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If people stopped catering to non-evergreen browsers, do you know how fast people would start adopting evergreen browsers?
by coding123 6y ago
If people stopped catering to non-evergreen browsers, do you know how fast people would start adopting evergreen browsers?
- cogman10 6y agoIsn't IE11 pretty much the last non-evergreen browser? Or does Safari land in that realm as well?
- sdflhasjd 6y agoI wouldn't regard Safari as evergreen, and it's also probably the most behind* (or they just outright refuse to implement) some APIs * of the modern browsers. edit: I'd like to clarify the reason I don't regard Safari as evergreen is it's tied to iOS versions. Enough users still use iOS 12 and 11
- Spivak 6y agoI really don't understand the hate that Safari gets for this. What's even the point of having different browsers if people get mad at any differences between them? Chrome, but made by four different companies is kinda the illusion of choice and competition.
- oblio 6y agoAren't they supposed to implement the same standard? Not much of a standard if people don't implement it.
- Spivak 6y agoThe standard just says if you're going to have $feature, this is what it has to look like. A web browser on a platform with no concept of notifications can still be standards compliant. A browser with no support for DRM can still be standards compliant too.
- cglong 6y agoUnfortunately Safari on macOS does have notifications, just not ones that adhere to the spec :/
- MBCook 6y agoNot much of a standard if Chrome invents it and everyone just starts complaining non-Chrome don’t adopt the ‘standard’ long before it’s official.
- capableweb 6y agoThis is literally how all standards in browsers are being initially created. Someone has an idea, implements it eventually in a browser, thinks it´s so good, they want other browsers to support it too so they make a proposal. If others like it, they´ll support it and try to find faults. Eventually it gets either rejected, or approved and others follow suit (most of the times). Although, some browser teams, like Google Chrome, has apparently the ability of just shoving Google people in the standards process so they can fast-track stuff. But in the end, it's _supposed_ to work in the fashion where one browser starts implementing something, then others.
- MBCook 6y agoI’m wasn’t complaining about Chrome testing something first. I agree, that’s how it is supposed to happen. I’m complaining about the armies of web developers who seem to think Chrome IS the standard and anything Chrome has that other browsers don’t mean the other browser is ‘The new IE’ and ‘holding the web back’ even if it just came out last week.
- dmitriid 6y agoA standard designed by people from Google, discussed exclusively by people from Google, fast tracked into Chrome by people from Google and then released in Chrome with utter disregard to any issues raised by other browser vendors does not a standard make. Unfortunately, since most web devs develop under Chrome (and rarely if ever test under other browsers) this perpetuates the myth that "Safari is holding the web back" or "Firefox is slow and doesn't implement standards fast enough". Here's total Web Apis counts in different web browsers: [1] - Chrome: 7106 - Firefox: 6376 - Safari: 6130 Of them: browser-specific APIs that developers cannot reasonably assume are a part of the web platform: - Chrome: 949 - Firefox: 507 - Safari: 546 And in 2017-2018 Chrome removed over a thousand APIs that were only implemented in Chrome, but were assumed to be standards" [1] And if you look at the omissions tab, you'll see that Firefox and Safari and not too far behind Chrome. But they are very wary of implementing quite a few standards just because Chrome fast tracked them (Constructible Stylesheets? Safari flat out refused to implement them. Signed HTTP exchanges? Mozilla considers them harmful and will not implement etc. etc.) [1] https://web-confluence.appspot.com/#!/confluence https://web-confluence.appspot.com/#!/confluence
- jdofaz 6y agoBecause on iOS you aren't allowed to use anything else
- heavyset_go 6y agoSafari still doesn't support WebP.
- saagarjha 6y agoSafari 14
- minxomat 6y agoOr opus outside of CAF
- andrethegiant 6y agoIt does as of Safari 14: https://developer.apple.com/documentation/safari-release-notes/safari-14-beta-release-notes https://developer.apple.com/documentation/safari-release-not...
- gruez 6y agotechnically firefox esr isn't evergreen. it's feature frozen for a year at a time.
- msla 6y agoIs there such a thing as an evergreen browser? What about the next bunch of web standards?
- CameronNemo 6y agoI think the commenter is referring to browsers that auto update on relevant (non-package managed) platforms. If IE 11 auto-updated to Edge, then it would be considered Evergreen under this definition. I am not sure how good of an adjective evergreen is in this case, if it is being used how I imagine it is being used.
- WorldMaker 6y agoFor most of its history IE auto-updated but was never considered evergreen because its update cycle was tied to the much slower OS update cycle and the cost gating of OS upgrade purchases. Evergreen tends to also imply "shorter update cycle" (at least regular six-month intervals seems to be the general case now) and little to no gating.
- int_19h 6y agoWhat do you call it when the OS auto-installs Edge alongside IE, and sets it up as the default browser if IE was one?
- solarkraft 6y agoThe point is that Chrome and Firefox auto-update, meaning people without the latest version are very rare, enabling the web to move more quickly.
- msla 6y agoSomeone uses a term and downvotes everyone who's confused by it? How does that work?