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US House passes federal cannabis decriminalisation bill
- nip180 6y ago2/3 of Americans support legalizing cannabis. I don’t understand why this bill is so bipartisan among politicians if so many citizens support it.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- farisjarrah 6y agoPrison Industrial Complex lobbying https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/04/28/how-for-profit-prisons-have-become-the-biggest-lobby-no-one-is-talking-about/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/04/28/...
- imglorp 6y agoDon't forget pharma [1]. Non-addictive pain management with fewer side effects is not in their interest. And similarly, the alcohol and tobacco industries. It's really never about morality. 1. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/07/13/one-striking-chart-shows-why-pharma-companies-are-fighting-legal-marijuana/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/07/13/one-s...
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- mumblemumble 6y agoWild accusation: Follow the money. There are a lot of people making a lot of money off of private prisons, generally in red states.
- claudeganon 6y agoAlcohol manufactures have also dumped massive amounts of money in lobbying against marijuana decriminalization because they don't want the competition.
- itronitron 6y agoAnd before that they went after Absinthe >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absinthe#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absinthe#History Absinthe makes you crazy and criminal, provokes epilepsy and tuberculosis, and has killed thousands of French people. It makes a ferocious beast of man, a martyr of woman, and a degenerate of the infant, it disorganizes and ruins the family and menaces the future of the country.
- ac29 6y agoPrivate prisons held only 8.2% of inmates in 2017, with many states having zero use at all. Looking at the map, it doesn't appear there is much of a divide between red and blue states in terms of likelihood to use private prisons, or the percentage of prisoners held in them. https://www.sentencingproject.org/publications/private-prisons-united-states/ https://www.sentencingproject.org/publications/private-priso...
- lhopki01 6y agoBecause Republicans don't need 50% of the support. They need way less because of imbalances built into the system. If your core support still does not support legalizing cannabis then it's not worth it to do it.
- CameronNemo 6y agoFor some hard numbers, as of 2018 15.95% of the US population lived in the 25 least populous states and elected half of the US Senate. To block an conviction of an impeached president or a constitutional amendment, only 34 senators (17 states) are needed. As of 2018, that was as little as 7.32% of the US population. If you care to do the math yourself, this is my source: https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_population https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_pop... And some python to help once you have lines to summarize: sum(map(float, open('foo').readlines()))
- mumblemumble 6y ago> For some hard numbers, as of 2018 15.95% of the US population lived in the 25 least populous states and elected half of the US Senate. Unless the Zetas have recently started moving into Wyoming, too, I'm guessing they're also the ones being least harmed by externalities from the war on drugs.
- CameronNemo 6y agoAmericans don't make laws (or approve judges), Senators do. <16% of the US population elects 50 senators.
- whythre 6y agoIt’s almost like the US is a representational republic, not a democracy.
- CameronNemo 6y agoI don't feel represented.
- chillwaves 6y agoThat's a clever turn of a phrase, but doesn't justify your position in any meaningful way. Can you tell me why it makes sense for so few people to dominate the wills of so many?
- fuzzer37 6y agoSomething something.... Land... something something... Coastal Elites...
- mmcconnell1618 6y agoThe problem isn't that we're a representative democracy. The problem is the ratio of representation is very far off from the ratios present when the country was formed. The population growth in urban centers combined with the addition of many states with low population has shifted power significantly to a minority. When the United States was formed and the compromise for 2 Senators per state and house representatives by population was agreed to, the largest state population was 11x the smallest state population. Today, California is 70x Wyoming. This has the effect that Senators from smaller states have way more power in today's world than they did in the 1800s. The ratios are unbalanced and need to be adjusted just like we adjust the apportionment of house representatives via the census every 10 years.
- pkulak 6y agoI assume you mean "partisan"? It's because the people who want it will still vote for you if you keep it criminalized. But a significant number of the ones who want it to stay criminalized will totally write you off if you decriminalize it. In the US, how motivated people are is usually even more important than how many of them there are. Combine that fact with the electoral college and gerrymandering, and there is a constant threat of minority rule. EDIT: Private prisons. Can't believe I forgot about that. Everyone else who replied has got the main reason nailed.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- dudul 6y agoIsn't it what "bipartisan" usually means? When both parties find common ground? I would expect most laws widely supported by the population to be part of a bipartisan situation.
