an unbiased news source. The religion of the employee being fired does not seem to actually be part of the story, just an interesting bit of irony being hyped up to sell the story: he was fired for saying Nazi, and Github's HR is not above the mistakes of any other HR, as in, following policy with zero tolerance. Most likely, in the employee contract, there is a list of words they may not utter while employed. On that list, most likely, is either "Nazi" directly, or "any terms that would be associated with white nationalism" indirectly. This is independent of the employee being Jewish, or there actually being Nazis at the rally (there were, this doesn't seem to be up for debate). The reason I mention these very important distinction is I've seen language by others elsewhere online claiming, somehow, Github has become part of the MAGA bullshit storm. It hasn't, Github made a typical HR mistake at a very inopportune time: don't make this some political argument to score fictional points in a game that has no rules. The whole thing just sounds bizarre, and I don't think the whole story is being told, or will ever be told.
- notsureaboutpg 6y agoId be very surprised if that was in the employee contract
- viraptor 6y ago> Most likely, in the employee contract, there is a list of words they may not utter while employed. That sounds like bullshit. Have you got anything to support that idea?
- notsureaboutpg 6y agoDoesn't matter that he's Jewish. You shouldn't get fired for this. These censorious companies are way too sensitive for this. I don't get how these are the same people who promote entrepreneurship and taking huge risks in business and tech but the second someone says a word that hurts their feelings they should be fired.
- ibejoeb 6y ago>100% Nazis were there That's great that github acknowledges that employees are free to talk about their concerns of bigotry, but calling everyone outside of your party a nazi is just as bigoted. Tone it down.
- progman32 6y agoDid the fired employee do this?
- ibejoeb 6y agoIt's quoted in the article. I'm not making it up. It is an employee, but that employee is not identified, so i don't know.
- monocasa 6y agoThat person is not saying that 100% of the people there are Nazis, but that there's a 100% chance that Nazis were present and prominent, which is absolutely true.
- monocasa 6y agoI mean, literal founding members of groups like "Maryland Skinheads" were leading the charge to break into the capitol. 100% Nazis were there. EDIT: Like, Jason Tankersley is standing there next to Q Shaman in tons of pics. How is this controversial?
- ibejoeb 6y agoJayden X was one of the very first in. It's on video. Would be tough to characterize him as a Nazi. The point is that there are many people with many ideologies, ugly or not, that patriciate in this year-long age of unrest. Can we stop with trying to characterize everything as something?
- monocasa 6y ago
- neom 6y agoAgree or disagree with him, it's refreshing to see a CEO taking a direct and absolute stance on a subject like this and not some wishy washy corporate doublespeak.
- lightgreen 6y agoI would hope CEO to protect someone saying “be safe from rioters and looters in BLM marches”, but that won’t happen. It’s easy to protect someone who is supported by the majority.
- cecja 6y agowhataboutism nothing more if you think the blm protests are the same as literal nazis marching the halls of our capitol you are lost.
- CryptoGhost 6y agoThis whole situation is a great example of why you should avoid politics / politically charged statements in the workplace all around. No one's mind about anything was fundamentally changed. People got upset and stressed out and wasted a bunch of time. People had their employment status impacted. It was just an overall negative episode. When people say something that is problematic or borderline, the response should be "end the thread" and everyone moves on with their work.
- eropple 6y agoIt isn't problematic to note that there are literal-not-figurative Nazis afoot. It is descriptive. How one chooses to respond to that description is telling on oneself. And "see? just don't talk about politics, ignore the literal Nazis" is telling on yourself, too.
- rglover 6y agoCan you share an example of where you've seen neo-Nazis recently (like legitimate, swastika-branded Nazis)?
- progman32 6y agoDoes this fit the description? https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/man-camp-auschwitz-shirt-photographed-u-s-capitol-riot-arrested-n1254070 https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/man-camp-auschwitz-shir...
- rglover 6y agoI'd say so. How many people like that do you think are bumping around having a meaningful impact on people's belief systems (versus just being ignorant in their own little bubbles)? I ask that because the level of fervor and fear around Nazis these days makes it sound like they're goose-stepping around in large groups.
