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The tech industry is rife with drinking culture and alcoholism in general. I do not drink, and I frequently feel isolated as a result, both at business and soci
by wildrhythms 6y ago
The tech industry is rife with drinking culture and alcoholism in general. I do not drink, and I frequently feel isolated as a result, both at business and social gatherings. 30+ year old colleagues will demand a reason for why I don't drink, as if I'm the one engaging in exclusionary behavior :(
- zelly 6y agoIn a few years that will be upgraded to cannabis smoking and you'll be gatekeeped out if you're not down with the herb.
- lotsofpulp 6y agoI’ve never been implored to smoke marijuana by any people smoking marijuana. They are also far more pleasant to be around than drunk people, with zero chance of violent outbursts.
- brightball 6y agoI do drink but never much. I’ve always found just having something in hand that looks like a drink will prevent most of what you describe though. Tonic water with lime on ice is popular to fit the “just so it looks like I’m drinking” need.
- monadic2 6y agoI’ve had to push for non-alcoholic entertainment at every company I’ve worked at. I understand the value of happy hour wholeheartedly, but encouraging your employees to drink at work at your workplace is downright creepy.
- microcolonel 6y ago> ...encouraging your employees to drink at work at your workplace is downright creepy. How is encouraging your employees to drink at your workplace creepy of all things?
- RodgerTheGreat 6y agoA manager offering an employee amphetamines to improve their performance is unethical, and extremely creepy. A manager encouraging employees to take up smoking to fit in better with their coworkers is unethical, and extremely creepy. A manager encouraging employees to consume alcohol at work in order to foster team building is not fundamentally different than either of the above, it's just milder and deeply entrenched by convention as socially acceptable behavior.
- hombre_fatal 6y agoI drink in general, yet at work gatherings with alcohol I stick to sparkling water. I'm approaching my mid-30s and never had anyone "encourage" me to put the water down and suck on a beer. Nor do I think wheeling a keg into the office is the same as a manager encouraging you to drink. You definitely stand out when you're in a drinking context and your hands are in your pockets. There's something that can feel distrustful about that in some scenarios. I'd encourage non-drinkers to at least learn to play along and have some beverage in their hand. A lot of our creep-detector software seems to kick in when someone isn't playing along with social ritual, and complaining that you have to play along doesn't really serve you. They're just basic social skills.
- sukilot 6y agoTo recap: there's nothing creepy about bullying people into drinking -- pretending to drink if they must! -- to prove their loyalty to the group, and despite the fact that should be common knowledge for everyone, you've never seen it happen?
- atq2119 6y agoThis discussion is absurd even on a linguistic level. If you have a glass of water in your hand, you are drinking. Maybe you're not drinking alcohol, but calling it "pretending to drink" is just silly.
- DonHopkins 6y ago
- aerovistae 6y agoI don't drink either and have had similar experiences as the parent comment, but "creepy"? What?
- monadic2 6y agoWhat part do you find confusing? You forgot to explain your confusion, sorry! Edit: apparently I‘ve been rate-limited by HN’s anti-spam techniques, so I can’t comment further for a few hours, but encouraging employees to ingest a drug, especially at a workplace, especially a drug that makes people more susceptible to manipulation, doesn’t seem to square with any good-faith interaction between a company and its employees. The point of throwing a party with alcohol at the workplace seems to be an effort to throw money at employment satisfaction, but extremely cheaply and to no positive material effect for the employees. Why not just give the money spent on the party to employees and organize off-site as “normal” people uninhibited by corporate values? Well, that doesn’t benefit anyone BUT employees. I’ve been to a fair number of off-campus celebrations, lunches, dinners, events, etc and the atmosphere is greatly relaxed and more respectful for it.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- hombre_fatal 6y ago"Creepy" means everything these days and you'll find people invoking it for everything. A guy dating a woman five years younger than him? "Creepy". Wheeling a keg into an office on Friday? "Creepy". Approaching the opposite sex? "Creepy". So I think you'll send a clearer message to explain what you mean instead of leaving it up to everyone's interpretation of the word "creepy". Edit: To respond to your edit, I can see how you can think something like that. But at the same time, alcohol is also an effective age-old mechanism for social bonding, and social bonding is important at a workplace. I think there's a certain cynicism in looking at social drinking at the workplace as some manipulation-play that errs into the side of unreasonableness. I, myself, often opt out with a sparkling water, yet I think the ritual is useful to really meet and befriend others at work. The nice thing about our drinking rituals is that they are inherently social. We don't need to go to some contrived "team building" activity. And it's effective to get people to talk to each other in a way that "Okay everyone, it's social time! Get chattin'!" just isn't. Alcohol definitely has its downsides. It's unhealthy. It can get people to make fools of themselves. It can make people aggressive. For sure, these are problems. But I wouldn't so quickly dismiss the upsides. Some social drinking can make things possible that I'm not even sure how to replicate without it, like getting people to actually open up and be real with one another. There's something to say about that that isn't just negative. Just like I don't think the workplace is optimal when we're all just impersonal professional drones who never really get to know the real human behind our coworkers.