- bryanlarsen 6y ago2/3rds of old white men don't support it, and that describes most politicians.
- nickysielicki 6y agoThere is just a lot of hand-wringing about the right way to do it. Both parties want to earmark the potential tax income for their special interests. Biden is pushing for meaningless rescheduling instead of outright legalization because those breaking federal drug laws are not legally allowed to own guns, and marijuana is the most used drug outside of alcohol in this country, and they like the way that plays out where millions of pot users have to choose between getting high and having their second amendment rights.
- throwaway122378 6y agoPositive but the Senate will reject it. Federal legalization is long overdue.
- ocdtrekkie 6y agoIn a very partisan vote that will not survive the Senate. Apart from virtue signalling, why bother? We are post election, so it doesn't even help us decide how to vote. Trying this after January at least might've made more sense. It's frustrating we see full House votes on pointless partisan efforts when there are issues like infrastructure that both parties could and should agree on and progress in.
- veritas3241 6y agoPretty sure they're doing this to entice people to vote in the Georgia runoffs so Dems will control the Senate. "Vote for us and we can make this law."
- SiFiPi 6y agoThis right here. It's literally this right here. So in other words, it's not pointless, it's political tactic. A good tactic to entice unlikely voters to vote Democrat.
- ocdtrekkie 6y agoI suppose this is reasonable, but then, why'd they wait until after the general?
- veritas3241 6y agoMultiple reasons, depending on your level of cynicism. Least cynical is that there were competing priorities in the general and the current President was (is) an overall distraction from any policy discussions. Most cynical is that Dems don't actually like winning because it gives them somebody to blame. Both are corporatist parties that don't generally work for the majority of people. But, like I said, that's the cynical take!
- dayofthedaleks 6y agoIn this case the virtue signalling has the potential of motivating voters to flip the senate via the Georgia runoffs or else in 2022.
- beervirus 6y agoWouldn't this be a surprising high note for Trump to go out on.
- res0nat0r 6y agoUnfortunately as of right now the Senate in no way is going to pass this bill or even bring it up for a vote. Who knows what may happen next month but it is DOA right now as it stands.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- meddlepal 6y agoIt won't pass the Senate floor. Absolutely pointless.
- paxys 6y agoIt will if Democrats win the Georgia races.
- meddlepal 6y agoUnlikely.
- minikites 6y agoThe Senate is an incredibly un-democratic institution and a truly massive barrier standing in the way of a functioning government. Mitch McConnell alone can dictate Senate business at his whims.
- t-writescode 6y agoIt is democratic, just not the sort one might expect. It’s a democracy of the states. That’s by design. The House is an approximate democracy of the people in the states (with some weighting so that the most populous states don’t have a complete monopoly) and the senate is a democracy of the states. Together they form an approximate republic of the country’s opinion... in an ideal world.
- door99 6y agoYeah, It’s a terrible design.
- nrclark 6y agoI could see that being true if we didn't have this two-party gridlock. In a world where D votes against R because "red team bad" and R votes against D because "blue team bad", it feels like we're watching our entire democracy erode away. One person shouldn't be able to unilaterally decide what will and won't be voted on, and shouldn't be able to tell half of the senate how they'll be voting if they want access to re-election funds. I don't know what the solution is, or who could implement one. But it's really hard to look at the last decade or two and claim that the senate is working as intended.
- seanieb 6y agoGreat to see the worsening COVID crisis getting the attention it deserves...
- throwaway6734 6y agoThey put off on voting on this before the election to focus on Covid legislation. The congress is more than capable of doing multiple things at once.
- minikites 6y agoIt's impossible to do more than one thing at a time?
- space_ghost 6y agoYup. The Senate is a Single Input Queue.
- nemothekid 6y agoThe house isn't the branch of government holding up the stimulus. McConnell has been sitting on a stimulus bill since July.
- mywittyname 6y agoThe government is capable of multi-tasking. There are talks going on for continuing stimulus. Vaccines are now approved by the CDC and will roll out shortly. Plus, state & local governments are continuing to provide updates on the status of their hospitals. COVID-19 is still a dedicated category on Google News, and other news sites. Nobody is ignoring it.
