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Until you need to haul 6 kids, or three bikes, or furniture, or hone remodeling supplies from Home Depot, etc. Cars aren’t sized to our average use case, they

Until you need to haul 6 kids, or three bikes, or furniture, or hone remodeling supplies from Home Depot, etc. Cars aren’t sized to our average use case, they they are sized to frequent use cases. I’m getting tired of the “all I need is a tiny tin box thus so should you” crowd.

stephencanon 6y ago
The only one of those that requires a large car is six kids (which is pretty rare). Bike racks work great on small cars. Home Depot delivers. I rent a van or truck to move furniture the one time a year I need to do it. Most people who drive a giant SUV absolutely do not need one.
- valuearb 6y ago
  No one needs a car at all. We could live like hermits in the woods and go back to hunting and gathering. But if you live in the real world, why not drive a car that makes it easier to do all the things you want to do, if it’s easily affordable?
  - Dylan16807 6y ago
    Thanks for the slippery slope, but they're saying that it barely makes it easier. So the question is how much money you want to spend on that barely.
    - stephencanon 6y ago
      Or alternatively, how much nicer of a car would you like to have for the same money? Most large SUVs are not well-constructed, nor are they much fun to drive. They’re just big. My smallish wagon does everything a typical family (2 adults, 2 kids, dog) has a regular need for (heck, I carry trees and 2x12s and gravel in it, which is more than most people need). On the rare occasion that I’m buying furniture and they don’t deliver or whatever, I rent a van. As a result, my day-to-day driving experience is infinitely more pleasant.
    - valuearb 6y ago
      No the question is why are you hectoring other people with different use cases for how they choose to drive their cars?
      - Dylan16807 6y ago
        The comment of yours that I replied to was in response to someone whose first sentence is an acknowledgement that the use case of 6 kids does need such a car. Then they suggest that the other use cases are valid but people like them don't need such a car despite those use cases. How did you interpret that as "hectoring other people with different use cases"??
pfranz 6y ago
That's a specific (I think over represented) use-case. When I had my first kid I considered something large. Looking around I saw people buy large cars after having their first kid and by the time they needed it (driving around friends, hockey equipment, etc) it was 5-7 years old and probably getting swapped out anyway. I'm happy I switched to a 4-door and went with a smaller car. I can carry much more and longer lumber using a roof rack on top of a subcompact than I can inside a larger vehicle. If I need something larger I rent it or have it delivered. Using a bike rack outside the car is much easier than storing it inside. For road trips I'm pretty sure I've seen its cheaper to rent something instead of putting miles on your daily vehicle--so you get a nicer car that's more appropriately sized. The average number of kids in the US is 1.9 and the median age interval is 2-3 years. That's not that many years of carrying around kids and their gear; one, maybe two cars in a lifetime. On the other hand, so many Americans drive by themselves, long distances, every day, in giant cars. A lot of people like larger cars because it makes them "feel safe." Or people buy the largest vehicle they can "just in case." I was taken aback when I found out about 10 years when a friend had to run his credit card twice to fill up because it capped the sale at $50 and when gas prices went up he couldn't fill his tank for that. I feel like I'm the weirdo in the US for preferring smaller cars. I couldn't stand poor pickup of fleet vehicles a decade ago, but as long as they have decent pickup I really love the maneuverability, the ease of parking in smaller spots, and the mileage of a smaller car.
throwaway0a5e 6y ago
>Until you need to haul 6 kids, or three bikes, or furniture, or hone remodeling supplies from Home Depot, etc. Station wagon with a roof rack can do any two of those things at once. And I say this as someone who also owns a minivan and a couple trucks. I actually prefer station wagons for hauling sheet material that's too long or wide to fit flat in a pickup bed because it's less of a pain to deal with strapping it to a roof rack than any of the other options. The problem with this approach is that despite the fact that modern vehicles can support thousands of pounds on (or in) the passenger cabin and that modern air suspension and dynamic shocks (as found on many higher trim SUVs these days) would be fine with the extra weight) it is not socially acceptable (and social norms are very much defined by vocal minorities) to use vehicle at 110% their capacity if you can reasonably avoid to. Imagine the "think of the children" themed hate you'd get if you posted a picture of a Mercedes wagon hauling 300lb of I-beam on the roof or a minivan hauling a ton of paver bricks or a bunch of people crammed into a Honda Fit for a road trip. That's why we can't made do with less.
- itsoktocry 6y ago
  >Station wagon with a roof rack can do any two of those things at once. Most roof racks have a capacity of 100-150lbs. You certainly aren't hauling plywood or furniture on your roof.
- valuearb 6y ago
  What’s a “station wagon”? They are called “SUVs” today Mr Griswold.
  - formerly_proven 6y ago
    Audi station wagons are probably the single most common company car in Germany. Much more fun to drive than any SUV for sure. A lot of the arguments here read like people want an SUV that will fit all the stuff you'd normally just use a trailer for, like moving furniture or a bunch of lumber. This seems very odd to me.
    - valuearb 6y ago
Componica 6y ago
We discovered, after accidentally having twins and bumping the kids count to 3, a typical sedan cannot physically carry more than two children because you cannot fit 3 or more child seats in the back as required by law. That's why families of 3 or more kids have minivans. It's not like the 80s where you toss the kids in a station wagon and let them wander in the back, they are required to be in massive padded seats.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- 1123581321 6y ago
  Chicco infant and EvenFlo little and big boosters will get you to three in a back row. Use a seatbelt extender or two to make buckling easier. Not taking away from your point, because parents absolutely prefer two to a row, just helping anyone who happens to read this.
- nawitus 6y ago
  Families of 3 also have e.g. station wagons. Big sedan should be fine seating-wise too.
Ericson2314 6y ago
Suburbia has made parents lives needlessly miserable with extra kid hauling. For the other rare occasions, rent a bigger vehicle. The idea that we need to clog the roads to prepare for that 2/y errand is also ridiculous. > I’m getting tired of the “all I need is a tiny tin box thus so should you” crowd. I don't care to tell people what they need, but I do want my public space back. Car owner's aggregate decisions absolutely do effect personally and the commons so they have no right to hide behind that shield.
- valuearb 6y ago
  Bigger cars don’t “clog” the roads. Their impact on car spacing is minor.
  - Ericson2314 6y ago
    Among the options in the US, but vehicles like this really do.