- rlt 6y agoWhat do you mean by “non-alcoholic entertainment”? Events where alcohol isn’t present?
- MattGaiser 6y agoI just say “health concerns” and leave it at that.
- QuixoticQuibit 6y agoI feel this is true with adult life in general. Drinking and going to bars is always the default social activity, particularly for young adults.
- fireattack 6y agoI agree. I feel like tech industry in this regard probably is below the average of all professions.
- sneak 6y agoI am always surprised when people feel like you have to drink if you go hang out in bars. Order a coke and some cheese sticks and hang out with your drunk friends, it’s not an issue.
- zelly 6y agoI think being sober around drunk people is like going to a naked beach with your clothes on. It just doesn't feel right, and if you don't want to drug yourself up then you shouldn't want to be around people who are.
- Jach 6y agoIt won't feel right if you're trying to fit in the same way, because you fundamentally are lacking the necessary attributes to do so (drunkeness, lack of clothes), but that doesn't matter if you don't feel a need to fit in. If you have any interest in people-watching, or perhaps one might call such interests anthropologist tendencies, things are fine. Observe, interact and join conversation or events as you please. Besides, most people are multi-dimensional, even if you don't fit in on this thing, you might fit in on another axis. Why are you even with the group to begin with? Focusing on that will be more important for social bonding than focusing on joining or not in alcoholic drinks.
- voidpointercast 6y agoOr just abstain from groups, but that comes with its own costs
- airstrike 6y agoI just ask for a glass of wine and essentially hold it the whole night
- duopixel 6y agoThis is perhaps the most effective thing to do, and yet we don't do it because deep down we want people to respect our choice to refuse to drink.
- toastal 6y agoI've done it before when offered/given, but I'm not gonna buy a $10 glass of wine as prop just to fit in.
- vijayr02 6y agoHeh I have a funny story on this: My buddy (non-drinker at the time) had a job that required him to grease the wheels with clients and a major lubricant was alcohol. He came up with an idea: cranberry juice in a wine glass Everything seemed to be going swimmingly well, till one of the senior clients came up to him and whispered in his ear: "it works better if you don't put ice cubes in there" :) Anyway, he started drinking pretty quickly after and hasn't looked back since.
- mmmpetrichor 6y agoI don't think its specific to tech. It's cultural. For instance, I think the oil/gas industry is even more alcohol soaked. For what it's worth, I work for a large tech company and have never felt like I had to drink to be part of the culture.
- grawprog 6y agoWorking in general is alcohol soaked in our culture. All over the world. Working people drink together. Alcohol has been marketed so heavily in all cultures for so long, and by so long i mean since beer was safer to drink than water, like pretty much since we invented fermentation, other than some brief puritan periods, alcohol it has been a huge part of human culture. If you stop to think for a bit, how many wars, how many disasters how many deaths, conflicts and other terrible things in human history that's happened, where alcohol may not have been a direct factor, but the people doing these things probably drank regularly. Alcohol is this strange partially acknowledged influence over so much of human culture and history, it's mindboggling when you start to really consider it.
