11 ms·

I really love the quote at the end: > I'm a dad who is happy to have his daughter and fiancé living with me. They pay the utilities and make me nice meals, and

I really love the quote at the end: > I'm a dad who is happy to have his daughter and fiancé living with me. They pay the utilities and make me nice meals, and it makes it a lot less lonely here. ... I like the multi-generational thing. I know it won't last forever, but it makes life better for now. It's so easy to get into that cold statistical mindset about these large-scale trends, but it's good to remember that these statistics are the aggregation of a large number of very human stories.

throwaway2048 6y ago
Now imagine all the human stories that are forced into this situation that aren't heartwarming.
- eternalban 6y ago
  You mean all the entirely predictable situations, like guaranteed increase in sexual abuse and domestic violence? When this genius plan was announced in late winter, I couldn't help but think of all those poor souls who lost whatever safe space (school, library, job, whatever) they had that kept them away from an abusive person in their lives, who were now together 24/7 under psychological and economic stress. Of course, the spirit of moderation requires that we consider both criminal incompetence as well as sociopaths with grand visions for the "betterment" of humanity and our planet, as an explanation as to how we ended up like this. [p.s. one fine day, the internets will unequivocaly sing the same song, with not a single person suffering from misunderstandings. That fine day, HN will do away with anonymous downvotes, since we will be in a state of perfect harmony.]
  - hunter-gatherer 6y ago
    I'm not sure why you were down-voted so much. There are real negative consequences for a State-wide lockdown that aren't immediately as obvious and the consequences of not locking down. I'm curious how in depth that analysis/discussion was, or if everything has been just knee-jerk reactions to the latest news and data points.
    - lazyasciiart 6y ago
      I'm a foster parent and have seen a lot of the discussion and tweaks among CPS and social workers in my state because of that. A shit ton of analysis and discussion has gone into every step here. People who act like they are the first person to ever think of the downsides to a lockdown are just not relevant.
tanilama 6y ago
I agree. I don't like what the title tries to suggest that living with your parents is something wrong/abnormal? Why is that? I understand for many it is not a choice, but it doesn't necessarily meaning people are suffering as a result.
- mandelbrotwurst 6y ago
  The American status quo is based on around individual independence and for better or for worse anything that moves away from that is considered a regression.
  - 1DRACOSEA8 6y ago
    Not enough butt sniffing nor use of the hacker newss innuendo and nuance glossary and vocabulary of success, but in four sentences you complete my: we are by de facto a third world shit hole. Dare I say you sound like a commoner, aka a non hacker news poster who, god forbid, made perfect sense without the innuendo or the nuance. But by all means, chastise my moniker for speaking sense to a bunch of pamperered boot camp JavaScript noobies.
- stinkytaco 6y ago
  Though I agree that it's not wrong or abnormal (at least for most of the world), in this context it represents a pretty large economic step backwards. There was a time in most middle aged people's memories where starting a career, affording a house and starting a family were all realistic goals in your twenties. Now that's not possible for many, even as economic indicators like GPD, the stock market, inflation, etc. improve. This statistic simply reflects a growing income inequality and corresponding quality of life decrease.
  - paulryanrogers 6y ago
    I doubt think this has been true for most of history. Rather usually one lived and worked the farm with the family. Then it got subdivided as more children survived childhood, at least until the birth rate declined. There has been golden eras, usually from expansion or industrialization where youths could acquire their own places relatively young. But it doesn't scale forever.
kelnos 6y ago
It's also useful to note that the "nuclear family" is a very Western thing, and the US takes it to an extreme. In other parts of the world it's abnormal for adults in their 20s to be living anywhere but with their parents, often even with a fiance or new spouse in the mix. The idea that having a multi-generational household means that the younger members haven't "grown up" and need to "learn to live on their own" is a completely manufactured attitude. I think many American families would have much stronger, more healthy inter-generational relationships if we lived together (at least for a bit) as adults. As it is now, most US kids leave home just when they're starting to be able to meaningfully contribute to the household as equals. (Having said that, I definitely feel the pull of childhood and societal expectations. When I was a new adult I was thrilled to be out of my parents' house, and could never have imagined moving back there. I'm nearly 40 now, and thinking about the possibility of living in my parents' house during my 20s still feels weird to me.)
- AStrangeMorrow 6y ago
  Even though I agree it is more of a western thing, I would argue it is also maybe more of a "recent" / urban trend. I am originally from rural Western Europe and a few years ago grandparents, parents and kids all in the same house was still a common sight. I would agree that people look for more independence these days but I feel like in some places it is still fairly recent.
- ip26 6y ago
  It's not all dumb cultural expectations. It's hard to chase opportunity & follow the work if you don't leave home.
- tuna-piano 6y ago
  While it's true this seems like a strong US thing, I haven't heard many happy long-term stories of folks living intergenerationally. In my experience (talking to people from a variety of countries), most couples in their 20s/30s want their own place (even in the countries where it's not common). It seems it can even lead to happier intergenerational relationships when the roomate-type fights don't need to happen. It would seem to me that it's most common in the US to move out because they can afford to... The US is just an incredibly rich place, even compared to much of western Europe (ex. the US has 40% more GDP per capita than France[1]) There are of course also family/social pressures in some places, but I really don't think it's the primary factor in the differences between many countries. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)...
rayiner 6y ago
Coronavirus ironically has been great for family bonding for us. We spend half our time at my parents house (who live 10 minutes away). Between four adults it’s much easier to take care of the kids, and my parents are retired and love the company. And we also enjoy spending time with them: I’ve gotten to talk to them much more than I have in a decade.
morgtheborg 6y ago
Agreed. I moved back in with my Dad with my husband. I'm 32, hubby is 30. He had two strokes and my little sister didn't want to be the only one nearby. It's been 6 months. Is it the easiest? No. But it's amazing to have this day-in-day-out time with my Dad again after not having lived at home for years. My older sister moved back in with her husband and two kids for 2 months as she studied for her medical school USMLE exams so she could take advantage of the free baby-sitting. Neither my sister's family or my own would've made this decision without the pandemic. My husband and I were both pushed remote (same salary) and my sister's child care plans went up in smoke. While 2020 has been shit, moving home in some cases isn't an indicator of a problem. It's just a smart reaction to the new reality of working from home.
tharne 6y ago
I have friend who immigrated to the U.S. when he was in his teens. After graduating college and finding a good job, he went to get a roommate and move out. His parents were horrified. "Why are you going to move out of your family's house so you can pay money to live with strangers you found on the internet?". At first we all laughed because it seemed like a case of immigrant parents no getting how things worked here, but the more we all thought about it, the more the parents seemed to make an excellent point, and one none of us had really considered. Not sure when families living together became a sign of failure rather than a sign of a close family.
Lammy 6y ago
That’s cool and all except the part where it’s literally illegal to build housing suited to this arrangement in many places, like in the majority of the land area of San Francisco: https://sf-planning.org/sites/default/files/FileCenter/Documents/5358-Residential%20Standards%20Summary%20Table.pdf https://sf-planning.org/sites/default/files/FileCenter/Docum...

