7 ms·

This should be very interesting, I'm not clear on the relationships after their split but Hyundai has a huge reach across every sort of heavy industry you can t

This should be very interesting, I'm not clear on the relationships after their split but Hyundai has a huge reach across every sort of heavy industry you can think of. I found another article that says it is the motor division that is acquiring Boston Dynamics. I'm surprised the US allowed this, Boston Dynamics seems like the sort of company they would keep close to home. https://www.kedglobal.com/newsView/ked202012080011 https://www.kedglobal.com/newsView/ked202012080011

nwsm 6y ago
What reason would there be to disallow it?
- lemax 6y ago
  National security, the Committee on Foreign Investment in the US (Cfius), has gone as far as requiring the repatriation of Grindr after it approved a deal for it to go to a Chinese company. https://www.ft.com/content/30408b0e-50e2-11e9-b401-8d9ef1626294 https://www.ft.com/content/30408b0e-50e2-11e9-b401-8d9ef1626... edit: not the FTC, it was Cfius
  - rdsubhas 6y ago
    Hyundai is South Korean
- kevin_thibedeau 6y ago
  They've been kept afloat with a lot of DARPA funding. Not a good ROI for the taxpayer.
- souprock 6y ago
  ITAR or even classified The robots are practically weapons. Imagine the 4-legged one chasing you down like a large cat could, then pouncing on you. Imagine the 2-legged one with armor, relentlessly stalking you like Terminator.
  - formerly_proven 6y ago
    Imagine getting blown up by a guided missile launched from a largely automated aircraft.
    - _jal 6y ago
      Or become a reporter and experience it for yourself. https://blogs.findlaw.com/dc_circuit/2020/11/doj-argues-us-can-kill-citizens-at-its-discretion-under-state-secrets-privilege.html https://blogs.findlaw.com/dc_circuit/2020/11/doj-argues-us-c...
    - magicsmoke 6y ago
      More likely to be a flying guillotine. https://www.wsj.com/articles/secret-u-s-missile-aims-to-kill-only-terrorists-not-nearby-civilians-11557403411 https://www.wsj.com/articles/secret-u-s-missile-aims-to-kill...
  - qchris 6y ago
    In my (somewhat limited) experience, I'd be surprised is Boston Dynamics robots are, wholesale, on the list of export control. ITAR classification isn't usually an arbitrary designation, there's typically some aspect in particular that falls under the designation. For example, non-binary source code in the robots could have the potential for export control, but almost certainly not the physical robot itself. As an example of this, many autonomous underwater vehicles (AUVs) are subject to export control laws. This isn't just because they can be used in an explicitly military manner (one of the most common uses is minesweeping), but because the Inertial Navigation System they use while submerged has enough sensitivity to be export controlled, since that tech can be adapted to be used in missiles. So it's not the robot that's export controlled, but the INS system inside the robot. If you took that out, most of them could be sold wherever. I believe the same thing goes for a lot of satellite technology that's export controlled. The robots Boston Dynamics build seem to be solving a different problem, the (very hard) one of physical adaptive control in real-world environments, but imho what I've seen doesn't line up with what often seems to the reasoning for assigning an export control label, whether ITAR, EAR, or even CUI, to most of the technology.
- souprock 6y ago
  It's interesting to question the presumption that it is acceptable to sell a company in a way that gives foreign control. Not every country allows this. China is growing very well with it restricted.
luc_ 6y ago
To be fair, SoftBank is a Japanese bank with lots of Saudi money...
gkanai 6y ago
> I'm surprised the US allowed this, Boston Dynamics seems like the sort of company they would keep close to home. South Korea is a treaty ally with the US. The US has thousands of soldiers at bases in S. Korea. S. Korea is not a country the US has to worry about afaik. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutual_Defense_Treaty_(United_States%E2%80%93South_Korea) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutual_Defense_Treaty_(United_...
- elefanten 6y ago
  Counterpoint: Hyundai is not government-run and it seems to be comfortable doing business with China. [0] Wonder if China's gonna require any IP transfer? [0] https://roboticsandautomationnews.com/2020/04/21/hgzn-and-hyundai-robotics-to-build-smart-factory-to-manufacture-robots-in-china/31852/ https://roboticsandautomationnews.com/2020/04/21/hgzn-and-hy...
  - throwaway0a5e 6y ago
    >Wonder if China's gonna require any IP transfer? That'll go over like a lead balloon in Korea even more than the west.
    - elefanten 6y ago
      Hopefully. Not informed on how well that trick works on neighbors compared to the more distant suckers.
      - seanmcdirmid 6y ago
        China’s neighbors are generally more wary of it than other countries further way due to a less than peaceful history.
      - renewiltord 6y ago
        Neighbours are usually more wary of each other than they are of far away people. It's precisely because their interests conflict so much. Part of America's reason for success is her relative isolation.