- Dylan16807 6y agoSo we're talking about situations where it's not particularly a positive or negative influence, just an influence? You could make similar arguments for a lot. How many times have indoor toilets changed the world through the butterfly effect? I doubt it's a small number.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- qchris 6y agoThere's a piece of dialogue from a show I really like which has stuck with me for years. --- Person 1: "Is everyone out here really so lifeless?" Person 2: "Yes. Yes we are. That's why we drink." Person 1: "Well, I drank just fine before." Person 2: "Yeah, because your world was so overwhelming and scary and you needed a break from it all. Now, you're going to drink because each day is so goddamn dull, and that takes a lot more booze." (Edit: formatting)
- innocenat 6y agoThis. Fortunately, "I am allergic to alcohol" always work. (Not sure if I have one -- I do have some allergic-like reaction to alcohol when I was a child, but I am not going to risk it)
- jimbob45 6y agoI’m always happy when people get mad that I don’t drink because it usually means they’ve never met an alcoholic whose life has been ruined by the bottle and that’s happy to me. Of course, they should know better than to ask the guy with an extremely addictive personality type who has played more WoW than hours they’ve ever spent watching TV. But hey, the world must be becoming a better place if fewer people know how bad addiction can be :)
- war1025 6y agoI don't get pressed about it often, but usually when people ask why I don't drink, I just say that I have poor self control and all my memories with alcohol end in vomiting. If they push it further than that, I tell them I have family with addiction issues and don't want to risk it.
- bawolff 6y agoOr they have an acohol problem and by not drinking you're un-normalizing alcohol consumption and making them feel self-concious of their faults so they lash out to distract from that. No idea if that's a true thing that happens, but that is definitely the sterotype of people who want everyone to drink.
- sdigital 6y agoThat's exactly it. My line is "no thanks, it's my least favorite drug"... you'll get some interesting reactions to that one.
- bawolff 6y agoAncedotal, but my experience has been that the tech industry is more understanding of not drinking as a choice than society at large. Of course, different companies have wildly different cultures
- kube-system 6y agoThis is also my experience, but I’ve always worked with pretty down to earth people. The better leaders I’ve worked under have made it a point to always ask new employees if they would prefer any non-alcoholic options in particular before any events, rather than assuming.
- hkmurakami 6y agoThat’s unfortunate. “I have a liver condition” could work. Kind of like wearing a wedding ring to prevent unwanted advances in the work place.
- katzgrau 6y agoOr just tell them the long and thoughtful truth on why you don't drink in detail. Mental clarity, avoidance of toxins, better workouts, etc. A nice exhaustive list. I garauntee they'll be sorry they even asked and zone out in 10 seconds or less.
- hkmurakami 6y agoI mean sure, if one feels invested enough in such people to expend the considerable effort to enlighten them and the folly of their judgment. But if one is already convinced of their own way, such an effort could be not worthwhile, or even fall on deaf ears.
- bawolff 6y agoOr just tell them No. As long as you are not hurting anyone, you're under no obligation to justify your life choices to your co-workers. I suppose some people might find that stand-offish, but the type of people who won't respect boundries on something as simple as this definitely won't respect boundries when it really matters.
- sukilot 6y agoIf you refuse to befriend jerks, you'll tend to find yourself lonely often.
- bawolff 6y agoAnd if you never stand up for yourself, you'll find that all the people you befriend happen to be jerks. In real life of course you have to find a balance. There is a line and its going to be different for every person
- katzgrau 6y agoI wouldn't call it alcoholism, but I do think there's too much emphasis on alcohol in team building. Getting trashed with your team and making memories (or lack thereof) is kind of a fast track to becoming tight. But there are healthier and better ways to do it. This is 30+ year old me speaking, but mid-20s me would be out until the early hours of the morning with the rest of the team on a work night, and I loved it. But now that I manage a team, I pretty much never make alcohol the focus of any company event - not really healthy or something I want to be actively promoting to employees. I guess I'm a bit of a puritan now.
- sukilot 6y agoBeing a mature adult who is interested in reality isn't "Puritan".
- marsdepinski 6y agoTrue, that's a boring, humorless, twat. A Puritan also doesn't bone, dance or sing.
- drewbug 6y agohttps://nypost.com/2016/10/21/the-puritans-really-loved-having-sex/ https://nypost.com/2016/10/21/the-puritans-really-loved-havi...
- eckza 6y agoI feel this. As someone who has seen some real shit... I feel like that kind of intimacy in a professional environment could actually be detrimental. I don't want to see my boss wasted. Nor do I ever want to fall in love with the hot scrum master again.
- clwk 6y agoBravo.
- baby 6y ago
- savrajsingh 6y agoAmazed at the number of fellow teetotalers in the replies here
- saagarjha 6y agoKeep in mind the parent comment essentially selected for these people ;)
- Causality1 6y agoI am one, for the simple reason most of my male ancestors were alcoholics and I decided the easiest way to not be one was to avoid it entirely.
