5 ms·

There's been a lot of talk about antitrust investigations and regulating big tech. I think one really useful step would be to require multiple methods of authen

There's been a lot of talk about antitrust investigations and regulating big tech. I think one really useful step would be to require multiple methods of authentication with devices like this. Oculus shouldn't require a Facebook account to use.

mtmail 6y ago
That might already be the reason why the Oculus is not available in Germany and Belgium https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24375652 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24375652
tomc1985 6y ago
How about, no authentication to use the device and an open platform of app stores and/or sideloading?
- swiley 6y ago
  Why do "apps" even need to be installed on it. Isn't it just a sensor array and a couple of displays? I used to think everyone should learn a programming language just so they can experience its expressive power but more and more I wish they would so they wouldn't get duped by really dumb marketing.
  - MadWombat 6y ago
    Because Quest 2 is a stand-alone VR headset. It is not a display device for a computer, it is an all-in-one. So you install games on it to play them.
  - ZitchDog 6y ago
    The camera based tracking is a marvel of modern engineering. Making something seem simple is really really hard.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- vaxman 6y ago
  good idea...but less profitable, though Facebook will continue to track these "banned" users as they roam around the network and trade on their information anyway.
  - tomc1985 6y ago
    So sick of "but that's less profitable"... these companies should exist to serve their customers, not shareholders
    - wraithy 6y ago
      I'm not sure if you're serious about this, but it seems very short sighted. If this were the case, I don't think the word "company" would still apply. However, capitalism doesn't leave consumers with no options - vote with your wallet!
      - tomc1985 6y ago
        So you're saying that modern capitalism has completely supplanted the original reason for starting a company in the first place? I did not write what I wrote as a parody. Shareholder primacy is the foremost blight on this modern existence and is responsible for an innumerably large portion of the negative externalities that cause so such much suffering today. I would vote with my wallet, but that will accomplish exactly jack shit. There are few who will stand with me if it means threatening their pathetically precious creature comforts which our modern capitalism so dutifully provides. Also, it is worth noting that the entire goal of capitalism is to eliminate those options, using "free-market economics" as cover for its seemingly insatiable lust for competitors to gobble up or otherwise drive out of business. Some of the very first things they teach you in b-school, about moat building and competitive advantages and all that other crap, is an outright attack on the marketplace model
      - TomSwirly 6y ago
        > However, capitalism doesn't leave consumers with no options - vote with your wallet! That really works with monopolies! /sarcasm /are-you-serious
DebtDeflation 6y ago
It seems like they're pushing FB as an authentication method for everything. Try and comment on a local news article (yeah, I know) and it wants to authenticate you with your FB account. Same thing with trying to buy something from a small independent web vendor. "Log in with your Facebook account" is becoming the default everywhere and it sucks.
- alexchantavy 6y ago
  FB sounds like it's trying to be an multinational version of WeChat by becoming the operating system of life. There are many cultural reasons why this is feasible in China but not in the US (and many other places)
  - selestify 6y ago
    What are these cultural reasons?
    - warent 6y ago
      I'd guess for starters that an extreme authoritarian centralized state is already normalized in China. USA is creeping that direction but there's still a ways to go
  - chrischen 6y ago
    Facebook sounds more like the communist party, where they are requiring your real name, web activity, or get banned and have all your things taken away (Oculus usage, paid apps, can’t message friends, etc).
- OkGoDoIt 6y ago
  I agree that’s not a great state to be in, but think about it from that locals new org’s point of view: comment spam is a major and hard-to-solve problem, and by tying commenting to the real-world identity and enforcement of bots that Facebook provides, the news organizations get to solve that thorny problem for free. Plus news orgs are already using FB to syndicate/share, so it’s really a no-brained for them. I wonder what the world would look like with a independent, trustworthy, non-advertising-based company/organization which provided a similar anti-spam service for free, with the option to publicly tie to verified identities as well. (For all the flack that real-name policies get, they do reduce spam and hate speech by a big margin, so any service which doesn’t verify identity isn’t really a drop-in replacement for FB as far as that news org is concerned)
amelius 6y ago
I think we need full separation of hardware and software. One company makes the hardware, others make the software. And let's not forget that it was like this for a long time (IBM+clones vs Microsoft, OS/2, Linux).
- analog31 6y ago
  Today, the distinction between hardware and software is murky. Hardware can't even be tested without co-development of software. Even making these things happen in separate departments of the same business, by people who eat lunch together, is inefficient when trying to move fast and create new things. I often have hardware and software development tools open on my computer at the same time.