- frankbreetz 6y agoThe house passed covid relief bill in June and then again in October. What more do you want from them? It takes two to negotiate
- dragonwriter 6y ago
- dpflan 6y agoWithout knowing when the Senate will look at this and assuming after inauguration, I can see this as a carrot to get out youth vote in the upcoming Georgia senate run-off elections.
- kitotik 6y agoIt’ll be DOA at the senate.
- jadell 6y agoThe House has shown the ability to pass it, which means that if the Dems can flip the Senate (using the GA election), then the House can pass it again next session and have it go to a more favorable Senate. This was less about getting it through Mitch McConnell's Senate, and more about signaling voters: this is what we can do if it's no longer Mitch McConnell's Senate.
- huntermeyer 6y ago> It includes measures to expunge the federal criminal records of those charged or convicted for non-violent cannabis offenses I feel this line is what'll cause the bill to not pass in the Senate. I don't see why the removal of cannabis from the scheduled drugs list needs to be coupled with criminal record expungement. Do one. Then move to do the next. Is this how things are usually done?
- tnorthcutt 6y agoYes, often even intentionally to reduce the changes of a bill passing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrecking_amendment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrecking_amendment
- pwagland 6y agoI assume that you mean "reduce chances of the bill passing", adding this rider would increase the changes if the bill passes!
- tnorthcutt 6y agoAh yes, thank you!
- kortilla 6y ago> Is this how things are usually done? Yes, you pack the politically tenuous stuff in with the widely supported stuff so you put the opposing side in an optically bad position if they reject it. The headlines will be “Senate rejects marijuana decriminalization bill supported by majority of population” rather than “Senate rejects criminal record expungement”. Politics are fucked in this country.
- lotsofpulp 6y agoThe only thing messed up is that someone would consider expunging convictions from a law that violated people's freedom to consume a substance that does no harm to anyone else as "politically tenuous".
- frankbreetz 6y agoI know hn doesn't like politics, but it amazes me how popular one party's policies are(see polls for single payer healthcare, gov funded college, wealth tax, etc ), but it is still competitive. Republicans are certainly better at "politics". It will be fun to see how they spin this into the vague notion of socialism or somehow this is taking away your freedom.
- robotresearcher 6y ago> Republicans are certainly better at "politics". They don't need to be better to get their way. The US system gives rural areas disproportionate political power. Rural areas are less diverse, older, more religious, less educated and more conservative than the cities. The disproportionate influence was built in on purpose when the US was formed. Sparsely-populated states wouldn't agree to a union if populous New York was going to dominate all policy. There have always been arguments about the pros and cons.
- door99 6y ago> see polls for single payer healthcare, gov funded college, wealth tax, etc Except the Democrats don’t run on that. None of this was part of Biden’s campaign, in the primaries, only Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren ran on these issues, and Biden tried to distance himself as much as possible from them. I agree that if the Democrats ran on what you’re describing, they would do much better electorally, but most do not.
- boogies 6y ago> somehow this is taking away your freedom IIUC it could indirectly reduce some people’s freedom to live, because marijuana can impair driving but is harder to diagnose as the cause for accidents than alcohol — because tests only show whether it has been taken in the last few weeks, not whether the subject is intoxicated at the moment of the test. Please correct me if I’m wrong.
- lotsofpulp 6y agoAs could mobile phones, putting on make up, working a 24 hour shift at the hospital... In fact, all the things listed above make someone a far more dangerous driver than marijuana use. Yet working extra long hours and sleep deprivation in the name of "productivity" is celebrated.
- ahoy 6y agoThis means very little while the republicans control the senate, I imagine.
- free2OSS 6y agoThe timing here is awfully Political. I imagine Democrats wouldn't do this if they had control of the government. Seems like lip service to their bases.
- ble 6y agoIt would be a shame if politicians got some Politics in our politics. /s
- ceejayoz 6y ago> I imagine Democrats wouldn't do this if they had control of the government. Why not? It's already decriminalized in virtually the entire country. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_cannabis_by_U.S._jurisdiction#/media/File:Map_of_US_state_cannabis_laws.svg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_cannabis_by_U.S._j... 35 states have legalized it for medical use, and 15 have legalized it recreationally. From the map, it looks like Idaho stands alone on it being completely illegal and criminalized.
