7 ms·

Switch teams? My experience were the first 2 years I was writing wholly new code and was able to write a ton. The next 3 years was all maintenance for new issu

Switch teams? My experience were the first 2 years I was writing wholly new code and was able to write a ton. The next 3 years was all maintenance for new issues, requirements and I felt unproductive. Also, just in general it felt like my output went down 50% or more because of code review and tests. Those were all essential but up until my FAANG job no team I was on did that stuff (games). We'd just make the game and file bugs while playing. We didn't write tests. We shipped too. I see the value and essential requirement for code review and tests, specially outside of games, but it was a rude awakening just how much slower things went. There was also just process. Because of code-review you were required to write small changes which I totally understand the need for but it also felt shitty to have to babysit several changes through the CI. Can't submit #3 until #2 passes, etc... so a it felt like wasting so much time on something that used to be instant on a smaller game team. Another example is review of #2 requiring refactoring #3 and #4. And of course the re-write is correct but having to propagate it through changes was more work than if I could have just submitted one change. Similarly while babysitting this stuff someone would check in something with conflicts and again, fixing those conflicts would have been easier with one large change than 4 small changes so again, just adding what feels like busy work. I get why it's important, it just feels poopy.

cyberdrunk 6y ago
> I get why it's important, it just feels poopy. I think it summarizes a lot of office work. We're organized in processes which are efficient and/or necessary at the scale of the company, but which severely restrict and constrain us, making a lot of us unhappy. For people for whom it's unbearable, there are two options: either join a small company or just check out completely, treat your job as some bullshit that brings you good money, be glad you're not cleaning toilets for 20% of your pay, and try to find fullfilment outside of work hours.
- sneak 6y ago
  > be glad you're not cleaning toilets for 20% of your pay Be advised: If you are programming computers in 2020 and making only 5x what a toilet cleaner makes, you are approximately 100% underpaid.
  - ChuckNorris89 6y ago
    I don't feel like the multiples of a toilet cleaner's wage should be a measurement system since it mostly shows income inequality. For example in Sweden and most of Europe, most devs only make 2x-3x NET of what the toilet cleaner makes. Not only because we're underpaid(which I hate) but the toilet cleaners tend to be paid fairly(which I like). In places with high inequality like South Africa, Latin America, Eastern Europe, the USA, a SW dev is expected to make multiples of low-end blue collar wages.
    - sneak 6y ago
      > For example in Sweden and most of Europe, most devs only make 2x-3x of what the toilet cleaner makes. Most devs in Europe are massively underpaid, and should work on the internet instead of some local underpaid wage-slave job. There is a shortage of skilled programmers in the world. There’s no reason to remain underpaid other than really, really wanting to work a very specific set of local timezone hours.
      - foldr 6y ago
        You are right about the underpayment, but you're underestimating the challenges of finding good remote working opportunities that pay more. For one thing, why would an American company offer to pay me twice as much as I could make in the UK if I'm in the UK? They only have to offer a little bit more to inceltivize me to take the job.
        cyberdrunk 6y ago
        > why would an American company offer to pay me twice as much as I could make in the UK if I'm in the UK? They only have to offer a little bit more to inceltivize me to take the job. If they have the money, e.g. they're a large corp or a startup with VC money to burn, they tend to not watch costs that closely and it should not be a problem. I've received multiple offers for six-figure remote jobs in the US (I'm from Eastern Europe) and so far only one offer for less than $100k - that one offer was from a small, profitable self-funded startup. OTOH, if you're already making say $100k in the UK and want to double it by getting a $200k remote offer, then it's considerably harder. I'm betting it would require a lot of valuable and unique experience in your CV.
dutchoven 6y ago
"I get why it's important, it just feels poopy." Very well said, that made my day :)

cyberdrunk 6y ago

> I get why it's important, it just feels poopy. I think it summarizes a lot of office work. We're organized in processes which are efficient and/or necessary at the scale of the company, but which severely restrict and constrain us, making a lot of us unhappy. For people for whom it's unbearable, there are two options: either join a small company or just check out completely, treat your job as some bullshit that brings you good money, be glad you're not cleaning toilets for 20% of your pay, and try to find fullfilment outside of work hours.

sneak 6y ago
> be glad you're not cleaning toilets for 20% of your pay Be advised: If you are programming computers in 2020 and making only 5x what a toilet cleaner makes, you are approximately 100% underpaid.
- ChuckNorris89 6y ago
  I don't feel like the multiples of a toilet cleaner's wage should be a measurement system since it mostly shows income inequality. For example in Sweden and most of Europe, most devs only make 2x-3x NET of what the toilet cleaner makes. Not only because we're underpaid(which I hate) but the toilet cleaners tend to be paid fairly(which I like). In places with high inequality like South Africa, Latin America, Eastern Europe, the USA, a SW dev is expected to make multiples of low-end blue collar wages.
  - sneak 6y ago
    > For example in Sweden and most of Europe, most devs only make 2x-3x of what the toilet cleaner makes. Most devs in Europe are massively underpaid, and should work on the internet instead of some local underpaid wage-slave job. There is a shortage of skilled programmers in the world. There’s no reason to remain underpaid other than really, really wanting to work a very specific set of local timezone hours.
    - foldr 6y ago
      You are right about the underpayment, but you're underestimating the challenges of finding good remote working opportunities that pay more. For one thing, why would an American company offer to pay me twice as much as I could make in the UK if I'm in the UK? They only have to offer a little bit more to inceltivize me to take the job.
      - cyberdrunk 6y ago
        > why would an American company offer to pay me twice as much as I could make in the UK if I'm in the UK? They only have to offer a little bit more to inceltivize me to take the job. If they have the money, e.g. they're a large corp or a startup with VC money to burn, they tend to not watch costs that closely and it should not be a problem. I've received multiple offers for six-figure remote jobs in the US (I'm from Eastern Europe) and so far only one offer for less than $100k - that one offer was from a small, profitable self-funded startup. OTOH, if you're already making say $100k in the UK and want to double it by getting a $200k remote offer, then it's considerably harder. I'm betting it would require a lot of valuable and unique experience in your CV.

dutchoven 6y ago

"I get why it's important, it just feels poopy." Very well said, that made my day :)