throwaway2048 6y ago

Now imagine all the human stories that are forced into this situation that aren't heartwarming.

eternalban 6y ago
You mean all the entirely predictable situations, like guaranteed increase in sexual abuse and domestic violence? When this genius plan was announced in late winter, I couldn't help but think of all those poor souls who lost whatever safe space (school, library, job, whatever) they had that kept them away from an abusive person in their lives, who were now together 24/7 under psychological and economic stress. Of course, the spirit of moderation requires that we consider both criminal incompetence as well as sociopaths with grand visions for the "betterment" of humanity and our planet, as an explanation as to how we ended up like this. [p.s. one fine day, the internets will unequivocaly sing the same song, with not a single person suffering from misunderstandings. That fine day, HN will do away with anonymous downvotes, since we will be in a state of perfect harmony.]
- hunter-gatherer 6y ago
  I'm not sure why you were down-voted so much. There are real negative consequences for a State-wide lockdown that aren't immediately as obvious and the consequences of not locking down. I'm curious how in depth that analysis/discussion was, or if everything has been just knee-jerk reactions to the latest news and data points.
  - lazyasciiart 6y ago
    I'm a foster parent and have seen a lot of the discussion and tweaks among CPS and social workers in my state because of that. A shit ton of analysis and discussion has gone into every step here. People who act like they are the first person to ever think of the downsides to a lockdown are just not relevant.

tanilama 6y ago

I agree. I don't like what the title tries to suggest that living with your parents is something wrong/abnormal? Why is that? I understand for many it is not a choice, but it doesn't necessarily meaning people are suffering as a result.