- mohn 6y agoI don't know if the USA is representative of the rest of the world in this regard but, with respect to drinking, American adults fall into deciles that surprised me[1]. Roughly 40% consumed almost no alcohol in the week before being surveyed, 40% were low-to-moderate drinkers, 10% averaged about two drinks per day, and 10% holy shit that's a lot of booze. [1] https://kottke.org/plus/misc/images/drinking-rate-usa.jpg https://kottke.org/plus/misc/images/drinking-rate-usa.jpg
- cfmcdonald 6y agoI think that chart is misleading, 0 drinks in the last week does not mean "doesn't drink at all, " which implies total abstention. You can easily go weeks or even months without a drink as an occasional drinker who only partakes at social gatherings.
- bawolff 6y agoGoing a week without acohol is considered a category below low-moderate acohol usage? That seems weird to me. I would describe myself as a low-moderate consumer of cake. I definitely don't eat it weekly.
- ALittleLight 6y agoI don't drink either, but I'm perfectly happy to answer "It's unhealthy and I don't like it" when people ask me why. Of course, I also try to avoid social interaction, so if this is a rude response it might not be as useful for others.
- DonHopkins 6y ago"I just found out I'm pregnant!"
- saagarjha 6y agoYeah, that might not fly for many of us here…
- siliconpotato 6y agoThat's akin to declining chocolate from a fat person by saying "no thanks, it makes me fat". I don't drink for medical reasons , although I used to in my twenties. I don't feel the pressure to drink, but understand why some people feel they need a reason. Saying "I don't feel like it" should be sufficient for most people
- cmoscoso 6y agoJust say you snorted some lines and don’t want to mix the drugs.
- lotsofpulp 6y ago> That's akin to declining chocolate from a fat person by saying "no thanks, it makes me fat". If the fat person asks you why you don’t want it, there’s no reason to lie to them.
- soneca 6y agoI don’t drink, but I never felt isolated because of that. I do go to bars though, I just order a coke, a juice, or even a coffee. Yes, I receive a soft pressure to drink. Mostly when I was in college. Yes, people are surprised and ask (sometimes afraid is a touchy subject) why I don’t drink (I just don’t like the taste). A few of the conversations are repeated dozens of times over the years. Some people are hesitant that I am judging them, but pretty early is clear that I am not. But all that is just some conversation, maybe even an ice-breaker. So it never affected my sociability. It is just a fact. Edit: ok, a few of the other answers are pretty judgemental towards people who do drink, so if that’s your case, I understand why it would make you isolated
- c54 6y agoI think this is a really good and healthy approach: engage with the social aspects, don’t get snooty, shoulder the (minor) cost of repeating the same conversation. I look up to this!
- varrock 6y agoHas anybody befriended you after those type of conversations? I've had success explaining why I'm not drinking, but afterwards, it's difficult to reconnect.
- soneca 6y agoNot drinking was never the main topic, just a passing topic. It was never an issue at all. Reconnection or not were due to other things. But I must say that I never made friends on bars. My friends were neighbors and school friends (in my teens), then college friends, then a few coworkers. And their friends. So I go to the bar with them, not to make friends. In nightclubs, to meet women, it had a larger impact, but not necessarily a negative one. It would be a conversation point, but I felt that some women actually preferred, maybe felt safer with someone that could better understand and respect limits, idk. I am not from US though, not sure how the culture is here. I never bought any woman a drink (not sure if it’s for real or just a movie thing)
- adamsea 6y ago
- Dylan16807 6y agoIt's interesting that you would read this article in particular and then say "as if" that way. (I mean, "as if" is still appropriate for your average party, but the article is describing a situation where that really is true!)
- yodon 6y agoA friend who spent much time grappling with how to refrain from social drinking came up with the essentially factual sentence "I've had _plenty_ of alcohol, thanks" (said with enthusiasm in a way that implies he's partied in the past to the point where he had a problem and has to refrain now going forward, without actually sounding like a buzzkill - it takes a bit of practice but is easy to get across in just the right notes)
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- bjo590 6y agoI'd like ways of saying no to alcohol without implying I have addiction problems.
- cschep 6y agohow about, "I've had all the alcohol I want tonight, that's for sure!"
