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EXoDOS: Collecting every game developed for DOS from original media
- LeoPanthera 6y agoMy biggest criticism of Exodos is that while it is from the original media, it is not the original media itself. They modify games for easy launching, often throwing away the installation files and other setup stuff. I prefer the philosophy of “TDC”, the Total DOS Collection, which in most cases is simply the original install media in a zip file.
- skissane 6y ago> I prefer the philosophy of “TDC”, the Total DOS Collection, which in most cases is simply the original install media in a zip file. Even better is to image the disks and provide a FAT file system image for each floppy disk.
- anyfoo 6y agoEven better is to create a kryoflux image, as that is not only disk format agnostic, but pretty much the most faithful digital preservation method we have right now.
- LeoPanthera 6y agoThe Kryoflux company claims ownership of all images created with Kryoflux hardware. To quote Internet Archive's Jason Scott, "I wouldn't use a Kryoflux to pry open my last can of beans." https://www.reddit.com/r/vintagecomputing/comments/buyj9f/til_that_computer_archivists_image_the_magnetic/epjwsut/ https://www.reddit.com/r/vintagecomputing/comments/buyj9f/ti... IA's Archive Team have guidance for anyone wanting to archive floppy disks: https://www.archiveteam.org/index.php?title=Rescuing_Floppy_Disks https://www.archiveteam.org/index.php?title=Rescuing_Floppy_... and optical discs: https://www.archiveteam.org/index.php?title=Rescuing_optical_media https://www.archiveteam.org/index.php?title=Rescuing_optical...
- burnte 6y agoUnfortunately copyright law doesn’t even remotely recognize that claim.
- LeoPanthera 6y agoWhether it does or doesn't, it's the attitude of the company that keeps me far, far away.
- burnte 6y agoAgreed,.
- skissane 6y agoEven if their claim is legally dubious, they may be inclined to try to legally enforce it through a lawsuit. Defending a lawsuit is an expense, hassle and risk that many people would rather avoid. That's why many would prefer to choose other products whose vendors don't even try to impose these kinds of conditions.
- burnte 6y agoAgreed.
- GreenHeuristics 6y agoI claim to own Iceland.
- mrmonkeyman 6y agoI am Iceland.
- bdowling 6y ago> The Kryoflux company claims ownership of all images created with Kryoflux hardware. From the links provided, the issue is regarding documentation of the image “flux” file format and the availability of software tools to manipulate the images. Jason Scott probably doesn’t want to use a proprietary format for archival of disk images, and that’s fine. For someone to say that Kyroflux is claiming ownership of images created by its customers, however, is just misleading.
- vaccinator 6y agowhy? that sounds ridiculous... original files should suffice.
- paulryanrogers 6y agoPossibly because of disc protection based on intentional 'bad' sectors or bytes?
- vaccinator 6y agoAnother area where pirated copies shine...
- anyfoo 6y agoBecause the assumption that software on floppy disks back then was entirely comprised of files in a normal FAT filesystem is wrong.
- skissane 6y agoAlso occasionally the original floppies contain interesting information in the unallocated space of the FAT filesystem – remnants of deleted files left over from the development process.
- LocalH 6y agoA file copy of the contents is not a preservation of the original media in its entirety. There might not even be any "files" to copy, depending on the platform (many Amiga games would bypass having a filesystem entirely and access data in a raw, direct manner). Working with disk images allows recovering "deleted" contents, or otherwise recovering data from "slack space" (say, if a file was edited and shortened, the data after the new end of the file in the final sector is likely still present).
- chungy 6y agoYeah that's something I noticed. No matter the claims of being from original media, that's the only thing I think is worthy of distribution.
- voltagex_ 6y agoIs TDC still around?
- ilaksh 6y agoYes on The Internet Archive.