- free2OSS 6y agoBig policy changes spends your political capital. You are going to be getting angry phone calls. Better to get those angry phone calls in exchange for a spending bill that goes to your donors/constituents. Elections have razor thin margins. What benefit does the politician get?
- ceejayoz 6y ago> Big policy changes spends your political capital. That's the point, though. It's not a big policy change - the map demonstrates that. Decriminalization is already the de facto situation in nearly the entire country. Federal law with regards to marijuana is completely and openly ignored in much of the country. Dispensaries operate with relative impunity.
- bransonf 6y ago> not expected to advance further as long as the Senate remains in Republican hands. > “This legislation does not legalize cannabis across the country. It stops the federal government from interfering with what states have decided to do” In all seriousness, isn’t the Republican platform weaker central government? Why the exception?
- jliptzin 6y agoRepublicans don't actually stand for anything, other than "do the opposite of what Democrats want"
- bbrree66 6y agoWhat a pea brained response.
- justaman 6y agoComments like this add nothing. By this logic, the inverse is also true.
- stu2b50 6y agoNot really, the very idea of conservatism is based around not doing new things. Without passing judgement on whether or not that's a good policy standpoint, it's clear the parties are asymmetrical - one wants to pass new policies to change something , the other oppose that. The GOP policy website this election was literally copy pasted from 2016 - it infamously contained references to how they need to change things the incumbent president did.
- free2OSS 6y agoDemocrats want less tariffs? I would love a Neoliberal Democratic party.
- chillwaves 6y agoRepublicans literally did not run a platform in the year 2020. They did not have one. Democrats did. It's easy to say "both sides" but the facts don't match that platitude.
- mullingitover 6y agoThe fact that this won't sail through congress in a week (it'll never even come up for a vote in the senate) really illustrates how out of touch legislators are with voters. If there was a nationwide referendum on legalizing (not just decriminalizing) it would pass in a landslide today. Instead, congress will dither on this issue for probably the next five years at minimum. I realize it's more complicated than giving voters what they want. The US has flexed its policy muscles for the drug war for decades, and fully legalizing now would violate a number of important treaties with other countries. However, decriminalizing should be a no-brainer.
- grecy 6y ago> and fully legalizing now would violate a number of important treaties with other countries I'd be fascinated to know which countries. Obviously Mexico and Canada couldn't care less. Which other ones haven't already moved on?
- dragonwriter 6y ago> Which other ones haven't already moved on? Most of the countries in the world (some places still make posession of small quantities of cannabis a potentially-capital offense); the treaties involved are global drug-control treaties.
- C19is20 6y ago...but, but, but. I voted.
- titzer 6y agoWell, of course. They need the dithering to negotiate their payouts, situate their investments, and set up their grift schemes. Don't forget the fingerpointing, moral grandstanding, and endless media appearances, jockeying for the spotlight.
- curiousgeorgio 6y ago> ...illustrates how out of touch legislators are with voters. If there was a nationwide referendum on legalizing (not just decriminalizing) it would pass in a landslide today. In your own echo chamber, that may be true, but I hope you understand, there's a large number of voters (myself included) who oppose legalization. They may not be as vocal about it online, but their votes count just as much as yours.
- citilife 6y agoReally glad this passed, but we can't get COVID19 support and / or get some election reform. There is even have video evidence of illegally adding and counting votes... but oh no! Can't discuss how to improve that process... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKkheU5cy2E https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKkheU5cy2E Frankly, while I agree with the legislation, but the entire country is angry (one way or another). We should probably try to address the real issues.
- chillwaves 6y agoCOVID19 support just means stealing from taxpayers to line the pockets of the rich. As more information comes out, the scam will be more revealed but unfortunately we do not live in a country of educated voters. I don't care about COVID relief. If anything passes it will be a scam and no money for the taxpayers who fund it. https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/12/01/ppp-sba-data/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/12/01/ppp-sba-d... https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-jared-kushner-ppp-loan-coronavirus-b1765356.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politic... They are literally and blatantly robbing our country at this point, but the political institutions are too dysfunctional to do anything about it.