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Emacs is not a text editor, it's a platform independent VM which can run your scripts with a text UI. E.g. do you want keep an eye on some information which ca

Emacs is not a text editor, it's a platform independent VM which can run your scripts with a text UI. E.g. do you want keep an eye on some information which can be fetched from the net? You just write a script which regularly fetches the info and puts it into a buffer, so you can take a look at it anytime, and then regardless of platform you have that info readily available just by installing your own emacs config file. It's much easier to write such things in emacs than curating various different scripts in various languages (python, etc.) which all require their specific support which is either available or not.

andreareina 6y ago
We've been joking about emacs being an OS for a long time. And it even reads email (still haven't set that up actually...)
- konjin 6y ago
  You can post on hacker news from it too. Sent from eww.
  - jimmyvalmer 6y ago
    Or Gnus. Sent from nnhackernews
    - mrspeaker 6y ago
      There's also a pretty nifty dedicated hackernews-mode. Sent from `M-x hackernews`.
      - jimmyvalmer 6y ago
        That mode is rubbish. You can't reply nor vote, requires manual syncing, and renders stories as links rather jumping directly to the story.
- kalleboo 6y ago
  Emacs is a great OS, just lacking a decent text editor
jeromenerf 6y ago
> t's much easier to write such things in emacs than curating various different scripts in various languages (python, etc.) which all require their specific support which is either available or not. Not in my experience. I much prefer to use the simpler acme / plan9 way, where I am free to use the language I prefer or that is better suited for the job. Same for vscode, atom, etc. Vim and neovim are halfway between these extremes and I would say easier to bend towards acme than towards emacs. That being said, I use org mode because it’s great, thanks to emacs capabilities. I would however also much prefer org mode if it was an external pandoc-like program, usable from anything.
- pmoriarty 6y ago
  I never got the appeal of acme. It's way too mouse-oriented for me.
roydivision 6y ago
> It's much easier to write such things in emacs than curating various different scripts in various languages (python, etc.) which all require their specific support which is either available or not. I disagree. I’ve been using Unix/Linux for 25 years, I’ve met maybe 1 or two people who know or use Emacs, whereas almost everyone knows enough to do some scripting. I’m also guessing that installing and configuring Emacs is way more work than installing Python. And any gained Python knowledge will pay you back tenfold more than learning Emacs.
- dmortin 6y ago
  I meant the case when you have to use an other machine and naturally emacs users want to use emacs even there, so that's given. But on Windows, for example, python may not be installed, so that's an extra install, while if you have your usual scripts in emacs then it's just a matter of installing one's emacs config which one does anyway. I use python too when it's the less hassle. E.g. when parsing a page with BeatifulSoup which would be more cumbersome in emacs without BeautifulSoup.
  - RMPR 6y ago
    > But on Windows, for example, python may not be installed Actually Python is not a very good example since Windows now includes python and python3 commands by default[0] 0: https://devblogs.microsoft.com/python/python-in-the-windows-10-may-2019-update/ https://devblogs.microsoft.com/python/python-in-the-windows-...
    - OrderlyTiamat 6y ago
      Actually it's a great example, because regardless of what microsoft says, it doesn't actually include python, just an empty executable that exits and tells you to download python from the windows store. You have to manually fix you path to get that folder out if you want to download it through some other way, too.
- indymike 6y ago
  Honestly, getting going with emacs: $ sudo apt install emacs $ emacs From there it's learning some keystrokes. Payback? Almost immediate. And you can use it to work with Python, or any other language. After that, maybe reading a couple of howtos and installing a few add-on packages and customizing your configuration. Payback? Almost immediate. It's really productive.
chrisseaton 6y ago
> Emacs is not a text editor https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/ https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/: > [Emacs is] an extensible, customizable, free/libre text editor — and more
- GavinMcG 6y ago
  Emacs saying it's a text editor doesn't make it a text editor any more than Amazon saying it's a bookseller would make it a bookseller. Emacs-as-platform long ago overtook Emacs-as-text-editor.
justaj 6y ago
I don't know. People keep saying that Emacs can work nice in terminals, but there's a specific bot-macro in the #emacs channel on Freenode: <user>: ,terminal fsbot [->] I heard terminals are [0] Terminals do weird thing to your keyboard input: http://catern.com/posts/terminal_quirks.html fsbot [1] Terminals have limitations compared to the graphical windows; it's advisable to use "graphical" Emacs unless one has a good reason not to. See ,betterdefaults for disabling scroll bars, tool bars, etc. fsbot [2] https://garbagecollected.org/2017/01/31/four-column-ascii/ ;;[ ,more / ,dump]
- Kaze404 6y ago
  As an evil mode user, the keyboard input thing doesn't really affect me. That lets me use emacs on the terminal when I'm away from my computer no problem.
- pmoriarty 6y ago
  Yes, there are many GUI Emacs fans on #emacs, and one of them obviously happened to set up this bot message. But not everyone agrees that GUI Emacs is better. Though terminals definitely have their quirks and limitations, they have some advantages over GUI Emacs. For example, I have my Emacs configuration geared towards terminal use, and use it from within tmux. Because of this I never have to fear losing my Emacs session because X froze or crashed (which has happened from time to time). I can also use Emacs configured the way I like it even before X has started, and on remote systems without X (for which I don't like to use TRAMP mode because it also has the potential to freeze up). By running Emacs in a terminal under tmux, I also don't have to mentally context-switch between the terminal and a separate GUI Emacs session. I have not been satisfied with any of Emacs' terminal modes, tough I have heard that libvterm is a lot better, so I might give it another go, though even if it's great at terminal emulation there are some other issues with running a terminal from within Emacs which may be insurmountable[1]... which leads me to the next point... With Emacs running under tmux in a terminal rather than the other way around, I never have to fear losing all of my terminal sessions when Emacs freezes or crashes (which has also happened from time to time). By contrast, tmux is super stable, and I've never once had it freeze or crash, so I can 100% rely on it to keep my terminal sessions running no matter what. [1] - Running a terminal under Emacs (even if it's a proper terminal like libvterm) has the issue of conflicting keybindings. I already have both Emacs keybindings and tmux keybindings that I have to make sure don't conflict, but if I add to those keybindings for any app I happen to run under a terminal under Emacs then there are bound to be way more conflicts. Of course, it's possible to require some extra keystroke to be pressed before sending on a raw keystroke to the terminal app, but that's just too painful for me to bother with except maybe under special circumstances. In the general case I prefer to have my shells running directly under tmux than in an Emacs terminal.