mandelbrotwurst 6y ago
The American status quo is based on around individual independence and for better or for worse anything that moves away from that is considered a regression.
- 1DRACOSEA8 6y ago
  Not enough butt sniffing nor use of the hacker newss innuendo and nuance glossary and vocabulary of success, but in four sentences you complete my: we are by de facto a third world shit hole. Dare I say you sound like a commoner, aka a non hacker news poster who, god forbid, made perfect sense without the innuendo or the nuance. But by all means, chastise my moniker for speaking sense to a bunch of pamperered boot camp JavaScript noobies.
stinkytaco 6y ago
Though I agree that it's not wrong or abnormal (at least for most of the world), in this context it represents a pretty large economic step backwards. There was a time in most middle aged people's memories where starting a career, affording a house and starting a family were all realistic goals in your twenties. Now that's not possible for many, even as economic indicators like GPD, the stock market, inflation, etc. improve. This statistic simply reflects a growing income inequality and corresponding quality of life decrease.
- paulryanrogers 6y ago
  I doubt think this has been true for most of history. Rather usually one lived and worked the farm with the family. Then it got subdivided as more children survived childhood, at least until the birth rate declined. There has been golden eras, usually from expansion or industrialization where youths could acquire their own places relatively young. But it doesn't scale forever.

kelnos 6y ago

It's also useful to note that the "nuclear family" is a very Western thing, and the US takes it to an extreme. In other parts of the world it's abnormal for adults in their 20s to be living anywhere but with their parents, often even with a fiance or new spouse in the mix. The idea that having a multi-generational household means that the younger members haven't "grown up" and need to "learn to live on their own" is a completely manufactured attitude. I think many American families would have much stronger, more healthy inter-generational relationships if we lived together (at least for a bit) as adults. As it is now, most US kids leave home just when they're starting to be able to meaningfully contribute to the household as equals. (Having said that, I definitely feel the pull of childhood and societal expectations. When I was a new adult I was thrilled to be out of my parents' house, and could never have imagined moving back there. I'm nearly 40 now, and thinking about the possibility of living in my parents' house during my 20s still feels weird to me.)

AStrangeMorrow 6y ago
Even though I agree it is more of a western thing, I would argue it is also maybe more of a "recent" / urban trend. I am originally from rural Western Europe and a few years ago grandparents, parents and kids all in the same house was still a common sight. I would agree that people look for more independence these days but I feel like in some places it is still fairly recent.
ip26 6y ago
It's not all dumb cultural expectations. It's hard to chase opportunity & follow the work if you don't leave home.
tuna-piano 6y ago
While it's true this seems like a strong US thing, I haven't heard many happy long-term stories of folks living intergenerationally. In my experience (talking to people from a variety of countries), most couples in their 20s/30s want their own place (even in the countries where it's not common). It seems it can even lead to happier intergenerational relationships when the roomate-type fights don't need to happen. It would seem to me that it's most common in the US to move out because they can afford to... The US is just an incredibly rich place, even compared to much of western Europe (ex. the US has 40% more GDP per capita than France[1]) There are of course also family/social pressures in some places, but I really don't think it's the primary factor in the differences between many countries. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)...

rayiner 6y ago

Coronavirus ironically has been great for family bonding for us. We spend half our time at my parents house (who live 10 minutes away). Between four adults it’s much easier to take care of the kids, and my parents are retired and love the company. And we also enjoy spending time with them: I’ve gotten to talk to them much more than I have in a decade.

morgtheborg 6y ago

Agreed. I moved back in with my Dad with my husband. I'm 32, hubby is 30. He had two strokes and my little sister didn't want to be the only one nearby. It's been 6 months. Is it the easiest? No. But it's amazing to have this day-in-day-out time with my Dad again after not having lived at home for years. My older sister moved back in with her husband and two kids for 2 months as she studied for her medical school USMLE exams so she could take advantage of the free baby-sitting. Neither my sister's family or my own would've made this decision without the pandemic. My husband and I were both pushed remote (same salary) and my sister's child care plans went up in smoke. While 2020 has been shit, moving home in some cases isn't an indicator of a problem. It's just a smart reaction to the new reality of working from home.

tharne 6y ago

I have friend who immigrated to the U.S. when he was in his teens. After graduating college and finding a good job, he went to get a roommate and move out. His parents were horrified. "Why are you going to move out of your family's house so you can pay money to live with strangers you found on the internet?". At first we all laughed because it seemed like a case of immigrant parents no getting how things worked here, but the more we all thought about it, the more the parents seemed to make an excellent point, and one none of us had really considered. Not sure when families living together became a sign of failure rather than a sign of a close family.

Lammy 6y ago

That’s cool and all except the part where it’s literally illegal to build housing suited to this arrangement in many places, like in the majority of the land area of San Francisco: https://sf-planning.org/sites/default/files/FileCenter/Documents/5358-Residential%20Standards%20Summary%20Table.pdf https://sf-planning.org/sites/default/files/FileCenter/Docum...