nwsm 6y ago

What reason would there be to disallow it?

lemax 6y ago
National security, the Committee on Foreign Investment in the US (Cfius), has gone as far as requiring the repatriation of Grindr after it approved a deal for it to go to a Chinese company. https://www.ft.com/content/30408b0e-50e2-11e9-b401-8d9ef1626294 https://www.ft.com/content/30408b0e-50e2-11e9-b401-8d9ef1626... edit: not the FTC, it was Cfius
- rdsubhas 6y ago
  Hyundai is South Korean
kevin_thibedeau 6y ago
They've been kept afloat with a lot of DARPA funding. Not a good ROI for the taxpayer.
souprock 6y ago
ITAR or even classified The robots are practically weapons. Imagine the 4-legged one chasing you down like a large cat could, then pouncing on you. Imagine the 2-legged one with armor, relentlessly stalking you like Terminator.
- formerly_proven 6y ago
  Imagine getting blown up by a guided missile launched from a largely automated aircraft.
  - _jal 6y ago
    Or become a reporter and experience it for yourself. https://blogs.findlaw.com/dc_circuit/2020/11/doj-argues-us-can-kill-citizens-at-its-discretion-under-state-secrets-privilege.html https://blogs.findlaw.com/dc_circuit/2020/11/doj-argues-us-c...
  - magicsmoke 6y ago
    More likely to be a flying guillotine. https://www.wsj.com/articles/secret-u-s-missile-aims-to-kill-only-terrorists-not-nearby-civilians-11557403411 https://www.wsj.com/articles/secret-u-s-missile-aims-to-kill...
- qchris 6y ago
  In my (somewhat limited) experience, I'd be surprised is Boston Dynamics robots are, wholesale, on the list of export control. ITAR classification isn't usually an arbitrary designation, there's typically some aspect in particular that falls under the designation. For example, non-binary source code in the robots could have the potential for export control, but almost certainly not the physical robot itself. As an example of this, many autonomous underwater vehicles (AUVs) are subject to export control laws. This isn't just because they can be used in an explicitly military manner (one of the most common uses is minesweeping), but because the Inertial Navigation System they use while submerged has enough sensitivity to be export controlled, since that tech can be adapted to be used in missiles. So it's not the robot that's export controlled, but the INS system inside the robot. If you took that out, most of them could be sold wherever. I believe the same thing goes for a lot of satellite technology that's export controlled. The robots Boston Dynamics build seem to be solving a different problem, the (very hard) one of physical adaptive control in real-world environments, but imho what I've seen doesn't line up with what often seems to the reasoning for assigning an export control label, whether ITAR, EAR, or even CUI, to most of the technology.
souprock 6y ago
It's interesting to question the presumption that it is acceptable to sell a company in a way that gives foreign control. Not every country allows this. China is growing very well with it restricted.

luc_ 6y ago

To be fair, SoftBank is a Japanese bank with lots of Saudi money...

gkanai 6y ago

> I'm surprised the US allowed this, Boston Dynamics seems like the sort of company they would keep close to home. South Korea is a treaty ally with the US. The US has thousands of soldiers at bases in S. Korea. S. Korea is not a country the US has to worry about afaik. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutual_Defense_Treaty_(United_States%E2%80%93South_Korea) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutual_Defense_Treaty_(United_...

elefanten 6y ago
Counterpoint: Hyundai is not government-run and it seems to be comfortable doing business with China. [0] Wonder if China's gonna require any IP transfer? [0] https://roboticsandautomationnews.com/2020/04/21/hgzn-and-hyundai-robotics-to-build-smart-factory-to-manufacture-robots-in-china/31852/ https://roboticsandautomationnews.com/2020/04/21/hgzn-and-hy...
- throwaway0a5e 6y ago
  >Wonder if China's gonna require any IP transfer? That'll go over like a lead balloon in Korea even more than the west.
  - elefanten 6y ago
    Hopefully. Not informed on how well that trick works on neighbors compared to the more distant suckers.
    - seanmcdirmid 6y ago
      China’s neighbors are generally more wary of it than other countries further way due to a less than peaceful history.
    - renewiltord 6y ago
      Neighbours are usually more wary of each other than they are of far away people. It's precisely because their interests conflict so much. Part of America's reason for success is her relative isolation.