andreareina 6y ago

We've been joking about emacs being an OS for a long time. And it even reads email (still haven't set that up actually...)

konjin 6y ago
You can post on hacker news from it too. Sent from eww.
- jimmyvalmer 6y ago
  Or Gnus. Sent from nnhackernews
  - mrspeaker 6y ago
    There's also a pretty nifty dedicated hackernews-mode. Sent from `M-x hackernews`.
    - jimmyvalmer 6y ago
      That mode is rubbish. You can't reply nor vote, requires manual syncing, and renders stories as links rather jumping directly to the story.
kalleboo 6y ago
Emacs is a great OS, just lacking a decent text editor

jeromenerf 6y ago

> t's much easier to write such things in emacs than curating various different scripts in various languages (python, etc.) which all require their specific support which is either available or not. Not in my experience. I much prefer to use the simpler acme / plan9 way, where I am free to use the language I prefer or that is better suited for the job. Same for vscode, atom, etc. Vim and neovim are halfway between these extremes and I would say easier to bend towards acme than towards emacs. That being said, I use org mode because it’s great, thanks to emacs capabilities. I would however also much prefer org mode if it was an external pandoc-like program, usable from anything.

pmoriarty 6y ago
I never got the appeal of acme. It's way too mouse-oriented for me.

roydivision 6y ago

> It's much easier to write such things in emacs than curating various different scripts in various languages (python, etc.) which all require their specific support which is either available or not. I disagree. I’ve been using Unix/Linux for 25 years, I’ve met maybe 1 or two people who know or use Emacs, whereas almost everyone knows enough to do some scripting. I’m also guessing that installing and configuring Emacs is way more work than installing Python. And any gained Python knowledge will pay you back tenfold more than learning Emacs.