stephencanon 6y ago

The only one of those that requires a large car is six kids (which is pretty rare). Bike racks work great on small cars. Home Depot delivers. I rent a van or truck to move furniture the one time a year I need to do it. Most people who drive a giant SUV absolutely do not need one.

valuearb 6y ago
No one needs a car at all. We could live like hermits in the woods and go back to hunting and gathering. But if you live in the real world, why not drive a car that makes it easier to do all the things you want to do, if it’s easily affordable?
- Dylan16807 6y ago
  Thanks for the slippery slope, but they're saying that it barely makes it easier. So the question is how much money you want to spend on that barely.
  - stephencanon 6y ago
    Or alternatively, how much nicer of a car would you like to have for the same money? Most large SUVs are not well-constructed, nor are they much fun to drive. They’re just big. My smallish wagon does everything a typical family (2 adults, 2 kids, dog) has a regular need for (heck, I carry trees and 2x12s and gravel in it, which is more than most people need). On the rare occasion that I’m buying furniture and they don’t deliver or whatever, I rent a van. As a result, my day-to-day driving experience is infinitely more pleasant.
  - valuearb 6y ago
    No the question is why are you hectoring other people with different use cases for how they choose to drive their cars?
    - Dylan16807 6y ago
      The comment of yours that I replied to was in response to someone whose first sentence is an acknowledgement that the use case of 6 kids does need such a car. Then they suggest that the other use cases are valid but people like them don't need such a car despite those use cases. How did you interpret that as "hectoring other people with different use cases"??

