6 ms·

Just a point of clarification for those not familiar with the heist, the weapons used were -not- legal in CA or the US. It was also during the time of the Feder

Just a point of clarification for those not familiar with the heist, the weapons used were -not- legal in CA or the US. It was also during the time of the Federal Assault Weapons ban. They were not owned nor able to be owned legally during that time. It was also the inspiration for Heat’s shootout!

Melting_Harps 6y ago
> Just a point of clarification for those not familiar with the heist, the weapons used were -not- legal in CA or the US. It was also during the time of the Federal Assault Weapons ban. They were not owned nor able to be owned legally during that time. Only semi-correct, they had full-auto AK47s and extended mags, all of which at the time could be purchased and legally owned with a special stamp by the ATF [0]. As a child a friend's father had one he would bring out on new years to only short lived amusement in the neighborhood as we all lived in a densely populated suburb near a major freeway. But without them, yes, you couldn't just go to a store and buy one off the shelf. 0: https://legalbeagle.com/8731203-class-three-stamp-through-atf.html https://legalbeagle.com/8731203-class-three-stamp-through-at...
- throwaway0a5e 6y ago
  The weapons they used theoretically could have been legal had they had the provenance to make them legal. Converting your own semi-auto to full auto is in now way legal then nor now. Full auto guns are basically a rich man's toy and have been since well before new ones were outlawed in 1986. The practicality mostly isn't there for criminal use and they're real expensive to feed.
  - EGreg 6y ago
    What happened in 1986 and are you saying it’s legal to own an automatic weapon if it was manufactured that long ago? Do you have to register it? And people can modify them and upgrade them?
    - azernik 6y ago
      See https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25514950 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25514950 tl;dr - you don't "have to register" them, because by definition the ones that are legal are already registered. In '86 they stopped allowing new registrations for automatic weapons, but existing registered weapons were grandfathered in. US gun law considers the lower receiver to bear the "identity" of the weapon, so some pretty extensive modification can occur while it technically stays "the same gun" in a Ship of Theseus fashion.
- Rebelgecko 6y ago
  Pretty much all NFA items are banned in California, even with a tax stamp. I believe that was already true at the time
DennisP 6y ago
So to clarify that...the federal Assault Weapons Ban applied to semi-auto rifles with certain ergonomic features, including pistol grips, flash hiders, and folding stocks. (Semi-auto is one bullet per trigger pull, full-auto means you can hold the trigger down and spray bullets.) The North Hollywood robbers had illegally modified their weapons to enable full-auto fire. Since well before 1997, modifying guns like this has been a federal felony that gets you a ten-year prison sentence. That's a prohibition that predates the Assault Weapon Ban, which had nothing to do with full-auto weapons. The AWB has since expired, and doing your own full-auto conversion will still get you ten years in the slammer. You can buy a full-auto weapon, but only after an extensive background check and approval of your local sheriff, if your state allows it, and only if the weapon was manufactured before 1986. The movie Heat, of course, also had its robbers using full-auto. Incidentally, the movie came out before the North Hollywood robbery; many people have actually blamed the movie for inspiring the real robbers, one of whom owned a copy of the movie! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Hollywood_shootout https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Hollywood_shootout https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Assault_Weapons_Ban https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Assault_Weapons_Ban https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_(1995_film)#Impact https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_(1995_film)#Impact
- tomcam 6y ago
  Where do you even buy those pre-86 full autos? Asking for a friend.
  - manfredo 6y ago
    Usually at auction. Even poor quality, worn out registered automatics will run in the high thousands, or low tens of thousands because of constrained supply. This creates interesting dynamics where people take cheap (relatively, still ~$5,000 on the low end) legal automatics like MAC-10s and converting them to 5.56x45mm while retaining the original lower receiver. Example: https://youtu.be/YjrnB2cXSqM https://youtu.be/YjrnB2cXSqM
    - EGreg 6y ago
      Wait wat? These are legal somehow in USA? Can you please trace how and prove it with links?
electriclove 6y ago
No, Heat came out Before that heist.
reshie 6y ago
thats right. what it did was giving the police more militarization and most police now carry an ar in their cruisers(used to be shotgun at best) and also lot more military surplus like nraps.
bhickey 6y ago
> It was also the inspiration for Heat’s shootout! The North Hollywood shootout was in 1997, Heat came out two years prior.