- retsibsi 6y agoIf anyone doubts the strength of the social pressure to drink alcohol, it's pretty telling that even in societies that stigmatise addiction, it can be easier to hint at alcoholism than to simply say you don't like to drink.
- nrclark 6y agoDuring my 20s, I routinely gave up drinking for Lent. My friends were all drinkers though, and going our for drinks was very much part of our routine. What worked for me was just to get my own drinks at the bar, and always order non-alcoholic stuff. When folks were buying rounds of drinks, I'd just say "Nah, I'm good for now". No need to mention that I wasn't drinking, and no need to explain why. It's easy to time your drink orders so that you're out-of-phase by few minutes. Then you're ordering at the bar, and you have total control over it. That way, I've got something in my hand to drink along with everybody else. Maybe it's a soda-water with lime, or maybe it's a near-beer poured into a pint glass. But I was taking part in the social aspect, and that's what mattered. I never lied if asked what I was drinking, but I wouldn't go out of my way to bring it up/make it visible either. Anybody who's had some good nights at the bar will tell you - there's nothing wrong with being a non-drinker, as long as you're not an asshole about it. Nobody likes to feel judged (even implicitly) for their life-choices. But if you can avoid giving off that vibe, nobody will care at all what's in your glass. In my observation, the social pressure isn't to drink _alcohol_ per-se. It's to drink _something_. Something that you bought at the bar, and something you're drinking along with everybody else. Soda-water is fine as long as you're pacing your drinks with the people around you, so that you're being part of the group.
- barry-cotter 6y ago[Every non-Muslim non-Mormon culture] is rife with drinking culture and alcoholism in general.
- Causality1 6y agoSome just replace it with something else. In my experience khat culture is effectively identical to drinking culture in much of the ME and in ME enclaves in Western nations.
- thisrod 6y agoSo are muslim cultures, at least the ones that I'm familiar with.
- aspenmayer 6y agoDrinking occurs in Muslim and Mormon households. Some are okay with it. Some have immense guilt for perceived sins, which can feed into a negative feedback loop in alcoholism, other substance abuse issues, and mental health issues. The advertising industry has blood on its hands where alcohol is concerned, at least, but alcohol is addictive enough to bring addicts out of the woodwork.[0] Alcohol is also a part of society and culture. It’s neither good nor bad inherently. It’s only bad to use it against your own moral code, or that of others, or that of your local jurisdiction. What you do with that abuse potential is up to you. Please drink responsibly, if you do at all. Drinking’s perceived minor heart benefits give people license to drink when they may not otherwise, to little benefit. However, social drinking is an opportunity to socialize, and with the intent on the socializing, the potential harms for overindulgence can be curbed. It’s easier to not get addicted to begin with. You have to be able to stop drinking for your choice as to when and why you drink to hold water, or your drink of choice. Cheers, HN. [0] https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/add.13284 https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/add.13284
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- auganov 6y agoIsrael and India are below some Muslim countries in alcohol consumption per capita [0]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_alcohol_consumption_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_alcohol_c...
- toastal 6y agoIt's the same way people get defensive when someone else says they're a vegan. People may often take it as this person signaling something they do as 'normal' and your refusal to partake means there might be a health, moral, or other flaw in their practice. That someone else never said anything further, cast down on the questioner for drinking/eating meat/etc., or said "it's debate time", but it's the symbol that the very thought that maybe they should second guess themselves that disgusts them -- and this event was supposed to be fun, and you are making it serious. I guess the pro-tip is to always have non-alcoholic beverages at a gathering.
- elliekelly 6y agoOr when you say you don’t intend to get married. They take it as a personal attack on their decision to get married when it actually has nothing at all to do with them or their marriage. Even the most progressive people can be weirdly defensive about the cultural norms they’ve adopted.
- KineticLensman 6y agoA conscious decision not to have children can have the same effect
- nhlx2 6y ago> I guess the pro-tip is to always have non-alcoholic beverages at a gathering. Alas you may find that those offered contain sugar and/or gluten ...
- phendrenad2 6y agoDrinking culture and alcoholism are not equivalent. Drinking culture is an annoying peer-pressure thing that builds comraderie, but takes up a lot of time. Alcoholism is a disease that leads people to drink alone more than not (to avoid stigma).
- partyboat1586 6y ago>Drinking culture is an annoying peer-pressure thing that builds comraderie, but takes up a lot of time. It takes less time than building it naturally in an office environment, hence why it's popular.