- scintill76 6y ago> Striving to find original media rather than using scene rips. Wow, this is a weird point of pride. So, you’re making a new scene rip? Better to just give everyone an image of original media along with some patches if you want.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- canada_dry 6y agoQuite the extensive collection... hundreds of zipped game files. I've been searching for years to find an early multiplayer DOS lan game (~1990) that I believe was called 'Trek'. You separately controlled multiple ships to protect your base and attack others. It was basic ascii graphics but my friends & co-workers spent hours playing via local lan setup. Hoping it's in this collection!
- wernercd 6y agoTrek (1985)? https://www.mobygames.com/game/dos/trek https://www.mobygames.com/game/dos/trek http://exodos.the-eye.us/public/eXoDOS/Games/Trek%20%281985%29.zip http://exodos.the-eye.us/public/eXoDOS/Games/Trek%20%281985%...
- canada_dry 6y agoHot damn... yup!! Thank you. Such a great game for its time. Edit: it's modem <-> modem not LAN so a max of 2 human players. So I assume we were using null modems to play together in the same room. Seems likely that this Carlton McLawhorn [i] from Wendell NC is the author (and also an avid rocketeer and scoutmaster). [i] https://stricklandfuneral.com/carlton-carl-bruce-mclawhorn/ https://stricklandfuneral.com/carlton-carl-bruce-mclawhorn/
- djsumdog 6y agooh, I remember playing EGA Trek.
- ilaksh 6y agoHow large is the download?
- pcdoodle 6y agoKind of cool to know the bits are from the OG media.
- 0-_-0 6y agoWhat's the purpose of the !DOSmetadata.zip and XODOSMetadata.zip files taking up 18 GB each?
- Scaevolus 6y agoXODOSMetadata is all the images (box art, disc art, screenshots) and manuals associated with a game, so the launcher has all the assets necessary to provide its interface. !DOSMetadata is dosbox configurations and .bat files for running games. It could be much smaller and stream those dynamically, but the creator is more focused on the archival and preservation than optimizing the download size.
- flatiron 6y agoNext weeks goal is to setup ao486 on my MiSTER and see how well these remind me of my first computer (486 66dx2)
- mysterydip 6y agoThere's a few projects out there to "convert" the exodos config files to better work with the mister, might be worth checking out to save yourself some time/headache.
- WoodenChair 6y agoHow is this legal? Sincere question, since all (nearly all? perhaps a couple have been put into public domain) of these games are protected by copyright. And yes, it is hurting the copyright holder in many cases, because many of the titles are still sold through distribution sites like GOG.com. Some of these games are not even that old (<20 years). They have a DMCA page, but their philosophy seems to be "put it all out there and wait for the DMCA notices." Disingenuous at best since they must know ahead of time that they are violating a lot of IP. It's one thing to be against our global IP laws. It's another thing to flagrantly disregard them. You can be against something without violating it. How does archive.org get around this with their software collection?
- toomuchtodo 6y agoThere is an exception in the DMCA for abandonware [1] [2], and anything DMCAd (legitimately) will be darked (remove from public availability, but still stored) until abandonware again. This seems more fair than having to obtain specific clearance for every work that may fall under copyright (Project Gutenberg has had to tolerate doing this for decades [3]). > You can be against something without violating it. Off topic: Civil disobedience is non violently disobeying unjust laws. Copyright law has become too draconian and infringes on the public good, therefore some don’t respect it. This doesn’t mean content creators shouldn’t get paid. Disclaimer: No affiliation with the Internet Archive. Words and thoughts are my own. [1] https://toucharcade.com/2015/10/29/new-dmca-exemption-takes-pity-on-abandonware-and-archivists/ https://toucharcade.com/2015/10/29/new-dmca-exemption-takes-... [2] https://copyright.gov/1201/2015/fedreg-publicinspectionFR.pdf https://copyright.gov/1201/2015/fedreg-publicinspectionFR.pd... [3] http://copy.pglaf.org/ http://copy.pglaf.org/
- TimTheTinker 6y ago> Civil disobedience is non violently disobeying unjust laws. It's worth noting that in the United States, a lot of civil disobedience that has happened, and is happening now, is built on legal reasoning that the unjust laws in question are also unconstitutional, since our constitution explicitly grants many rights to US citizens. This also affords a way to commit civil disobedience in good conscience for those whose religion or personal convictions forbid disobedience to civil authority.