Melting_Harps 6y ago

> Just a point of clarification for those not familiar with the heist, the weapons used were -not- legal in CA or the US. It was also during the time of the Federal Assault Weapons ban. They were not owned nor able to be owned legally during that time. Only semi-correct, they had full-auto AK47s and extended mags, all of which at the time could be purchased and legally owned with a special stamp by the ATF [0]. As a child a friend's father had one he would bring out on new years to only short lived amusement in the neighborhood as we all lived in a densely populated suburb near a major freeway. But without them, yes, you couldn't just go to a store and buy one off the shelf. 0: https://legalbeagle.com/8731203-class-three-stamp-through-atf.html https://legalbeagle.com/8731203-class-three-stamp-through-at...

throwaway0a5e 6y ago
The weapons they used theoretically could have been legal had they had the provenance to make them legal. Converting your own semi-auto to full auto is in now way legal then nor now. Full auto guns are basically a rich man's toy and have been since well before new ones were outlawed in 1986. The practicality mostly isn't there for criminal use and they're real expensive to feed.
- EGreg 6y ago
  What happened in 1986 and are you saying it’s legal to own an automatic weapon if it was manufactured that long ago? Do you have to register it? And people can modify them and upgrade them?
  - azernik 6y ago
    See https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25514950 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25514950 tl;dr - you don't "have to register" them, because by definition the ones that are legal are already registered. In '86 they stopped allowing new registrations for automatic weapons, but existing registered weapons were grandfathered in. US gun law considers the lower receiver to bear the "identity" of the weapon, so some pretty extensive modification can occur while it technically stays "the same gun" in a Ship of Theseus fashion.
Rebelgecko 6y ago
Pretty much all NFA items are banned in California, even with a tax stamp. I believe that was already true at the time

DennisP 6y ago

So to clarify that...the federal Assault Weapons Ban applied to semi-auto rifles with certain ergonomic features, including pistol grips, flash hiders, and folding stocks. (Semi-auto is one bullet per trigger pull, full-auto means you can hold the trigger down and spray bullets.) The North Hollywood robbers had illegally modified their weapons to enable full-auto fire. Since well before 1997, modifying guns like this has been a federal felony that gets you a ten-year prison sentence. That's a prohibition that predates the Assault Weapon Ban, which had nothing to do with full-auto weapons. The AWB has since expired, and doing your own full-auto conversion will still get you ten years in the slammer. You can buy a full-auto weapon, but only after an extensive background check and approval of your local sheriff, if your state allows it, and only if the weapon was manufactured before 1986. The movie Heat, of course, also had its robbers using full-auto. Incidentally, the movie came out before the North Hollywood robbery; many people have actually blamed the movie for inspiring the real robbers, one of whom owned a copy of the movie! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Hollywood_shootout https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Hollywood_shootout https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Assault_Weapons_Ban https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Assault_Weapons_Ban https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_(1995_film)#Impact https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_(1995_film)#Impact

tomcam 6y ago
Where do you even buy those pre-86 full autos? Asking for a friend.
- manfredo 6y ago
  Usually at auction. Even poor quality, worn out registered automatics will run in the high thousands, or low tens of thousands because of constrained supply. This creates interesting dynamics where people take cheap (relatively, still ~$5,000 on the low end) legal automatics like MAC-10s and converting them to 5.56x45mm while retaining the original lower receiver. Example: https://youtu.be/YjrnB2cXSqM https://youtu.be/YjrnB2cXSqM
  - EGreg 6y ago
    Wait wat? These are legal somehow in USA? Can you please trace how and prove it with links?

electriclove 6y ago

No, Heat came out Before that heist.

reshie 6y ago

thats right. what it did was giving the police more militarization and most police now carry an ar in their cruisers(used to be shotgun at best) and also lot more military surplus like nraps.

bhickey 6y ago

> It was also the inspiration for Heat’s shootout! The North Hollywood shootout was in 1997, Heat came out two years prior.