- neurostimulant 6y agoYou can always hang out with them but not ordering any alcohol, or is it frowned upon there?
- agency 6y agoAsking someone why they don’t drink is such a deranged thing to do. I can’t believe how often it happens.
- saagarjha 6y agoAsking someone why they don’t drink is not deranged. Pestering them until they give in might be, though.
- grecy 6y ago> 30+ year old colleagues will demand a reason for why I don't drink Sorry to hear people treat you this way. Depending on the situation and my energy level, I have a few standard answers. Obviously I'm careful about which one I use in what circumstance, but I get a kick out of shocking people who push when they shouldn't, and I find it teaches them not to push. I'm very aware these are all excuses that I shouldn't have to make, but I feel they teach me more about the person I'm dealing with than just setting up a "dig in the heels" approach of "I don't want to". My favourite is "My parole officer told me not to drink again". Playing with delivery on that one is a lot of fun. Say it quietly like you're scared someone else will hear, or say it super loud like you think it's a massive joke, and you might just drink again anyway! "I promised myself I'd go a month without drinking to see how I feel" (How they respond to that tells you a lot about if they have any care in the world for you and your choices) "A good friend was killed by a drink driver. I've had a hard time with alcohol since" (true story, so I don't feel bad saying it) "I'm a professional athlete, alcohol messes with my training" "Drug testing at work means I can't drink" "I'm driving" "I want to get up early tomorrow and train"
- gallegojaime 6y agoMany people can remember an excuse like that. I met a few coworkers who get a kick out of this - and it makes you appear manipulative and erratic when I catch you on the lie. I prefer the truth - not a suspicion of the guy being a sociopath.
- throwaway98797 6y agoSociety is comfortable with misleading statements, especially at companies outside of tech departments.
- gallegojaime 6y agoMisleading, yes, but what I meant is lying outright. The workplace has much lower tolerance for it. Would you concur in that small groups (like most workplaces) will avoid or barely tolerate bullshitters caught in the act?
- refurb 6y agoJust relaying my personal experience, but I don't drink either and have never felt excluded. I occasionally get asked why (most people don't even notice) and I tell them the truth "I feel like crap the next day, even with just one drink".
- manigandham 6y agoIt's not about the tech industry but the prevailing culture of the country and region. Drinks after work is extremely common in most places.
- lotsofpulp 6y agoIn the US, there is a huge portion of the country, if not majority, that must drive home from work. Women certainly can’t afford a couple drinks before driving, maybe even one, as it can impair their driving abilities and result in drunk driving. Probably true for many men too.
- manigandham 6y agoAny amount of alcohol can cause impairment in any person.
- lotsofpulp 6y agoYes, of course. And I would recommend abstaining from any driving after any amount of alcohol, but I meant sufficiently impaired that it causes you legal troubles.
- powersnail 6y agoI'd like to think the younger generation is better at "tolerating" not drinking. I remember my father and his colleagues used to have drinks together on occasions, and throw up, and get home sick, and wake up with a headache. My father hated alcohol, yet he still felt obliged to drink together. I had acquainted several of his colleagues, and not surprisingly, none of them like drinking. Most of them hated drinking. So, it's actually a self-fulfilling prophecy. Everyone thought others expected everyone to drink, thus showed up to drink, and validated everyone's expectation. If they were to sit down, sober, honest about their not liking alcohol, they would have found that a bunch of people who didn't enjoy drinking, forced themselves to drink with one another. This impression was marked on my mind, that I initially thought I always had to drink, too. But, I was wrong; we had plenty to do in gatherings, BBQ-ing, playing cards and board games. And as long as I'm into some of the activities, not drinking isn't a barrier to friendship, or trust, or "team spirit". It's quite liberating that the circle I'm in has jumped out of the self-fulfilling prophecy of "obliged to drink".
- AkelaA 6y agoMany statistics have shown that younger generations are less likely to drink: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-45807152 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-45807152 (among many other things: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/44880278 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/44880278) so it seams like staying sober is becoming more normalised. The recent growth of non-alcoholic drinks and bars certainly suggests that. I imagine that since drinking is a social activity, without the social pressure to drink many are simply forgoing it entirely - which itself acts as a feedback loop that further reduces the social pressure to drink. I think a lot of people are discovering that you really don't need alcohol as a kind of "social lubricator" to have a great time out.