- monocasa 6y agoIn this classic picture https://news.yahoo.com/q-shaman-stormed-capitol-upset-192631226.html https://news.yahoo.com/q-shaman-stormed-capitol-upset-192631... the guy in the yellow shirt is Jason Tankersley, founder of the Maryland Skinheads. The guy to his right in the mask is Matthew Heimbach, former leader of the Traditionalist Workers Party (a neo nazi org).
- bluecalm 6y agoWhat is quite amazing to me is that they were so quick to fire him. I mean, even if he said something inappropriate it just doesn't make business sense. People say all kind of inappropriate things all the time. If a comment violates your policy have a chat with them and continue normally. Firing an employee is very expensive. Firing them over inappropriate comment is also demoralizing to the rest of the team. I mean it's better to have some co-workers who are dicks, some that call you a grammar nazi and maybe even some who disagree with you politically than to play a Russian roulette with words every day - you never know which one is loaded and terminates your career.
- bArray 6y agoI think it's important to remember this was all said in the context of private messages, so none of this was ever intended to be aired. The fact that messages sent in private are now made public is itself quite concerning. > “Others have already said so, but I just want to say it > explicitly myself - I think that nazis were present at > some protests on Jan 6, and that it’s very scary to see > those ideas on display,” wrote one engineer in Slack. I am yet to see evidence of Nazis being at the protests - I don't think anybody openly displaying support for Nazi ideals would find wide support in a pro-America crowd. Assuming there were some in the crowd, I am slightly concerned that what was actually meant was "all of those people were Nazis", in which case this is dangerous rhetoric. > “100% Nazis were there, and 1000000000% Nazis are scary as > fuck and do not belong anywhere. PARTICULARLY AT GitHub!” > responded another. This idea that any group "do not belong anywhere" is quite scary. Once you have gained the title of 'Nazi' (which seems to be a more abused label in modern times), then there seems to be this idea that you have no place in society - and that you can have all services removed from you. Even if you are a literal Nazi (or Communist, or <insert bad ideology>), as long as you abide by the laws of the land, you can be a functioning member of society, and as such need the same basic protections. These people should be allowed to open bank accounts, buy groceries, go to work, pay taxes, drink at a bar, etc. We can't de-humanize people because we disagree with the way they think. > “Hubbers are free to express concerns about neo-Nazis, > antisemitism, white supremacy or any other form of > discrimination or harassment,” he wrote. “And of course, > we expect Hubbers to be respectful, professional, and to > follow GitHub policies on discrimination and harassment at > all times.” I miss the days when it was taboo to mention politics or religion in companies. I used to work with a "Nazi" and a "Communist" (as well as a whole range of political leanings), and we worked together fine. I've also worked with alcoholics and drug addicts. Generally we all agreed that if we want to do these things, we do it off company time.
- readflaggedcomm 6y agoYou say private messages, but the BI article posted to HN before (https://www.businessinsider.com/microsoft-github-backlash-jewish-employee-termination-2021-1 https://www.businessinsider.com/microsoft-github-backlash-je...) calls the communications channel "a Slack group for Jewish employees." GitHub was way out of line viewing and judging these messages. It doesn't matter what happened there. That channel is not for them.
- neilsense 6y agoThe woke eating the woke is just beautiful to watch.
- ndosnfiwjaijx 6y agoThis nazi psychosis nowadays really reminds me of the communist psychosis during the Cold War. Nazis, nazis everywhere!
- s1artibartfast 6y agoI think it is pretty clear that part of the story here is missing. No company fires someone just for saying the word Nazi. there was a complaint made against them perhaps a misunderstanding. The quote saying that “Nazis have no place at github” is particularly confusing. My guess is that someone interpreted this as Trump supporters are Nazis and as an accusation of their coworkers
- tootie 6y agoI think that's it. It was viewed as an insult and someone invoked Godwin's Law against him. Only it turns out he was speaking correctly and accurately.
- monadic3 6y agoWhy was this flagged?