- emmanueloga_ 6y agoKind of crazy to think in the thousands of man hours involved in old software products. These products generated millions (billions?) of dollars and impacted the life of so many people, only to be available for free now, only just a few decades ... isn't this kind of thing unique of the software craft?
- dewitt 6y agoPublic libraries have been a thing since the 1800's, which are equally amazing in terms of bringing tremendous impact to millions of people who wouldn't have otherwise had that benefit. The key different of course is that mid-80's DOS software is more-or-less obsolete and abandoned for a reason (the computer history community notwithstanding, of which I'm a part), whereas public libraries are filled with books that still retain almost as much value as they day they were written.
- iso1210 6y ago> only to be available for free now Not legally. I doubt very much the copyright holders of all of these games have allowed their use in this manner.
- harel 6y agoI actually gasped when I spotted a game I made in the 90s in there (text adventure). Then I gasped again when I noticed how big that archive is...
- travbrack 6y agoThis reminded me of a story I read once upon a time where someone found a game online they wrote 20 years earlier. The thing that was weird about it was that they only shared it with their cousin. I can't find the story now. Anyone know what I'm talking about?
- bagpuss 6y agohttps://mobile.twitter.com/rickbrewpdn/status/1210023029087985664 https://mobile.twitter.com/rickbrewpdn/status/12100230290879... The Golden Flute 4 was the name of the game
- dvasdekis 6y agoMacaw45 is an awesome streamer generally, with an unparalleled knowledge of retro games. Check him out!
- PTOB 6y agoMight be a good moment to pass on this coming rebuild of X-Wing, XWVM[0], that's in the offing. It uses the original game files and audio but is built on a modern 3D engine. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqWo9FNiidE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqWo9FNiidE
- paulryanrogers 6y agoGreat. Now I just need to find some patches to add an easy mode. That game was brutal.
- djsumdog 6y agoThere was an old Japanese game I found on a BBS. It was a side scrolling (left to right I think) shooter (like Raptor, but left/right) and the graphics felt very anime. I think it was VGA/DOS. There's no way I can possibly look it up because it was entirely in Japanese. I have no idea what it could have been called. I don't remember the name of the ZIP file either.
- throwtown2 6y agoRangerfox? Edit: Oh I now see that it had an English release. The version I had was Japanese or Korean and was tricky to navigate the menus. Still it was fairly animeish and had a cool soundtrack from what I remember
- StanislavPetrov 6y agoAwesome project, definitely going to grab the file. Did anyone else think of Ultima 3 when they went to their page? https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61%2Bvy7oGONL.jpg https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61%2Bvy7oGO...
- trackofalljades 6y agoIs there a reason this needs to exist, as opposed to the massive collections already congealing at The Internet Archive? Is there some deficiency in those collections that makes this superior?
- apetresc 6y agoThe ROMs on Archive.org are largely pulled from eXo's collection anyway. The main value that eXo's collection adds is the custom DosBox tuning for each individual title. The Archive.org JS-based runner doesn't come close, most titles there barely run at all, let alone with hand-tuned configurations and metadata.
- koenigdavidmj 6y agoSort of off topic, but I recall a DOS game my dad played that was kind of like a Roguelike but with rudimentary top-down graphics, where you explored a castle. Anyone know what it is?
- hosh 6y agoHmm, I almost want to say zzt but it is not procedurally generated or used sprites. Nahklah was a favorite of mine, but it is not procedurally generated either.
- HideousKojima 6y agoThe Castle of the Winds, maybe? It was a fairly popular shareware title
- Exmoor 6y agoTechnically that game was Win 3.1, not DOS (although Win 3.1 ran on top of DOS, so...). Still a very fun game and my first exposure to RPGs.