pfranz 6y ago

That's a specific (I think over represented) use-case. When I had my first kid I considered something large. Looking around I saw people buy large cars after having their first kid and by the time they needed it (driving around friends, hockey equipment, etc) it was 5-7 years old and probably getting swapped out anyway. I'm happy I switched to a 4-door and went with a smaller car. I can carry much more and longer lumber using a roof rack on top of a subcompact than I can inside a larger vehicle. If I need something larger I rent it or have it delivered. Using a bike rack outside the car is much easier than storing it inside. For road trips I'm pretty sure I've seen its cheaper to rent something instead of putting miles on your daily vehicle--so you get a nicer car that's more appropriately sized. The average number of kids in the US is 1.9 and the median age interval is 2-3 years. That's not that many years of carrying around kids and their gear; one, maybe two cars in a lifetime. On the other hand, so many Americans drive by themselves, long distances, every day, in giant cars. A lot of people like larger cars because it makes them "feel safe." Or people buy the largest vehicle they can "just in case." I was taken aback when I found out about 10 years when a friend had to run his credit card twice to fill up because it capped the sale at $50 and when gas prices went up he couldn't fill his tank for that. I feel like I'm the weirdo in the US for preferring smaller cars. I couldn't stand poor pickup of fleet vehicles a decade ago, but as long as they have decent pickup I really love the maneuverability, the ease of parking in smaller spots, and the mileage of a smaller car.

throwaway0a5e 6y ago

>Until you need to haul 6 kids, or three bikes, or furniture, or hone remodeling supplies from Home Depot, etc. Station wagon with a roof rack can do any two of those things at once. And I say this as someone who also owns a minivan and a couple trucks. I actually prefer station wagons for hauling sheet material that's too long or wide to fit flat in a pickup bed because it's less of a pain to deal with strapping it to a roof rack than any of the other options. The problem with this approach is that despite the fact that modern vehicles can support thousands of pounds on (or in) the passenger cabin and that modern air suspension and dynamic shocks (as found on many higher trim SUVs these days) would be fine with the extra weight) it is not socially acceptable (and social norms are very much defined by vocal minorities) to use vehicle at 110% their capacity if you can reasonably avoid to. Imagine the "think of the children" themed hate you'd get if you posted a picture of a Mercedes wagon hauling 300lb of I-beam on the roof or a minivan hauling a ton of paver bricks or a bunch of people crammed into a Honda Fit for a road trip. That's why we can't made do with less.

itsoktocry 6y ago
>Station wagon with a roof rack can do any two of those things at once. Most roof racks have a capacity of 100-150lbs. You certainly aren't hauling plywood or furniture on your roof.
valuearb 6y ago
What’s a “station wagon”? They are called “SUVs” today Mr Griswold.
- formerly_proven 6y ago
  Audi station wagons are probably the single most common company car in Germany. Much more fun to drive than any SUV for sure. A lot of the arguments here read like people want an SUV that will fit all the stuff you'd normally just use a trailer for, like moving furniture or a bunch of lumber. This seems very odd to me.
  - valuearb 6y ago

Componica 6y ago

We discovered, after accidentally having twins and bumping the kids count to 3, a typical sedan cannot physically carry more than two children because you cannot fit 3 or more child seats in the back as required by law. That's why families of 3 or more kids have minivans. It's not like the 80s where you toss the kids in a station wagon and let them wander in the back, they are required to be in massive padded seats.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
1123581321 6y ago
Chicco infant and EvenFlo little and big boosters will get you to three in a back row. Use a seatbelt extender or two to make buckling easier. Not taking away from your point, because parents absolutely prefer two to a row, just helping anyone who happens to read this.
nawitus 6y ago
Families of 3 also have e.g. station wagons. Big sedan should be fine seating-wise too.

Ericson2314 6y ago

Suburbia has made parents lives needlessly miserable with extra kid hauling. For the other rare occasions, rent a bigger vehicle. The idea that we need to clog the roads to prepare for that 2/y errand is also ridiculous. > I’m getting tired of the “all I need is a tiny tin box thus so should you” crowd. I don't care to tell people what they need, but I do want my public space back. Car owner's aggregate decisions absolutely do effect personally and the commons so they have no right to hide behind that shield.

valuearb 6y ago
Bigger cars don’t “clog” the roads. Their impact on car spacing is minor.
- Ericson2314 6y ago
  Among the options in the US, but vehicles like this really do.