dmortin 6y ago
I meant the case when you have to use an other machine and naturally emacs users want to use emacs even there, so that's given. But on Windows, for example, python may not be installed, so that's an extra install, while if you have your usual scripts in emacs then it's just a matter of installing one's emacs config which one does anyway. I use python too when it's the less hassle. E.g. when parsing a page with BeatifulSoup which would be more cumbersome in emacs without BeautifulSoup.
- RMPR 6y ago
  > But on Windows, for example, python may not be installed Actually Python is not a very good example since Windows now includes python and python3 commands by default[0] 0: https://devblogs.microsoft.com/python/python-in-the-windows-10-may-2019-update/ https://devblogs.microsoft.com/python/python-in-the-windows-...
  - OrderlyTiamat 6y ago
    Actually it's a great example, because regardless of what microsoft says, it doesn't actually include python, just an empty executable that exits and tells you to download python from the windows store. You have to manually fix you path to get that folder out if you want to download it through some other way, too.
indymike 6y ago
Honestly, getting going with emacs: $ sudo apt install emacs $ emacs From there it's learning some keystrokes. Payback? Almost immediate. And you can use it to work with Python, or any other language. After that, maybe reading a couple of howtos and installing a few add-on packages and customizing your configuration. Payback? Almost immediate. It's really productive.

chrisseaton 6y ago

> Emacs is not a text editor https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/ https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/: > [Emacs is] an extensible, customizable, free/libre text editor — and more

GavinMcG 6y ago
Emacs saying it's a text editor doesn't make it a text editor any more than Amazon saying it's a bookseller would make it a bookseller. Emacs-as-platform long ago overtook Emacs-as-text-editor.

justaj 6y ago

I don't know. People keep saying that Emacs can work nice in terminals, but there's a specific bot-macro in the #emacs channel on Freenode: <user>: ,terminal fsbot [->] I heard terminals are [0] Terminals do weird thing to your keyboard input: http://catern.com/posts/terminal_quirks.html fsbot [1] Terminals have limitations compared to the graphical windows; it's advisable to use "graphical" Emacs unless one has a good reason not to. See ,betterdefaults for disabling scroll bars, tool bars, etc. fsbot [2] https://garbagecollected.org/2017/01/31/four-column-ascii/ ;;[ ,more / ,dump]

Kaze404 6y ago
As an evil mode user, the keyboard input thing doesn't really affect me. That lets me use emacs on the terminal when I'm away from my computer no problem.
pmoriarty 6y ago
Yes, there are many GUI Emacs fans on #emacs, and one of them obviously happened to set up this bot message. But not everyone agrees that GUI Emacs is better. Though terminals definitely have their quirks and limitations, they have some advantages over GUI Emacs. For example, I have my Emacs configuration geared towards terminal use, and use it from within tmux. Because of this I never have to fear losing my Emacs session because X froze or crashed (which has happened from time to time). I can also use Emacs configured the way I like it even before X has started, and on remote systems without X (for which I don't like to use TRAMP mode because it also has the potential to freeze up). By running Emacs in a terminal under tmux, I also don't have to mentally context-switch between the terminal and a separate GUI Emacs session. I have not been satisfied with any of Emacs' terminal modes, tough I have heard that libvterm is a lot better, so I might give it another go, though even if it's great at terminal emulation there are some other issues with running a terminal from within Emacs which may be insurmountable[1]... which leads me to the next point... With Emacs running under tmux in a terminal rather than the other way around, I never have to fear losing all of my terminal sessions when Emacs freezes or crashes (which has also happened from time to time). By contrast, tmux is super stable, and I've never once had it freeze or crash, so I can 100% rely on it to keep my terminal sessions running no matter what. [1] - Running a terminal under Emacs (even if it's a proper terminal like libvterm) has the issue of conflicting keybindings. I already have both Emacs keybindings and tmux keybindings that I have to make sure don't conflict, but if I add to those keybindings for any app I happen to run under a terminal under Emacs then there are bound to be way more conflicts. Of course, it's possible to require some extra keystroke to be pressed before sending on a raw keystroke to the terminal app, but that's just too painful for me to bother with except maybe under special circumstances. In the general case I prefer to have my shells running directly under tmux than in an Emacs terminal.