- nfirvine 6y agoCastle Adventure? https://archive.org/details/msdos_Castle_Adventure_1984 https://archive.org/details/msdos_Castle_Adventure_1984 That's how I learned to spell the word "necklace"
- unixhero 6y agoPost this question to /r/tipofmyjoystick , they will know
- juststeve 6y agoit might be Mystic Towers?
- 29athrowaway 6y agoA DOSBox emulator question... If I run a DOS MZ executable infected with a virus that attempts to flash my BIOS, will that affect the host computer?
- midwestemo 6y agoAre you talking about CIH? Anyways it could damage your system on dosbox as dosbox has your files mounted a drive so it could wipe that. Virtual machines are the best way to go. Either way it will not affect the BIOS as most boards are UEFI
- 29athrowaway 6y agoBut CIH infects PE executables not MZ executables right?
- midwestemo 6y agoOh, didn't see that. You're correct
- thristian 6y agoNo: - A program running inside DOSBox sees the DOSBox BIOS, not the host computer's BIOS - Even the host computer's BIOS was visible, the host computer's OS is responsible for preventing random programs (including DOSBox) from poking directly at hardware - I'm pretty sure DOS viruses generally predate flashable BIOS, and even if there was a DOS virus that tried to flash your BIOS, it wouldn't know what to do with a modern UEFI setup
- cjones26 6y agoIt's missing "Pickle Wars"!
- banana_giraffe 6y agoI always felt the "Golden Age" of DOS games was 90-95, this archive at least mostly agrees with that feeling, which is interesting to me: https://imgur.com/a/gfO19Nt https://imgur.com/a/gfO19Nt The outliers are interesting to me too: Adventureland (1978) Beneath Apple Manor (1978) Pirate Adventure (1978) Mission Impossible (1979) Dungeons of Noudar 3D (2018) Encroaching Gloom, The (2018) MagiDuck (2018) Planet X3 (2018) Sigil (2019) I've heard of a couple of 'em.
- xhrpost 6y agoThis is what is amazing, you can't answer the question "what was the last DOS game made?" because people are still making DOS games [1]. Thanks for posting this, will certainly check some of these out. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSKeWH4TY9Y&t=8s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSKeWH4TY9Y&t=8s
- paulryanrogers 6y agoI'd interpret the question as last (mainstream) DOS game made. As in sold in retailers and therefore somewhat known. And IME it's probably the WWII shooter that used Build engine.
- banana_giraffe 6y agoThis indirectly reminds me of this youtube video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHQ4WCU1WQc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHQ4WCU1WQc It's a long one, but it tries to answer when the first video game was made. Most of it, though, is trying to figure out what it means to be a video game in the first place. Sometimes really the trouble with the question is the lack of precision in the definitions involved.
- headstorm 6y agoAdventureland, Pirate Adventure, and Mission Impossible were text adventures by Scott Adams - http://www.msadams.com/ http://www.msadams.com/ .
- needle0 6y ago> eXoDOS is an attempt to catalog, obtain, and make playable every game developed for the DOS and PC Booter platform > The focus is on games that were either released in English Oh. So not "every game" at all.
- Viliam1234 6y agoI understood it that their goal is to collect all games, but English ones are a priority.
- unixhero 6y agoI absolutely love ExoDos. It's done so much to fill my MSDOS collection, that I am actually done with collecting MSDOS software :) ExoDos version 4 is incredible. What's also really nice is the catalog they made for it: http://exodos.the-eye.us/public/eXoDOS%20Catalog.pdf http://exodos.the-eye.us/public/eXoDOS%20Catalog.pdf
- chooban 6y agoWonderful! This has let me confirm my 30+ year grudge that the game Osbit is bloody difficult!
- Randor 6y agoHmmm, Does anyone know if those games come with the manual? In the 1980's DRM was implemented something like "What is the third word in paragraph 3 on page 14 of the manual?" I see several games in there that I remember having this type of protection.
- juangacovas 6y agoThey talk about that on readme/manual
- doublerabbit 6y agoReminds me of those 5001 DOS game demo disks you could buy cheaply at markets. Good times.