mtmail 6y ago

That might already be the reason why the Oculus is not available in Germany and Belgium https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24375652 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24375652

tomc1985 6y ago

How about, no authentication to use the device and an open platform of app stores and/or sideloading?

swiley 6y ago
Why do "apps" even need to be installed on it. Isn't it just a sensor array and a couple of displays? I used to think everyone should learn a programming language just so they can experience its expressive power but more and more I wish they would so they wouldn't get duped by really dumb marketing.
- MadWombat 6y ago
  Because Quest 2 is a stand-alone VR headset. It is not a display device for a computer, it is an all-in-one. So you install games on it to play them.
- ZitchDog 6y ago
  The camera based tracking is a marvel of modern engineering. Making something seem simple is really really hard.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
vaxman 6y ago
good idea...but less profitable, though Facebook will continue to track these "banned" users as they roam around the network and trade on their information anyway.
- tomc1985 6y ago
  So sick of "but that's less profitable"... these companies should exist to serve their customers, not shareholders
  - wraithy 6y ago
    I'm not sure if you're serious about this, but it seems very short sighted. If this were the case, I don't think the word "company" would still apply. However, capitalism doesn't leave consumers with no options - vote with your wallet!
    - tomc1985 6y ago
      So you're saying that modern capitalism has completely supplanted the original reason for starting a company in the first place? I did not write what I wrote as a parody. Shareholder primacy is the foremost blight on this modern existence and is responsible for an innumerably large portion of the negative externalities that cause so such much suffering today. I would vote with my wallet, but that will accomplish exactly jack shit. There are few who will stand with me if it means threatening their pathetically precious creature comforts which our modern capitalism so dutifully provides. Also, it is worth noting that the entire goal of capitalism is to eliminate those options, using "free-market economics" as cover for its seemingly insatiable lust for competitors to gobble up or otherwise drive out of business. Some of the very first things they teach you in b-school, about moat building and competitive advantages and all that other crap, is an outright attack on the marketplace model
    - TomSwirly 6y ago
      > However, capitalism doesn't leave consumers with no options - vote with your wallet! That really works with monopolies! /sarcasm /are-you-serious

DebtDeflation 6y ago

It seems like they're pushing FB as an authentication method for everything. Try and comment on a local news article (yeah, I know) and it wants to authenticate you with your FB account. Same thing with trying to buy something from a small independent web vendor. "Log in with your Facebook account" is becoming the default everywhere and it sucks.

alexchantavy 6y ago
FB sounds like it's trying to be an multinational version of WeChat by becoming the operating system of life. There are many cultural reasons why this is feasible in China but not in the US (and many other places)
- selestify 6y ago
  What are these cultural reasons?
  - warent 6y ago
    I'd guess for starters that an extreme authoritarian centralized state is already normalized in China. USA is creeping that direction but there's still a ways to go
- chrischen 6y ago
  Facebook sounds more like the communist party, where they are requiring your real name, web activity, or get banned and have all your things taken away (Oculus usage, paid apps, can’t message friends, etc).
OkGoDoIt 6y ago
I agree that’s not a great state to be in, but think about it from that locals new org’s point of view: comment spam is a major and hard-to-solve problem, and by tying commenting to the real-world identity and enforcement of bots that Facebook provides, the news organizations get to solve that thorny problem for free. Plus news orgs are already using FB to syndicate/share, so it’s really a no-brained for them. I wonder what the world would look like with a independent, trustworthy, non-advertising-based company/organization which provided a similar anti-spam service for free, with the option to publicly tie to verified identities as well. (For all the flack that real-name policies get, they do reduce spam and hate speech by a big margin, so any service which doesn’t verify identity isn’t really a drop-in replacement for FB as far as that news org is concerned)

amelius 6y ago

I think we need full separation of hardware and software. One company makes the hardware, others make the software. And let's not forget that it was like this for a long time (IBM+clones vs Microsoft, OS/2, Linux).

analog31 6y ago
Today, the distinction between hardware and software is murky. Hardware can't even be tested without co-development of software. Even making these things happen in separate departments of the same business, by people who eat lunch together, is inefficient when trying to move fast and create new things. I often have hardware and software development tools open on my computer at the same time.